Paisley brazilians Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 (edited) With the topic about crap football stadiums lead me to this. Scottish football were did it all go wrong. With the rise and rise of the English Premiership and most clubs either building brand new state of the art facilities or upgrading existing facilities. With world class marketing attracting the best deals to bring in the best players.para shoot funds.100s of millions filtering through the leagues. What happened to us. Edited April 7, 2017 by Paisley brazilians Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pod Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 The auld firm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 10 minutes ago, pod said: The auld firm. So predictable. Blaming the same three clubs as usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 1 hour ago, Paisley brazilians said: With the topic about crap football stadiums lead me to this. Scottish football were did it all go wrong. With the rise and rise of the English Premiership and most clubs either building brand new state of the art facilities or upgrading existing facilities. With world class marketing attracting the best deals to bring in the best players.para shoot funds.100s of millions filtering through the leagues. What happened to us. Your off on one today Bud ....... Whilst I hear you that we are very poor relations can we really be compared to the English Prem with its billions. Also is that sustainable as virtually all top clubs are foreign owned, with foreign managers and 65% foreign players.... Even with a £3-5B English clubs are not profitable, yes its a great product, not the best football but my god is it marketed well by BT and SKY............... Despite the top grossing league England continue to FAIL massively at International level, their teams fail at CL and even Europa, and it also shows with FA and League Cup that the top clubs usually don't bother, which is why you get teams like Bradford, Stoke and Wigan having cup final appearances... This does not detract from your point. We are shite and embarrassing.... taking Tic out of the equation- even though like T May they lost in Gibraltar, our so called top teams cant beat part time fishermen. Hearts losing to a Maltese team said it all....................... The letters IMHO answer this-- The S F A ...... WITHOUT DOUBT THE MOST FEEBLE USELESS F A OUT... We employ morons and have done for decades--- Ernie Walker, Farry, Smith and now Reegan and Carter Doncaster............ I don't believe any of these tossers ever cared about the big picture, just the tiny wee one. And a pod says the OF control everything. To set up a 12 team league and have a vote which is 11/1 to get change proves they have no interest but keep the biggots happy................... Change at top is what we have needed for decades................ get Barry Hearns in................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chalky1 Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 The Bosman Ruling, lots of scottish clubs stopped investing in their youth players and paid over the odds for average players who didn't really bring anything to the game. Stupid TV deals where scottish football wasn't paid its true value. Football agents manufacturing moves for 17 year olds to english championships clubs when they weren't ready, lots of youngsters now lost to the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 2 hours ago, DougJamie said: Your off on one today Bud ....... Whilst I hear you that we are very poor relations can we really be compared to the English Prem with its billions. Also is that sustainable as virtually all top clubs are foreign owned, with foreign managers and 65% foreign players.... Even with a £3-5B English clubs are not profitable, yes its a great product, not the best football but my god is it marketed well by BT and SKY............... Despite the top grossing league England continue to FAIL massively at International level, their teams fail at CL and even Europa, and it also shows with FA and League Cup that the top clubs usually don't bother, which is why you get teams like Bradford, Stoke and Wigan having cup final appearances... This does not detract from your point. We are shite and embarrassing.... taking Tic out of the equation- even though like T May they lost in Gibraltar, our so called top teams cant beat part time fishermen. Hearts losing to a Maltese team said it all....................... The letters IMHO answer this-- The S F A ...... WITHOUT DOUBT THE MOST FEEBLE USELESS F A OUT... We employ morons and have done for decades--- Ernie Walker, Farry, Smith and now Reegan and Carter Doncaster............ I don't believe any of these tossers ever cared about the big picture, just the tiny wee one. And a pod says the OF control everything. To set up a 12 team league and have a vote which is 11/1 to get change proves they have no interest but keep the biggots happy................... Change at top is what we have needed for decades................ get Barry Hearns in................... English clubs paid £220 Millions to agents from 2016 -2017 I am party to blame for paying money to Sky and BT but I do wish they would go bust so football can get back to what it was before telly f it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 I don't watch Sky or English Football. Why we give so much time and coverage to it in Scotland, I fail to understand. Zero interest for me. Now - St Mirren - a whole different story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 When Scottish fitba changed the rules of the games so that clubs retained ALL of their home league gates - was the start of the decline. Even back in the day, before the change, there was already an in-built discrepancy - an uneven playing field - bestowed upon the arse-cheeks due to the masses of bigots who follow-follow their teams from every corner of Scotland, in a misplaced show of 'religion'... Although the arse-cheeks were then sharing their big home gates, they were always recipients of the income from BIGGER crowds. They always had that advantage. Nonetheless Scotland could still, on occasion, produce teams and clubs that could sometimes compete successfully. They could afford to pay for and keep some great players and even build consistent, long-lasting teams. It's now almost impossible. There is no level playing fields in Scottish fitba - so why would the fans keep showing up to see an unfair, biased competition in which so much luck can never prevail over institutional over-investment? Scottish fitba went wrong initially with the arse-cheeks, then compounded the problem by letting them twist the finances even further in their own favour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintargyll Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 With the Millions poured into the English top 2 divisions.... The England national team are still crap ( better than us of course) Roger whits his name,put a lot of teams into debt with the white elephant 10,000 seated stadia (wanker) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 If Scottish football has 'gone wrong', then to look at it, we need to decide when it was 'right'. Was it in black and white days when huge crowds of mostly working class men wearing flat caps used football as an escape from the normal tough working week? Was it in the 1960s when clubs like Killie and Hearts were top sides and before the Lisbon Lions? Was it in the 1980s when the Old Firm were shite and Aberdeen and Dundee United weren't shite? What era are we pining for or hoping we could go back to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Sanchez Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 Didn't Henry McLeish sort all this out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 6 minutes ago, Dirty Sanchez said: Didn't Henry McLeish sort all this out? Didn't he have a Wank Tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Posted April 7, 2017 Report Share Posted April 7, 2017 If Scottish football has 'gone wrong', then to look at it, we need to decide when it was 'right'. Was it in black and white days when huge crowds of mostly working class men wearing flat caps used football as an escape from the normal tough working week? Was it in the 1960s when clubs like Killie and Hearts were top sides and before the Lisbon Lions? Was it in the 1980s when the Old Firm were shite and Aberdeen and Dundee United weren't shite? What era are we pining for or hoping we could go back to? 1987 would be far enough back for me [emoji106] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windae cleaner Posted April 8, 2017 Report Share Posted April 8, 2017 15 hours ago, pozbaird said: If Scottish football has 'gone wrong', then to look at it, we need to decide when it was 'right'. Was it in black and white days when huge crowds of mostly working class men wearing flat caps used football as an escape from the normal tough working week? Was it in the 1960s when clubs like Killie and Hearts were top sides and before the Lisbon Lions? Was it in the 1980s when the Old Firm were shite and Aberdeen and Dundee United weren't shite? What era are we pining for or hoping we could go back to? 1980s for me before Souness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luther G. Presley Posted April 9, 2017 Report Share Posted April 9, 2017 Scottish football has been on a downward spiral ever since the Souness era at Rangers, every other club starting spending money they didn't have on mostly foreign duds to try and keep up, at the time very few young Scottish players were getting a chance and we have still not recovered from this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paisley brazilians Posted April 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 Granted there has been some great football teams over the years in Scottish football.club and national sides.but both have been less fruitful.the point hear is the SPL had an opportunity to come up with the a similar model to the English premiership but obviously certain clubs were wanting more of the spoils than others.along with incompetent buiseness skills resulting in the structure we currently have.as for the national side we either have to move to a 4 foreigner rule like the German league to strengthen our national side and probably make young players more desirable. also look at the Belgium national side how far it has come in last ten years with a new infrastructure in place and the fact they play the one formation so they can mould young players into that structure. Thing need to happen starting with having competent people at the top of our game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 Must admit, and this is no defence to the prats that have run our game into the ground... We cant really mention our game in the same breath as German, English, French, Italian and Spanish football as all countries are 10 times the size of ours. however the fact that Belguim, Sweden , Swiss and Croatian football is miles ahead of ours shows that despite all the talk, the SFA don't invest in our game..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 In my opinion, l guess what we would all like to see are full stadiums which then generate lots of noise and atmosphere. Without researching the statistics the period for big crowds at football coincided with a 5.5 day working week and increases in disposable incomes in the 30s and 40s into 50s and early 60s. 5 day weeks and an increase in the number of women working plus TV and the rise of alternative entertainment all ate onto the numbers coming ...unless your club was winning or challenging for trophies. I guess we are now reinventing the game as a family entertainment. This will take time to build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 (edited) On 04/07/2017 at 5:51 PM, St.Ricky said: I don't watch Sky or English Football. Why we give so much time and coverage to it in Scotland, I fail to understand. Zero interest for me. Now - St Mirren - a whole different story. Ditto. Like you, I have absolutely no interest in English fitba. I don't have an interest in any fitba elsewhere either (unless it directly affects Saints and, to a diminishing extent, Scotland). During the match at the weekend, my mate informed me about an earlier score from dahn saaf - Spurs or Fulham or some such. It meant absolutely nothing to me. Not a thing. Fair enough, if you follow another club elsewhere, and that's your thing, but I think that the saturated media coverage hasn't helped the situation at home. Edited April 10, 2017 by Drew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmac Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 For me, its probably about time for the government to legislate, create a football regulator who will be above the SFA or whatever they want to call themselves, who are there to try and protect clubs from themselves; protect the interests of the paying public (why should anybody go and pay £20 / £25 to watch a game in that shithole stand at Firhill); and most of all, create a level playing field. if a team is consistently winning the top league by huge margins of points, why don't they start the following season with a points handicap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 13 minutes ago, melmac said: For me, its probably about time for the government to legislate, create a football regulator who will be above the SFA or whatever they want to call themselves, who are there to try and protect clubs from themselves; protect the interests of the paying public (why should anybody go and pay £20 / £25 to watch a game in that shithole stand at Firhill); and most of all, create a level playing field. if a team is consistently winning the top league by huge margins of points, why don't they start the following season with a points handicap. Ok some logic there, then it went a bit strange No one makes us Saints supporters its our choice, fact is if I went to see Tic play Sevco I would be glued to phone checking out how Saints are doing. Its not Tics fault they are miles better than anyone else, what I cant stand is the lack of development that our so called clubs do....... Penalizing success is never the answer, that just stifles growth.................. Leicester did it last year, Monaco this year..... And seriously if Tic started 30 points ahead of any other team, what would that give us............................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 I think we need to stop bloody whining. Our leagues are great up here, highly competitive with the exception of a single team in a division we don't play in anyway. All the other divisions are nip and tuck with most games meaningful. The Cups routinely throw up shocks with Championship sides regularly making the latter stages and the finals themselves. Couldn't care less about Europe. Couldn't care less about the National team right now. Look at the attendances over the last few seasons in the Championship. It's been staggering. As for that one club I spoke about? Teams need to stop talking about finances and start understanding how to work with what they have got. Bring through the right young players at the right time in large quantities across all teams and build from there. It is completely irrelevant how much these guys are paid. Get all these other teams to believe they can beat the top club and you'll see results. Nobody believes they can catch Celtic. That is the issue right there. Teams believe they can beat Rangers who have players on similar-ish wages and look how many other clubs take points off them. This is our game. It won't change. We either make the best of it or pack up and do something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrin Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, DougJamie said: Its not Tics fault they are miles better than anyone else, what I cant stand is the lack of development that our so called clubs do....... Celtic are more than a wee bit complicit in that they encouraged all things anti-Rangers and that they pushed so that they could keep all their home gates.... and let the diddy clubs keep their home gates... and, as Celtic are always on telly, their 'fans' don't need to visit wee diddy grounds in the numbers that would make a difference. They have more income and strive to increase that income, despite the fact they are robbing their opponents of any chance of being genuine opposition Recently, it's slightly different as we now have Sevco around - for a little longer - but Celtic don't encourage them. Why should they? They don't need an insular and ephemeral 'Old Firm' to be magicked up against a new diddy club. Celtic proceed unchallengeable every year to further enrich themselves in European football, with not a thought to the league and teams that sustain them, in 'competition'. 3 hours ago, oaksoft said: I think we need to stop bloody whining. Our leagues are great up here, highly competitive with the exception of a single team in a division we don't play in anyway. As for that one club I spoke about? Teams need to stop talking about finances and start understanding how to work with what they have got. Bring through the right young players at the right time in large quantities across all teams and build from there. It is completely irrelevant how much these guys are paid. Get all these other teams to believe they can beat the top club and you'll see results. Nobody believes they can catch Celtic. That is the issue right there. Teams believe they can beat Rangers who have players on similar-ish wages and look how many other clubs take points off them. This is our game. It won't change. We either make the best of it or pack up and do something else. The first law of life is that everything changes. Before you got interested in football, all teams shared the attendance monies. The bigot arse-cheeks did not get to gorge on it all, making themselves even more fat and less attractive. Once upon a time, THAT was our game. It WAS changed. An immoral action I have always felt. You need more than one team to make a genuine sporting competition. Neither is lesser than the other. The rich one MUST HAVE opponents. With everyone else playing for the also-ran places that renders the whole set-up less attractive. There are intelligent Celtic fans already aware of the discrepancy and how it makes the game a shambles. They are already talking about addressing it. It will not happen soon, but it's inevitable. To achieve what you suggest DEMANDS FINANCING. Diddy clubs can't just set up huge schemes to cultivate the best talent and hope some of them blend together at the same time to make magic. Celtic bought the heart from an effective DUFC and see where they are now - and also see where those talented players are... Rich clubs will hoover up all the talent - English clubs are already doing so. Top Scottish players will all be bought by wee diddy but rich English lower league clubs (through tv - often subsidised by daft Scots - subscribers. Scottish clubs are not operating to achieve success on a fitba field - They operate to keep alive and if that means selling players to keep functioning, then that's what will happen. Unless there is change the Scottish game will die. It is already puny and weak in comparison with the English game. Edited April 10, 2017 by antrin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 Of course Scottish football is 'puny and weak' compared to England. English football can only be compared to Spanish football for any sort of fair comparison. Back in the day, I would have said Italian football would be in that ballpark too, but I would put Italian football in a bracket with Germany and perhaps France these days. England and Spain are the big bloated worldwide behemoths... IMHO. I take a far greater interest in the EPL than I do in the rest of Scottish football. Take St Mirren out of the equation and why would I be interested in a top division that has been dominated for decades by two disproportionally large clubs fuelled by sectarianism who 99% of the time roger the hapless opposition up the sphincter with minimal resistance? I know Celtic won the league, I genuinely did not know who was bottom of the league, or who was fannying around in mid-table. Could not give a flying fcuk. I happen to be far more interested in Newcastle and Leeds trying to come up, I am far more interested in Sunderland staying up, and I am far more interested in watching (as I did) something thrilling like the first half of this weekend's Everton v Leicester game, where two well-matched competitive teams fought it out in a full, atmospheric stadium. At the start of every EPL season these days, Chelsea, Man City, Man Utd, Arsenal, Liverpool and Spurs harbour genuine title hopes, with clubs like Everton, Southampton and others far from being fodder for the big guns to rape up the arse... hence my interest in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted April 10, 2017 Report Share Posted April 10, 2017 Antrin, whilst I agree with most you say on Tic, remember they are not meant to run our game, that's the SFAs job, which is my point. Yes they did vote to change, but hey, they were allowed to do so, and why should they give a jot about the SPFL, I mean after all they get more for one CL win than they do in winning the League by 30 points. Personally I wish them and their laughable Glasgow giant brothers would piss off to some Atlantic league, I am no fan...... However at least they actually play Scots now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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