The Original 59er

Nah 59er. There was definitely guns on both sides.
Tedious Tom telt me and he should know, he was there!

We almost beat that
ST MIRREN FC  2( POPULATION 76000) SPARTANS ( 300) 2  

To be fair, the state of the pitch was very poor

Apparently pitchforks aren't much of a defence against muskets, and to use present day football analogy, disorganised rabble generally all at sea with instructions and lost the dressing room. 

Thanks mate
 
Ok I have updated it marked it and Fixed it  for his next job

I believe TF said something along the lines "we wanted and went for a Manager with First Class experience of the Premier Division" -  or something to that effect!
 
Googled it...........................: 
“He’s a leader, plays exciting football and his recruitment is very good when you see the quality players he brought to Hibs. He knows the Scottish game inside out and he’s a brilliant coach who can get the best out of the academy boys.
“Alan has real stature and made history by winning the Scottish Cup with Hibs.” 

Delighted that someone has managed to get this back on topic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ever since I started supporting Saints and that is a long time back ()............. I watched scores of buses heading along the Glasgow Road towards either Darkheid or Ipox and initially wondered why they dragged so many people out of Paisley when there was a wonderful football club in their own town.
Then I learnt of religious divides and bigotry and even then could maybe understand why some of them went east, but not all. You then realise they were generally glory hunters or they just plainly followed their father's ideological mistakes .
Even when we were at our best and challenged the OF by staying at the top end of the top league until Christmas we might have got 15,000 or even 18,000 at an OF match - I remember a particularly foggy game against Rangers at Love St when I think Hughie Gilshan scored the winner, and also attending a Celtic game when you feared that a beer can  full of p*ss would be poured down your leg or sprayed all over you as it was tossed from the back of the vile mob that stood behind you.
Even in these days a crowd of 6,000 for a 'run of the mill' match was good going at LS and it really summed up our problem, in that no matter how well we played and no matter how competitive we were, the ugly sisters drained our town of mistakenly potential misguided supporters. Even in Fergie's days when he went round the housing estates with a tannoy attached to the top of the car and urged supporters to come along and see his young exciting team it didn't manage to encourage much more than 5 or 6,000 to a game. 
Also we are considered a stepping stone for players and we have as long as I can remember, (e.g. Tottie Beck, George McLean, Frank McAvennie, Tommy Bryceland, Billy Thomson, Tony Fitzpatrick, Billy Stark, Frank McGarvey, Ian Ferguson, Lewis Morgan etc, etc to name just a few), we have managed to hold on to them for a short while until they attract the attention of the OF or someone down south who snaps them up and gives us some financial breathing space for a season or two more.
So, I wouldn't hold your breath in this day of multi-TV matches and alternative attractions on a Saturday, but for those who enjoy the UPS and downs of supporting a local team, we at least  offer our merry band an occasional exciting visit to the National Stadium, or a season to remember to stick firmly in the memory bank for another few years.
 
Good luck OK, I personally wish your tenure at St Mirren to be as long and fruitful as possible. 

Brilliant post 59er. 

Delighted that someone has managed to get this back on topic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ever since I started supporting Saints and that is a long time back ()............. I watched scores of buses heading along the Glasgow Road towards either Darkheid or Ipox and initially wondered why they dragged so many people out of Paisley when there was a wonderful football club in their own town.
Then I learnt of religious divides and bigotry and even then could maybe understand why some of them went east, but not all. You then realise they were generally glory hunters or they just plainly followed their father's ideological mistakes .
Even when we were at our best and challenged the OF by staying at the top end of the top league until Christmas we might have got 15,000 or even 18,000 at an OF match - I remember a particularly foggy game against Rangers at Love St when I think Hughie Gilshan scored the winner, and also attending a Celtic game when you feared that a beer can  full of p*ss would be poured down your leg or sprayed all over you as it was tossed from the back of the vile mob that stood behind you.
Even in these days a crowd of 6,000 for a 'run of the mill' match was good going at LS and it really summed up our problem, in that no matter how well we played and no matter how competitive we were, the ugly sisters drained our town of mistakenly potential misguided supporters. Even in Fergie's days when he went round the housing estates with a tannoy attached to the top of the car and urged supporters to come along and see his young exciting team it didn't manage to encourage much more than 5 or 6,000 to a game. 
Also we are considered a stepping stone for players and we have as long as I can remember, (e.g. Tottie Beck, George McLean, Frank McAvennie, Tommy Bryceland, Billy Thomson, Tony Fitzpatrick, Billy Stark, Frank McGarvey, Ian Ferguson, Lewis Morgan etc, etc to name just a few), we have managed to hold on to them for a short while until they attract the attention of the OF or someone down south who snaps them up and gives us some financial breathing space for a season or two more.
So, I wouldn't hold your breath in this day of multi-TV matches and alternative attractions on a Saturday, but for those who enjoy the UPS and downs of supporting a local team, we at least  offer our merry band an occasional exciting visit to the National Stadium, or a season to remember to stick firmly in the memory bank for another few years.
 
Good luck OK, I personally wish your tenure at St Mirren to be as long and fruitful as possible. 

Delighted that someone has managed to get this back on topic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ever since I started supporting Saints and that is a long time back ()............. I watched scores of buses heading along the Glasgow Road towards either Darkheid or Ipox and initially wondered why they dragged so many people out of Paisley when there was a wonderful football club in their own town.
Then I learnt of religious divides and bigotry and even then could maybe understand why some of them went east, but not all. You then realise they were generally glory hunters or they just plainly followed their father's ideological mistakes .
Even when we were at our best and challenged the OF by staying at the top end of the top league until Christmas we might have got 15,000 or even 18,000 at an OF match - I remember a particularly foggy game against Rangers at Love St when I think Hughie Gilshan scored the winner, and also attending a Celtic game when you feared that a beer can  full of p*ss would be poured down your leg or sprayed all over you as it was tossed from the back of the vile mob that stood behind you.
Even in these days a crowd of 6,000 for a 'run of the mill' match was good going at LS and it really summed up our problem, in that no matter how well we played and no matter how competitive we were, the ugly sisters drained our town of mistakenly potential misguided supporters. Even in Fergie's days when he went round the housing estates with a tannoy attached to the top of the car and urged supporters to come along and see his young exciting team it didn't manage to encourage much more than 5 or 6,000 to a game. 
Also we are considered a stepping stone for players and we have as long as I can remember, (e.g. Tottie Beck, George McLean, Frank McAvennie, Tommy Bryceland, Billy Thomson, Tony Fitzpatrick, Billy Stark, Frank McGarvey, Ian Ferguson, Lewis Morgan etc, etc to name just a few), we have managed to hold on to them for a short while until they attract the attention of the OF or someone down south who snaps them up and gives us some financial breathing space for a season or two more.
So, I wouldn't hold your breath in this day of multi-TV matches and alternative attractions on a Saturday, but for those who enjoy the UPS and downs of supporting a local team, we at least  offer our merry band an occasional exciting visit to the National Stadium, or a season to remember to stick firmly in the memory bank for another few years.
 
Good luck OK, I personally wish your tenure at St Mirren to be as long and fruitful as possible. 

Spade and shovel come to mind!  

Yes the BoD's have reacted much more quickly than in TC's reign, but that doesn't get away from the fact that they have hardly shown themselves up to be prudent custodians of the club!
I repeat the question:"what good self-respecting person would want to take this gig"?!
I'm not convinced that the mistakes the Board have made and the rumblings coming from the way that all this has been handled make us a likely target for any aspiring manager who sees us as a step up and provides them with any form of job stability any longer than 1 year (near enough our average length of time through 7 managers since 2010) 

Wait until the supporters take over. They'll show them how to be prudent custodians.  
First thing  to replace is  the crystal ball.

When you interview and get to a point of thinking "this is the best person for the job", it is incumbent on you to then do your homework on their CV and get more than one bit of feedback on a range of their managerial qualities, especially if you are going to offer them a 3 year contract!
Football is such an open forum these days and someone, somewhere from Everton, Hibs or Rotherham should have been able to give our BoD's the low-down on his man management, dressing-room feel and his effectiveness at the training ground that would have allowed them to fully consider the appointment before any offer was made..................  Do you think our Board went through that process  ?

When you interview and get to a point of thinking "this is the best person for the job", it is incumbent on you to then do your homework on their CV and get more than one bit of feedback on a range of their managerial qualities, especially if you are going to offer them a 3 year contract!
Football is such an open forum these days and someone, somewhere from Everton, Hibs or Rotherham should have been able to give our BoD's the low-down on his man management, dressing-room feel and his effectiveness at the training ground that would have allowed them to fully consider the appointment before any offer was made..................  Do you think our Board went through that process  ?

Took a step back last night when the confirmation came through our manager had been sacked after four league games. It seems the co-ordinated campaign to de-stabilise him with leak, after leak from players, directors and staff got the result they wanted? And please, dont insult either your, or my intelligence sugesting this wasnt a club endorsed approach to build up an Anti Stubbs mob, so the board could make it look like they were getting it right by eventually sacking him.
this shit-strewn type of dirty campaign has been run by clubs before, including ours, and always comes with a much higher cost than those who endorsed and encouraged it ever conceive. So what now? Whats the club strategy now they have succeeded in smearing their own employee?
looking for a new manager? Well yes someone will always take the job, its a job at the end of the day. Question is..? What manager worth their salt will be really interested now? So far names bandied about are Gus Mc Pherson who has just had his team relegated to league two. Then their is club legend Jim Goodwin whose recently promoted Alloa are no better off than us, in a lower league (i wonder if his bosses& players are trying to oust him?). And the other name mentioned is Jim McIntyre, who in his last job won just TWO of his first NINETEEN games in this very league..!
honest opinions, does anyone see either of those three gents being able to lead us to the promised land of Premiership survival given, they will have to work with the self same group of players their predecessor did? I mean if the players dont like the next guy, (Gus and McIntyre suffered this at our club and county) will he be gone after three, four, five defeats..?
and what of this squad? The 'DownToolers'... not exactly covered themselves in glory with their attitudes, whining, performances and finger-pointing. We've had the captain no less, in the media blaming all the new recruits for our poor performances..! Nice to see, like his former manager he's got his teammates backs..! What i think may now be taken out of the club, and players hands is one or more of the loaning clubs taking their players back, as the set up the originally agreed to loan into has changed drastically with the departure of the high level coach (Stubbs) they intrusted their player to.
it was interesting to read on here last night, after the confirmation of Stubbs departure, a more considered group of posters showing genuine concern as to where the club, under this board is heading. Their is a growing concern the board are non-functioning, reactive, poor decision makers and completely lacking in self-belief. How else do you explain the circus around Ross trying almost all of last season to get another job? Feck me he was never off the motorways of the UK taking interviews. Then the drawn out process to replace him, with the board assuring us that in Stubbs... they had found their man. They said;
Stubbs was the "standout candidate".
"He fits in perfectly with the philosophy of the club of promoting young players throughout the team,". "Our youth policy is vital to us and he'll be able to bring those players on.
"He's a fantastic coach, great man manager. He's also got a great presence and I think he will be successful here.
"He's someone the fans will take to and they will get a real lift. He's a well known name and he's a really good person. It's a fantastic fit for the football club."
this after interviewing McIntyre, Caldwell and Kearney...
how could they get it all so completely wrong? Did Stubbs have Mourinho do the interviews for him?
this board need hunting, i dont think its a coincidence that David Nicol the Smisa rep is standing down early. If he's seen through their collective failings, and smear tactics i wouldnt blame him for letting some other poor bugger have to keep their mouths shut for fearnof swallowing the shit they are shoulder deep in.

In answer to the above; "When we did play them I seem to recall that they scored 4 against us.  " - at least we had shots on goal and scored some last year!
 
The wider issue that concerns me here is the fact that our signings seem to have been random and (on the face of it) unplanned. 
I accept that the move up from the Championship to the PL necessitated a change in personnel in certain areas, but unless you can be assured that the replacements are better than the ones that are going, then don't throw the bath water out too early!
In a perfect world you have a system where you (as Manager) presumably see a gap in the team set up and discuss that with the coach, general manager and chairman and then draw up a potential list of target replacements. You attempt to get the best but the 2nd or 3rd targets should still be a better option than what you already have.
So far I have seen maybe one possible incomer that gives me hope, otherwise I get the firm impression that the policy has been to sign up players on the back of their agent's videos / best bits (on the field) and on the strength of these clips they have moved to Paisley either on loan or signing up for at least a year and probably two. The agent's clips, by the way, don't show lack of effort, long periods on mundanity, or glaring misses in front of goal. What happened to good old scouting and checking a player out for a few weeks before you made the approach.
I would happily draw up dossiers on target players, watch them perform on the park and comprehensively report on any player that we intended signing. That of course isn't happening with AS and whilst JR could see what he needed to bring in, to achieve the escape and then the promotion,  AS hasn't got that same savvy and the recruitment policy has been all over the place.
 
I see a long bumpy ride ahead of us again this season.  i.e. a slow ever so painful 
 
 

I posted an extract from this one previous year................ it looks wholly appropriate for this year also :
And in the naked light I saw
Ten thousand people, maybe more
People talking without speaking
People hearing without listening
People writing songs that voices never share
And no one dared
Disturb the sound of silence   Fools, said I, you do not know
Silence like a cancer grows
Hear my words that I might teach you
Take my arms that I might reach you
But my words, like silent raindrops fell
And echoed in the wells of silence

I posted an extract from this one previous year................ it looks wholly appropriate for this year also :
And in the naked light I saw
Ten thousand people, maybe more
People talking without speaking
People hearing without listening
People writing songs that voices never share
And no one dared
Disturb the sound of silence   Fools, said I, you do not know
Silence like a cancer grows
Hear my words that I might teach you
Take my arms that I might reach you
But my words, like silent raindrops fell
And echoed in the wells of silence

My point in another post. However sticking to the theme of this post, I don't want AS to fail, in fact I don't want any Saints Manager to fail when they are appointed, and given we have had 29 Managers since 1961 each lasting under an average of 2 years that is a lot of Managers I have hoped would do well.
I have seen quite a number of Saint's teams flounder over the years and it has been more common than having a successful year. That having been said I have seen us challenge at the top end of the league right up to Christmas and also if you take the Watford example of a well organised team getting a good start in the league it makes for lot's of positives all around the place both on and off the field.
Last year you could see the feel-good factor on the field and each player played their part in what turned out to be a slightly unexpected, very successful season. This year I almost see the opposite. Yes they are virtually a new set of players or at least a different group trying to play together, but I don't see that tell-tale gelling on the park. I suspect that the character of AS isn't the same as JR and he hasn't the same approach with the players.
 
Oh to dream of a Watford feel good factor! 

My point in another post. However sticking to the theme of this post, I don't want AS to fail, in fact I don't want any Saints Manager to fail when they are appointed, and given we have had 29 Managers since 1961 each lasting under an average of 2 years that is a lot of Managers I have hoped would do well.
I have seen quite a number of Saint's teams flounder over the years and it has been more common than having a successful year. That having been said I have seen us challenge at the top end of the league right up to Christmas and also if you take the Watford example of a well organised team getting a good start in the league it makes for lot's of positives all around the place both on and off the field.
Last year you could see the feel-good factor on the field and each player played their part in what turned out to be a slightly unexpected, very successful season. This year I almost see the opposite. Yes they are virtually a new set of players or at least a different group trying to play together, but I don't see that tell-tale gelling on the park. I suspect that the character of AS isn't the same as JR and he hasn't the same approach with the players.
 
Oh to dream of a Watford feel good factor! 

In answer to the above; "When we did play them I seem to recall that they scored 4 against us.  " - at least we had shots on goal and scored some last year!
 
The wider issue that concerns me here is the fact that our signings seem to have been random and (on the face of it) unplanned. 
I accept that the move up from the Championship to the PL necessitated a change in personnel in certain areas, but unless you can be assured that the replacements are better than the ones that are going, then don't throw the bath water out too early!
In a perfect world you have a system where you (as Manager) presumably see a gap in the team set up and discuss that with the coach, general manager and chairman and then draw up a potential list of target replacements. You attempt to get the best but the 2nd or 3rd targets should still be a better option than what you already have.
So far I have seen maybe one possible incomer that gives me hope, otherwise I get the firm impression that the policy has been to sign up players on the back of their agent's videos / best bits (on the field) and on the strength of these clips they have moved to Paisley either on loan or signing up for at least a year and probably two. The agent's clips, by the way, don't show lack of effort, long periods on mundanity, or glaring misses in front of goal. What happened to good old scouting and checking a player out for a few weeks before you made the approach.
I would happily draw up dossiers on target players, watch them perform on the park and comprehensively report on any player that we intended signing. That of course isn't happening with AS and whilst JR could see what he needed to bring in, to achieve the escape and then the promotion,  AS hasn't got that same savvy and the recruitment policy has been all over the place.
 
I see a long bumpy ride ahead of us again this season.  i.e. a slow ever so painful 
 
 

Unfortunately it's a forum where adults get to behave like children and often spit the dummy out.  

I'll start with the Statistics:
•    Match Stats
Home Team          Aberdeen                        Away Team    St Mirren
Possession            Home63%                                  Away37%
Shots                        Home23                                      Away7
Shots on Target  Home12                                      Away2
Corners                   Home6                                        Away2
Fouls                         Home12                                     Away9

•    Match Stats
Home Team           Rangers                            Away Team    St Mirren
Possession             Home59%                       Away41%
Shots                         Home11                           Away6
Shots on Target   Home8                              Away1
Corners                    Home5                             Away4
Fouls                          Home11                          Away18

•    Match Stats
Home Team            St Mirren                        Away Team    Livingston
Possession              Home51%                      Away49%
Shots                          Home5                             Away13
Shots on Target    Home0                             Away8
Corners                     Home5                            Away6
Fouls                           Home9                            Away9
 
I can accept that the possession against Aberdeen was always going to be difficult, but against a 10 man Rangers it was poor and from all accounts from those who were there it was 2 goals against which could have been 6.
The really worrying stat is shots and shots on target. Over three  games we have had 18 shots of which 3 have been on target, whilst the opposition have had 47 shots of which 28 have been on target.
It doesn't take a mathematician to work out that if a team has only 3 shots on target in three games there is a disastrously worrying aspect in the team that is missing and it's not just that we lack a goal scorer, we also lack players that can put the ball into the danger areas that allow shots on target.
47 shots against, also suggests that between midfield and defence we are in for an extremely long season.
 
I'll now turn to the Lies:
1)       We have a team of players that is playing for the manager or the coach.
2)       The Manager and coach have developed a feel good factor in the dressing room.
3)       We will finish in the top 6 - given current form and team formations.
4)       The Manager and coaches have scoured the market and brought in players that have obviously improved the squad and are capable of holding their own in this league.
5)      We are a team that has made advances on and off the field since last season
 
I am extremely disappointed in many aspects relating to the start to this season and I am already deeply worried that if this form and level of statistics continues we will be deeply mired in the relegation spots long before Christmas. I personally don't think that a Kenny Miller signing is the real answer. He brings baggage, he is in his very late 30's and has stepped down from a management role to continue playing. If this is the best AS can do, I could well stop coming to watch this season. 
Panic and desperation are setting in at such an early point in the season!

I'll start with the Statistics:
•    Match Stats
Home Team          Aberdeen                        Away Team    St Mirren
Possession            Home63%                                  Away37%
Shots                        Home23                                      Away7
Shots on Target  Home12                                      Away2
Corners                   Home6                                        Away2
Fouls                         Home12                                     Away9

•    Match Stats
Home Team           Rangers                            Away Team    St Mirren
Possession             Home59%                       Away41%
Shots                         Home11                           Away6
Shots on Target   Home8                              Away1
Corners                    Home5                             Away4
Fouls                          Home11                          Away18

•    Match Stats
Home Team            St Mirren                        Away Team    Livingston
Possession              Home51%                      Away49%
Shots                          Home5                             Away13
Shots on Target    Home0                             Away8
Corners                     Home5                            Away6
Fouls                           Home9                            Away9
 
I can accept that the possession against Aberdeen was always going to be difficult, but against a 10 man Rangers it was poor and from all accounts from those who were there it was 2 goals against which could have been 6.
The really worrying stat is shots and shots on target. Over three  games we have had 18 shots of which 3 have been on target, whilst the opposition have had 47 shots of which 28 have been on target.
It doesn't take a mathematician to work out that if a team has only 3 shots on target in three games there is a disastrously worrying aspect in the team that is missing and it's not just that we lack a goal scorer, we also lack players that can put the ball into the danger areas that allow shots on target.
47 shots against, also suggests that between midfield and defence we are in for an extremely long season.
 
I'll now turn to the Lies:
1)       We have a team of players that is playing for the manager or the coach.
2)       The Manager and coach have developed a feel good factor in the dressing room.
3)       We will finish in the top 6 - given current form and team formations.
4)       The Manager and coaches have scoured the market and brought in players that have obviously improved the squad and are capable of holding their own in this league.
5)      We are a team that has made advances on and off the field since last season
 
I am extremely disappointed in many aspects relating to the start to this season and I am already deeply worried that if this form and level of statistics continues we will be deeply mired in the relegation spots long before Christmas. I personally don't think that a Kenny Miller signing is the real answer. He brings baggage, he is in his very late 30's and has stepped down from a management role to continue playing. If this is the best AS can do, I could well stop coming to watch this season. 
Panic and desperation are setting in at such an early point in the season!