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Yflab

Saints
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  1. Like
    Yflab reacted to div in This Forum, It's Rules and Your Behaviour   
    I've just read through the latest batch of complaints on the forum and thought I'd just remind you all about a few key things.
    Threats of Violence
    The forum is all about opinions, and we won't always agree. If another poster is annoying you then you can choose to ignore their posts using the "ignore members" option. This is available by clicking where it says "signed in as....." at the top of the forum. You will see an option of "Manage Ignored Users" there.
    The same goes for guests of other clubs who come on and join in the forum. Although this is a Saints board it doesn't do much harm to have a few opposition fans drop in from time to time, and can help liven things up. By all means berate them and their team but there is no need to resort to making threats of violence.
    Religious Bigotry
    Religious bigotry also won't be tolerated, as per our rules and regulations which are clearly linked at the top of the forum. You don't need me to tell you there is a big focus on online religious bigotry and people even being carpeted in court and getting custodial sentences for posting certain remarks on the internet.
    We are all collectively responsible for ensuring that the board stays clear of this sort of thing which has absolutely no place in Scottish society let alone football. Leave the religious stuff to the two ugly sisters up the road, we are all better than that and above it so keep it off the board please and if you do see the sort of stuff I am talking about please use the report button.
    Moderation
    The mod team has suffered a bit in recent months due to technical issues, changes in circumstances, lack of time. Tom, David and NSS all do an admirable job when they are online but it's fair to say I myself have not devoted as much time as I should have done to keeping the place ticking over. That will change now, I will undertake to review the complaints panel every day so if there is anything on the forum which you think is breaking the rules, please use the report button and I or one of the other mods will deal with it.
    The future
    There are hopefully the first green shoots of some exciting things beginning to happen on the park. Off the park we have a lot going on. At times like these the forum should be coming into it's own as the best place to discuss all things St.Mirren. This is without doubt the busiest online forum for Saints fans and it will continue to exist for a very long time to come yet but we all have to play our part in making it reflect well on the club. At times recently I am sure some of the stuff on here has been an embarassment to St.Mirren.
    Please think about the above, get involved with the forum and remember that first and foremost we are ALL St.Mirren supporters.
    Ta
  2. Like
    Yflab reacted to Gordon Urquhart in Is the CIC dead?   
    Seems like it.
    The most disappointing thing is the way the relatively high profile individuals concerned seem to have chucked it. Not updating basic information sources such as this forum or the Facebook page, when they were all over it when it suited them, is a shame.
    If there is a major factor or blockage stopping it happening then come out and say so, don't just disappear and pretend it never happened. Poor show.
  3. Like
    Yflab reacted to Big Fras in Its time   
    It was a simple statement:
    If the CIC is paying over the odds for the club do you think this is right ?
    Do you think this helps the CIC going forward ?
    Do you think that given the complete lack of any suitable buyers, and the economic sh*tsorm that prevails and may get worse, that the CIC could put in a "revised" bid for immediate completion and speed up the freeing up of CIC cash ?
    And BTW I've supported this club for my entire life, and far from running thm down, i have taken several opportunities to "big them up" through some stuff I did for the likes 4-4-2 and talkSport.
    Ever since my old man stuck me up on his shoulders at the old LS end in 1975, I've had no dalliance with any other team........ unlike you Shaint Shid, the shameless shamrock shagging shitehawk (as Shhhhir Shhhean Connery would say)
  4. Like
    Yflab reacted to Big Fras in Its time   
    Semi-serious point:
    I think the CIC model is great. My main concern is that it is immediately saddled with too much debt, and a huge amount of the initial "payback" from supporters and community backers is going straight into managing that debt.
    This is entirely down to the ludicrous fee being asked by the BoD for the club. Good luck to them if they can get away with it, but with no other bidder to be seen for miles, I think RA is in a position of strength here. Its probably too late, but I would be looking at a "re-evaluation" of the selling price, with a guarantee of fixing the deal as a consequence. Nothing personal, just simple business - supply and demand, etc.
    This may cheer up any knicker-wetting public funders, and would also ensure that it speeds up the time where the monies coming in can be spent backing the team on the pitch, which is what we all want to see.
    In short:
    CIC - good concept. Could be great for the club if actioned properly.
    REA good guy - with genuine intentions.
    Big problem - CIC loaded with unneccesarily high debt due to agreeing to an asking price that nobody else is prepared to go anywhere near (quite rightly), thus reducing its effectiveness in the critical first 12-36 months.
    No problem with the BoD getting their slice from all the work they have out in, but a wee bit of realism is surely warranted here, after all the deal has always been to sell to someone for "the good of the club". Loading a rookie organisation up to the gills with debt due an unjustifiably high asking price is not good for the club.
    I can imagine the Dragon's Den scenario. A football club Director meets Duncan "I'm fae Clydebank no' Glasgow" Bannatyne :
    Director: I would like £2 million pounds for 52% of my business.
    Dragon: So you value your business at nearly £4m pounds?
    Director: Yes
    Dragon: What profit did you show last year?
    Director: Er....nothing
    Dragon: What assets does your company hold?
    Director: We have a Football stadium with a value of f**k all as land can be purchased locally for very little. That's on the basis that you Dragons - or any bank - would want the option of building houses or a supermarket on it if this goes tits up.We have players on contracts which are all due to expire within 2 years. They are not "top end" players so I suppose the value of those would be..........f**k all.
    Dragon: What plans do you have for expansion within the market?
    Director: Well, Scottish football is going through a major downturn as attendances fall, sponsorship diminishes and Television deals are being squeezed every year, so I suppose we have f**k all chance of any growth in the next 100 years.
    Dragon: Do you have anything positive to tell us?
    Director: Well I have persuaded a pleasant businessman to buy the business using the Public Purse and have the debts for this paid off by business groups & supporters who presently really don't have a clue what they will get for their money. Its a great idea and commendably involves the community and supporters - but that lot have got to worry about paying me back first .......because they are going to pay my valuation, even though it bears no relation to the real world.
    Dragon: (Ashen faced Bannatyne) f**k me ragged, you should be sitting here!!!!
  5. Like
    Yflab reacted to flyingscot in Meeting on Thursday Confirmed   
    I thought it was a very good meeting and being the first I made it to, I was impressed with RA and others talking.
    Some funny moments too, the best being when RA was saying OF going out of Europe was bad news as we lose money and someone said "that's a price worth paying"
  6. Downvote
    Yflab reacted in Meeting on Thursday Confirmed   
    All done in 6 weeks??? And christmas mentioned too! But still funding not granted! as Johnny Logan said "Whats another year?"
    Forgot the best bit in classic Father Ted style "The new company has been set up so the £2m knicker can just "Rest There" until it goes to the selling consortium"
  7. Like
    Yflab reacted to div in Meeting on Thursday Confirmed   
    Good summary from Dibble
    Some other points;
    798 people have pledged individual support for the CIC
    Around 500 of those have returned completed direct debit forms
    The 24 target for community members has been reached and surpassed
    The corporate membership target is difficult to measure as some corporate organisations are looking to group together to take out joint/group membership. The CIC welcomes this approach but there are some concerns about ensuring voting rights remain fair among the corporate members so this is still being worked through.
    There is a 22 page document which outlines the processes and procedures that will underpin the CIC and this document is currently being worked on and refined ready for launch.
    The construction of the members bar area will begin as soon as the deal is completed. The design, costings, contractors etc are all in place and the experience of GLS in the project will be very valuable given his experience in the construction industry and the build of the stadium.
    Complete aside, but the elimination of Celtic, Rangers and Hearts from Europe tonight will cost Saints "several thousand pounds" due to some sort of UEFA "solidarity fund" whatever that is
    Some of the funding to complete the deal is sitting in a bank account but the CIC don't want to draw it down until the full £2m is in place.
    There will be an interim football board appointed on completion of the deal who will steer the club through to the AGM which takes place in December. Those board members will be able to stand for election at that time if they so wish. The initial interim board will be made up of individuals within the CIC who it is felt have the best skills to deal with the early challenges. I'd expect GLS and Tony Fitz to both join that board but that part is just my opinion !
    GLS will not be "representing the 48%" as such. He feels that divisions like 48% vs CIC are negative and that everyone should pull together and work together to take the club forward once the deal completes.
    Deal "should" complete any time now, but after that it will be "around 6 weeks" before all the legal paperwork is completed, the shares change hands, and the CIC becomes the majority shareholder in the club.
    The kit deal with JD is very financially rewarding for the club and whilst there have been teething problems (availability of socks etc) the general result of the kit and training kit deal with JD has been very good for the club. There was absolutely no fall out with Alan Provan.
    The club retains the rights to the merchandising (ie all the other club related stuff) and is working on improving the club shop. This will merge with the ticket office to allow fans much more accessibility to buy Saints merchandise (and tickets !) as well as up-selling gear when people are in buying match tickets. It was accepted that the club shop could be better but the club is trialling ranges at the moment to work out what sells and does not want to tie up lots of cash in stock. All lines are on very short order lead times so stock will be replenished between home games.
    The cash flow problems that have dogged the club in recent years have been worked on very hard over the last year and the current budget, which makes no provision at all for ANY cup cash or extra TV games, should mean there are no cash flow issues, but there is provision to cover any issue in future (through Maxi) if it were needed in an emergency situation.
    I think they are the salient points I can remember !
  8. Like
    Yflab reacted to Dibbles old paperboy in Meeting on Thursday Confirmed   
    Just back from the meeting. RA said the deal is 99% done and has been held up by a technical issue which has been dragging on for a few weeks and until the deal is done he can't share what the hold up has been but he is dying to explain it all once the deal has gone through. RA also said he has been told by the last funder that he should have no concerns about their money arriving and it is a formality. Tony Fitzpatrick answered questions and said he was aware of online rumours claiming he had fallen out with the CIC people or lost interest in it and said those were rubbish... it did sound as if he had been worried at one point that the deal might not happen or was frustrated by the delays but he is still very positive about the CIC being the way forward. Gordon Scott answered questions too and explained it has only been in the last couple of weeks that he has taken an interest in the CIC and reached the view that despite his initial ignorance of how a CIC worked and questions about how it could benefit St Mirren FC he has been won over and supports it and would consider standing for election to the new board when the deal goes through. He was asked about his own offer to buy the club and said he offered what he thought was a fair price and when he was asked whether he thought it was better that the CIC took over the majority shareholding or whether he'd been successful he said he preferred the CIC route and joked that this was because it saved him spending a fortune on St Mirren and on a more serious note he said that it can be frustrating being on the BoD and not be able to talk more to the fans about decisions and why they were made or why good things hadn't happened and he welcomed the CIC model as offering more openness with the fans as well as being able to use their skills and enthusiasm.
  9. Like
    Yflab reacted to Dibbles old paperboy in Takeover to be completed next week   
    An online alias demanding that named individuals answer their questions in a straightforward transparent manner; you cannae beat it!
  10. Downvote
    Yflab reacted to animal in Takeover to be completed next week   
    Yes you are. I simply asked a few relevant questions and all I seem to get is abuse in return. God help us if this the kind of treatment ordinary (non CIC) supporters can look forward to when you and your friends have taken over the Club I have supported for over 40 years. I do not look forward to being a second class supporter.
    Is is so hard for Mr. Bell to tell us all:-
    If Mr. Gilmour met with SMISA and persuaded them to change their minds. A simple YES or No would do.
    For Mr. Atkinson to tell us:-
    Is it true that the CIC funders will not hand over the cash unless a supporter's organisation will back the bid ?
    I really have to wonder if SMISA members understand that every penny of their money will simply go to Mr. Gilmour and will not financially benefit the club in any way. ?
  11. Like
    Yflab reacted to ktf in Takeover to be completed next week   
    Typical lack of facts and knowledge from the increasingly more silent Mag7ers... How's Yul, Animal, Animal, Yul?
    SMiSA operate a one member, one vote system. All major decisions that they make are reached by majority vote. It is simply impossible, given their constitution, to agree to something, then have a change of heart, then have their arm twisted into it again. Impossible.
    Meetings with RA re the Cic were arranged and reasonably attended, a vote on contributing to the CiC was cast and member were balloted. There was not an adequate turnout for the result to stand and so another meeting was arranged followed by another ballot. This time the turnout was much better with the overwhelming majority in favour of SMiSA contributing to the CiC with condition to be negotiated.
    That's hw it happened.
    Once again, nae luck!
  12. Like
    Yflab reacted to civilsaint in Takeover to be completed next week   
    You seem to like "stories" rather than facts. SMISA had a vote, their memebers decided to to support the CIC. Unless you are a member, the workings of SMISA are none of your business. If you are a member, take your issues or "stories" up with the appropriate members in a private forum.
    You don't do yourself any favours with your mischievious posting style.
  13. Downvote
    Yflab reacted to animal in Takeover to be completed next week   
    Heard an interesting story today at the game. Can St Sid or anyone else or even 1000000000 hours (the length of time this deal is taking) confirm or deny it ???
    1) SMISA had first agreed to hand over their £50,000 to Richard Atkinson with unknown conditions.
    2) SMISA had a change of heart and said sorry but no thanks.
    3) Mr. Gilmour met with SMISA and persuaded them to change their minds again.
    Is it true that the CIC funders will not hand over the cash unless a supporter's organisation will back the bid ?
    Does it seems OK for Mr. Gilmour to be asking SMISA to hand over their cash to Mr. Atkinson so that he can pass it right on to Mr. Gilmour ?
    Are you there Mr. Bell ? Why does the SMISA web site not work ? Is any of this true ?
  14. Like
    Yflab got a reaction from ADMITCHELL in SMiSA agree to contribute £50k to 10000 Hours CIC with conditions   
    St Sid - as I remember from the open nights the intention was to have an initial members meeting to discuss the way forward. The organisation would start to evolve from there. I think it is unfair to suggest at this stage that SMiSA would be representative of the wider support and therefore be handed any sort of role unless formal elections were carried out first. Having attended all the meetings including the SMiSA ones at no stage do I remember anything suggesting that SMiSA would be offered any positions as a result of the £50K contribution.
    One of the concerns that some SMiSA members had was handing over the full £50K lump sum was that there would no longer be a fighting fund available in the event that something unforeseen went wrong with the CiC. SMiSA have always been open with what they have done so far, and I'm sure that any conditions that are negotiated with 10000Hours will probably have to be approved by the general membership.
    I don't feel it is worth people getting hung up on the "SMiSA funding conditions" until the actual CIC external funding concludes and an initial members meeting takes place. At which stage this can be discussed openly. For people to suggest that they would not support the CiC because of this perceived issue does seem rather odd.
    I'm sure the SMiSA comittee will in due course be very open with the wider support on the conditions of the funding.
  15. Like
    Yflab got a reaction from jimdickloyal in SMiSA agree to contribute £50k to 10000 Hours CIC with conditions   
    St Sid - as I remember from the open nights the intention was to have an initial members meeting to discuss the way forward. The organisation would start to evolve from there. I think it is unfair to suggest at this stage that SMiSA would be representative of the wider support and therefore be handed any sort of role unless formal elections were carried out first. Having attended all the meetings including the SMiSA ones at no stage do I remember anything suggesting that SMiSA would be offered any positions as a result of the £50K contribution.
    One of the concerns that some SMiSA members had was handing over the full £50K lump sum was that there would no longer be a fighting fund available in the event that something unforeseen went wrong with the CiC. SMiSA have always been open with what they have done so far, and I'm sure that any conditions that are negotiated with 10000Hours will probably have to be approved by the general membership.
    I don't feel it is worth people getting hung up on the "SMiSA funding conditions" until the actual CIC external funding concludes and an initial members meeting takes place. At which stage this can be discussed openly. For people to suggest that they would not support the CiC because of this perceived issue does seem rather odd.
    I'm sure the SMiSA comittee will in due course be very open with the wider support on the conditions of the funding.
  16. Like
    Yflab reacted to reborn saint in What would you do?   
    Well that's it guys.....The deal is done. In Scottish law a nudge is as good as a wink and we move on to our future under a majority shareholding of our community interest company , 10000hrs. I have read all the posts on here which have been mainly positive and the negative, apart from a few that have been looking for more detail in the takeover. The hidden agendas and the dark places some people wish to place themselves have made up the few. As it has taken a while to acheive this and our thoughts have mainly been on "will it happen?"it is time to move on and see what we as St Mirren and Paisley can acheive. We are a true enigma of a club. Not long ago the biggest town in the UK,( population 190,000) we have suffered not only by having a majority old firm support in the town but a decline in the standard of football which has seen attendances drop off to fake saint levels. They have 23% of our population and have just as many old firm fans in ratio (and remember 70% of them don't attend any games). Our target must be to get the people in the town who either favour St Mirren but don't go to games or the ones who currently have not been interested in football, to come along and attend games. "One Town One Team" is an exellent logo which the cic can adopt to take us forward. The "tut tut" brigade formed by the people who object to "Tax payers money being used to buy a club" have no idea what this is about and should take up REA's offer to meet or shut up. The community aspect of this deal will not just deliver the minimum requirement of the funding bodies but will now far excede it. The result will be a reduction of the loan aspect of the £2m (£800,000 grant ..£1.2M loan) converting the loan part to a smaller figure. Once the company is launched there should be more target funding which has already been suggested on another thread. The worst case senario has already been explained, the best? debts paid of in 6 months...budget next season up from 1.3m to 2.2m (if we stay up} and a community that has use of the best facility ever offered at a knocked down price of between £800,000 and £1.5m depending on Grant/Loan ratio to ANY cic.
  17. Downvote
    Yflab reacted to davidg in The Club Buy Out - 10000 Hours   
    My concern from day 1 has been what happens if it fails?
    So far every one has been saying just give it a go, if it fails the shares go back up for sale, no harm done, the club is safe.......
    My concern is if it goes wrong the shares are up for sale by someone who doesn't give a toss about St Mirren FC, they will go to the highest bidder who may be borrowing from a bank to fund the purchase.
    Asked this question on the OS
    Answer from 10000hours
    If fans lose interest and it fails after a couple of years then there could be problems?
    If we were to get relegated next season, do you think we would hit the required level of subscribers? I genuinely doubt it.
    I'm still haven't made my mind up, I want it to work but deep down I am concerned.
  18. Like
    Yflab reacted to Sonny in The Club Buy Out - 10000 Hours   
    As a supporter and season ticket holder for 40 years I have been looking at all this with interest but have not commented before now.
    Nothing in life provides future-proof guarantees. There are always uncertainties with anything whether thats a job, marriage or a CIC buyout. Ultimately you can only make decisions by studying the information you currently have, seek advice or opinion elsewhere but finally you have to trust your instinct and make a choice.
    The good thing about any choice is that if it isn't the correct choice you can make another choice at a later date. Always.
    After perusing the information and opinions placed before me, I like the whole idea of the CiC model. I like the fact that the ethos is more than just the football club but is also about people out there in the community. A community spirit is something which Western society has little of. Providing opportunities to those disadvantaged or those that require support or providing frameworks for new ventures is a great goal which should also bring many benefits to the club. My knowledge, to date, and instinct tell me to endorse it.
    There are those who obviously have reservations (no pun intended, Yul). However they are making a mockery of this important debate by not addressing their reservations in an open and honest way so that issues can be addressed and dealt with. This sniping away in whispers from the corner does no-one any good and nullifies any serious points the snipers may have. If the snipers have valid points then lets hear them in an open and constructive way because at the moment they are just turning people off. And if their points are ultimately justifiable then THEY should be blamed for their childish behaviour with no 'I told you so' chest beating as they are NOT telling us coherently what these reservations are.
    This situation reminds me of Ian Gray's performances against Alex Salmond every week where all he ever did was moan away in a quiet voice without ever offering valid points or suggesting solutions. It gets boring.
    If the dissenters have something to say then say it and give us alternatives to consider or else shut up. You are helping no-one at the moment especially your own credibility. If you have valid points please make them sensibly so they can be discussed and answered by 10000hours and provide more information to the knowledge base for decision making. At the moment you are doing a dis-service to your fellow supporters.
  19. Like
    Yflab reacted to rea in The Club Buy Out - 10000 Hours   
    Sorry to disappoint you all but there is no conspiracy, let me explain.
    You will firstly notice this is coming from my personal forum account rather than 10000hours.
    This is because the financial transaction that I will discuss in a moment has nothing to do with 10000hours.
    The transaction which has resulted in the noted charge is purely a matter of the Board of St Mirren FC running the club.
    So what is all this about:
    The club as a result of the stadium move etc has been due a tax rebate of over 100K. This was expected to be in around about March 2011, but as happens with these things it took longer than intended, no fault of the club.
    Some of you may have an understanding of the bugeting process that a football club goes through and the schedueling of payments that come to the club from the likes of the SPL etc.
    Obviously the club at the beginning of the season budgeted on the tax return being in before the end of the season 2010/2011 and as it is in the best interests of the club to make sure it can spend as much money as it has avaliable on the product on the park this money was factored into the equation.
    However when the money did not come in as planned, and indeed was going to be significantly delayed the Board of Directors have to take the responsibilty to sort out any potential short term cash flow position that may end up happening
    Normally what would happen is that your Board members would all put a few thousand pounds of their own money in on a short term basis to get over any blip that may occur.
    (This is one of those things that BOD tend not to get any credit for when people are commenting on what they do for the club.)
    However the board decided that as we were in the middle of the takeover that we hoped would complete before the end of the season (rather than as is now scheduled June) that having individual directors writting money into the club could lead to some confusion and I was happy that instead Maxi Group would lend a very small amount of money on a short term basis into the club so that if cash flow became a problem while we were waiting on the Tax refund then we would be able to pay suppliers and not let anyone down.
    On the basis that we knew the tax refund was coming but just not in the timescale we hoped this seemed resonable.
    However for one Ltd company to lend to another it all needs to be done legally and above board and so the debt is registered as a charge on St Mirren FC.
    Now the payment from the Tax man arrived in on Monday and so the charge will shortly be removed and the money that was put in to prevent any cash flow issues for St Mirren and thus affect the clubs local suppliers, will be paid back.
    It is just as simple as that.
  20. Like
    Yflab reacted to div in Final Q&A & Sign Up Meeting   
    Yes I don't think that is a bad idea at all. The whole process should be transparent, open and honest. If there are those within our support that genuinely believe this project is a bad move for the club then they have to stand up and be counted and a public Q&A will give them that platform. I am sure the CIC guys would even allow those guys to take the mic and address the audience if they so wished ?
  21. Like
    Yflab reacted to 10000hours in 10000 Hours Q&A Thread   
    Fair enough a match is an event that the club hold.
    The sort of events we would be refering to would be say a wedding/or dinner that the club host such as the recent Erskine sportsmans dinner.
    In the case of that dinner Erskine were introduced to the opportunity to have the dinner at the club by 10000hours CIC.
    Erskine raised an enormous sum of money that night while the club benefited significantly from the income from the bar and one of the CIC partners Kibble provided all of the food and staff for the event
    The CIC in this case only made the introduction and made no money directly from the event.
    10000hours CIC
  22. Like
    Yflab reacted to 10000hours in 10000 Hours Q&A Thread   
    No, not true. They conducted an initail 3 week trial which has now finished they are now consulting further with their members about a more permanent move
    No.
    No one is being forced to do anything.
    Is it not perfectly understandable that a group of folk (the consortium) who have put as much blood, sweat and tears into St Mirren over the years would not of their own back decide to put some of the money back into enabling the community purchase of the club, in a way that they chose, whether that is Corporate Membership or some other way?
    No. The architect drawings and building warrant are all in place to be started as soon as we can.
    This is a forum for answering 10000hours questions, not REA questions.
    It is true that this process has taken much longer than we and the consortium had hoped.
    10000hours has not been working in a vacuum away from the consortium, both are working together on virtually a day to day basis. There were target dates some have been met some have not along the way, but all parties have been happy to continue and have understood the reasons for any delays. It is a totally transparent process behind the scenes between 10000hours CIC and the Consortium.
    However if it was a "deadline" that had passed then the deal would now be "dead" it is very much alive.
    Of course there is. If any of the parties involved did not have a significant degree of confidence in both the proposal and the ability of the team and the funding organisations to deliver the proposal then we would have stopped a long time ago. Remember lots of people are putting a lot of hard work and many hours into this for no financial return, for all of these people to be prepared to do this they have got to believe that not only is the deal possible but that it is good for the club and the community.
    What is garanteed going through is the sale of the club.
    We think the sale of the club to a community footing is both the best way to grow the club (and so improve the team) and to protect the clubs future from the "one man" owner.
    So far at least 700 individuals agree with us and so we hope shortly to make this a reality.
    We are not there yet but we are close and those who have pledged will be recieving some further info from us later today.
    10000hours CIC
  23. Downvote
    Yflab reacted to Stu in 10000 Hours Q&A Thread   
    Is that an event held by a CIC corporate/community member at the club?
    And a wee while back you said this in response to a similar question from me:
    So why in certain cases does the club now seem to get the revenue?
  24. Like
    Yflab reacted to 10000hours in 10000 Hours Q&A Thread   
    It is a members bar brought into existence becuase of the work of the 10000hours CIC membership so you will have to be a 10000hours member to use it.
    It would of course be within the power of the members at a later date to change the entry criteria if they wished.
    10000hours CIC
  25. Like
    Yflab reacted to pozbaird in Shareholders Not Joining the CIC   
    I know you've got a forum style of dry 'stick the boot in' humour Sid, and I'm genuinely not having a pop at you, but while I'm supportive of the CIC plan myself, one thing I'm really getting sick of is the increasing danger of multiple-splits into perceived factions. We've got CIC supporters, CIC dissenters, ST holders, pay-at-the-gate punters, SMiSA members, 'The forgotten 48%' shareholders, the community members, the corporate members.....
    Fcuk sake - as far as I'm concerned we're all just St Mirren supporters.
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