Stabbed In The Back

[Dibbles old paperboy]

I was a Gus supporter, then a Danny supporter, now a Tommy supporter. It's quite simple.

According to Tommy and Jim, their offer to become Danny's successor came as a complete surprise and was not pre-meditated on their part in the slightest. Tommy and Danny have discussed the situation and remain friends. There is no bad blood between parties and no ill feelings from Lennon towards St Mirren. This comes directly from the men themselves.

There was no back stabbing by any of these people. Danny leaves the club after seeing out his contract as a cup winning hero with dignity intact and a great CV. A vacancy opens up. The BoD elect to promote from within. It's almost a non-story.

Maybe there's just not enough soap operas on tv to keep some folk happy.

Sorry I think that it is disingenuous to say the way DL left the club is "almost a non-story". Quote from Tom English on the BBC website: "Lennon has shown great strength this season. He has been pelted with flak for much of it.

Some of it he has deserved, but credit to him, he has never once responded to it. Never once shown anger or resentment. He has been dignified amid a maelstrom and part of the maelstrom was set in motion by folk from within his own club.

This is where you have sympathy for Lennon. Earlier in the season, people in power at St Mirren let it be known to journalists that Lennon was finished - or as good as finished.

The information was that he might not last another game. Lennon had to put up with leaks and reading and hearing about how he was a dead man walking.

He never griped at the disloyalty from within. He kept at it and got St Mirren safe. He has a right to leave the club with his head held high.

His remit was to keep St Mirren in the Premiership and to keep producing young talent. He succeeded. But the goalposts in football management change all the time. That is the reality of this world."

James Lennon's posts on Facebook (DL's brother) when the official St Mirren page announced Tommy Craig was DL's successor perhaps indicate that while DL publicly thanked the board for his time at the club, and TC claims Danny wished him all the best, privately there could be bitterness and a sense of being stabbed in the back by some at the club:

"James Lennon The most two faced club in Scotland you deserve to go down thanks thats a trophy for users and Judas

13 May at 18:26 · Edited · Like · 1"

[Lord Pityme]

This is the side of "Social Media" I don't like as it doesn't do anyone any good.

Edited to say:- I don't mean you Dibbles just the idea of close family members and friends of players, managers etc.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CC8Q3ywwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DIfSI0GVIBJE%26feature%3Dkp&ei=VSF0U6y3PO_Y7AaOpICgCQ&usg=AFQjCNEk0cPHguOMAvqIPvdT9YJtWdRaaQ&bvm=bv.66699033,d.ZGU

[farmer john]

the most important thing now is that Jim Goodwin does an "Archie" as in Alan Archibald, and grows his hair out and, perhaps does a "Danny" as in Just For Mens it in a mid brown colour. That way he will look less like a hatchet man midfield hardman and more like a respectable player coach and the referees, and media, will lay off him a bit.

yes yes.

[Edinbuddie]

Sorry I think that it is disingenuous to say the way DL left the club is "almost a non-story". Quote from Tom English on the BBC website: "Lennon has shown great strength this season. He has been pelted with flak for much of it.

Some of it he has deserved, but credit to him, he has never once responded to it. Never once shown anger or resentment. He has been dignified amid a maelstrom and part of the maelstrom was set in motion by folk from within his own club.

This is where you have sympathy for Lennon. Earlier in the season, people in power at St Mirren let it be known to journalists that Lennon was finished - or as good as finished.

The information was that he might not last another game. Lennon had to put up with leaks and reading and hearing about how he was a dead man walking.

He never griped at the disloyalty from within. He kept at it and got St Mirren safe. He has a right to leave the club with his head held high.

His remit was to keep St Mirren in the Premiership and to keep producing young talent. He succeeded. But the goalposts in football management change all the time. That is the reality of this world."

James Lennon's posts on Facebook (DL's brother) when the official St Mirren page announced Tommy Craig was DL's successor perhaps indicate that while DL publicly thanked the board for his time at the club, and TC claims Danny wished him all the best, privately there could be bitterness and a sense of being stabbed in the back by some at the club:

"James Lennon The most two faced club in Scotland you deserve to go down thanks thats a trophy for users and Judas

13 May at 18:26 · Edited · Like · 1"

As has been said, football seems to be a brutal, two faced, back stabbing industry.

Guys like John Potter, Gareth Wardlaw, Shuggie Murray, Jon Robertson etc, have all intimated that they were less than happy at the way Danny Lennon had treated them when they were let go. Both Potter and Wardlaw suggested that the manager had given them assurances that they'd get a deal before the manager changed his mind and released them. Was that two faced, was that using them, was the manager a 'Judas' for doing that?

I'm not claiming that everything was handled correctly or it's the way that we as fans would like our club to act, but I think it's fair to point out that, whether fans like it or not, it's an industry where hiring, firing, signing, releasing, falling out, tapping up, briefing against players/managers/directors/officials etc, are not all that unusual.

Danny Lennon and his family may view him as a victim on this occasion, but there have undoubtedly been occasions where others have felt themselves to be victims of Danny's decisions.

[TopCat]

Lennon took the Cowden job on from assistant manager after then manager Brain Welsh was sacked. Long story short Welsh wanted to kill him for back stabbing him and there was huge unrest. Lennon can't be too annoyed.

From a Cowdenbeath fan on PNB. What goes around....

[RickMcD]

As has been said, football seems to be a brutal, two faced, back stabbing industry.

Guys like John Potter, Gareth Wardlaw, Shuggie Murray, Jon Robertson etc, have all intimated that they were less than happy at the way Danny Lennon had treated them when they were let go. Both Potter and Wardlaw suggested that the manager had given them assurances that they'd get a deal before the manager changed his mind and released them. Was that two faced, was that using them, was the manager a 'Judas' for doing that?

I'm not claiming that everything was handled correctly or it's the way that we as fans would like our club to act, but I think it's fair to point out that, whether fans like it or not, it's an industry where hiring, firing, signing, releasing, falling out, tapping up, briefing against players/managers/directors/officials etc, are not all that unusual.

Danny Lennon and his family may view him as a victim on this occasion, but there have undoubtedly been occasions where others have felt themselves to be victims of Danny's decisions.

Two wrongs don't make a right. I'm a bit uncomfortable with some aspects of what went on. I think Danny has behaved with great dignity and I wish him well for the future. I hope he is back in football soon.

It's time to move on. Let's not have another four years like we've had with all the crud we've heard about how hard Gus was done by. Let it go and get behind the new management and the team.

[pozbaird]

James Lennon's social media comments are excedingly bitter, but it's his brother and he's angry, so the comments are his view but in my opinion require no further discussion between St Mirren fans. He was angry, probably battered the keyboard in anger.

I think the BoD have in some regards treated the Danny situation badly. Anyone who still thinks the BoD are beyond criticism because of fifteen plus year old events are (in my opinion) in denial. I don't think we are the biggest two-faced club in Scotland though. God only knows what the chancers running The Rangers are really doing on a daily basis, trying to blackmail fans into buying STs all the while. That's another story though.

It genuinely is time for St Mirren to pass on to new owners who can take the club forward in so many areas. Who they might be is of course a long running soap opera.

[HSS]

From a Cowdenbeath fan on PNB. What goes around....

Somebuddie who does Facebook should pass that on to James.

[Stuart Dickson]

You say undermining the manager, I say cutting costs once any prospect of promotion were gone - as ever we seem to have reached an impasse. I'm surprised you claim to be sickened by the Board's actions that season as you seem to be a fan of "strong management" in other walks of life - anyway at least it hasn't stopped you supporting Saint Mirren.

Hmm, I'm interested in this idea that you think I might be a fan of employers who shaft their customers and their employees in other walks of life. Can you give me any examples? I certainly can't think of anything I may have posted that could be construed in that manner. Indeed when it comes to companies f**king over their customers and providing shit service or poor value for money I've often been there front and centre - often taking flak for it from the more lily livered users on the forum.

Want examples - Comet, Sky, Argos, my hardline stance on Sevco gaining admission to the SPL and/or the First Division, my annoyance at the Call Centre industry, Esure, ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds. There's even the fact that I renounced my support for St Mirren after the shambolic Tom Hendrie sacking stating clearly that I had decided that the actions of the people running the club no longer represented me and that I couldn't support a business that would mishandle their employees in such a disgraceful way. I could give countless more examples of where I have previously taken a strong position

I'm not a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion, but the world is full of right and wrong and I'll always act in a way that I can rest easy with my conscience.

[marrez]

Hmm, I'm interested in this idea that you think I might be a fan of employers who shaft their customers and their employees in other walks of life. Can you give me any examples? I certainly can't think of anything I may have posted that could be construed in that manner. Indeed when it comes to companies f**king over their customers and providing shit service or poor value for money I've often been there front and centre - often taking flak for it from the more lily livered users on the forum.

Want examples - Comet, Sky, Argos, my hardline stance on Sevco gaining admission to the SPL and/or the First Division, my annoyance at the Call Centre industry, Esure, ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds. There's even the fact that I renounced my support for St Mirren after the shambolic Tom Hendrie sacking stating clearly that I had decided that the actions of the people running the club no longer represented me and that I couldn't support a business that would mishandle their employees in such a disgraceful way. I could give countless more examples of where I have previously taken a strong position

I'm not a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion, but the world is full of right and wrong and I'll always act in a way that I can rest easy with my conscience.

Saints obviously still have a big place in your life though Stuart, I can understand your reasons (you are not alone, Cubby who ran one of the buses has not been back for years after their bus got taken for 20k by Saints, he still supports but will never go and see them while the current board are in place).

When the board finally do go, will you return fully?

[Bud the Baker]

Hmm, I'm interested in this idea that you think I might be a fan of employers who shaft their customers and their employees in other walks of life. Can you give me any examples? I certainly can't think of anything I may have posted that could be construed in that manner. Indeed when it comes to companies f**king over their customers and providing shit service or poor value for money I've often been there front and centre - often taking flak for it from the more lily livered users on the forum.

Right let's get back to what I said which was "strong management" not the altered version you give "fucking over their customers" - I refer you to numerous posts you made in Grangemouth, Shipbuilding, Thatcher and Zero Hour Contract threads in the GN forum.

Want examples - Comet, Sky, Argos, my hardline stance on Sevco gaining admission to the SPL and/or the First Division, my annoyance at the Call Centre industry, Esure, ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds. There's even the fact that I renounced my support for St Mirren after the shambolic Tom Hendrie sacking stating clearly that I had decided that the actions of the people running the club no longer represented me and that I couldn't support a business that would mishandle their employees in such a disgraceful way. I could give countless more examples of where I have previously taken a strong position

I have managed to get refunds for faulty goods without throwing them at shop staff. Was readmitting Rangers to the SPL/First Division an example of strong management - I didn't think so, it was kowtowing to a couple of big clubs and are you seriously claiming to be any more than one of the hundreds, maybe thousands of fans of diddy clubs who forced the governing bodies to backtrack? Just what have you changed regarding the Call Centre industry and ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds? This paragraph is just self-aggrandising and irrelevant. As to not being a St. Mirren fan - if you attend like a duck and post like a duck then you're a duck.

I'm not a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion, but the world is full of right and wrong and I'll always act in a way that I can rest easy with my conscience.

Bully for you although I find your claim not to be "a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion" at odds with what you say of the last paragraph. As to what is right and wrong in the world it's just a shame that their is no universal agreement on the bulk of these issues - I'll be sticking to my opinions.

[Bud the Baker]

Hmm, I'm interested in this idea that you think I might be a fan of employers who shaft their customers and their employees in other walks of life. Can you give me any examples? I certainly can't think of anything I may have posted that could be construed in that manner. Indeed when it comes to companies f**king over their customers and providing shit service or poor value for money I've often been there front and centre - often taking flak for it from the more lily livered users on the forum.

Right let's get back to what I said which was "strong management" not the altered version you give "fucking over their customers" - I refer you to numerous posts you made in Grangemouth, Shipbuilding, Thatcher and Zero Hour Contract threads in the GN forum.

Want examples - Comet, Sky, Argos, my hardline stance on Sevco gaining admission to the SPL and/or the First Division, my annoyance at the Call Centre industry, Esure, ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds. There's even the fact that I renounced my support for St Mirren after the shambolic Tom Hendrie sacking stating clearly that I had decided that the actions of the people running the club no longer represented me and that I couldn't support a business that would mishandle their employees in such a disgraceful way. I could give countless more examples of where I have previously taken a strong position

I have managed to get refunds for faulty goods without throwing them at shop staff. Was readmitting Rangers to the SPL/First Division an example of strong management - I didn't think so, it was kowtowing to a couple of big clubs and are you seriously claiming to be any more than one of the hundreds, maybe thousands of fans of diddy clubs who forced the governing bodies to backtrack? Just what have you changed regarding the Call Centre industry and ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds? This paragraph is just self-aggrandising and irrelevant. As to not being a St. Mirren fan - if you attend like a duck and post like a duck then you're a duck.

I'm not a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion, but the world is full of right and wrong and I'll always act in a way that I can rest easy with my conscience.

Bully for you although I find your claim not to be "a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion" at odds with what you say of the last paragraph. As to what is right and wrong in the world it's just a shame that their is no universal agreement on the bulk of these issues - I'll be sticking to my opinions.

You're obviously a big fan of Question Time always trying to shift the agenda although I would dearly love to see a post where someone came out and directly supported "shafting/fucking" a third party on a consumer issue rather than the lily-livered dissembling we normally see!

Edited May 15, 2014 by Bud the Baker

[Stuart Dickson]

Hmm, I'm interested in this idea that you think I might be a fan of employers who shaft their customers and their employees in other walks of life. Can you give me any examples? I certainly can't think of anything I may have posted that could be construed in that manner. Indeed when it comes to companies f**king over their customers and providing shit service or poor value for money I've often been there front and centre - often taking flak for it from the more lily livered users on the forum.

Right let's get back to what I said which was "strong management" not the altered version you give "fucking over their customers" - I refer you to numerous posts you made in Grangemouth, Shipbuilding, Thatcher and Zero Hour Contract threads in the GN forum.

Want examples - Comet, Sky, Argos, my hardline stance on Sevco gaining admission to the SPL and/or the First Division, my annoyance at the Call Centre industry, Esure, ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds. There's even the fact that I renounced my support for St Mirren after the shambolic Tom Hendrie sacking stating clearly that I had decided that the actions of the people running the club no longer represented me and that I couldn't support a business that would mishandle their employees in such a disgraceful way. I could give countless more examples of where I have previously taken a strong position

I have managed to get refunds for faulty goods without throwing them at shop staff. Was readmitting Rangers to the SPL/First Division an example of strong management - I didn't think so, it was kowtowing to a couple of big clubs and are you seriously claiming to be any more than one of the hundreds, maybe thousands of fans of diddy clubs who forced the governing bodies to backtrack? Just what have you changed regarding the Call Centre industry and ticket prices at Scottish Football grounds? This paragraph is just self-aggrandising and irrelevant. As to not being a St. Mirren fan - if you attend like a duck and post like a duck then you're a duck.

I'm not a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion, but the world is full of right and wrong and I'll always act in a way that I can rest easy with my conscience.

Bully for you although I find your claim not to be "a spokesman for anyone or a consumer champion" at odds with what you say of the last paragraph. As to what is right and wrong in the world it's just a shame that their is no universal agreement on the bulk of these issues - I'll be sticking to my opinions.

Oh FFS, there's a huge difference between putting a bonus in place for staff and then undermining their ability to achieve it, and tackling the abuses of Trade Unions within your business. If you can't grasp that you seriously have lost touch with reality.

Grangemouth was all about tackling trade unions who thought they were untouchable. Who thought they could get away with anything. The owners there were 100% right to take that head on. They won, and I have no problem with my views on that. I sleep well at night.

Thatcher did a huge amount of good for the majority of the UK population. If you look at her achievements she restructured the UK economy modernising it and creating the kind of environment that means the UK is still one of the major world powers today. She shared wealth. She made it easier for everyone to buy their own homes. Council tenants who could never afford to buy their own place were giving huge discounts. This will have a lasting positive effect in the UK as those who took advantage pass away leaving an inheritance for future generations that could never have been achieved had it not been for Thatcher and her government. She's also credited with having ended the Cold War. Soviets were impressed with her power and her directness and it was her negotiations and influence over Mikhail Gorbachev and Boris Yeltsin that meant the Iron Curtain came tumbling down. She tackled the unions, ensuring that we ended this three day week shite that they had started. Rubbish didn't pile up ever again, and we weren't held hostage to coal miners intent on turning our lights out. Thatcher was a true leader and her government gave great value for money.

Shipbuilding - I'm not sure what you are referring to here? Are you talking about the fact that I don't think the tradesmen employed in the shipyards these days are as good as Scots like to make out? That's from personal experience. It's hardly a comment about management.

And Zero Hour Contracts - all I have said on them is that they work and that they suit a number of people working in zero hour contract situations. It has worked for the benefit of the economy because it is a route back into work for people who have been on benefits. We can see the successes in the current employment figures. And it suits many workers because it allows them the freedom to reject work - I've given an example of my son - a student at University who has three zero hour contract positions and he's in a position where he can take on the best paid work on offer at all times, or reject work when it doesn't suit him in terms of his studies. It's worked so well for him that he has refused a number of jobs where there are contracted hours in order to continue in the three jobs that he's got. Again that's f**k all to do with ripping off staff or customers and it's hugely different from sabotaging a staff bonus and ripping off customers to save a few quid.

[Bud the Baker]

Oh FFS, there's a huge difference between putting a bonus in place for staff and then undermining their ability to achieve it, and tackling the abuses of Trade Unions within your business. If you can't grasp that you seriously have lost touch with reality.

Grangemouth was all about tackling trade unions who thought they were untouchable. Who thought they could get away with anything. The owners there were 100% right to take that head on. They won, and I have no problem with my views on that. I sleep well at night.

Thatcher did a huge amount of good for the majority of the UK population. If you look at her achievements she restructured the UK economy modernising it and creating the kind of environment that means the UK is still one of the major world powers today. She shared wealth. She made it easier for everyone to buy their own homes. Council tenants who could never afford to buy their own place were giving huge discounts. This will have a lasting positive effect in the UK as those who took advantage pass away leaving an inheritance for future generations that could never have been achieved had it not been for Thatcher and her government. She's also credited with having ended the Cold War. Soviets were impressed with her power and her directness and it was her negotiations and influence over Mikhail Gorbachev and Boris Yeltsin that meant the Iron Curtain came tumbling down. She tackled the unions, ensuring that we ended this three day week shite that they had started. Rubbish didn't pile up ever again, and we weren't held hostage to coal miners intent on turning our lights out. Thatcher was a true leader and her government gave great value for money.

Shipbuilding - I'm not sure what you are referring to here? Are you talking about the fact that I don't think the tradesmen employed in the shipyards these days are as good as Scots like to make out? That's from personal experience. It's hardly a comment about management.

And Zero Hour Contracts - all I have said on them is that they work and that they suit a number of people working in zero hour contract situations. It has worked for the benefit of the economy because it is a route back into work for people who have been on benefits. We can see the successes in the current employment figures. And it suits many workers because it allows them the freedom to reject work - I've given an example of my son - a student at University who has three zero hour contract positions and he's in a position where he can take on the best paid work on offer at all times, or reject work when it doesn't suit him in terms of his studies. It's worked so well for him that he has refused a number of jobs where there are contracted hours in order to continue in the three jobs that he's got. Again that's f**k all to do with ripping off staff or customers and it's hugely different from sabotaging a staff bonus and ripping off customers to save a few quid.

Right I'm not really interested in debating these views other than to confirm what I've already said - I disagree with them most of them and neither of us are likely to change our opinions.

Really, it's all a distraction to cover up that when you presented the bonus issue in 2001/02 as being an example of the BoD undermining Tom Hendrie and continue to do so you clearly know that it this is only one version of events and that neither of us really know the truth.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Bud the Baker

[ds10]

Cowden til i die, on 15 May 2014 - 08:25, said:

Lennon took the Cowden job on from assistant manager after then manager Brain Welsh was sacked. Long story short Welsh wanted to kill him for back stabbing him and there was huge unrest. Lennon can't be too annoyed.

From a Cowdenbeath fan on PNB. What goes around....

Came across this on that very issue........

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/c/cowdenbeath/7449146.stm

"I won't just sign someone for the sake of it," Lennon stressed.

Djemba-Djemba? Oh no... Lennon said: “He’s probably the biggest signing ever for St Mirren."

[Drew]

I think we need to move on from this, now. Few, if any, of us really know the score as to what went on behind the scenes, and the debate is at risk of becoming a petty point-scoring exercise.

Like most others, I've thrown my tuppence worth in, but I am now more interested in the squad rebuilding ahead, and our prospects for the season coming up.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Drew

[Luther G. Presley]

Its hardly stabbing the guy in the back. Lennon was out of contract and the board decided he was out of a job.

All four involved were out of contract. The three took the job out of self-preservation. Like any normal person would do.

Put it in to context. You get a job because your friend gets you in to his place of employment. After a few years your friend is shown the door and the bosses ask if you would like some more money and more security, but the down side is you have to take your friends former role.

Do you tell the bosses thanks but no thanks, I am happy to go home to my wife and children and advise them that I am officially unemployed.

OR

Do you take the job and see it as an opportunity.

If I was 63 I think I would just retire and enjoy my twilight years.

[Stuart Dickson]

Saints obviously still have a big place in your life though Stuart, I can understand your reasons (you are not alone, Cubby who ran one of the buses has not been back for years after their bus got taken for 20k by Saints, he still supports but will never go and see them while the current board are in place).

When the board finally do go, will you return fully?

To answer the question as honestly as I can Mark, I really don't know. I might give it a try but I think the truth is that I've actually enjoyed not going as frequently as I used to. I guess it would depend on who came in and what their philosophy was as to how much I could get behind it. I could have backed Richard Atkinson and 10,000Hours I reckon - I'm not so sure that I could a single shareholder with 75% of the shares.

[Stuart Dickson]

Really, it's all a distraction to cover up that when you presented the bonus issue in 2001/02 as being an example of the BoD undermining Tom Hendrie and continue to do so you clearly know that it this is only one version of events and that neither of us really know the truth.

You made the claim that I was being contradictory to my previously expressed beliefs and I'm simply showing you that its' not the case. I do not judge St Mirren by any different standard as to how I live the rest of my life. The dismal way the board handled the sacking of Tom Hendrie did not represent me and it wasn't something I could support as a fan of the club so I renounced my support.

You're right about the bonus issue. Two versions. One from Gilmour, the other from four different players who were at the club at that time. Maybe those four players all colluded to give me the same version but I doubt it. Certainly the actions of the board at the time speaks volumes. Seven points off having to pay out a bonus at the end of the season, yet they had moved on the clubs only full time goalkeeper on the 26th of February of that season. You'd have to wonder why any season ticket holder who had committed money into the club that season would be satisfied in the knowledge that the club board had torpedoed the team just to save money on bonus payments but I guess some fans were just desperate for the Tom Hendrie era to end so they could get John Coughlin in as manager.....

[Gruffalo]

Seven points off having to pay out a bonus at the end of the season, yet they had moved on the clubs only full time goalkeeper on the 26th of February of that season. You'd have to wonder why any season ticket holder who had committed money into the club that season would be satisfied in the knowledge that the club board had torpedoed the team just to save money on bonus payments but I guess some fans were just desperate for the Tom Hendrie era to end so they could get John Coughlin in as manager.....

Again selective of your recollection of events.

Firstly that season we finished 8th out of 10th (almost relegated)

Another 7 points would have put us in 3rd place. (based on results we were never going to achieve it)

After we replaced Roy with Hillcoat our run of results improved for the season. Hillcoat was more than a replacement for Roy at the time.

Also Hendrie was not sacked until the following season.

You seem to have a habit of spouting information and passing it off as fact

[Stuart Dickson]

Again selective of your recollection of events.

Firstly that season we finished 8th out of 10th (almost relegated)

Another 7 points would have put us in 3rd place. (based on results we were never going to achieve it)

After we replaced Roy with Hillcoat our run of results improved for the season. Hillcoat was more than a replacement for Roy at the time.

Also Hendrie was not sacked until the following season.

You seem to have a habit of spouting information and passing it off as fact

"Hillcoat was more than a replacement for Roy"?

Really? And I'm supposed to be the one spouting information and passing it off as fact? Roy was a full time goalkeeper in a full time squad. When Roy left and was replaced by a part time goalkeeper how do you think that might have affected training sessions? Do you think it would have improved defensive cohesion? Also Hillcoat was signed from Dumbarton to replace a goalkeeper that had gone to St Johnstone.

"Almost relegated" - St Mirren finished 10 points ahead of the only side relegated that year - Raith Rovers. Going by your reckoning St Mirren were far more close to being Almost Third than they were to being "almost relegated"

As for the rest of your points I don't know where you are getting the fact that I'm saying anything different. St Mirren finished the league 7 points behind Ayr United - we agree on that. And I know damned well that Hendrie was put on garden leave in September 2002 after a vindictive and spiteful innuendo filled whispering campaign was launched against him from inside the club and what followed was one of the most shameful embarrassing attempts to force a manager out of his job that St Mirren FC has seen in my lifetime. I've even said as much in one of my previous posts. It's the moment I stopped supporting St Mirren.

Anyway on a scale of back stabbing - Lennon got off lightly. The clubs treatment of Tom Hendrie was far worse.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Stuart Dickson

[David Mc]

Reminded me

[Stuart Dickson]

One last post on this topic and then I'm done.

One way or another this reflects badly on the Board of Directors. Not because of the sacking of Danny Lennon and how they went about it - although that obviously leaves a bad taste in a number of peoples mouths - but because in all the years they've been at the club they have failed to recruit any managers who have been able to advance their careers. This highlights one of two things. Either the recruitment policy is seriously flawed and the boards ability to spot talent is seriously poor, or the managers they have recruited have been starved of support and undermined by those in the boardroom.

Compare St Mirrens record on managerial development to clubs like Inverness and St Johnstone and the deficit is very apparent.

[simondsmfc]

One last post on this topic and then I'm done.

One way or another this reflects badly on the Board of Directors. Not because of the sacking of Danny Lennon and how they went about it - although that obviously leaves a bad taste in a number of peoples mouths - but because in all the years they've been at the club they have failed to recruit any managers who have been able to advance their careers. This highlights one of two things. Either the recruitment policy is seriously flawed and the boards ability to spot talent is seriously poor, or the managers they have recruited have been starved of support and undermined by those in the boardroom.

Compare St Mirrens record on managerial development to clubs like Inverness and St Johnstone and the deficit is very apparent.

I disagree with this view as I think the board have done well with identifying talent. Hendrie was a success in getting us promotion and almost keeping us in the league at a time when all our competitors were seriously spending money on players. Macpherson was a success by getting us promotion and keeping us in the spl. Lennon succeeded by keeping us up and winning us a national trophy for the first time in a generation. That seems like decent talent spotting to me?

[pod]

One last post on this forum and then I'm done.