Lennon Out

[norman]

I honestly think some of our "supporters" would rather be relegated with Lennon in charge than have a new guy come in and keep us up, just because that would prove their "nobody can do better than Danny" mantra wrong.

Pathetic attitude to be honest, and not one true supporters would have.

[bluto]

I honestly think some of our "supporters" would rather be relegated with Lennon in charge than have a new guy come in and keep us up, just because that would prove their "nobody can do better than Danny" mantra wrong.

Pathetic attitude to be honest, and not one true supporters would have.

"True supporters"?

GTF

[shull]

In the past 30 minutes we've had quotes from 2 posters claiming real and true supporters widnae dae this or they wid dae that.

I AM NOT F*CKING WORTHY

Honoured to be among you

PATHETIC !!!

[norman]

If it wasn't for us true supporters of Saint Mirren F.C, many of the "fans" on here wouldn't have a team to listen to on the radio on a Saturday.

[bluto]

I believe you are a Troll supporter.

Your team went bust .

Trolls with too much time on their gnarled hands need a new pastime.

[The Original 59er]

What baffles me about all this superficial unrest is that the one thing DL was initially being praised for

- was his team served up better football than the Sainted Gus.

And eventually I came to agree. The quality of football was a bit more entertaining.

Even Saturday's result - tho ultimately a boot in the boz - came after sparkling, goal-scoring, entertaining fitba.

Compare that to Gus's fitba and the paucity of goals/good results when I was a very miserable bunny. DL came along, the fitba was more attractive, and a couple of splashes of colour were added to the grey, Greenhill mausoleum.

I still hadn't seen a WIN there, though... till the Killie match. THAT should sustain me for a while.

Do you not all recall when you were bleating about, "I wouldn't mind getting beat so often if the team scored a few goals/played better fitba"?

Sometimes... I know, I know, this sounds silly... sometimes I think some fitba fans can be awfy picky with short memories...

To an extent I agree Bluto, if only he had picked up the odd bit of external 'advice' along the way and strengthened the defence, particularly in the middle of the back four.

Had he done that and made the defence mean in their 'Christmas present' department, my suspicions are that we wouldn't be anywhere near the bottom of the league and we also wouldn't have a thread that sits at 71 pages......................... and counting!

[faraway saint]

To an extent I agree Bluto, if only he had picked up the odd bit of external 'advice' along the way and strengthened the defence, particularly in the middle of the back four.

Had he done that and made the defence mean in their 'Christmas present' department, my suspicions are that we wouldn't be anywhere near the bottom of the league and we also wouldn't have a thread that sits at 71 pages......................... and counting!

Agreed.

Been our Achilles heel for many a year, the amount of soft goals we lose is murder.

[Bud the Baker]

What baffles me about all this superficial unrest is that the one thing DL was initially being praised for

- was his team served up better football than the Sainted Gus.

And eventually I came to agree. The quality of football was a bit more entertaining.

Even Saturday's result - tho ultimately a boot in the boz - came after sparkling, goal-scoring, entertaining fitba.

Compare that to Gus's fitba and the paucity of goals/good results when I was a very miserable bunny. DL came along, the fitba was more attractive, and a couple of splashes of colour were added to the grey, Greenhill mausoleum.

I still hadn't seen a WIN there, though... till the Killie match. THAT should sustain me for a while.

Do you not all recall when you were bleating about, "I wouldn't mind getting beat so often if the team scored a few goals/played better fitba"?

Sometimes... I know, I know, this sounds silly... sometimes I think some fitba fans can be awfy picky with short memories...

Here we go again - it's just my opinion but for the bulk of Lennon's tenure the football has been just as turgid as that served up by MacPherson - the start of the 2011/12 season before Lennon's tactics were sussed and the period just after Isma arrived until his post-match dismissal against Celtic being the exceptions. For the bulk of the rest it's been 1 good game in 4 or 5 when we were in the mood, again not much different from how I recall the MacPherson era.

In MacPherson's last season we scored 36 goals in 38 league games, so far this season we've got 29 goals from 29 - hardly a seismic change.

Oh and for the record I don't go to the football to watch entertaining football, I go to see Saints win and I applaud Isma's dive against Celtic which earned us a point, unfortunately not all three, that was sweet after all the times the decisions have gone the other way. It was Thompson's on-screen confession that irks me - how often have we seen other players defend their teammate or prevaricate in similar circumstances?

***************************************

For me the only biggest difference between the MacPherson (once we'd reached the SPL and survived the first season) and Lennon tenures is that Lennon has tried to maintain good relations between himself and the support, oh and the small matter of a League Cup win.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Bud the Baker

[Drew]

The discussion around our defensive frailties certainly chimes with me.

Danny's former philosophy was to play the ball out of defence, and while this could be nice on the eye, we simply didn't have the calibre of player to pull this off (MATRON!). The result was that we all too often surrendered possession cheaply and conceded goals that should never have been conceded.

So, the alternative option was to punt the ball up the park, whereby we invariably lose possession and the ball is played straight back into our half - cue a defensive clusterf**k.

The elephant in the room has, for some time, been the dodgy central defence, and Danny has to carry the can for failing to address this.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Drew

[Magic Monkey]

What gets me is that hard bastard, no-nonsense centre halves should be ten-a-penny. I don't know why we can't find one. Same goes for a half decent defensive mid.

Setting the 'baldy' connection aside, we managed to stretch to the likes of Scott Walker, Gus McP and Will Haining while in the first division.

Any of them, in their prime, would slot into our squad quite happily now.

[E=Mc2]

I'm not really convinced there is a great deal of difference in their records (11th, 10th, 11th, 10th) vs. (11th, 8th, 11th, 11th) in the league.

Both took the team to 1 League Cup Final. Macpherson's team lost 1-0 to the team that won the SPL that year, Lennon's team beat a Hearts team who finished 10th in the SPL.

In my opinion the year we finished 8th, we played as well in the SPL as I've ever seen us play, and winning the League Cup final was great.

But over the course of the 4 years, and with all the advantages Lennon has had (training ground, Teale, Thompson) I don't see how you can say Lennon's significantly improved the team since he took over from McPherson.

Did we get a bye in the League Cup semi?

Selective facts undermine your case.

[windae cleaner]

What gets me is that hard bastard, no-nonsense centre halves should be ten-a-penny. I don't know why we can't find one. Same goes for a half decent defensive mid.

Setting the 'baldy' connection aside, we managed to stretch to the likes of Scott Walker, Gus McP and Will Haining while in the first division.

Any of them, in their prime, would slot into our squad quite happily now.

I find it staggering we haven't signed a central defender in 4 years and in that time we have got rid of 2.

Also one of them has been injured the good part of 2 seasons out of the 4.

I don't think it's the case can't find one,we haven't been looking for one

Case proven in Jan when we got rid of 2 players who have played there this season

We went out and signed 2 more midfielders

[norman]

I believe you are a Troll supporter.

Your team went bust .

Trolls with too much time on their gnarled hands need a new pastime.

I believe you should show more respect to a true supporter. If it wasn't for the likes of me many folk on this forum wouldn't have a club to support on the rare occassion they could be arsed.

[Froggie]

Three weeks ago, just before the Killie game, it was more or less assumed that had we lost Lennon would be sacked. All in the media were agreeing with this. Since then we have won that game and the pressure seems to be off again, despite throwing away a teo goal lead last week. Having now lost 8 of the last 11 league games since the turn of the year, and with 4 games before the split, then 5 afterwards, it appears Lennon has a "free" weekend coming up. This is where he is allowed to lose in any fashion, and may even get some credit for a narrow defeat ( it wont be, this time though) because its against Celtic (whom we all know he supports).

Bearing that in mind, the pressure must surely mount again for the home game against St Johnstone because the last three games look like being defeats on current form.

Ive accepted that he is going to be here until the end of the season unfortunately, because no-one is prepared to sack him and he wont resign.Last game i attended was the Hearts fiasco at home, and looks like only the play off game could tempt me again this season, such is the apathy Lennon has caused.

Saturdays match will be listened to with fingers in the ears and fearing the worst.trangely, in years gone by its the kind of game we used to win, when we were completely written off. Not any more under Lennons "leadership", lol.

[norman]

Here we go again - it's just my opinion but for the bulk of Lennon's tenure the football has been just as turgid as that served up by MacPherson - the start of the 2011/12 season before Lennon's tactics were sussed and the period just after Isma arrived until his post-match dismissal against Celtic being the exceptions. For the bulk of the rest it's been 1 good game in 4 or 5 when we were in the mood, again not much different from how I recall the MacPherson era.

In MacPherson's last season we scored 36 goals in 38 league games, so far this season we've got 29 goals from 29 - hardly a seismic change.

Oh and for the record I don't go to the football to watch entertaining football, I go to see Saints win and I applaud Isma's dive against Celtic which earned us a point, unfortunately not all three, that was sweet after all the times the decisions have gone the other way. It was Thompson's on-screen confession that irks me - how often have we seen other players defend their teammate or prevaricate in similar circumstances?

***************************************

For me the only biggest difference between the MacPherson (once we'd reached the SPL and survived the first season) and Lennon tenures is that Lennon has tried to maintain good relations between himself and the support, oh and the small matter of a League Cup win.

Agreed, there have been plenty of turgid performances under Lennon, and there were actually some great performances under Gus at times. Both managers were sucessful St. Mirren managers and should be respected as such. However, like MacPherson, I think Lennon has reached the end of the line now. I would have loved it for him to have kicked on after last season's success, but it hasn't worked out. Like MacPherson he seems to have a blind spot when it comes to certain deficiencies in the team (we all remember the yearly cries for a left back) and I think that will cost him.

I genuinely think a short term option like Calderwood would do us a turn right now, though I can completetly understand why some people would be resistant to that. I just think now it's looking less and less like Lennon has the ability, or even desire to dig us out this hole. We need a big performance soon.

[HSS]

I believe you should show more respect to a true supporter. If it wasn't for the likes of me many folk on this forum wouldn't have a club to support on the rare occassion they could be arsed.

You really are the man Norman,have a big thanks from me.

PS.Any good at anagrams?

Real shoe.

[Soctty]

I'm not really convinced there is a great deal of difference in their records (11th, 10th, 11th, 10th) vs. (11th, 8th, 11th, 11th) in the league.

Both took the team to 1 League Cup Final. Macpherson's team lost 1-0 to the team that won the SPL that year, Lennon's team beat a Hearts team who finished 10th in the SPL.

In my opinion the year we finished 8th, we played as well in the SPL as I've ever seen us play, and winning the League Cup final was great.

But over the course of the 4 years, and with all the advantages Lennon has had (training ground, Teale, Thompson) I don't see how you can say Lennon's significantly improved the team since he took over from McPherson.

From the previous post, Gus gave us our best finish in twenty years - Lennon improved that by two places. Gus took us to our first cup final in 23 years - Lennon won us that trophy, our first in 26 years.

To my mind the improvement is clear. Talk of all advantages doesn't cover the fact that Lennon had to cut the wage bill when he took over, and has been asked cut it further since then. Happy to be corrected on this, but not on the fact that Lennon has improved on what Gus did for us, and Gus did a very decent job himself.

[norman]

You really are the man Norman,have a big thanks from me.

You are welcome. It's nice to be appreciated from time to time.

[Soctty]

How many times has Lennon been SPL manager of the month?

I'm pretty sure he has never won this accolade, McPherson on the other hand won it a couple of times.

How many times did the team win the League Cup under McPherson - I'm pretty sure we never won this trophy under Gus. Under Lennon we won it once.

I'm sure he'd trade in that trophy for a couple of manager of the month accolades...

[faraway saint]

You really are the man Norman,have a big thanks from me.

PS.Any good at anagrams?

Real shoe.

I know, I know.........................is there a prize?

[Bud the Baker]

From the previous post, Gus gave us our best finish in twenty years - Lennon improved that by two places. Gus took us to our first cup final in 23 years - Lennon won us that trophy, our first in 26 years.

To my mind the improvement is clear. Talk of all advantages doesn't cover the fact that Lennon had to cut the wage bill when he took over, and has been asked cut it further since then. Happy to be corrected on this, but not on the fact that Lennon has improved on what Gus did for us, and Gus did a very decent job himself.

Let's wait and see where we finish this season before we say Lennon has a better overall league record than MacPherson as Saints manager - one good season in four isn't a compelling case especially when Rangers have been missing for the past two seasons and Hearts crippled for the same period. As for the wage bill Lennon's cuts have taken place against a background of more realistic budgets in the SP(F)L and apart from last season (possibly) he's never had the lowest budget in the division like MacPherson did in 2006/07 - by a margin.

Like I said the major differences are the LC win but perhaps more importantly the fact that Lennon hasn't retreated into the bunker this season as results have gone against him - I know there's been a few guys who've gone over the top but there's been nothing like the levels of vitriol seen in MacPherson's last season.

[faraway saint]

Let's wait and see where we finish this season before we say Lennon has a better overall league record than MacPherson as Saints manager - one good season in four isn't a compelling case especially when Rangers have been missing for the past two seasons and Hearts crippled for the same period. As for the wage bill Lennon's cuts have taken place against a background of more realistic budgets in the SP(F)L and apart from last season (possibly) he's never had the lowest budget in the division like MacPherson did in 2006/07 - by a margin.

Like I said the major differences are the LC win but perhaps more importantly the fact that Lennon hasn't retreated into the bunker this season as results have gone against him - I know there's been a few guys who've gone over the top but there's been nothing like the levels of vitriol seen in MacPherson's last season.

Indeed.

Astounding from memory.

Makes you wonder.

[Lord Pityme]

I honestly think some of our "supporters" would rather be relegated with Lennon in charge than have a new guy come in and keep us up, just because that would prove their "nobody can do better than Danny" mantra wrong.

Pathetic attitude to be honest, and not one true supporters would have.

and they say elvis, Lovestreet, bud, sid etc etc are deid?

[Soctty]

Let's wait and see where we finish this season before we say Lennon has a better overall league record than MacPherson as Saints manager - one good season in four isn't a compelling case especially when Rangers have been missing for the past two seasons and Hearts crippled for the same period. As for the wage bill Lennon's cuts have taken place against a background of more realistic budgets in the SP(F)L and apart from last season (possibly) he's never had the lowest budget in the division like MacPherson did in 2006/07 - by a margin.

One season finishing 8th is better than finishing second bottom twice, and a point off it twice as we did under Gus. Difficult to measure the effect of Rangers being out of the league, although we did take 4 points from 9 against them in their last season in the SPL.

Even if Lennon finishes 11th this season, he'll have a better overall league record in my opinion, having finished 8th while Rangers were still in the league.

Like I said the major differences are the LC win but perhaps more importantly the fact that Lennon hasn't retreated into the bunker this season as results have gone against him - I know there's been a few guys who've gone over the top but there's been nothing like the levels of vitriol seen in MacPherson's last season.

Lennon has dealt with the situation with dignity, despite the abuse from some. Agree Gus got worse, and I would not have got rid of him when we did, as I was satisfied with how we were doing. I do think Lennon has taken us further though. Hopefully whoever is next in the door improves again, otherwise change will be pointless.

[aldo_j]

Indeed.

Astounding from memory.

Makes you wonder.

Think this time it has been the prolonged monotony of the arguing, amongst the same few, dominating most threads.