What makes a St Mirren Fan?

[St.Ricky]

As an avid reader (now very recently also a contributor) of the B&WA Forum, I sometimes feel more than a little dejected at the vitriol poured out by some fans towards the club, the board and other fans of the Buddies. Now, I agree fully, that football stirs passions and that we, at times. take very different views. None more so than regarding the then "current" manager. Nothing wrong with that but personal vilification of the individuals seem to serve no useful purpose other than to further divide loyalties amongst fans and perhaps even players. This is to my mind, highly counter-productive to creating the Us (Club, Manager, Players, Fans) and Them (Our opposition). 

I have liked some boards, admired the work done by some, taken issue with some decisions but have never doubted that those involved were interested in the same thing as I was - having a financially stable club which punches above its weight (in my mind this translates as finishing higher up the leagues than their average attendance figures suggest they should). Managers have different approaches but each tries to create a team and squad which will fulfill this objective and in doing so, win more often than they lose. Entertainment is for many of these perhaps an understandable secondary desire. 

As fans, we can be guilty of being greedy and why not? Fans of every club would like to have it all, a board that they believe in, a manager they have confidence in and a team that is delivering results on the pitch in an entertaining fashion. Just ask fans of the old firm! Patience is a virtue they say but like common sense it is not common. I suffer too when the team loses. I suffer though when we seem to show a lack of respect for our own fans, players and managers of this fine club. One Town One Club. Our club, The Paisley Saint Mirren. 

This is a professional game. We love it but the manager and players largely do what they do for money. It is their means of earning a living. For most their football loyalties lie elsewhere but when they pull on the Black and White they become my heros and I think yours too. So how can we act as Black and White heros? 

We can turn up to watch games, make some noise, we can bring kids to the games, encourage friends to join us, We can buy scratch cards, buy our pies and soft drinks, Buy the kit.

We can show our passions noisily at matches to support players and manager. We can engage in the community activities of the club. More than ever, St Mirren are Our Team.

We can of course express opinions here on our own forum,

Lets support the team, lets support each other,Lets enjoy the good times, endure the bad and hope and plan for better.

Now you might take a different view. That's fine. Feel free to express them.

 

Edited August 30, 2016 by St.Ricky

[Herbie]

We can buy the kit.

No we can't. ....

[Stuart Dickson]

I don't think I want to be a fan. It looks more like a derogatory term to me. "Fans" appear to be expected to pay whatever is demanded to watch whatever rubbish is put in front of them and not only are they expected to keep doing it over and over again. They are to be roundly ignored when it comes to issues like league reconstruction or keeping a bankrupt "Rangers" in the top league. They are also expected to hero worship - even to the point of singing about it - the very people who rip them off week after week.

I prefer the term "customer" or even "member" - this is a club after all. A customer complains or simply takes their custom elsewhere if the value for money is poor. It's a more discerning relationship. One that is perhaps more demanding and challenging for those in charge but ultimately more rewarding too.

A member of the club has more influence. They can just enjoy the facilities and the product as a customer if they wish, but if they aren't happy or the see potential improvements they actually can do something about it - or at least the should be able to. It is "their" club after all and if those representing them in charge aren't doing their job the member gets their chance to boot them into touch.

[magnus]

2 hours ago, St.Ricky said:

As an avid reader (now very recently also a contributor) of the B&WA Forum, I sometimes feel more than a little dejected at the vitriol poured out by some fans towards the club, the board and other fans of the Buddies. Now, I agree fully, that football stirs passions and that we, at times. take very different views. None more so than regarding the then "current" manager. Nothing wrong with that but personal vilification of the individuals seem to serve no useful purpose other than to further divide loyalties amongst fans and perhaps even players. This is to my mind, highly counter-productive to creating the Us (Club, Manager, Players, Fans) and Them (Our opposition). 

I have liked some boards, admired the work done by some, taken issue with some decisions but have never doubted that those involved were interested in the same thing as I was - having a financially stable club which punches above its weight (in my mind this translates as finishing higher up the leagues than their average attendance figures suggest they should). Managers have different approaches but each tries to create a team and squad which will fulfill this objective and in doing so, win more often than they lose. Entertainment is for many of these perhaps an understandable secondary desire. 

As fans, we can be guilty of being greedy and why not? Fans of every club would like to have it all, a board that they believe in, a manager they have confidence in and a team that is delivering results on the pitch in an entertaining fashion. Just ask fans of the old firm! Patience is a virtue they say but like common sense it is not common. I suffer too when the team loses. I suffer though when we seem to show a lack of respect for our own fans, players and managers of this fine club. One Town One Club. Our club, The Paisley Saint Mirren. 

This is a professional game. We love it but the manager and players largely do what they do for money. It is their means of earning a living. For most their football loyalties lie elsewhere but when they pull on the Black and White they become my heros and I think yours too. So how can we act as Black and White heros? 

We can turn up to watch games, make some noise, we can bring kids to the games, encourage friends to join us, We can buy scratch cards, buy our pies and soft drinks, Buy the kit.

We can show our passions noisily at matches to support players and manager. We can engage in the community activities of the club. More than ever, St Mirren are Our Team.

We can of course express opinions here on our own forum,

Lets support the team, lets support each other,Lets enjoy the good times, endure the bad and hope and plan for better.

Now you might take a different view. That's fine. Feel free to express them.

 

Good post. I was listening to Nigel Pearson manager of Derby County being interviewed the other day and he said that supporters had to appreciate what his players had gone through mentally over the last 4 or 5 seasons narrowly missing out on promotion year on year. It strikes me that Saints supporters are probably in a tough place just now having watched 3-4 seasons of really gash football from poor players and often an embarrassing lack of commitment to the jersey. I dont think the Saints fans are being greedy to expect a team to be competitive and make us proud to be Saints fans. I take my hat off to all the Saints supporters who turn up every week and who care enough to post on here. To my mind its not the fans that need to take a look at themselves. What makes a St Mirren player?

[El Gingero]

Stuart, everyone knows what a fan is.

It's indescribable to a certain extent.

Sweaty palms when you can't get a game, being crabbit to the wife when you can't manage a game because she's arranged a night out with the neighbours, watching periscope to see who we get in a Shitey wee cup.

Getting pumped 7-0 at Celtic Park but clapping the team off the park.

I wouldn't change being a St Mirren fan - I've changed my wife twice instead.

[div]

6 minutes ago, Stuart Dickson said:

I don't think I want to be a fan. It looks more like a derogatory term to me. "Fans" appear to be expected to pay whatever is demanded to watch whatever rubbish is put in front of them and not only are they expected to keep doing it over and over again. They are to be roundly ignored when it comes to issues like league reconstruction or keeping a bankrupt "Rangers" in the top league. They are also expected to hero worship - even to the point of singing about it - the very people who rip them off week after week.

I prefer the term "customer" or even "member" - this is a club after all. A customer complains or simply takes their custom elsewhere if the value for money is poor. It's a more discerning relationship. One that is perhaps more demanding and challenging for those in charge but ultimately more rewarding too.

A member of the club has more influence. They can just enjoy the facilities and the product as a customer if they wish, but if they aren't happy or the see potential improvements they actually can do something about it - or at least the should be able to. It is "their" club after all and if those representing them in charge aren't doing their job the member gets their chance to boot them into touch.
 

The emotional investment in Football is what sets it apart from most other businesses.

Whilst you may feel the ability to up sticks and take your custom elsewhere, most football supporters have invested too much emotionally to do the same.

The reality is that when a football supporter has had enough, they are lost to the game completely.

At the moment the St.Mirren support are generally very downbeat. I spoke to loads of fellow fans on Saturday and at the previous match against Hibs and the overwhelming feeling was of despondancy. It's totally understandable considering the team have barely kicked a ball in the last three years since we won the league cup.

Football tends to go in cycles. We are in a downward cycle at the moment but at some point it will turn and we'll be better again and when the football team starts winning matches and entertaining again then the fans will be happier, more will come, and we might actually start enjoying ourselves again.

One fan I spoke to on Sat said it was like watching a John Coughlin team again. Whilst I wouldn't go that far at all, I do remember watching the likes of Ricky Robb getting a game for Saints and seeing us losing 4 goals away at Alloa for example.

I couldn't see a way out then and yet ten years later we were winning a national cup final at Hampden.

It's a funny old game. When you get as old as me I think you get a bit wiser and you realise that it will get better again at some point.

As to when, who knows, but I'm sure most of us will stick around regardless.

[Drew]

I like the knock about stuff on here, at games, and in the pub pre and post-match. As long as it doesn't get too abusive, it shows we care.

Div's right, things will improve. My concern is that we could drop further before things are turned round. So it goes. Its just a pity that the positive developments in terms of the GLS/SMiSA bid succeeding haven't been matched with a buzz around on-field affairs.

[pozbaird]

Following the 2010 League Cup final it was tough, bordering on embarrasing, to be a St Mirren fan. Following the 2013 League Cup final it was fantastic to be a St Mirren fan. For most of my forty years following St Mirren they have ploughed a furrow somewhere between those extreme highs and lows, with ups and downs along the way. However, whether up or down, I always sensed the management and players were trying, they seemed to care. For the vast majority of those forty years.

This current lot need to take a long hard look at themselves IMHO. In their defence, they are merely the latest in a line stretching back to just after March 17th 2013 of under-achieving St Mirren players, lead by managers who were severely lacking in the skillset required to organise and motivate what was a top flight professional football club - overseen by a want-away BoD who at times looked to have downed tools. It's no wonder St Mirren fans feel downbeat, as Div put it. Craig - Murray - Rae(?) have been / are currently looking like being an absolute triumvirate of unrelenting and unmitigated shite.

Let's hope we get back to being up and down, but while doing so, look like we're trying a leg, overseen by a manager who knows what the fcuk he's doing, and with an injection of enthusiasm generated down the line by GLS/SMiSA.

[zebrakid]

  

 

What makes a St Mirren Fan?

In my case the Royal Navy Stoker & WAAF Radio Operator

[Sonny]

I support St Mirren because I am a glory hunter.

[Stuart Dickson]

1 hour ago, El Gingero said:

Stuart, everyone knows what a fan is.

It's indescribable to a certain extent.

Sweaty palms when you can't get a game, being crabbit to the wife when you can't manage a game because she's arranged a night out with the neighbours, watching periscope to see who we get in a Shitey wee cup.

Getting pumped 7-0 at Celtic Park but clapping the team off the park.

I wouldn't change being a St Mirren fan - I've changed my wife twice instead.

Oh I've been there but when I reflect back I think it was more a case of not wanting to be in the house on the Saturday afternoon, than having a really deep desire to watch St Mirren play. 

I can remember the first time I had to change my weekly pattern. It was in 99/00 season. St Mirren were chasing the league title, with one of the most entertaining St Mirren sides I'd ever watched play and I had to go to cover a Dunfermline v Raith Rovers match instead. I should have been gutted, but instead I really enjoyed the drive through to Dunfermline and I watched a entertaining game of football. I had people at the St Mirren game sending me updates, and both Dunfermline and Raith were promotion rivals but I quickly realised that so long as I was at a football match and I was enjoying it, it didn't need to be a St Mirren game at all. 

When St Mirren sacked Tom Hendrie in such an underhand manner it was easy for me to simply take my custom elsewhere. I don't think I had been any less emotionally involved than any other St Mirren fan. I'd travelled home and away for years at that point never missing a match and shouted myself hoarse at every game. But suddenly there was a realisation at that point that St Mirren weren't the club I'd put on a pedestal as a kid. Instead they were just as flawed as any other greed ridden football club at that time. It was all about money and f**k all to do with community, fans, club employees or family and it certainly wasn't about doing the right thing. Maybe my expectation as a fan was just unrealistic, but I honestly thought the cause I was backing was something special. When it proved not to be, it was easy to stop being fanatical. 

These days I still take an interest in the Saints. After the buy out I thought maybe I could be a fan again. I've even tried making an effort to go to more St Mirren matches this season even though they haven't been that enjoyable. My two sons are currently season ticket holders and my mate still goes to every home game with his father in law, so it's quite nice to go and spend an afternoon at the game with them . I'd imagine I'll give it most of this season regardless of how the team plays but if member ownership doesn't deliver a club I can feel better about "supporting" I don't think I'll be all that bothered about switching back to just enjoying my football at whatever game I've picked from the fixture list. I think my days of being a fan of anything are long gone though. Being a customer or a member is far more healthy. 

[El Gingero]

Of course I value your opinions and respect your actions.

From 2008 until 2013 I didn't go to very many games due to working away Monday to Friday and having toddlers I spent weekends with them. Now I'm back in the Central Belt it's easier to go most weeks. I'm not going to every game but would imagine 80% or so.

[whydowebother]

Being a 'fan' of a team can be whatever each individual feels the extent of their own desire or interest in said club.

If the forum is anything to go by , being a St Mirren 'fan' could easily be interpreted differently to what it actually is.

The ability to launch personal attacks on fellow fans, players & management. The overwhelming desire to be hyper critical of any decision made regarding the club regardless of who makes it. The need to call for people to be sacked 360 minutes ( or sooner ) into the new league season. The repeated calls and criticism against the club by people who have no 'solutions' to offer or who like to limit their involvement to just hating all things St Mirren.

For me , it's simple. I love the team , the club , the town. I enjoy the good days and results knowing full well they will be outstripped by bad days & results.

In our lives , people come & go , friends & family come & go , partners & jobs come & go. They , like St Mirren , all have the ability to make you feel , happy , sad , elated , frustrated ( sometimes all in one day ) but the one difference is this , all them things come & go , but one thing stays the same, your team , will always be your team - St Mirren

COYS !

Now let's crack on with the season , with what we've got , support the team , the management & play our part in helping the success of what ultimately is 'our club'.

[Seaside Nipper]

In my case, it was Alex Ferguson and the fact that I was born in the Paisley environs. Oh of course my old fella, strangely enough, a cynical saints man like all good and true. That and the fact that there was something iconic about proper black and white stripes marked St Mirren out as different,  for me, from the get go.

We know who we are, for whatever reasons.

The pain and ruination of more Saturday nights than can be handled by any normal mortal , but Buddies , clearly more insane and undeniably loyal than any glory hunter anywhere. No one understands unfulfilled potential like a St Mirren fan. 

That is all

 

[Bud the Baker]

wanting St. Mirren to win.

It a hard thing to give up as our most famous ex-fan demonstrates a few posts above.....................

[shull]

More a Gory Hunter in this era. 

[oaksoft]

1 hour ago, El Gingero said:

Of course I value your opinions and respect your actions.

 

Yeah unfortunately he is lying through his teeth.

He turned against Saints because Stewart Gilmour turned down his brainless business idea and called him a loose cannon. He has waged a one man war against the club ever since.

I would respect Dickson more if was at least honest about all of this but he keeps lying through his arse about all this "customer" crap so I have to keep reminding him.

 

Edited August 30, 2016 by oaksoft

[El Gingero]

Oaksoft - I don't know any of that as this was all before I gave in to the temptations of social media etc.

In any dealings with SD I have found him to be forthright and opinionated - but aren't we all.

[Stuart Dickson]

Yeah unfortunately he is lying through his teeth.

He turned against Saints because Stewart Gilmour turned down his brainless business idea and called him a loose cannon. He has waged a one man war against the club ever since.

I would respect Dickson more if was at least honest about all of this but he keeps lying through his arse about all this "customer" crap so I have to keep reminding him.

 

You persist with this despite being told the truth repeatedly. I offered the club 33% of all the profits from a business I was setting up. It was supposed to be my contribution to help build the Love Street end stand to get the club promoted. He knocked it back. The business went on to do pretty well and I got to keep all my profits instead of just 66% of them. For some reason you seem to think this made me incredibly angry but the reality is I continued to support the club home and away all through that Premiership season and the season after relegation. It was only when Hendrie was sacked I did walking away.

I'm sure someone with access to season ticket sales at the club would be able to confirm that I continued to hold a season ticket through the period as described. Certainly there were plenty of Saints Online guest book users who know I attended matches as a fan long after the meeting with Gilmour.

Oaksoft? Well I'm not convinced he's ever seen a football match. He certainly knows f**k all about the sport

[Dibbles old paperboy]

A glory hunter parading around all summer in the latest home strip.

[stlucifer]

4 hours ago, Stuart Dickson said:

I don't think I want to be a fan. It looks more like a derogatory term to me. "Fans" appear to be expected to pay whatever is demanded to watch whatever rubbish is put in front of them and not only are they expected to keep doing it over and over again. They are to be roundly ignored when it comes to issues like league reconstruction or keeping a bankrupt "Rangers" in the top league. They are also expected to hero worship - even to the point of singing about it - the very people who rip them off week after week.

I prefer the term "customer" or even "member" - this is a club after all. A customer complains or simply takes their custom elsewhere if the value for money is poor. It's a more discerning relationship. One that is perhaps more demanding and challenging for those in charge but ultimately more rewarding too.

A member of the club has more influence. They can just enjoy the facilities and the product as a customer if they wish, but if they aren't happy or the see potential improvements they actually can do something about it - or at least the should be able to. It is "their" club after all and if those representing them in charge aren't doing their job the member gets their chance to boot them into touch.
 

Sometimes you certainly come across as such. A member I mean. The term fan,as most will know, comes from the word fanatic, (from the latin "fanaticus"), You certainly appear fanatical when it comes to Saint Mirren.

Edited August 30, 2016 by stlucifer

[oaksoft]

56 minutes ago, El Gingero said:

Oaksoft - I don't know any of that as this was all before I gave in to the temptations of social media etc.

In any dealings with SD I have found him to be forthright and opinionated - but aren't we all.
 

Thats the reason I keep having to repost this stuff. He keeps trying to hoodwink people.

There is a difference between opiniated and a downright liar. At least you are forewarned about the type of person you are dealing with.

[oaksoft]

47 minutes ago, Stuart Dickson said:

You persist with this despite being told the truth repeatedly. I offered the club 33% of all the profits from a business I was setting up. It was supposed to be my contribution to help build the Love Street end stand to get the club promoted. He knocked it back. The business went on to do pretty well and I got to keep all my profits instead of just 66% of them. For some reason you seem to think this made me incredibly angry but the reality is I continued to support the club home and away all through that Premiership season and the season after relegation. It was only when Hendrie was sacked I did walking away.

I'm sure someone with access to season ticket sales at the club would be able to confirm that I continued to hold a season ticket through the period as described. Certainly there were plenty of Saints Online guest book users who know I attended matches as a fan long after the meeting with Gilmour.

Oaksoft? Well I'm not convinced he's ever seen a football match. He certainly knows f**k all about the sport

This story of yours changes every time you tell it.

Nobody is impressed.

[Stuart Dickson]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

This story of yours changes every time you tell it.

Nobody is impressed.

Bollocks. But do you know what I'll let you go dig out the "other versions". Have fun dafty. 

[Liverpool Bud]

At 46 you think I'd know better!

but being the product of a father born in Greenock - who resided in Innellan - whose pals came from Paisley and Largs watching the Saints from the late 50's I think I was pre determined to be a Buddie.

And growing up in Bearsden and being one of 3 saints supporters in our Secondary school twinned with the glorious days of the 80's whilst moving to Liverpool in 1988 and proudly doing my bit by #buyingthebuddies I don't think I've ever been prouder to be a Saint!

il be back north with some pals from my work for the Dundee Utd game.

 

ive experienced many highs and lows in my years but to experience sitting in between my son and my father with tears in my eyes on the 17th March 2013 was all the reason I need to know that a fan has it in there heart and members / customers feel it with their head.