Speculation Thread

[Drew]

We clearly need more options in the wide areas, but if OK plays Coulson in the left mid role, we could probably get by until January.

My biggest concern is what would appear to be the paucity of goal scoring threats in the current squad. Perhaps NBM will shine now that we have a new manager, and I certainly haven't written him off, but if there is a decent striker out there who is available, I hope we would take a look.

[Callum Gilhooley]

I’m inclined to agree that those free agents will take too long to gain match fitness. Let’s hope OK can get NBM Fired up Pretty damn quickly

[Drew]

9 minutes ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

I’m inclined to agree that those free agents will take too long to gain match fitness. Let’s hope OK can get NBM Fired up Pretty damn quickly

Aye. There might be the odd gem ready to go out there, but they'll be few and far between. NBM might yet surprise us.

[MenstrieSaint]

46 minutes ago, Drew said:

Aye. There might be the odd gem ready to go out there, but they'll be few and far between. NBM might yet surprise us.

hoping we can add Cody Cooke and Josh Heaton to that list , maybe it might be better easing new players into a settled team  when injuries and suspension kick in , rather than making wholesale changes .

[Ayrshire Saints]

7 minutes ago, MenstrieSaint said:

hoping we can add Cody Cooke and Josh Heaton to that list , maybe it might be better easing new players into a settled team  when injuries and suspension kick in , rather than making wholesale changes .

Those two need to go out on loan imo (once fit enough) - they didn't look anywhere near the standard required yet but they are both young and with no experience of Scottish football a spell out on loan up here would do them both the power of good and help us to establish if they are good enough or not.

[Drew]

8 minutes ago, Ayrshire Saints said:

Those two need to go out on loan imo (once fit enough) - they didn't look anywhere near the standard required yet but they are both young and with no experience of Scottish football a spell out on loan up here would do them both the power of good and help us to establish if they are good enough or not.

Cooke is 25, so not sure whether he qualifies for 'young' in football playing terms, but I tend to agree that loan deals would make sense.

[St.Ricky]

27 minutes ago, MenstrieSaint said:

hoping we can add Cody Cooke and Josh Heaton to that list , maybe it might be better easing new players into a settled team  when injuries and suspension kick in , rather than making wholesale changes .

This makes sense to me. I haven't seen enough of these guys to make any final judgement but we need to keep a decent squad size.

[pod]

16 minutes ago, St.Ricky said:

This makes sense to me. I haven't seen enough of these guys to make any final judgement but we need to keep a decent squad size.

Nobody has. 

[Wendy Saintss]

34 minutes ago, pod said:

Nobody has. 

What the 3 above *really* mean is that they personally haven't seen enough of these guys to make their own personal judgement and that is why they want them out on loan.

In reality, it makes no difference whatsoever if the 3 above haven't seen much of them in action. Its the manager who counts and he'll see them in training every day.

[St.Ricky]

26 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

What the 3 above *really* mean is that they personally haven't seen enough of these guys to make their own personal judgement and that is why they want them out on loan.

In reality, it makes no difference whatsoever if the 3 above haven't seen much of them in action. Its the manager who counts and he'll see them in training every day.

As one of the above 3, I don't want them going out on loan.  I want them in and about the club.  The manager will have time to guide,  coach and improve them before January.  This is fair to the players and suits our needs.  If they, or any others,  are felt to be surplus to needs then they go when he is able to bring in better.  Nothing wrong there.  Theoretically that's what created the opportunity for them in the first  place. 

[pod]

58 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

What the 3 above *really* mean is that they personally haven't seen enough of these guys to make their own personal judgement and that is why they want them out on loan.

In reality, it makes no difference whatsoever if the 3 above haven't seen much of them in action. Its the manager who counts and he'll see them in training every day.

Why don't we wait and see what they can do under a new manager.  We need players at present and there's always January if the need to farm them out.  My Opinion. 

[Sonny]

I would certainly put Heaton and Cooke out on loan.

I watched Heaton play 90mins against the part-time amateurs of QP and he was poor. Considering Heaton is now 5th choice centre back (6th when GaryMac is back), with no knowledge of Scottish football and not getting game time then a loan period would suit him (remember that he would still be training with us) and us.

I have only seen Cooke for 55 mins against Spartans when he was then subbed. A very poor display from him. He is 25 and never played full-time football professional football in his life. Again he needs game time at a higher level than English National League South.

Neither of these players at the moment are anywhere near capable of walking into a Premiership team IMHO. A loan move would give us a chance to see what level they can play at in the short term.

[Hendo]

11 minutes ago, Sonny said:

I would certainly put Heaton and Cooke out on loan.

I watched Heaton play 90mins against the part-time amateurs of QP and he was poor. Considering Heaton is now 5th choice centre back (6th when GaryMac is back), with no knowledge of Scottish football and not getting game time then a loan period would suit him (remember that he would still be training with us) and us.

I have only seen Cooke for 55 mins against Spartans when he was then subbed. A very poor display from him. He is 25 and never played full-time football professional football in his life. Again he needs game time at a higher level than English National League South.

Neither of these players at the moment are anywhere near capable of walking into a Premiership team IMHO. A loan move would give us a chance to see what level they can play at in the short term.

I would still hold out a lot of hope for Heaton. Darlington fans really rated him, championship clubs in England were looking at him. It's quite unfair to judge him on one bad game under an incompetent manager. Likewise, Cooke has only played in a shambolic team, though his age and relative mediocre career before joining us probably makes him less likely to be a success.

[Lord Pityme]

Given the window is shut, given their lack of game time, and the likelyhood of someone seeking out either Heaton or Cooke as a must have Emergency Loan in the championship is next to nada..! They're going nowhere till January at the earliest.

[Sonny]

Just now, Hendo said:

I would still hold out a lot of hope for Heaton. Darlington fans really rated him, championship clubs in England were looking at him. It's quite unfair to judge him on one bad game under an incompetent manager. Likewise, Cooke has only played in a shambolic team, though his age and relative mediocre career before joining us probably makes him less likely to be a success.

I am not necessarily writing them off but both are pretty far down the pecking order and lack game time. Makes sense to me to have them play regularly for a few months. They would still be training with us so the manager can still see how they fit in instead of not even getting anywhere near the bench.

Heaton was signed first but Kpekawa was preferred to him. Then Jones preferred over Kpekawa. Then Ferdinand over Jones. And on Fri night even Paul McGinn was preferred over Jones so Heaton has a long way to go to start a game. And considering we are desperate for a striker Cooke cannot make the bench even with BM injured and no other striker available.

[Magic Monkey]

2 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Given the window is shut, given their lack of game time, and the likelyhood of someone seeking out either Heaton or Cooke as a must have Emergency Loan in the championship is next to nada..! They're going nowhere till January at the earliest.

Actually agree with that. They might get a game at a lower level than the Champ, but that would be of no use or value to us going forward - if that were the case (ie a league one loan), we'd be as well paying off their contracts now and being done with it.

That said, I still do think there's a player in Heaton, potentially.

[Hendo]

1 minute ago, Sonny said:

I am not necessarily writing them off but both are pretty far down the pecking order and lack game time. Makes sense to me to have them play regularly for a few months. They would still be training with us so the manager can still see how they fit in instead of not even getting anywhere near the bench.

Heaton was signed first but Kpekawa was preferred to him. Then Jones preferred over Kpekawa. Then Ferdinand over Jones. And on Fri night even Paul McGinn was preferred over Jones so Heaton has a long way to go to start a game. And considering we are desperate for a striker Cooke cannot make the bench even with BM injured and no other striker available.

But it was Stubbs who preferred most of these players to Heaton and he didn't have a clue. Yes. OK brought in Ferdinand, but Heaton is currently injured and not available for selection. 

[pod]

1 hour ago, Hendo said:

But it was Stubbs who preferred most of these players to Heaton and he didn't have a clue. Yes. OK brought in Ferdinand, but Heaton is currently injured and not available for selection. 

IMO I don't think Heaton was fit enough to play when signed.  

[Ayrshire Saints]

9 hours ago, St.Ricky said:

This makes sense to me. I haven't seen enough of these guys to make any final judgement but we need to keep a decent squad size.

We have a first team squad of 28 according to OK !

[DougJamie]

7 minutes ago, Ayrshire Saints said:

We have a first team squad of 28 according to OK !

Think he was including the cones at Ralston. Some of them defended better

[djchapsticks]

8 hours ago, Ayrshire Saints said:

We have a first team squad of 28 according to OK !

He's not wrong you know. Wikipedia has us with 26, and that's not including Kellerman or Muir. 

[Callum Gilhooley]

We have a first team squad of 28 according to OK !

The magazine ? [emoji848]

[St.Ricky]

1 hour ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

 

The magazine ?

 

Ohhh you are on form.

[Wendy Saintss]

Regarding Cotterill, what I don’t understand is how professional football players let themselves get out of shape.

Since his last club, the guy would have had so much time on his hands go get himself fit.

Highlights a bad attitude and poor work ethic IMO.

I guess if he was fit though and had a good attitude he’d have been nowhere near us and be with a Championship club right now!

[djchapsticks]

34 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

Regarding Cotterill, what I don’t understand is how professional football players let themselves get out of shape.

Since his last club, the guy would have had so much time on his hands go get himself fit.

Highlights a bad attitude and poor work ethic IMO.

I guess if he was fit though and had a good attitude he’d have been nowhere near us and be with a Championship club right now!

I'm his case, I think he became a new dad back in March and left his club in India. He was sort of hamstrung for the rest of last season in that he then couldn't sign for anyone. 

But I fully agree. If you are out of a job and your primary deciding factor on getting work is fitness, you'd at least work at keeping this up at a decent level daily. The match sharpness etc would come not long afterwards. 

Unfortunately some guys use pre season break as a sign that they should let everything go. Look at the likes of Graham Carey, Charlie Adam, Lawrence Shankland with us. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by djchapsticks