Phil McCracken Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 (edited) And then after a wee while on high wages, the owners get bored and pull out or run out of money . Therefore unsustainable salaries. And probably death of St Mirren Football Club or Admin if we're lucky. Nae thanks !!! GILMOUR & CO. MUST STAY !!!! Are high wages and unsustainable salaries the plan of the new owners? IOB Saint has the new owners down for cut backs and lower salaries (despite pouring money into the club)! Some folk have vivid imaginations! Edited September 28, 2014 by Phil McCracken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 If someone were to 'pour money in to' the club, surely that would mean a higher player budget, more staff, etc? If you are suggesting that they would want to take money out of the club, then why pour money into it in the first place? Leaving that aside, I would imagine that there are far easier ways for a someone to make money from a circa £2m investment than buying a Scottish football club and then running it down. I meant to pay for the club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 Are high wages and unsustainable salaries the plan of the new owners? IOB Saint has the new owners down for cut backs and lower salaries (despite pouring money into the club)! Some folk have vivid imaginations! : Unsustainable salaries would never be part of the plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Pityme Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 These guys are all about 'Sustainable Salary' http://bragafresh.com/archives/introducing-josies-organics-brand-sleeved-celery-and-celery-hearts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 I meant to pay for the club So, despite knowing nothing about the buyers or whetherthere are actually any buyers, that their plan is to cut wages whilst shull thinks the plan is to inflate salaries? Maybe the plan is neither? If someone has £2 million to invest, do you seriously believe that the best way to make money would be to buy a football club then start making cut backs and hope that you can squeeze some profit out of it whilst retaining a place in the SPL despite the cut backs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 Unsustainable salaries would never be part of the plan. Who said they were? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Pityme Posted September 29, 2014 Report Share Posted September 29, 2014 Unsustainable salaries would never be part of the plan. Well they tried them at Sevco (three times and counting)' Well, Dundee (three times and counting) Aberdeen (they took the wig aff Milne's heid) Livi Gretna Hibs Hertz (three times and counting) And it seemed to work ok for ..... Oh hing oan a meenute! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Andy you think someone is going to throw 2 million at St Mirren for no return. Of course they are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 The only way there going g to get rid of there shares is if they give them away there's no one in there right mind would buy us I know we have a good infra structure but what's the point in that when the product on the park is utter shite week in week out who would buy into that ?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Andy you think someone is going to throw 2 million at St Mirren for no return. Of course they are not. And do you think that the best way to invest £2 million is to buy a football club then run it down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) I struggle to understand why anyone would want to pay a significant sum of money to take ownership of a club like St Mirren in arguably a declining market and then try and continue to run it without incurring losses (personal or against the assets of the club). . Is it a declining market? Outside of the Old Firm, gates are fairly good. Indeed, gates are far better today than they were when Scottish football was at its peak on the field in the last 60s and early 80s. And looking beyond Scotland, money seems to be pouring in football in England, Spain, & Germany. Maybe someone is taking a holistic view to making money from buying a Scottish football club? To be honest, its only guess work on my part but if you 'think outside the box' then there may well be a market. Running down a football club certainly isn't a way to make money however! Edited September 30, 2014 by Phil McCracken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mc Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 I think buyers at this point in time could be coming in at a good time from their point of view provided we stay up. Revenues will inevitably increase noticeably next season as Hearts and regretably Sevco post-McCoist will return. There's also signs that if we can get the youth development side right there is an income stream there from transfers as some other clubs have shown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
div Posted September 30, 2014 Report Share Posted September 30, 2014 Said since day one that there are really only a few plausible scenarios why anyone would want to buy St.Mirren; 1) They are die-hard St.Mirren fan(s) who want to continue the legacy of the outgoing board 2) They want to earn their outlay back out of the club via salary and then sell it onwards again further down the line (maybe to fans) 3) They are football agent(s) looking to use club as showcase for their players with business model of on-selling 4) A rich owner of another club wants to buy us to use as a feeder club I can't really see any other scenario. The club can't really be asset stripped as it has no real assets other than the stadium and the training facility. I think after 4 years we can rule out scenario 1. The only St.Mirren minded people with sufficient funding were Gordon Scott (bid rejected) and possibly Ken McGeoch (bid booted out before it even got going). Nobody in the current climate is going to be able to borrow money against the stadium IMHO so the investment is going to have to come from private finance. Anyone looking to take money out of the club to pay back their borrowing is going to have to be pretty sure they can increase our revenue significantly first of all. I can't really see how that would fly to be honest. The land opposite the stadium I guess is a possibility but it can't be worth very much surely ? That kind of rules out scenario 2. I think any of the other two the football agent route is the most likely. It hasn't really worked anywhere else that I know of (Claude Anelka tried this model at Raith and Mad Vlad sort of tried it at Hearts). Feeder club is an oft used phrase but I can't think of a formal feeder club system that actually exists in the UK ? There may be another scenario where a group of wealthy non-saints fans buy the club just for the ego trip but I think that kind of unlikely too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickMcD Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 I'm always amazed at the amount of cynicism and scepticism that pours out of our supporters at even the hint of new owners. St.Mirren supporters and optimism certainly don't go together hand in hand. What we need is a beneficent multi-millionaire who isn't looking for a return on his/her investment. I accept they're hard to find. If I won mega bucks on Euromillions. I'd be happy to pay the guts of £2m. to buy St.Mirren. In addition I reckon another £1m would be needed almost immediately for working capital. But that could only ever be a beginning. A hint of money and agents are on the prowl doing their best. But who for? Some of our players who 'would die for St.Mirren' suddenly want another £1K per week for that privelege. Some of our fans would still expect us to compete with the big Scottish clubs to sign big names. A new owner or owners would probably need to invest a further couple of million over the first few years to really make a difference. Being a feeder club, nurturing young talent and selling players on seems to be the way ahead. We seem to be reasonably good at bringing boys on but simply can't or don't cash in. Are they at the end of the day just not good enough for bigger clubs? The present board has done a great job over the last ten years or so. I think there is a great foundation there and a bit of effort and imagination can improve things further.. But without an injection of a fair bit of capital it's hard to see our lot improving significantly. Last night's good result can't disguise the fact that we are in a very difficult situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickMcD Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 That model worked well for clubs like Gretna, Hearts, Livingston, Dundee, Motherwell.... John McGuinness exactly a case in point of someone blowing the Lotto millions at Livingston. A fool and his money are easily parted.....especially when it comes to football clubs. Just look at a very successful businessman down south Simon Jordan who blew a £75million fortune over a 6 year period on his boyhood team Crystal Palace. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Careful-What-You-Wish-For/dp/0224091816 I certainly would not class Jordan as a fool regarding how he built his business and then sold it, but look what football club ownership did to him? It carries tremendous risk in exchange for mostly grief. There are far easier ways to invest money and make a profit than in a football club - especially in Scotland. I would call my approach to the sale of the club as realistic rather than cynical. Personally I prefer a fan-led co-operative community ownership model, but sadly that is only likely to happen if the club gets into financial difficulties. I agree with everything you say. The point I was making but not putting across very well that in my hypothetical case when I win my megabucks is that the five million I invest in St.Mirren over say five years is the absolute limit. I'll live comfortably off my other fifty million. The five million in St.Mirren will probably never yield a return. If it did it would be an unexpected bonus. Simon Jordan must have lost his marbles somewhere down the line. Is it commendable what he tried to do for his beloved team? Or crass stupidity? Now, where the f**k did I put that lottery ticket? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 Div makes some good points. Just on Romanov, did his 'model' really not work at Hearts? Okay, they got relegated last season... but they seem to be enjoying this season. I know a Hearts fan who hasn't been going to games for years but has suddenly bought a season ticket this season. The Hearts support is buzzing just now. The trade off was winning two Scottish Cups, including a once in a lifetime beating of rivals Hibernian in the final by a scoreline of 5-1 that gives them bragging rights for ever and ever. Personally, I would trade relegation for winning 2 Scottish Cups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM1 Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 Good old Captain, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bud77 Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 Said since day one that there are really only a few plausible scenarios why anyone would want to buy St.Mirren; 1) They are die-hard St.Mirren fan(s) who want to continue the legacy of the outgoing board 2) They want to earn their outlay back out of the club via salary and then sell it onwards again further down the line (maybe to fans) 3) They are football agent(s) looking to use club as showcase for their players with business model of on-selling 4) A rich owner of another club wants to buy us to use as a feeder club I can't really see any other scenario. The club can't really be asset stripped as it has no real assets other than the stadium and the training facility. Isn't there something in the rules about not being able to own over a certain percentage of the shares in a club if you are already involved with another club. I'm sure I read that Mike Ashley had to get special dispensation from the SFA to buy his shares in the tribute act because he already owns Newcastle and the reasons it was granted were because he would be under a certain percentage and would not be involved in running the new club. That would rule out scenario 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintargyll Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 Div makes some good points. Just on Romanov, did his 'model' really not work at Hearts? Okay, they got relegated last season... but they seem to be enjoying this season. I know a Hearts fan who hasn't been going to games for years but has suddenly bought a season ticket this season. The Hearts support is buzzing just now. The trade off was winning two Scottish Cups, including a once in a lifetime beating of rivals Hibernian in the final by a scoreline of 5-1 that gives them bragging rights for ever and ever. Personally, I would trade relegation for winning 2 Scottish Cups. there is no trade ...what will be will be...you can however dream and i wont be dreaming of relegation and 2 cups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Yoda Posted October 1, 2014 Report Share Posted October 1, 2014 .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil McCracken Posted October 2, 2014 Report Share Posted October 2, 2014 Did you miss Hearts administration? Did one of your many aliases not suggest that you would be happy to dance on their grave when their club died? Sorry but too many clubs in Scotland have shafted creditors through financial mismanagement. You still think that model is OK? but they aren't in administration now a sugar daddy throwing money at us and winning cups then wiping the debt... That model works for me as for dancing on their grave, that ain't really relevant. Id dance on the grave of every rival club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Zo Posted October 2, 2014 Report Share Posted October 2, 2014 I wonder what the next few days hold? Interesting times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billyg Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 I wonder what the next few days hold? Interesting times. Here's hoping ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Is there something in the pipeline regarding the sale.or is it just wishfull thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billyg Posted October 3, 2014 Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Is there something in the pipeline regarding the sale.or is it just wishfull thinking. I think Mr Zo maybe party to some info that he can't talk about yet , let's hope so ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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