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Stuart Dickson

Glasgow Tops Uk Workless Homes Survey

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Guest TPAFKATS

Nice try. You've been caught lying so like a typical Natsi you try desperately to turn it all around again so that it's big bad Englands fault. Lets have a look at that claim though.

From the Scottish Governments own website - prior to devolution in May 99 Scotland's unemployment rate stood at 5.5%, indeed by April 2000 it was 5.0%. Today, after 13 years of home rule Scottish unemployment stands at 7.5%. Another interesting statistic shows that if you use employment rates - as the SNP appear to like doing - then when Alex Salmond took office as first minister taking over from Jack McConnell Scotlands employment rate stood at 74.9%. Today Alex Salmond gets all moist when it gets to 72.1%. Presumably a decline in employment rates of 2.8% during his time in office is supposed to be seen as some kind of success?

I could also make reference to the high proportion of public sector jobs in Scotland - as a percentage of working population it's far, far higher than any other country in the UK and most of those jobs depend entirely on UK government policy but I won't go there yet. Instead I'll keep that back for when you make your next silly post. rolleyes.gif

I'm not lying, but good try with the scandalous approach to catching me out - its as poor as wee burnie lamont's effort with wee smug eck today http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-24067411

I'm also not blaming England; simply trying to point out your stats can be interpreted in other ways than the skewed view that you give them. Or to put it another way, you claim Scotland is lagging behind the rest of the uk whilst we are effectively ruled from London. To extrapolate this, surely we would be better off independent?

BTW, as oaksoft points out - your stats are pish!

Edited by TPAFKATS

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So you don't consider £25,000 to be a disincentive to work?

But you DO consider £70 a week dole money to be a disincentive to work?

Anyone else confused?

And BTW your comment on why should a safety net be needed?

lol.giflol.giflol.gif

I can just see the Daily Mail headlines:

Schooolchildren Eat Rats to Survive After Parents Spend their Money on Drugs

or perhaps:

5 Million Children Starve to Death After Parents Use their Allowance to Top Up 40p Per Hour Manufacturing Jobs

The most frightening aspect of our democracy is that people like Dickson can actually get elected and become Prime Minister.

There's no barrier to entry.

Mind you we have several politicians who believe in UFO's and Homeopathy so idiocy isn't limited to Lanarkshire.

The £25,000 is the families dividend. They may opt not to work but the taxpayer wouldn't need to fund that lifestyle choice. It would be up to them how they use their money and the rest of us wouldn't need to worry about it. If they are feckless and starve to death - well we gave them a chance.

As for drug abusers - in my world they wouldn't be classed as UK citizens so they wouldn't qualify for their dividend. Part of being a UK Resident UK Citizen would be the need to abide by the law. A drug abuser would not be handed control of any dividend and the childs share of the money would be controlled on their behalf by someone appointed to manage their money by the courts.

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I think it's fair to say that if £25,000 landed on my doorstep I'd retire tomorrow and so would probably 20 million others.

I wonder where the following years money would come from?

Once your kids have grown up though and left this average 4 person family - you'd be stuck with just £12,500 per annum between you and your wife and when she left you cause you are a lazy f**ker you'd be down to £6,500 per annum - by which point I can imagine you'd be desperate to start sewing pants for 40p per hour :rolleyes:

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And the safety net would exist under the carrot and stick principle. AND I QUOTE!

AND.

If everyone decided to work 10 hours per week where would the revenue come from to pay circa £6 bloody grand per person?

Edited to add.

Sorry Not Utopia at all.

Fantasia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It would come from the corporate tax revenues from the private healthcare providers and from the private education providers - amongst others :rolleyes:

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Guest TPAFKATS

It would come from the corporate tax revenues from the private healthcare providers and from the private education providers - amongst others rolleyes.gif

lol.giflol.giflol.gif

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The £25,000 is the families dividend. They may opt not to work but the taxpayer wouldn't need to fund that lifestyle choice. It would be up to them how they use their money and the rest of us wouldn't need to worry about it. If they are feckless and starve to death - well we gave them a chance.

As for drug abusers - in my world they wouldn't be classed as UK citizens so they wouldn't qualify for their dividend. Part of being a UK Resident UK Citizen would be the need to abide by the law. A drug abuser would not be handed control of any dividend and the childs share of the money would be controlled on their behalf by someone appointed to manage their money by the courts.

But £25,000 is the average wage in the country FFS.

I could easily just keep it and live off it rather than sending the kids to school.

After all you'll pay the kids £25k a year when they reach 18 anyway so why waste money educating them when they don't need to work?

How exactly would you stop me and everyone else doing this leaving your new government with a tax intake of precisely the square root of f**k all?

What is it you're not getting about this?

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Once your kids have grown up though and left this average 4 person family - you'd be stuck with just £12,500 per annum between you and your wife and when she left you cause you are a lazy f**ker you'd be down to £6,500 per annum - by which point I can imagine you'd be desperate to start sewing pants for 40p per hour rolleyes.gif

Fortunately I'm a scientist so I'd be pretty much immune to your f**kwittery in this regard.

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It would come from the corporate tax revenues from the private healthcare providers and from the private education providers - amongst others rolleyes.gif

I'm sorry but lol.giflol.giflol.giflol.gif

This has to be the funniest thing you've ever posted and there have been some right crackers over the years.

If you want to know why we are laughing Stuart, try doing the following.

Get a calculator.

There are about 65 million people in the country.

Presumably about 40-60 million of them would receive your payment.

At £25,000 each per year.

Multiply those two number together and come back and tell us what the calculator says.

Then tell you exactly how much on average the 2 million UK based businesses would have to pay in tax to cover it each year.

ETA:

I can't contain myself.

The answer is between 1 and 1.6 THOUSAND BILLION pounds a year in corporation tax alone.

It's like something out of Austin Powers with Dr Evil's hilarious demand.

That would wipe our national debt overnight.

Each of our two million companies (bear in mind the vast majority - 90% or so are under 10 employees) would be paying an eye watering

£500,000 in corporation tax!!!! Given corporation tax is about 20% at the moment this could only work if the companies were raising £2.5 million in pre-tax profits. You also have to understand that companies usually expect profit margins of 5-20% of turnover which means the only companies who could possibly pay this are those with turnover exceeding £20-50 million per year.

Any company earning this amount (and there are VERY few of them indeed - perhaps no more than a few thousand) will be based offshore to avoid paying tax altogether.

That would bankrupt more or less every other company and by extension the country overnight.

Thanks for the belly laugh. Incompetence on this scale is truly hilarious.

BTW the numbers are so huge I had to get my calculator out and do the maths 4 times to check.

ETA:

For those who are interested, the UK brings in about £400 billion pounds a year. That comes from corporation tax, VAT, and an army of employees all paying income tax, national insurance, miscellaneous other taxes and various investments all over the world. Corporation tax brings in a small proportion of the overall £400 billion take and this is because a company turning over anything like £20 million a year will employ an army of accountants to find ways of not paying anything.

Edited by oaksoft

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I'm sorry but lol.giflol.giflol.giflol.gif

This has to be the funniest thing you've ever posted and there have been some right crackers over the years.

If you want to know why we are laughing Stuart, try doing the following.

Get a calculator.

There are about 65 million people in the country.

Presumably about 40-60 million of them would receive your payment.

At £25,000 each per year.

Multiply those two number together and come back and tell us what the calculator says.

Then tell you exactly how much on average the 2 million UK based businesses would have to pay in tax to cover it each year.

ETA:

I can't contain myself.

The answer is between 1 and 1.6 THOUSAND BILLION pounds a year in corporation tax alone.

It's like something out of Austin Powers with Dr Evil's hilarious demand.

That would wipe our national debt overnight.

Each of our two million companies (bear in mind the vast majority - 90% or so are under 10 employees) would be paying an eye watering

£500,000 in corporation tax!!!! Given corporation tax is about 20% at the moment this could only work if the companies were raising £2.5 million in pre-tax profits. You also have to understand that companies usually expect profit margins of 5-20% of turnover which means the only companies who could possibly pay this are those with turnover exceeding £20-50 million per year.

Any company earning this amount (and there are VERY few of them indeed - perhaps no more than a few thousand) will be based offshore to avoid paying tax altogether.

That would bankrupt more or less every other company and by extension the country overnight.

Thanks for the belly laugh. Incompetence on this scale is truly hilarious.

BTW the numbers are so huge I had to get my calculator out and do the maths 4 times to check.

ETA:

For those who are interested, the UK brings in about £400 billion pounds a year. That comes from corporation tax, VAT, and an army of employees all paying income tax, national insurance, miscellaneous other taxes and various investments all over the world. Corporation tax brings in a small proportion of the overall £400 billion take and this is because a company turning over anything like £20 million a year will employ an army of accountants to find ways of not paying anything.

Ffs, oaky, you've played right into his hands. The £25k is for a family of 4, divide the £1.6 trillion by 4 and you get the figure you quote as current tax take. Thank fekk he can't count, he'll never figure it out......

:)

Edited by salmonbuddie

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Ffs, oaky, you've played right into his hands. The £25k is for a family of 4, divide the £1.6 trillion by 4 and you get the figure you quote as current tax take. Thank fekk he can't count, he'll never figure it out......

smile.png

Well not really because he's talking about giving this dividend to EVERY adult not just families of 4.

There are only a few million families which are 4 in number.

BTW I should also add that the tax take I mentioned currently includes dozens of sources of which corporation tax is a small part.

He's now going to remove most of those other sources (because people will retire if you hand them £25k) and have corporation tax vastly increased to close the gap. My mistake isn't quite as bad as being 4 times out. I'm probably out by perhaps a few billion. It's a Fermi calculation (educated guess) rather than a precise measure.

Even at worst case, a £400 billion corporation tax bill will bankrupt the entire country overnight.

Edited by oaksoft

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Well not really because he's talking about giving this dividend to EVERY adult not just families of 4.

There are only a few million families which are 4 in number.

BTW I should also add that the tax take I mentioned currently includes dozens of sources of which corporation tax is a small part.

He's now going to remove most of those other sources (because people will retire if you hand them £25k) and have corporation tax vastly increased to close the gap. My mistake isn't quite as bad as being 4 times out. I'm probably out by perhaps a few billion. It's a Fermi calculation (educated guess) rather than a precise measure.

Even at worst case, a £400 billion corporation tax bill will bankrupt the entire country overnight.

No I'm not. I've been very clear. Each UK resident UK Citizen would get an equal share of the current Welfare, Health Care and Education budget, regardless of age. That currently would work out at around £6,500 per annum, per person assuming every person currently residing in the UK would qualify as a UK Citizen.

The average family of four would receive around £26,000 - 4 x 6,500 - from which they would have to provide their children with a private education, or else lose their own personal dividend, possibly for life - if a court deems that as fit punishment.

It's no surprise you've struggled with comprehension again whilst you contemporaries got it. Put that dunce hat back on and sit in the corner. :rolleyes:

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Didn't notice earlier. Where did you get the £6,500 figure from?

Edited to add, The NHS isn't perfect but i really hope none of your children take not well and you couldn't raise the money due to the private insurance company not paying out.

The UK Central Government website.

The annual budget for Healthcare in the UK is £129.7Bn, Education is £88.6Bn, Welfare £110Bn and interest repayments on our national debt - which will be completely repaid (extremely conservative figure) by the sale or let of all schools, hospitals, back up services etc, etc - totals £57Bn. Divide the total of that by 64m - the population of the UK and you get around £6,100 per person. I've deliberately left the UK pensions budget - £144Bn - where it is, however there would also be a strong argument to assimilate that into the fund as well as it would be a far better way of controlling the spiralling costs of providing a state pension. If you were to assimilate that into the figures then the actual amount using the basic calculation would be closer to £8,000 per person, and that is before you start to factor in those who are currently counted in the UK population figures, but who aren't UK resident, UK citizens.

As for your edit, it's swings and roundabouts. You would be getting approx £6,500 - inflation proofed and tax free - per annum per person for life. You can choose to purchase adequate healthcare insurance, or not and just pay as you go. The whole point though is that it becomes the responsibility of the individual and not of the taxpayer. You get full control of your dividend and you aren't dictated to by some public servant over what hospital you should attend and what surgeon will carry out your operations.

Edited by Stuart Dickson

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No I'm not. I've been very clear. Each UK resident UK Citizen would get an equal share of the current Welfare, Health Care and Education budget, regardless of age. That currently would work out at around £6,500 per annum, per person assuming every person currently residing in the UK would qualify as a UK Citizen.

The average family of four would receive around £26,000 - 4 x 6,500 - from which they would have to provide their children with a private education, or else lose their own personal dividend, possibly for life - if a court deems that as fit punishment.

It's no surprise you've struggled with comprehension again whilst you contemporaries got it. Put that dunce hat back on and sit in the corner. rolleyes.gif

Actually you contradict yourself so often to suit your argument that it's tough to work out what you DO actually mean.

I blame myself for humouring you with this nonsensical idea of yours.

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Guest TPAFKATS

Didn't notice earlier. Where did you get the £6,500 figure from?

Edited to add, The NHS isn't perfect but i really hope none of your children take not well and you couldn't raise the money due to the private insurance company not paying out.

With regards getting ill - I pointed this out months ago. His view is that insurance will cover everything.. you now, similar to how well it used to in the good ol' usa.

Your pissing in the wind cockles - and remember this is also assuming that any adults dont get ill.

Oh, and also assuming that your £6500 covers a years education - you'll struggle to send your kids to private education for less than £8k a year!

But its okay, in the people's republic of studick all is well as long as he's ok.

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With regards getting ill - I pointed this out months ago. His view is that insurance will cover everything.. you now, similar to how well it used to in the good ol' usa.

Your pissing in the wind cockles - and remember this is also assuming that any adults dont get ill.

Oh, and also assuming that your £6500 covers a years education - you'll struggle to send your kids to private education for less than £8k a year!

But its okay, in the people's republic of studick all is well as long as he's ok.

Nope - I know how much a private education costs and there is no need for it to come in under £6,500 per annum. Why? Well a child doesn't go to school until they are 4 at the earliest, and more often 5. That would mean that before they ever needed to pay for education they would have personally accumulated savings of £26,000 and £32,500. Therefore it makes absolutely no odds whatsoever that private education costs more than the dividend payment in that year.

I don't really know why you struggle so much with this Tony but healthcare would no longer be a concern for the taxpayer. It would be for the individual to be concerned about. If a fat drunken junkie, wants to eat, drink and inject themselves to oblivion they can do so without being a burden on the rest of us. There would be no more healthcare tourism, no more hospital beds being blocked by ageing Indians coming over to get their knees replaced on the NHS where lazy staff will just not ask any questions for fear of having to fill in a form or two. We'd be incentivising individuals to get fit and to stay healthy.

Edited by Stuart Dickson

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Nope - I know how much a private education costs and there is no need for it to come in under £6,500 per annum. Why? Well a child doesn't go to school until they are 4 at the earliest, and more often 5. That would mean that before they ever needed to pay for education they would have personally accumulated savings of £26,000 and £32,500. Therefore it makes absolutely no odds whatsoever that private education costs more than the dividend payment in that year.

 

I don't really know why you struggle so much with this Tony but healthcare would no longer be a concern for the taxpayer. It would be for the individual to be concerned about. If a fat drunken junkie, wants to eat, drink and inject themselves to oblivion they can do so without being a burden on the rest of us. There would be no more healthcare tourism, no more hospital beds being blocked by ageing Indians coming over to get their knees replaced on the NHS where lazy staff will just not ask any questions for fear of having to fill in a form or two. We'd be incentivising individuals to get fit and to stay healthy. 

Out of curiosity Stuart, what happens if said child had had to use their 26 or 32k fighting some illness. They are now penalised at the age of 5 when it comes to school as they have spent all their dividend on private health care.

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It's no surprise you've struggled with comprehension again whilst you contemporaries got it. Put that dunce hat back on and sit in the corner. :rolleyes:

Really?

 

BTW I should also add that the tax take I mentioned currently includes dozens of sources of which corporation tax is a small part.

Even at worst case, a £400 billion corporation tax bill will bankrupt the entire country overnight.

Pot/kettle when it comes to comprehension. Now where did I put that dunce's hat....

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Out of curiosity Stuart, what happens if said child had had to use their 26 or 32k fighting some illness. They are now penalised at the age of 5 when it comes to school as they have spent all their dividend on private health care.

Penalised is the wrong word. They'll have been given their dividend to spend as they wish - as will their parents and the rest of their family. The taxpayers responsibility ends there.

I know it sounds harsh but it's no worse than what happens currently. Look at the Vanessa Riddle case that I publicised on here, or the case of thousands of other sick kids every year who are refused the treatment they need by the NHS because of the cost of provision. And what happens to their education when they have to take a year out, or two years out of their schooling to fight their illness?

At least when they control their own share of the budget they will be able to fund their education beyond current school leavers age.

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I'm sorry but lol.giflol.giflol.giflol.gif

This has to be the funniest thing you've ever posted and there have been some right crackers over the years.

If you want to know why we are laughing Stuart, try doing the following.

Get a calculator.

There are about 65 million people in the country.

Presumably about 40-60 million of them would receive your payment.

At £25,000 each per year.

Multiply those two number together and come back and tell us what the calculator says.

Then tell you exactly how much on average the 2 million UK based businesses would have to pay in tax to cover it each year.

ETA:

I can't contain myself.

The answer is between 1 and 1.6 THOUSAND BILLION pounds a year in corporation tax alone.

It's like something out of Austin Powers with Dr Evil's hilarious demand.

That would wipe our national debt overnight.

Each of our two million companies (bear in mind the vast majority - 90% or so are under 10 employees) would be paying an eye watering

£500,000 in corporation tax!!!! Given corporation tax is about 20% at the moment this could only work if the companies were raising £2.5 million in pre-tax profits. You also have to understand that companies usually expect profit margins of 5-20% of turnover which means the only companies who could possibly pay this are those with turnover exceeding £20-50 million per year.

Any company earning this amount (and there are VERY few of them indeed - perhaps no more than a few thousand) will be based offshore to avoid paying tax altogether.

That would bankrupt more or less every other company and by extension the country overnight.

Thanks for the belly laugh. Incompetence on this scale is truly hilarious.

BTW the numbers are so huge I had to get my calculator out and do the maths 4 times to check.

ETA:

For those who are interested, the UK brings in about £400 billion pounds a year. That comes from corporation tax, VAT, and an army of employees all paying income tax, national insurance, miscellaneous other taxes and various investments all over the world. Corporation tax brings in a small proportion of the overall £400 billion take and this is because a company turning over anything like £20 million a year will employ an army of accountants to find ways of not paying anything.

:lol:

You got the calculator out to check it out 4 times yet you were still out by a factor of 4!

Right enough, mad! :1eye

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