animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 It wouldn't oversee all, but does provide some governance around budgets and significant contracts. That's fair enough as, Michelle, they hold the debt and it's not levered against the club or the individual, corporate or community members. Thanks for the compliment but I ain't Michelle ! I am not sure who actually 'holds' the debt. I doubt the executive Board members are putting up any security. The real security, which Mr. A's accountant eventually admitted at one point, is that if the lenders have to call it a day, is that they would have to put the 52% share holding up for sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 (edited) Just back from the public meeting. Have finally got a very large important bit of the jigsaw. The power point presentation which was mailed to us is very misleading. A whole level has been strangely omitted from the top. Right at the very top should be something which, during the presentation from Mr. Atkinson, slipped out. There is to be an EXECUTIVE BOARD. I have not heard of this before in the hundreds of posts since I started this thread a long time ago. It seems this body will overseen all below it. The CIC board will have to agree its budget with this board. In turn the SMFC board will, in effect, report to it. The executive board with be (as best I can understand) made up of the founders of the CIC - Mr. Atkinson, a guy from the Kibble school and the rest of the people driving this scheme. The community (us) will be expected to fund the interest on the debt (In the region of £1,000,000) by paying in our £10 an month, but the real power will remain with the unelected Executive Board who as far as I can see ain't paying a penny. Is that why it's called a Community Interest Company - because the community pay the interest on the loans ? I think (hard to hear sometimes) the guy from the Kibble said this is because the as yet unnamed lenders of the £1,000,000 will only have 'confidence' in these Executive Board people (and not in us lesser mortals). For a wee while at the end I thought NSS was going to shag you. You look much better on radio. Edited April 21, 2011 by St. Sid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Just back from the public meeting. Have finally got a very large important bit of the jigsaw. The power point presentation which was mailed to us is very misleading. A whole level has been strangely omitted from the top. Right at the very top should be something which, during the presentation from Mr. Atkinson, slipped out. There is to be an EXECUTIVE BOARD. I have not heard of this before in the hundreds of posts since I started this thread a long time ago. It seems this body will overseen all below it. The CIC board will have to agree its budget with this board. In turn the SMFC board will, in effect, report to it. The executive board with be (as best I can understand) made up of the founders of the CIC - Mr. Atkinson, a guy from the Kibble school and the rest of the people driving this scheme. The community (us) will be expected to fund the interest on the debt (In the region of £1,000,000) by paying in our £10 an month, but the real power will remain with the unelected Executive Board who as far as I can see ain't paying a penny. Is that why it's called a Community Interest Company - because the community pay the interest on the loans ? I think (hard to hear sometimes) the guy from the Kibble said this is because the as yet unnamed lenders of the £1,000,000 will only have 'confidence' in these Executive Board people (and not in us lesser mortals). Animal, I sit on a committee at a juvenile football club and the structure that is being proposed makes sense to me. We have various committees within the club - disciplinary, coaches and fund raising. All of them have their set functions but we also have an elected Executive Committee which deals with the club accounts, player protection, and communication. This is a structure that is outlined within the SFA's own club development programme and in reality all the Executive Committee does is approve or deny the various tournament requests from our coaches and we look to protect the reputation of the club. You could claim the executive committee within our structure has overall control of the club but it would be wrong. The power comes from beneath us because if we don't follow the direction our coaches and players want us to follow we won't have teams to field. Same goes for this structure. If the executive don't follow the wishes of the Corporate, Community and Individual membership they won't have those members in the second year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Same goes for this structure. If the executive don't follow the wishes of the Corporate, Community and Individual membership they won't have those members in the second year. I understand there is no way for anyone to 'sack' the Executive Board. It is not elected by anyone ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Thanks for the compliment but I ain't Michelle ! I am not sure who actually 'holds' the debt. I doubt the executive Board members are putting up any security. The real security, which Mr. A's accountant eventually admitted at one point, is that if the lenders have to call it a day, is that they would have to put the 52% share holding up for sale. I know, it was just in case Michelle was reading. I think we all know they'd have to put the 52% up if it goes to shit, but who'd take it on after the fans weren't able to keep it going? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 I understand there is no way for anyone to 'sack' the Executive Board. It is not elected by anyone ! Good luck sacking the current BoD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Dickson Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 I understand there is no way for anyone to 'sack' the Executive Board. It is not elected by anyone ! Hmm, I'll need to wait on the transcript. I would have expected the Executive Board to have been put up for re-election at AGM's. However the point I was making is still valid - if whoever is on that Executive Board doesn't follow the wishes of the members, they won't have a membership and they won't be able to retain control of the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdickloyal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Just back from the public meeting. Have finally got a very large important bit of the jigsaw. The power point presentation which was mailed to us is very misleading. A whole level has been strangely omitted from the top. Right at the very top should be something which, during the presentation from Mr. Atkinson, slipped out. There is to be an EXECUTIVE BOARD. I have not heard of this before in the hundreds of posts since I started this thread a long time ago. It seems this body will overseen all below it. The CIC board will have to agree its budget with this board. In turn the SMFC board will, in effect, report to it. The executive board with be (as best I can understand) made up of the founders of the CIC - Mr. Atkinson, a guy from the Kibble school and the rest of the people driving this scheme. The community (us) will be expected to fund the interest on the debt (In the region of £1,000,000) by paying in our £10 an month, but the real power will remain with the unelected Executive Board who as far as I can see ain't paying a penny. Is that why it's called a Community Interest Company - because the community pay the interest on the loans ? I think (hard to hear sometimes) the guy from the Kibble said this is because the as yet unnamed lenders of the £1,000,000 will only have 'confidence' in these Executive Board people (and not in us lesser mortals). Im unsure as to why you reached that conclusion. Were you the person who repeatedly asked this question? The important facts (as I see them) is that St Mirren FC will NOT inherit any debt. The debt taken on by the CIC is entirely servicable by the cic IF it gets the support (which it will). If the cic were to collapse (which it wont) then the 52% shareholding goes up for sale and we are exactly where we are now. Its relatively risk free for the club. Indeed the benefit to the club was laid out quite clearly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Good luck sacking the current BoD. Well at least the existing Board have put their hands in their own pockets - This Executive Board are putting their hands in our pockets ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdickloyal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Hmm, I'll need to wait on the transcript. I would have expected the Executive Board to have been put up for re-election at AGM's. However the point I was making is still valid - if whoever is on that Executive Board doesn't follow the wishes of the members, they won't have a membership and they won't be able to retain control of the club. RA made it crystal clear that the the executive board will only be him, Fitzy etc initially as those who will be providing funding are used to dealing with these individuals. They will be electable, could not have been clearer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Hmm, I'll need to wait on the transcript. I would have expected the Executive Board to have been put up for re-election at AGM's. However the point I was making is still valid - if whoever is on that Executive Board doesn't follow the wishes of the members, they won't have a membership and they won't be able to retain control of the club. The Executive Board are NOT ELECTED THEY ARE SELF APPOINTED. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 RA made it crystal clear that the the executive board will only be him, Fitzy etc initially as those who will be providing funding are used to dealing with these individuals. They will be electable, could not have been clearer! Were you at the same meeting as me ? Perhaps Mr. A could clarify this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Well at least the existing Board have put their hands in their own pockets - This Executive Board are putting their hands in our pockets ! It's of course possible that social returns will cut the debt. I think some fans are still hoping someone will take us down the Dundee Utd, Killie, Motherwell route of throwing completely unsustainable money at the team. I quite like the idea of a bit of work getting a 20% increase in the playing budget as it's gradual, real and sustainable. I've been involved in cash being thrown in before and it isn't the answer as you need to find it the next season, the next season and the... well, you get the idea. Indeed, the fans who want that actually want our club in debt to make it possible. I'd rather this than some investors soft loans over us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Well at least the existing Board have put their hands in their own pockets - This Executive Board are putting their hands in our pockets ! Really, did you get confirmation of that tonight? Must have missed that question. You have completely missed the entire point of a CIC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Well at least the existing Board have put their hands in their own pockets - This Executive Board are putting their hands in our pockets ! One of the executive board members is already on the existing board, and has already put his hand in his own pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 The transcript of the meeting, as best as I could capture it, is now at http://www.10000hours.org/live Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 One of the executive board members is already on the existing board, and has already put his hand in his own pocket. And the rest ? I wonder why virtually no one even knew that an Executive Board was part of the plan before tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 (edited) I can understand most things (unlike that blummin' wummin' down the front tonight), but I cannot understand the uproar from some about the 'Executive Board'. The 'Executive Board' SHOULD be made up of RA, Chris Stewart, Jim Mullin, Scott McLennan and others. For 'Executive Board' read: The people who will actually make it happen. The people who have spent a year on this already. The people who are qualified in the areas required - marketing, accountancy, business acumen, banking, etc. No brainer in my view - without them there is no CIC! Help ma' boab! Edited April 21, 2011 by pozbaird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimdickloyal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Were you at the same meeting as me ? Perhaps Mr. A could clarify this. I sure Mr A is unable to confirm that I was at the meeting as he has not had the pleasure of meeting me. The point was perfectly clear, as was everything in the meeting. If you left that meeting with unanswered questions then I am surprised as plenty opportunity was given to ask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 And the rest ? I wonder why virtually no one even knew that an Executive Board was part of the plan before tonight. I can't believe people didn't think a CIC would have a Board of Directors, that's all this is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 And the rest ? I wonder why virtually no one even knew that an Executive Board was part of the plan before tonight. Everyone who was there tonight knows, and everyone who joined in online knows. I don't think it's a big secret or a big deal but I suppose if this is all you could find to pick fault with then the meeting must have been a success ! How many questions did you ask on the night ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animal Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 I can understand most things (unlike that blummin' wummin' down the front tonight), but I cannot understand the uproar from some about the 'Executive Board'. The 'Executive Board' SHOULD be made up of RA, Chris Stewart, Jim Mullin, Scott McLennan and others. For 'Executive Board' read: The people who will actually make it happen. The people who have spent a year on this already. The people who are qualified in the areas required - marketing, accountancy, business acumen, banking, etc. No brainer in my view - without them there is no CIC! Help ma' boab! The Executive Board may well have spent time on this but we are being asked to pay for this fairly risky financial experiment. And we are being told that the 'community' has some kind of power in this scheme. Don't get me wrong, I have to admire Mr.A for dreaming this up. Hundreds of thousands of pounds of taxpayer's money to be obtained in grants. Maybe a million in loans, and 300 supporters paying off the loans for them, while not putting a personal penny at risk. A touch of genius here ! The only reason the community is involved is to gain access to grants and loans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 You missed my comparison points about MYFC out from the twitters you baldy gitty git faced baldy git. Seriously though, good typing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 And the rest ? I wonder why virtually no one even knew that an Executive Board was part of the plan before tonight. That's not actually true. I certainly knew about it as I bothered my @rse to find out and continued to post nonsense on the Internet whereas you just went straight to posting nonsense on the Internet. The third tier is new to most people though and does require further clarification - mainly because there are significant advantages to having the three tiers that din't come out tonight. If you were as clever and as knowledgeable as you think you are you would already have worked out those advantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 The Executive Board may well have spent time on this but we are being asked to pay for this fairly risky financial experiment. And we are being told that the 'community' has some kind of power in this scheme. Don't get me wrong, I have to admire Mr.A for dreaming this up. Hundreds of thousands of pounds of taxpayer's money to be obtained in grants. Maybe a million in loans, and 300 supporters paying off the loans for them, while not putting a personal penny at risk. A touch of genius here ! The only reason the community is involved is to gain access to grants and loans. Mate, stop for a second...ask yourself the following 2 questions... Who's been paying all the legal fees for this? How many years would I and then my next of kin need to be members to match that financial commitment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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