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Another Attack In London


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On 21 June 2017 at 8:29 PM, Isle Of Bute Saint said:

I wear a St Mitten strip to bed every night. Stick my season ticket on the living room wall. Take my dog out with a St Mitten coat on even when it is sunny. My car is painted black and white stripes while the day before matches I camp outside the gate so I'm first in the stadium for match days. That is extreme hope that helps. 

Whilst that is pretty extreme behaviour , it is unlikely to injure anyone or offend them (perhaps the occasional Mor*on fan) even. It is not illegal to have extreme views in this country but it is illegal to plan and perpetrate acts of violence against people for whatever reason . .

 

 

 

 

 

By the way , I don't care how big you are , my tent was there first. .:P

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On 22/06/2017 at 9:59 AM, Russian Saint said:

 


I used the word "allegedly" twice..........which is hardly lots, but let's not split hairs.

I noticed you picked up on the scenario WRT a ISIS returnee driving school buses, but I noticed you overlooked or chose not to answer probably the most important part of my post.
Would you Faraway Saint want to have a known ISIS Jihadist living next door to you.? Because the fact is, they're going to have to be someone's neighbor.

 

 

On 22/06/2017 at 0:41 PM, Vambo57 said:

I have and you already know the answers.  Perhaps you could for once answer one of my questions: Why are you so intent on keeping them on the streets?

Of course it IS simple.  Your scenario if Internment was in force may come to pass, but maybe not, or to a lesser degree as they do not have the support of their community, as the IRA did in Northern Ireland.  GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!!

Yes, it would be difficult and measures would need to in place - vis a vis a judge's decision if the weight of evidence points to an individual being a grave danger to the innocent.

GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!!

You guys are hilarious. :lol:

Oh hang on.... you are actually serious?????? :blink:

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On 25/06/2017 at 0:56 PM, oaksoft said:

 

You guys are hilarious. :lol:

Oh hang on.... you are actually serious?????? :blink:

Seriously... Innocent people are being murdered but you think a suggested means to protect innocents is hilarious?  Seriously?

GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!!

Edited by Vambo57
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17 hours ago, Vambo57 said:

Seriously... Innocent people are being murdered but you think a suggested means to protect innocents is hilarious?  Seriously?

GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!!

Yes. Hilarious.

I think that suggestions like internment are so utterly brainless and have proven to be brainless through decades of experience in Northern Ireland that they deserve to be laughed.

To be incapable of understanding that introducing internment would turn moderate muslims against us, making a bad situation considerably worse, is laughable.

Solutions are definitely needed but you running around a forum screaming "GET THEM OFF THE STREETS" is not one of them - especially when you don't have the guts to actually articulate that when you say "THEY", you effectively mean that we should target people with brown faces - predominately immigrants.

For the benefit of doubt, because you seem confused, I am laughing at you personally because your 20 seconds of thought into the problem really deserves nothing more.

Only an idiot would think I was laughing at genuine solutions to stop people being murdered.

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On 6/25/2017 at 1:01 PM, Russian Saint said:

Ok Oaksoft, please share with Vambo57 and myself your thoughts. You obviously have your own views, as you believe ours are "hilarious"

Of course I have my own views but you won't like them.

The key to this is for us natives to be as genuinely welcoming, inclusive and friendly to people who choose to come here to live, work and holiday as it is possible to be. We need a lot less "tolerance" and a lot more acceptance and inclusion.

Hatred, division, suspicion and fear are the tools which cause the problem we are seeing. Intelligent people know this which is why you are being laughed at.

When people feel included and welcome they tend not to shit on their own doorstep.

Many muslims do not feel as welcome, wanted or valued in this country as they should do and this is a stain of shame on our country as a whole.

We don't to "educate" muslims. We need to start educating ignorant people like you and vambo.

I am not afraid of terrorists. I am more worried about ignorance amongst the non-muslim natives in this country because IMO they create the conditions which ISIS exploit so easily. Cut off the supply of isolated muslims and you deal with the source of the problem.

Edited by oaksoft
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Wow........ what a retort. Let me pick through the bones of your statement.
1. This is the most important one in my view. We're not talking about Muslims, we're talking about extremists, we're talking about those that left to take up arms in the Jihad and have returned to the UK to walk our streets.

2. Education of ignorant people such as myself and Vambo57. I can only speak for myself here, but I've worked and lived in many Muslim countries (Egypt, Qatar, Bosnia, Chad, Bangladesh and Kazakhstan) to name a few. So please don't try to tell me about Muslims, as I have many Muslim friends and know a helluva lot about their beliefs. Can you say likewise????

3. "I'm not afraid of terrorists" Really??? Well you should be. It's people like you that make so proud to be British (that was a bit of sarcasm there)

4. Not that I really care, but who's laughing at us???? Vambo57, can you hear anyone laughing?

You're argument, well you don't really have one....... Do you.

As Dennis Thatcher once said. "It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt"

Vambo57. I'll tee them up, you knock them in.

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7 minutes ago, Russian Saint said:



As Dennis Thatcher once said. "It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt"

 

Abraham Lincoln gets most of the credit for that saying altho a few credit it to Mark Twain.

Speak?Dennis Thatcher wasn't allowed to think.:lol:

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You're argument, well you don't really have one....... Do you.

 

 

His argument is that, historically, internment has been shown to have the opposite effect to what you hope it will achieve by alienating a whole community. You've stated nothing to rebut that.

 

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His argument is that, historically, internment has been shown to have the opposite effect to what you hope it will achieve by alienating a whole community. You've stated nothing to rebut that.
 


So what you're saying is (correct me if I'm wrong)

Let's say Govanhill in Glasgow that has a large Muslim community. If they were all peaceful people bar one known extremist that had fought in Syria. If that one extremist was taken off the streets, you're telling me that by doing that the rest of the community would feel alienated?????
Do you not think the peaceful Muslims would be more than happy to get the bad apple out of the barre?
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10 minutes ago, Russian Saint said:

 


So what you're saying is (correct me if I'm wrong)

Let's say Govanhill in Glasgow that has a large Muslim community. If they were all peaceful people bar one known extremist that had fought in Syria. If that one extremist was taken off the streets, you're telling me that by doing that the rest of the community would feel alienated?????
Do you not think the peaceful Muslims would be more than happy to get the bad apple out of the barre?

 

You've missed out the term "internment" which, just to clarify, was more of a hindrance than help as it allowed "them" in Northern Ireland to be arrested and jailed without trial.

Operation Demetrius was a British Army operation in Northern Ireland on 9–10 August 1971, during the Troubles. It involved the mass arrest and internment (imprisonment without trial) of 342 people suspected of being involved with the Irish Republican Army (IRA), which was waging a campaign against the state.

No one is saying any person known to be posing a threat shouldn't be "off the streets" but the generalisation being used is rather disturbing. Also there are many people seen as "extremists" by one group and only speaking their mind by others.

You posted earlier about Tommy Robinson, seen by many as an extremist, jail him?

We have to very careful or we, UK, could become a country where freedom of speech is clamped down on, mainly on Muslims if some had their way.

The authorities are doing what they can, regular reports of possible attacks being stopped are generally overlooked, but it's an impossible situation to stop all attacks.

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18 hours ago, oaksoft said:

Yes. Hilarious.

I think that suggestions like internment are so utterly brainless and have proven to be brainless through decades of experience in Northern Ireland that they deserve to be laughed.  No, I think Brainless is the ability to have only one standpoint, one term of reference, that is presumed to be utterly correct and resort to abuse of those who disagree with you.

To be incapable of understanding that introducing internment would turn moderate muslims against us, making a bad situation considerably worse, is laughable. No, Have you EVER considered that you're assumption is wrong?

Solutions are definitely needed but you running around a forum screaming "GET THEM OFF THE STREETS" is not one of them - especially when you don't have the guts to actually articulate that when you say "THEY", you effectively mean that we should target people with brown faces - predominately immigrants. Who is the racist here?  Not once have I even alluded to your definition of "THEY"  Anyone that knows me will vouch that I am anything but a racist. Please believe me when I warn you that: if you accuse me of Racism again, I will see you in court.

For the benefit of doubt, because you seem confused, I am laughing at you personally because your 20 seconds of thought into the problem really deserves nothing more.

Only an idiot would think I was laughing at genuine solutions to stop people being murdered.

Thanks for all the abuse pal.  Heed my warning.

9 hours ago, Russian Saint said:

Wow........ what a retort. Let me pick through the bones of your statement.
1. This is the most important one in my view. We're not talking about Muslims, we're talking about extremists, we're talking about those that left to take up arms in the Jihad and have returned to the UK to walk our streets.

2. Education of ignorant people such as myself and Vambo57. I can only speak for myself here, but I've worked and lived in many Muslim countries (Egypt, Qatar, Bosnia, Chad, Bangladesh and Kazakhstan) to name a few. So please don't try to tell me about Muslims, as I have many Muslim friends and know a helluva lot about their beliefs. Can you say likewise????

3. "I'm not afraid of terrorists" Really??? Well you should be. It's people like you that make so proud to be British (that was a bit of sarcasm there)

4. Not that I really care, but who's laughing at us???? Vambo57, can you hear anyone laughing?

You're argument, well you don't really have one....... Do you.

As Dennis Thatcher once said. "It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt"

Vambo57. I'll tee them up, you knock them in.

I don't wish to argue with anyone over this.  I was just stating my opinion, but now I am being accused of being racist WITH NO JUSTIFICATION, except in the accuser's head.

6 hours ago, salmonbuddie said:

 

His argument is that, historically, internment has been shown to have the opposite effect to what you hope it will achieve by alienating a whole community. You've stated nothing to rebut that.

 

Yes, historically that was the case, but I can see no 'community' that supports extremists? 

1 hour ago, faraway saint said:

Internment...............the results in NI.

The introduction of the new measures and the secret dawn raids sparked fierce gun battles and protests in Ulster which claimed the lives of 12 people, including two women.

How many innocent peoples deaths will it take before we GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!

 

It may not be a perfect solution, but it would save lives IMHO

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44 minutes ago, Vambo57 said:

Thanks for all the abuse pal.  Heed my warning.

I don't wish to argue with anyone over this.  I was just stating my opinion, but now I am being accused of being racist WITH NO JUSTIFICATION, except in the accuser's head.

Yes, historically that was the case, but I can see no 'community' that supports extremists? 

How many innocent peoples deaths will it take before we GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!

 

It may not be a perfect solution, but it would save lives IMHO

Heed your warning? :lol:

Criiiiinge.

Where did I call you a racist?

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1 hour ago, Vambo57 said:

Thanks for all the abuse pal.  Heed my warning.

I don't wish to argue with anyone over this.  I was just stating my opinion, but now I am being accused of being racist WITH NO JUSTIFICATION, except in the accuser's head.

Yes, historically that was the case, but I can see no 'community' that supports extremists? 

How many innocent peoples deaths will it take before we GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!

 

It may not be a perfect solution, but it would save lives IMHO

Your point is totally flawed and self defeating

What we call evil, some call purification

What we call normal, others call evil

 

 So- Get WHO off the streets

This is the issue here, we don't interact with our Muslim friends, we cant look at a short term solution here as that's making martyrs.  

Its has to be a change in culture and mindest, bring communities together , don't divide, we seem to forget its one planet. Is that fat boot that tortured and killed her child anything different from a " terrorist"

Change in views starting now, "extremist" is our terminology, and those that cause harm believe they are right. So we have to break walls not build them ...

That's the only way you can possibly stop this. This is not a new issue, its thousands of years that man has try be different....

Jesus there is more hostility towards the DUP than there is so called ISIS ( ON THE STREETS)

 

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Guest TPAFKATS

As I said earlier in the thread, the current legislation is sufficient to remove those known to be a threat from the streets. Therefore there's no need for internment to do likewise.
Of course, the authorities have been made aware by the local community of guys such as the Manchester bomber and chose to let him remain at liberty.

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2 minutes ago, TPAFKATS said:

As I said earlier in the thread, the current legislation is sufficient to remove those known to be a threat from the streets. Therefore there's no need for internment to do likewise.
Of course, the authorities have been made aware by the local community of guys such as the Manchester bomber and chose to let him remain at liberty.

Indeed, things, as they stand are in place but, regarding your last sentence, it's well near impossible as the authorities will have been made aware of many people and it's impossible to take everyone "off the streets" although there are plenty white UK citizens who I would gladly take off the streets. :wink:

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Guest TPAFKATS
Indeed, things, as they stand are in place but, regarding your last sentence, it's well near impossible as the authorities will have been made aware of many people and it's impossible to take everyone "off the streets" although there are plenty white UK citizens who I would gladly take off the streets. :wink:

The last sentence was me trying to show that despite being reported 5 times the security services deemed him not to be a sufficient risk. It would be the same with internment, unless we intern everyone simply on the say so of someone - which brings us neatly to your last sentence [emoji6]
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22 hours ago, oaksoft said:

Heed your warning? :lol:

Criiiiinge.

Where did I call you a racist?

You know where and i am not going to repeat it.  Neither should you, as it came from your head and fingers, not mine.  Have a good look at yourself.

For those still asking who I deem as '"They" or "them" are, I have already answered that, but for the final time: “No sides on my part.  Extremists who are on the Security Forces radar as likely terrorists or promoters of such”  GET THEM OFF THE STREETS!

22 hours ago, DougJamie said:

Your point is totally flawed and self defeating

What we call evil, some call purification

What we call normal, others call evil

 

 So- Get WHO off the streets

This is the issue here, we don't interact with our Muslim friends, we cant look at a short term solution here as that's making martyrs.  

Its has to be a change in culture and mindest, bring communities together , don't divide, we seem to forget its one planet. Is that fat boot that tortured and killed her child anything different from a " terrorist"

Change in views starting now, "extremist" is our terminology, and those that cause harm believe they are right. So we have to break walls not build them ...

That's the only way you can possibly stop this. This is not a new issue, its thousands of years that man has try be different....

Jesus there is more hostility towards the DUP than there is so called ISIS ( ON THE STREETS)

 

You seem to be following the same line as Oaksoft here... are the only extremists Muslim extremists?

21 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:


The last sentence was me trying to show that despite being reported 5 times the security services deemed him not to be a sufficient risk. It would be the same with internment, unless we intern everyone simply on the say so of someone - which brings us neatly to your last sentence emoji6.png

We don't know the details of the 5 reports and the SF (Security Forces) decision.  I am surmising here, but the SF may well have been tailing him, hoping to gain info on other extremists.  My point on Internment is that the guy should have been interred, not tailed, thus saving innocent lives. 

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  • 7 months later...

I haven't found any racism coming from Mr Robinson. 

He seems to be against very bad extremists who are doing harm to innocents. 

Anyway, we are all one Race  

So Racism doesn't really exist 

Just Cnuts picking on others that they perceive to be different 

Like a ginger haired person getting bullied at school, workplace or wherever. 

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2 hours ago, shull said:

I haven't found any racism coming from Mr Robinson. 

He seems to be against very bad extremists who are doing harm to innocents. 

Anyway, we are all one Race  

So Racism doesn't really exist 

Just Cnuts picking on others that they perceive to be different 

Like a ginger haired person getting bullied at school, workplace or wherever. 

He founded the EDL.

A vile racist and sectarian organisation that preaches hate against minorities.

Why can't you see he is morally corrupt?

Edited by Longtimecoming
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10 minutes ago, Longtimecoming said:

He founded the EDL.

A vile racist and sectarian organisation that preaches hate against minorities.

Why can't you see he is morally corrupt?

Show examples of Mr Robinson preaching hate since left the English Defence League, or even examples while he was a member.

And why did he leave the English Defence League ?

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