div Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 The 10000Hours bid, after a rollercoaster ride of two years of many ups and downs has just two days left. Everyone will just need to decide if they are in or out. If the numbers aren't sufficient the deal fails and we move on, we roll the dice and we take our chances with international owners who may or may not destroy the club. That's not scaremongering, that's the reality of life as demonstrated in recent times and at various Scottish Clubs by Craig Whyte, Vladimir Romanov, Ron Dixon, Claude Anelka and Angelo Massone. South of the border we have had the shambles at Portsmouth with foreign owners, the current meltdown with Venkys at Blackburn, the original botched takeover of Liverpool and the unhappy situation at Man Utd where the Glaziers put the club hundreds of millions into debt to buy the club. These are all real examples of foreign ownership. It's too late for the fans to say 10000 hours model isn't good enough, nobody else within the St.Mirren support has put forward a fans ownership model in the three years that they have had to do so. This is the only shot we are going to get at this. The time for talking is nearly done. For me personally, 10000Hours might not be perfect but it can refined from the inside out by sensible St.Mirren supporters. The debt is a necessary part of the purchase, and will be a necessary part of ANY purchase by ANYONE. Spreading that debt across hundreds of individuals who all care about the club and without incurring borrowing against any club owned assets is a sensible approach in my opinion. That's enough for me. I'm in, 500 others are also in to date and personally I hope it goes through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supermac Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Agree with all of that. I'm in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Old Fan Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Agree totally with the above and am disappointed my lucky dip on lottery did not come up last night. I have committed what I can to 10000 and in return I am looking for nothing more than a football club to support for another 50 years. This is in my opinion the best way to achieve that for my grandchildren and hope everyone that loves the club will sign up if they have not already done so. It is far from perfect but is the best on the table with the opportunity to mould it into what the members want. I trust the fans, including those that are not convinced,, we all want the same, and this is an amazing opportunity to belive in ourselves and take charge of the club we love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I'm in, and have had no problem saying that a big part of my reason for being in is the trust and faith I am putting in individuals involved in the bid. My support isn't so much because I agree with the fine print of the draft constitution, because I think the plan is 100% perfect, or because I think it is absolutely 100% nailed-down perfect.... because it isn't. I'm in because while not perfect, I genuinely believe REA, GLS, and the others involved to be of sound character and sound motive. No-one goes into this as an outsider and stranger, and sticks with it for well over two years if they have dodgy Craig Whyte intent. The current BOD, lead by SG have been a very safe pair of hands. My fear when they put the club up for sale was that we would end up with new owners no-one knew, who could prove to be far from a safe pair of hands. I think if the CIC bid can pull this off, we are in safe hands, and the task can begin of working on the aspects of the bid we are unsure about. Some will say we should have been working on the detail and meat on the bones before now, and that we should know every last detail and be happy with it. Maybes aye, maybes naw. Each to their own. I'm in because I like the basic premise, I like the fan involvement, I buy into the community aspect of it too, but as I said, mostly because I trust the main players to have their hearts in the right place to take the baton on from SG & Co, who over the piece, did a magnificent job for St Mirren. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Agree totally with the above and am disappointed my lucky dip on lottery did not come up last night. I have committed what I can to 10000 and in return I am looking for nothing more than a football club to support for another 50 years. This is in my opinion the best way to achieve that for my grandchildren and hope everyone that loves the club will sign up if they have not already done so. It is far from perfect but is the best on the table with the opportunity to mould it into what the members want. I trust the fans, including those that are not convinced,, we all want the same, and this is an amazing opportunity to belive in ourselves and take charge of the club we love. Yep, in all the pish and wind that has been generated by some folk on here over the past couple of years and certainly in the lead up to the deadline, THAT is the important point in all this. It can be shaped and remoulded and turned into what the fans want. What we start off with here isn't necessarily how it will be down the line. Thats up to us if we get the chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray7 Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 It took me a lot of convincing, but I completed my Direct Debit yesterday and hope the target is met by Friday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denbud Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I'm in as has been said it might not be perfect but atleast the club will be controled by people who care!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mc Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Never met REA and know GLS from years back in 'playing football' capacity - In my case more verging on incapacity. I'm in on principle and because guys like Div, Poz, etc.and others seem like sound guys. For REA to put the amount effort in his own time that he has is a convincer for me too. That's the sort of spirit we need to capture in future. Most people won't have the time, energy or will to be on the CIC Board, but just about everyone can contribute to a clearer future just by being a member IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) Never met REA and know GLS from years back in 'playing football' capacity - In my case more verging on incapacity. I'm in on principle and because guys like Div, Poz, etc.and others seem like sound guys. For REA to put the amount effort in his own time that he has is a convincer for me too. That's the sort of spirit we need to capture in future. Most people won't have the time, energy or will to be on the CIC Board, but just about everyone can contribute to a clearer future just by being a member IMO. From my own POV, it's no secret that while working on the 'Final Chapter' book, GLS, AWP, and Norrie Jamieson were probably the main three guys who were absolutely brilliant with us throughout the 18 months we worked on it, and without them it would never have seen the light of day. Also of course, to CK for allowing four muppets like us to take the project on at all. Also common knowledge that I have done graphic work for REA and the club in regard to the HoF panels, leaflets, the new strip designs, blah, blah de blah... If I had thought any of the guys were dodgy geezers or ripping the pish out of us, I would have 'walked away' so to speak. I have seen nothing to suggest they are dodgy geezers at all, so as I said above, quite happy to pledge my support to the bid, and to see the club enter a new post-SG era. It is different and in truth, a wee bit scary, but it will be a moot point anyway if there's not enough support out there to get it off the ground in the first place. Edited June 14, 2012 by pozbaird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 My view it has now firmed up. I am definitely not getting involved and will see how it develops after the AGMs in November. If the concerns are unwarranted then I'll help pay the debt off quicker. However, I suspect that I will have to end up investing to get the CIC out of trouble in the not too distant future. It will be a long time paying debt and fans having to invest in all sorts of hair brained schemes to service the debt. In return, we have no idea what the fans are going to get from a BoD that it doesn;t actually have any influence over. The fans are owning the debt, and have no influence in the club. Hence the argument of 10000 Hours being reduced to - if you don't pay for us to own the club, someone you don't know will buy it. Not much of an offer for £1.5Million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I'm in. No takeover is ever going to be perfect but what is important is that those that do takeover have the Club's interests at heart and 10,000 HRs has that. There are very, very few takeovers from rich business men that have succeeded. They either die or get bored. The fans' takeover is the way to go. The structure and rules can be modified down the line but the most important thing is the control by the people who matter - the fans. Sign up NOW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazil85 Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Signed up and in, do we know where we're standing currently? the info on the website isn't all that clear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ds10 Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 The 10000Hours bid, after a rollercoaster ride of two years of many ups and downs has just two days left. That's enough for me. I'm in, 500 others are also in to date and personally I hope it goes through. And in addition to all that, you can get a vote of whether to let the Rangers Newco back into the SPL........ What other club offers that?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 As of 2 mins ago; £5880 per month now in place on Individual subscriptions, 78% of target. That has come from 484 individual subscribers. Growth in the last 24 hours was 8%, going to be touch and go whether we get there or not. Gordon is working hard on the other membership tiers, personally contacting individuals who have expressed an interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenbud Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 162 more people at £10 a month or less if people pay more......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennant's Lager Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Having given it no end of considered thought, I've finally decided to join 10k Hours again. I have concerns about it yes, and the bid may still fail clearly, but the end thoughts have been what do I want to happen, and that if there's anything I don't like, they could and should be changed and I reserve the right to shout my mouth off about it if not. I know plenty of people on here do and will take an alternative view and have no problem with that at all. Ultimately I'm something of a naive optimist and what will be will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Having given it no end of considered thought, I've finally decided to join 10k Hours again. I have concerns about it yes, and the bid may still fail clearly, but the end thoughts have been what do I want to happen, and that if there's anything I don't like, they could and should be changed and I reserve the right to shout my mouth off about it if not. I know plenty of people on here do and will take an alternative view and have no problem with that at all. Ultimately I'm something of a naive optimist and what will be will be. Good man David. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TsuMirren Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 I'm in, having looked at it from pretty much all sides and even considered myself out at one point...there's enough good people around, plus it's about Saint Mirren and not the application of creating a "global club" or whatever MYFC was meant to be. I'm also one of the three to have applied for the 3 interim places, my Grandpa used to sell lottery tickets in the Piazza booths and hopefully I'll get to my chance to help Saint Mirren along the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennant's Lager Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Good man David. Are you going to ramp up the amount of updates to the total on the site today/tomorrow? One a day is too few methinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vambo57 Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) I'm in, having looked at it from pretty much all sides and even considered myself out at one point...there's enough good people around, plus it's about Saint Mirren and not the application of creating a "global club" or whatever MYFC was meant to be. I'm also one of the three to have applied for the 3 interim places, my Grandpa used to sell lottery tickets in the Piazza booths and hopefully I'll get to my chance to help Saint Mirren along the road. Good man! I am sure your experiences down at Ebbsfleet will stand you in good stead and provide invaluable insight. I'm in... I suppose I've always been in.... except for the couple of times I have been out... Edited June 14, 2012 by Vambo57 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktf Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) Probably no surprise to anyone, I'm in. So are as many community groups that I am connected with, as I can muster! Given my experience in that side of things and the fact that I make my own diary and hours every week, I will put my name in the hat for an interim place. I believe that the one of the main selling points initially was the community side of the bid, whilst that has fallen by the wayside somewhat, it shouldn't be too hard to recharge it again with a desire to do so and the right people on board - perhaps, if folks agree, I can help to play a part in that. Edited June 14, 2012 by ktf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Saints Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 My view it has now firmed up. I am definitely not getting involved and will see how it develops after the AGMs in November. If the concerns are unwarranted then I'll help pay the debt off quicker. However, I suspect that I will have to end up investing to get the CIC out of trouble in the not too distant future. It will be a long time paying debt and fans having to invest in all sorts of hair brained schemes to service the debt. In return, we have no idea what the fans are going to get from a BoD that it doesn;t actually have any influence over. The fans are owning the debt, and have no influence in the club. Hence the argument of 10000 Hours being reduced to - if you don't pay for us to own the club, someone you don't know will buy it. Not much of an offer for £1.5Million. Sid by taking this stance I presume you feel it will go through without your backing ? If you feel strongly enough that you would be willing to bail the CiC out in the future as you seem to be saying then why not just opt in now. If you would bail these guys out then why not be in at the start in an attempt to get the thing off the ground in the first place. There will be very little opportunity for you to bail us out if the club is sold to foreign investors and ends up going tits up. Im in and as I see it this is the only deal on the table that we can have any confidence in at all - we can moan about the way it's being financed or the influence it gives us until the cows come home but any other purchaser would give us no insight into any of these matters. This is at the very least an (almost completely) transparent option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Sid by taking this stance I presume you feel it will go through without your backing ? If you feel strongly enough that you would be willing to bail the CiC out in the future as you seem to be saying then why not just opt in now. If you would bail these guys out then why not be in at the start in an attempt to get the thing off the ground in the first place. There will be very little opportunity for you to bail us out if the club is sold to foreign investors and ends up going tits up. Im in and as I see it this is the only deal on the table that we can have any confidence in at all - we can moan about the way it's being financed or the influence it gives us until the cows come home but any other purchaser would give us no insight into any of these matters. This is at the very least an (almost completely) transparent option. I asked this question in another post earlier this morning. How many folk currently refusing to be involved for their variety of reasons would considering joining if the CiC deal goes through and there is no other option on the table? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Probably no surprise to anyone, I'm in. So are as many community groups that I am connected with, as I can muster! Given my experience in that side of things and the fact that I make my own diary and hours every week, I will put my name in the hat for an interim place. I believe that the one of the main selling points initially was the community side of the bid, whilst that has fallen by the wayside somewhat, it shouldn't be too hard to recharge it again with a desire to do so and the right people on board - perhaps, if folks agree, I can help to play a part in that. I'd probably have voted for you if I was joining. Only met you the once briefly when we were handing out the flyers for CIC#2. However, you seem an honest enough chap albeit a bit gullible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Sid Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Sid by taking this stance I presume you feel it will go through without your backing ? If you feel strongly enough that you would be willing to bail the CiC out in the future as you seem to be saying then why not just opt in now. If you would bail these guys out then why not be in at the start in an attempt to get the thing off the ground in the first place. There will be very little opportunity for you to bail us out if the club is sold to foreign investors and ends up going tits up. Im in and as I see it this is the only deal on the table that we can have any confidence in at all - we can moan about the way it's being financed or the influence it gives us until the cows come home but any other purchaser would give us no insight into any of these matters. This is at the very least an (almost completely) transparent option. Very odd spin on it AS, especially the last part of your claim. Firstly by signing up now you are providing a mandate for 10000 Hours to go ahead. You are effectively taking a decision for all fans by doing that including those not supporting 10000 Hours. Personally I would need to have zero doubts to take on such an arrogant position of making the decision for all fans. I have lots of doubts and gave 10000 Hours and its supporters every opportunity to address them. They chose not to and delivered the sam old soundbites that we've been trotting out since its inception - I know cos I made half of the soundbites up when ripping the pish out of the likes of animal and Yul. If 10000 Hours does end up in the shitter it will demand fans save it. I'll be pretty f'k'n pissed off it that is the case but I would still help the club as would most fans - that's the catch22. If it is private ownership I would support it through its times of trouble just as I did when the Clydesdale Bank was threatening to shut us down on a monthly basis. 10000 Hours MIGHT work......the other bidders might have us in Europe the season after next and have the stadium full every week - we don;t know. 10000 Hours could end up in the shitter in a few months. We don't know....some fans will make the decision on behalf of the rest of the support. I'm not prepared to do that - humility and integrity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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