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St Mirren V Motherwell.. 5/4/14


Lex

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Partick will probably beat Hearts, as Archibald isn't a clueless coward, so we really need something out of this match. Ross Co play on the Friday too...5 pts adrift going in to the split could basically be it.

Loving the "belief" that Hearts will probably lose to Partick?

Also you're drooling over the possibility Ross County will win on Friday.

Couldnae make it up, forever the optimist. thumbdown.gif

In the past the team going into the post split fixtures in 12th place was almost always relegated especially if there was a points gap bigger than the 3 for a 1 game margin. The two relegation battles I really remember are 2001 against Dundee Utd. and 2012 against Dunfermline - in both seasons the bottom team was unable to bridge a 4 point gap despite winning the ultimately not so crucial H2H game. The only time a gap of this size was bridged successfully IIRC when Livingston overtook Dundee in 2004/05.

TsuMirren's analysis seems more realistic to me, at some point optimism becomes self-delusion - we have now entered the must win stage of the season.

COYS!

Edited by Bud the Baker
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Can't see where the optimism's coming from , our home record against Motherwell in league games since we were promoted is poor , poor , poor. It will take a miraculous turnaround in attitude , throughout the club , for us to avoid the play-offs now ! TBH , for the first time in around forty years, I don't think anyone within the club really cares , what with the RFC , HMFC and DAFC safety net likely to be in place next season ! Sad and worrying times for the fans !

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In the past the team going into the post split fixtures in 12th place was almost always relegated especially if there was a points gap bigger than the 3 for a 1 game margin. The two relegation battles I really remember are 2001 against Dundee Utd. and 2012 against Dunfermline - in both seasons the bottom team was unable to bridge a 4 point gap despite winning the ultimately not so crucial H2H game. The only time a gap of this size was bridged successfully IIRC when Livingston overtook Dundee in 2004/05.

TsuMirren's analysis seems more realistic to me, at some point optimism becomes self-delusion - we have now entered the must win stage of the season.

COYS!

I'm not going to refute facts but I'm of the opinion that Hearts could easily beat Partick and RC could lose on Friday therefore we, worst case scenario, could still be in the ame position we are in right now.

I agree this weekend could almost seal things but until then, still some hope, small as it is.

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Surprised at the negativity on this thread. You'd think we were 10 points behind or something.

We don't have to win this weekend. We could lose this weekend and finish 8th. Any of the bottom 6 could go on a terrible run and not win another game this season, watch Hibs in this regard especially. It's going to come down to the 5 games after the split, simple.

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Surprised at the negativity on this thread. You'd think we were 10 points behind or something.

We don't have to win this weekend. We could lose this weekend and finish 8th. Any of the bottom 6 could go on a terrible run and not win another game this season, watch Hibs in this regard especially. It's going to come down to the 5 games after the split, simple.

We have seen it over the years with other teams we have relegated. Play rotten football for the majority of the season, get rotten results and expect it to turn around come the split.

Its going to come down to courage and bottle. I don't think our players/management have shown enough of that this season. Danny still doesn't know his best starting line up/system.

Personally I am assuming Thistle beat Hearts and County take something against ICT, I think we need 3 points here. 4 or 5 points behind going into the split is a really big ask to turn around.

Saying that I think we can do it, we have to.

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If we lose this weekend and Partick and Ross County win, then we would need a miraculous turnaround to avoid 11th.

But if we win and they lose then we are no longer favourites for 11th going into the split.

So anyone claiming the Motherwell game isn't a must win is deluded.

If we lose and they (Partick & RC) lose? blink.png

Not great but still makes it an interesting set of games in the play offs. Flush.gif

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1. Wow, there is a lot of knickerwetting about these days.

2. We are Saint Mirren. Too good to finish 11th, even with some of the crazyness like playing Newton as a full back.

3. It's not a must win game for us this week. I think that we will win, but even if we don't, please have another look at point 2.

4. I'm as frustrated as the next guy about our form this year. We have a squad to be top 6. There will be changes and we will progress next season. When I win the euromillions, I'll be buying the club and putting a photo of my baw face right on the strip where the sponsor logo is. Then you can all start knickerwetting, until then, trust in Thommo and Co.

5. Saints 2- 1 Motherwell. Teal and Thompson. Crowd: 3768

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Hopefully Teale starts this one and every player is geared up for it.

Agreed. Teale did more in the 26 minutes he had on Saturday than Campbell and Wylde did in their combined 128. The old legend is definitely due a start, even if we do only get 60 minutes or so out of him, he's just so much better than the two aforementioned youngsters.

Well have had a midweek trip to Sneck and their squad is apparently pretty stretched for this one. We should be fresher and there's more at stake for us. Therefore I'm confident we will get at least a point, infact I'm going to go as far as to say that I don't think we will be 11th at 5pm on Saturday.

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Agreed. Teale did more in the 26 minutes he had on Saturday than Campbell and Wylde did in their combined 128. The old legend is definitely due a start, even if we do only get 60 minutes or so out of him, he's just so much better than the two aforementioned youngsters.

Well have had a midweek trip to Sneck and their squad is apparently pretty stretched for this one. We should be fresher and there's more at stake for us. Therefore I'm confident we will get at least a point, infact I'm going to go as far as to say that I don't think we will be 11th at 5pm on Saturday.

It is frightening how much better we are with Gary Teale available. He actually runs at the defence, and creates chances that we can't replicate in his absence.

Hopefully his return also sparks Thompson back into form, with some quality service.

Gary Teale cloud9.gif

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Agreed. Teale did more in the 26 minutes he had on Saturday than Campbell and Wylde did in their combined 128. The old legend is definitely due a start, even if we do only get 60 minutes or so out of him, he's just so much better than the two aforementioned youngsters.

Well have had a midweek trip to Sneck and their squad is apparently pretty stretched for this one. We should be fresher and there's more at stake for us. Therefore I'm confident we will get at least a point, infact I'm going to go as far as to say that I don't think we will be 11th at 5pm on Saturday.

...............and yet despite Teale being up against 10 men for the majority of his time on the pitch he/we failed to produce anything tangible. Indeed the term "flatters to deceive" could have been coined for him during his spell with us apart from the brief period just after Isma arrived. I certainly would not offer him another contract.

I'll offer you a bet - if we move off 11th spot this weekend I'll not post on this site again if we're still there you don't.

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...............and yet despite Teale being up against 10 men for the majority of his time on the pitch he/we failed to produce anything tangible. Indeed the term "flatters to deceive" could have been coined for him during his spell with us apart from the brief period just after Isma arrived. I certainly would not offer him another contract.

I'll offer you a bet - if we move off 11th spot this weekend I'll not post on this site again if we're still there you don't.

Teale's final ball is probably his biggest failing, but, when on form, he does offer us something that others don't. Even if that is only to drag opponents into wide positions (often he has two men on him) and thus create space for his team-mates to exploit, then that is a valuable attribute. I think part of the problem is that other players fail to use this created space effectively by making telling runs. We need players like McGowan, Newton and McLean to be on their game for Teale's contribution to be effective.

Like Thompson, he can't do it all himself.

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...............and yet despite Teale being up against 10 men for the majority of his time on the pitch he/we failed to produce anything tangible. Indeed the term "flatters to deceive" could have been coined for him during his spell with us apart from the brief period just after Isma arrived. I certainly would not offer him another contract.

I'll offer you a bet - if we move off 11th spot this weekend I'll not post on this site again if we're still there you don't.

Teale is the most direct and dangerous player we have and he has been badly missed when he's been out injured most of the season.

Look at the chance Mclean missed near the end of the Inverness game, Teale gets the ball out wide with 2 men on him.. skips between both of them and puts the ball right on Mcleans foot for what should have been a goal.

Or do you recall him creating a certain goal for Isma last March that 'Lifted St Mirren off the canvas' punk.gif

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Teale's final ball is probably his biggest failing, but, when on form, he does offer us something that others don't. Even if that is only to drag opponents into wide positions (often he has two men on him) and thus create space for his team-mates to exploit, then that is a valuable attribute. I think part of the problem is that other players fail to use this created space effectively by making telling runs. We need players like McGowan, Newton and McLean to be on their game for Teale's contribution to be effective.

Like Thompson, he can't do it all himself.

I've heard this line before used to defend a fans favourite - in general and most certainly in the specific case of Teale I disagree, anyway isn't your admission that his final ball has often been poor kinda an admission that my argument that he "flatters to deceive" is correct.

*******************

Teale is the most direct and dangerous player we have and he has been badly missed when he's been out injured most of the season.

Look at the chance Mclean missed near the end of the Inverness game, Teale gets the ball out wide with 2 men on him.. skips between both of them and puts the ball right on Mcleans foot for what should have been a goal.

Or do you recall him creating a certain goal for Isma last March that 'Lifted St Mirren off the canvas' punk.gif

We can all cherrypick moments during a game, it doesn't change anything - not the final result against ICT nor the fact that in approaching three years with the club he's yet to score a league goal, a pretty dire record for a an attacking player.

Let me provide you with an alternative factoid - our most successful spell of the season came while Teale was out of the team. You form your opinion of a player and then look for facts to back them up but over the three seasons he's been with he's not done enough to impress me except in the short period I mentioned in my previous post.

When Isma returns there'll be a place for Teale in the team.

Edited by Bud the Baker
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I've heard this line before used to defend a fans favourite - in general and most certainly in the specific case of Teale I disagree, anyway isn't your admission that his final ball has often been poor kinda an admission that my argument that he "flatters to deceive" is correct.

*******************

We can all cherrypick moments during a game, it doesn't change anything - not the final result against ICT nor the fact that in approaching three years with the club he's yet to score a league goal, a pretty dire record for a an attacking player.

When Isma returns there'll be a place for Teale in the team.

Since when was it the wingers job to score goals? He done his job, Mclean never.

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I've heard this line before used to defend a fans favourite - in general and most certainly in the specific case of Teale I disagree, anyway isn't your admission that his final ball has often been poor kinda an admission that my argument that he "flatters to deceive" is correct.

*******************

I never suggested he was a superstar, but highlighting what I believe to be his main failing doesn't mean that I don't think he offers something to the team when he plays. Even the best players have failings, after all. Teale's final ball is often not the best, but this also applies to many players (McGowan being an obvious example) who offer other attributes nonetheless.

I'm not sure where the 'flatters to deceive" argument comes from. As I've already posted, even the very fact that he creates space for other players to exploit should be ticked off as a positive. Their failure to capitalise isn't Teale's responsibility.

It may be a hackneyed phrase, but it applies for all that - if he didn't have a few deficiencies in his game, he wouldn't be playing for St Mirren. Let's put it this way, on their respective showings, I'd have Teale ahead of Magennis, Campbell, or Newton on the right side of midfield. What other options do we have?

Edited by Drew
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...............and yet despite Teale being up against 10 men for the majority of his time on the pitch he/we failed to produce anything tangible. Indeed the term "flatters to deceive" could have been coined for him during his spell with us apart from the brief period just after Isma arrived. I certainly would not offer him another contract.

I'll offer you a bet - if we move off 11th spot this weekend I'll not post on this site again if we're still there you don't.

Teale best two men and put in a fantastic cross for McLean, who then forced a superb save from Brill, in what was our only good chance after they went down to ten, that's pretty tangible if you ask me. He also actually had less space against 10 than Campbell and Wylde had against 11, because ICT shut up shop after the sending off and played for a point.

He was superb for all of last season and was deservedly in the top 3 of this sites POTY fans poll, he assisted goals in the semi and the final. However he's getting on a bit and clearly has fitness issues so I would also be reticent to offer him a new deal. Doesn't mean he's not got something to offer between now and the end of the season and he's certainly earned a starting spot ahead of Wylde/Campbell.

As for your bet, no thanks. Just cause I think something's going to happen doesn't mean I'm willing to bet my forum membership on it, jeez.

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