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Wilbur

Gowser Assaults Tony Fitzpatrick

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Good post. As someone who has previously worked with the police and who has several friends and family currently serving I agree with everything you've said. He deserves everything that's coming to him.

Also, assuming the assault took place in the custody suite of the police office - I can see reason why he'd be anywhere else in the building - the whole sorry episode would have been recorded on CCTV complete with audio.

Perhaps this fact has more to do with Mr McGowan's guilty plea than him being stitched up by police officers which I can see is ( quite outrageously and perhaps criminally IMO ) being implied here.

As a citizen I'd like to see him locked up, as a St Mirren fan it's terrible news. But there's far more important things than football, and seeing justice served is one of them.

1eye.gif

f**k me! Columbo is back from the dead!

Edited by Drew

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The police can easily provoke people. Police brutality in this country is common. Look at the protests in London, for example. McGowan may have been daft, he may have had a few drinks too many, but he may also have been provoked.

We don't know, but those of us who know him know he is not a bad lad.

Those calling for jail sentences and bans should be ashamed of yourselves.

Lets say you're right (although you probably aren't).... if a police officer was winding you up, you would start lashing out and assaulting them would you? That's a normal reaction is it?

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two points in summary

1. McGowan has embarrassed the club and as criminal should be dealt with accordingly no matter what we all think of him as a player

2. pro police guys, yes police do have a lot to deal with but their credibility ( or lack of ) in recent years regarding covering up their own criminal acts leaves them open to 'set up' suspicions in every situation

Edited by thewhiteman

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Lex - you are the outrageous one here - you are condemning him without full knowledge of the facts.

Do you think the police will ever admit they are wrong here?

He's plead guilty to assaulting police officers in a police office. Police custody suites are rigged up with audio and visual recording equipment. If he thought the police were in the wrong he could have quite easily plead not guilty and went to trial. He never. I'm not condemning him, he's admitted to the charges, he condemned himself. He was innocent till found guilty, now he's admitted his guilt.

That's all the facts i need and it's all the facts the public will get. He deserves a jail sentence. Would you be defending him if he wasn't a Saints player?

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two points in summary

1. McGowan has embarrassed the club and as criminal should be dealt with accordingly no matter what we all think of him as a player

2. pro police guys, yes police do have a lot to deal with but their credibility in recent years regarding covering up their own criminal acts leaves them open to 'set up' suspicions in every situation

Suspicions are fair play, but presumptions are just stupid.

He is one of our best players and I'm gutted to have heard this today, but football aint everything and Paul now has a history of attacking police which is fking stupid behaviour from any adult. He fully deserves the jail sentence which is coming to him (only because its not the first time he's done it!), which is a shame because he has great talent on the pitch.

It's also pretty embarrasing for the club too, and a major headache which affects more than just the player himself.

Having said that, I'd support his rehabilitation and will still support him in the jersey. Everyone makes mistakes I guess, some more than others, and perhaps a sentence will be good life changer.

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For all those baying that McGowan should get the jail, is it safe to assume that you have been appraised of the full facts of this situation?

As for the line that he pleaded guilty etc., WTF else was he likely to do? Any solicitor worth his or her salt would have advised him to plead guilty in the circumstances. Let's see....

He was charged with police assault, presumably the principal witnesses were police officers, and he has form in this regard. Oh aye, of course he would be pleading not guilty!

Now here's a thing, and I'm only putting this out there as an alternative twist. So McGowan has a previous conviction for police assault. He won't be popular with the local constabulary, one wouldn't have thought - not if he has previously assaulted one of their own. Made himself a potential target for special attention? A soft target, even? Perhaps it wouldn't take much to make a wee example of the guy. Just saying like....

Now, let me reiterate, I am NOT suggesting that there is anything whatsoever in the above scenario, but need it be any less plausible than an alternative scenario (equally invented, on the basis of no factual backing) that would justify calling for the guy to be jailed and sacked? A few folk a bit quick to judge on here, in my humble opinion.

Drew, do you have any thoghts at all about the victim in all of this because you seem in an indecent haste to defend a confessed criminal with a history of violence against police officers.

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This passage from the BBC report is interesting:

He had not guilty pleas accepted to kicking Special Constable Martine McNee on the body and acting in a threatening and abusing manner likely to cause fear and alarm.

So someone must have accused him of kicking a female officer and behaving in a threatening and abusive manner, yet they couldn't pin this on him. That's a curious one.

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Moreover, if he wasn't acting in a threatening and abusing manner when kicking out at the other officers, you have to wonder how much intent he had to genuinely cause harm. Did he think he was defending himself? I don't know, but it does introduce an interesting slant, no?

Not really, no. He's admitted kicking two policemen, one multiple times.

.....

Big, bleeding heart liberal that I am. I think that act on it's own deserves jail time. The fact he's done it before, well, how can he defend that. Once is maybe a mistake, take the punishment, move on. Twice though........ come on. Really?

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Not really, no. He's admitted kicking two policemen, one multiple times.

.....

Big, bleeding heart liberal that I am. I think that act on it's own deserves jail time. The fact he's done it before, well, how can he defend that. Once is maybe a mistake, take the punishment, move on. Twice though........ come on. Really?

Exactly. Is it really asking too much for a serial offender to be jailed for assaulting someone?

Nobody is saying 5 years but why should anyone have to tolerate being attacked in the street - especially when doing their jobs?

IMO a repeat violent offence should carry a mandatory 12 months.

It won't though because our justice system is setup to favour the criminal over the victim and you are seeing an entire thread where almost Nobody has expressed any concern whatsoever for the victim.

This is the sort of thing which angers victoms of crime most across the country.

Nobody gives a f**k about them.

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Would you if found guilty of an assault charge (which has a various range from putting your hand on someone to use of force, though I'm no expert on the law so I stand to be corrected) if you had kicked Joe Bloggs in the street (whether provoked or not) Normally you read a fine and or community service and maybe a tag. So why would you expect a stretch at her majesties pleasure, just because it was a member/members of the local constabulary? I'm not condoning what he did, but let's be realistic. I hope the club stand by and support him. I'll put the tin hat on now and stand by for the flak as I seem to be in the minority.

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Perhaps he was provoked, but let's say he comes through this and still plays for us. Can you imagine the level of provocation he's going to get from opposition players about his behaviour? He'll be lucky to survive in the professional game and that would be a real shame. Remember when you point the finger there are three pointing back at you.

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Perhaps he was provoked, but let's say he comes through this and still plays for us. Can you imagine the level of provocation he's going to get from opposition players about his behaviour? He'll be lucky to survive in the professional game and that would be a real shame. Remember when you point the finger there are three pointing back at you.

He'll be lucky to survive the professional game? Being a tad overdramatic there. He's hardly the first, or the only current, SPFL player to get a criminal conviction.

No doubt Gowser is in the wrong and will get punished. That will not involve a custodial sentence though.

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Drew, do you have any thoghts at all about the victim in all of this because you seem in an indecent haste to defend a confessed criminal with a history of violence against police officers.

Did you read my initial post on this thread? I think it was quite clear. I am defending nothing and no-one.

My subsequent posts are a counter to those who seem in an indecent haste to see McGowan sacked, jailed, and most likely strung up from a lamp-post at Paisley Cross.

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Did you read my initial post on this thread? I think it was quite clear. I am defending nothing and no-one.

My subsequent posts are a counter to those who seem in an indecent haste to see McGowan sacked, jailed, and most likely strung up from a lamp-post at Paisley Cross.

A bit over dramatic. Some folk just think that when you're guilty of your second violent crime, it's time for some jail.

Maybe you should take your black and white glasses off for a second?

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A bit over dramatic. Some folk just think that when you're guilty of your second violent crime, it's time for some jail.

Maybe you should take your black and white glasses off for a second?

No black and white glasses here. I think it is some others who are seeing things in black and white. It is laughable how many people are happy to make assumptions about this case without having access to any detail whatsoever.

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Did you read my initial post on this thread? I think it was quite clear. I am defending nothing and no-one.

My subsequent posts are a counter to those who seem in an indecent haste to see McGowan sacked, jailed, and most likely strung up from a lamp-post at Paisley Cross.

He's not being strung up from a lamp-post at Paisley Cross. He's being strung up from a lamp-post in County Square. The provost will be there with a St Mirren scarf on.

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Not really, no. He's admitted kicking two policemen, one multiple times.

.....

Big, bleeding heart liberal that I am. I think that act on it's own deserves jail time. The fact he's done it before, well, how can he defend that. Once is maybe a mistake, take the punishment, move on. Twice though........ come on. Really?

I'm surpised that the police gave him an opportunity to kick out.

Ask Ian Tomilson, Jean Charles de Menezes, and Blair Peach their thoughts on the matter.

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An awful lot of amatuer sheriff / judges on here deciding on a sentence. Lets just let the law take it's course then discuss the fall out then. He might be jailed he might not but why speculate what might be the consequences when no one knows the punishment yet. Whatever the punishment handed down he will have deserved it since he has admitted the charge but beyond that no one should be speculating on what the effect should be on his livelyhood.

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