Jump to content

Teachers - Great Idea


faraway saint

Recommended Posts

Odd, I have found myself in agreement with SD for the first time ever.

Regarding the summer clubs, some teachers already help out but as they are working their holiday they get double pay... you couldn't make it up.

Exactly. It's supposed to be their vocation. As Oaksoft says plenty want their job. You would think they wouldn't choose teaching as a profession if they didn't want to work with kids.

Miss Saint makes a good point. My girlfriend is a manager for a care company who look after people with learning disabilities. She's on a relatively low wage, not quite national minimum wage, but not all that much above it. She has had job offers to move into much better paid lines of work, even in the past year since I met her but she always refuses. Why? Because she cares about the people she looks after, she'd miss them if she left, and she knows that those people need her. She's also been involved recently in setting up care homes for the charity she works for for dementia sufferers in the Edinburgh area and she loves what she does. She's got "service users" who will lash out violently. Last month one who is allowed to come and go from his own stood outside one of the care homes throwing rocks at her and a colleague who were leaving the building because they had a death in the home and it meant they couldn't get staff to take this service user shopping in Edinburgh. She is rota'd to work a full 40 hour working week, but she'll do way more than that without any paid overtime. They've got this thing too where if a service user dies all of the staff come in to support each other and if they want to wash and prepare the dead body as they think it's better that they do it than leave it to a funeral director. I'm sure, despite the occasional bit of bad press that the majority of people in the care sector are in exactly the same boat, doing the work they do because they actually give a shit. And then we've got teachers who spend most of the few working days they have gossiping to each other while their unsupervised class runs riot.

Teachers need a good kick up the backside. If they want more time off give them it, but cut their wages and benefits accordingly and make them work for their money over the summer holidays. Lazy bastards!

Edited by Stuart Dickson
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Looks like my original point is being lost/overlooked by many.

Ok, teachers have terms & conditions that many workers could only dream about.

A very desirable pension scheme, full sickness pay, 3 months holiday and short hours. (all facts before people start bleating)

We seem to have many people who concentrate on the "extra hours" they do but this is impossible to substantiate and also how many teachers actually do these hours.

While teaching in a secondary school has it's challenges isn't that their job? Don't other jobs have challenges, targets, pressure?

Primary school teaching also has challenges, learning all the "tables", sticking leaves onto a board and singing songs.

While most of the above is tongue in cheek the idea this profession is up there with the most difficult is far fro the truth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest TPAFKATS

Not sure about the short hours FS, mibees just 'normal' 37-40 hour working week?

I certainly couldn't be a teacher, I'd be in trouble for giving the cherubs a skite.

Financial rewards aren't the best measure of a professions worth or difficulty as you point out - footballers are probably the best example in this country!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not sure about the short hours FS, mibees just 'normal' 37-40 hour working week?

I certainly couldn't be a teacher, I'd be in trouble for giving the cherubs a skite.

Financial rewards aren't the best measure of a professions worth or difficulty as you point out - footballers are probably the best example in this country!

They are contracted to work around the lower figure you quote but are currently campaigning to work only 20 hours in the classroom, thus removing them form all the hassle that goes with being a teacher.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2302936/Now-teachers-demand-work-just-35-hours-week--want-allowed-home.html

Overall I'm not too fussed what teachers terms & conditions are but the constant whinging gets a bit much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In my day the job of being a teacher would have been easy

The exam to become a teacher must have went something like this

1) A child does not do homework, what do you do?

a) Beat them senseless

2) A child is disruptive in class, what do you do?

a) Beat them senseless

3) A child is struggling with reading and complains that some of the letters look "back to front", how do you deal with this

a) Beat them senseless

4) Scenario question

A child complains that they are being bullied by a bigger uglier child, how do you deal with the bully?

a) Beat them senseless

How do you deal with the victim

a) Beat them senseless for telling on the bully and tell them to "man up"

5) A child forgets kit for physical education, what do you do?

a) beat them senseless and make them do it in pants

6) A childs parent contact's you and complain's that the child has returned home and complained that a junior teacher was smelling strongly of drink whilst beating the child for nothing. How do you deal with this?

a) Insist that the whislteblowing child is satan re-incarnated, council the parent to dish out more beatings to that child and for the rest of that child's schoolday's you and the junior teacher beat that child dailly

7) A child in your school is presenting at school hungry with clothing that does not fit properly and is inadequate for the weather.

a) Nothing unless the child complains at which time you beat them

8) A child in your school has contracted head lice, what do you do?

a) Get the nit nurse immediately and once that child is free of lice beat it so hard the lice will not return and in addition make sure the entire school are aware of the identity of the child that caused the nit nurse to visit.

9) At a well used public forum people are questioning your work ethic and the extraordinary long holidays you are afforded. What do you do?

a) Complain that you spend hours "marking" every night and if you can identify the children of those complaining and beat them

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have more

10) A child is writing perfectly well but using the left hand. What do you do?

a) Proclaim this as the work of the devil and beat the child senseless and however long it takes beat them until they write with the proper Godly hand.

11) A well known cigar smoking, medallion wearing local celebrity with grey hair has decided to pop into your school to spend time with the children (for no obvious reason) whilst passing by from his Glencoe cottage on his way to run his 25000th marathon. Some of the children do not want to spend time with the celebrity because they feel "creepy". What do you do?

a) Force them into the staff room alone with the celebrity for the 15 minutes he requests with each as the celebrity didn't leave that 40 ouncer of whisky in the staff room only to be insulted. Oh and after the celebrity is gone beat the children for good measure.

12) You notice at Church on Sunday that one of the children has not been attending. You later learn that the child has been attending a different church only yards away that celebrates the same fictional God in a slightly different way. What do you do?

a) Beat them and convince them that as a second class human being they will burn in the fictional fires of hell.

13) You learn that two of the children in your class have parents that are footballers. One child has a parent who plays for a professional team from Paisley. How do you react

a) That child will get the very best of education, be allowed to behave as they wish and will be given good exam marks whether they can count to five or not

The other child has a father who plays for a professional football team from Greenock

a) Inform the child that his "father" has no biological connection to him/her whatsoever and not to get overly attached as he is most likely ony a temporary feature in the childs life and inform the child that it's mother is nothing but a "whore" and to remedy this you will beat the child dailly.

I have not even started on the dreaded pointed hat with the red "D" on the front.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Looks like my original point is being lost/overlooked by many.

Ok, teachers have terms & conditions that many workers could only dream about.

A very desirable pension scheme, full sickness pay, 3 months holiday and short hours. (all facts before people start bleating)

We seem to have many people who concentrate on the "extra hours" they do but this is impossible to substantiate and also how many teachers actually do these hours.

While teaching in a secondary school has it's challenges isn't that their job? Don't other jobs have challenges, targets, pressure?

Primary school teaching also has challenges, learning all the "tables", sticking leaves onto a board and singing songs.

While most of the above is tongue in cheek the idea this profession is up there with the most difficult is far fro the truth.

You couldn't handle the truth.

You wouldn't last a day.

You trumpets who say teachers have it easy and do short hours, do not have a clue. You should be ashamed of yourself.

They are contracted to work around the lower figure you quote but are currently campaigning to work only 20 hours in the classroom, thus removing them form all the hassle that goes with being a teacher.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2302936/Now-teachers-demand-work-just-35-hours-week--want-allowed-home.html

Overall I'm not too fussed what teachers terms & conditions are but the constant whinging gets a bit much

Oooo the irony.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see your working hard as f**k, all day and night long.

The usual holidays are looked at and 2 + 2 = 22 answer comes up. reality is the Scottish government at this time has only power for Health - Transport - Education. Not a lot for a whole government to spend it's time on. result constant changes ( not tweaks like Stuart says )20 Years ago teaching was a good profession ( in some eyes) Today teaching is a whole different ball game with targets to be met. !% pay rise a few years ago resulting in much longer hours. Again it was not a bad paid job a good few years ago it is now lagging behind what it should be as is nurses and doctors.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You trumpets who say teachers have it easy and do short hours, do not have a clue. You should be ashamed of yourself.

.

For the last 9 years I've volunteered to run a juvenile football team. Prior to that for four years I was a Parents Rep on the committee at a local athletics club. In that time the clubs I've been one of a number of coaches that have sent 7 kids to the International Childrens Games to compete for North Lanarkshire, and 14 boys from the football club have gone to pro youth level. Along with other volunteers we've taught children some of the most relevant skills that they'll need in the future working lives. Indeed some of those volunteers have been so good that school teachers in the local schools recommend the clubs to their pupils as an after school activity, and the local authorities have invited some of these volunteer coaches in to work within their schools delivering a part of the primary school curriculum that teachers just won't do.

We get kids who come down with the mindset that they are here in their spare time to have fun, a laugh and a carry on and these volunteers have to work with that in a way that school teachers don't because most children know how they are supposed to behave in school. And these volunteers do their work without the back up of a Head Teacher or someone more senior to bail them out when the going gets a bit tough. Those volunteers do it cause they love their sports, and they are doing their duty. Some of the volunteers are fannies and not great at what they are doing, but the proportion of them is far smaller than the proportion of school teachers who haven't got a clue despite the fact they are supposedly trained professionals.

I've no time for the pathetic whinging of school teachers and their work shy unions. Maybe if some of these teachers had the same work ethic as those who volunteer our education system wouldn't be plunging down the league tables when compared with other countries.

Edited by Stuart Dickson
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok trumpet, what is so difficult about being a teacher?

Surely even you admit a primary teaches job is on the easy side?

What's the hassle with a secondary school teacher?

Not all them bad boys & girls?

Run along. bye1.gif

To be honest FS, my job is hard enough without me worrying about how other professions are getting on.

As I said before I have done a bit of teaching so I do have an inkling of what it's about even though what I've done is pretty miniscule.

I know for a fact that many teachers are suffering stress and depression. Clearly there's a problem. I'm not in a position to know whether a reduction in hours will help them but there's obviously a problem.

Anyone who is commenting on how easy a teachers job must be clearly doesn't work as a teacher. "Working at a college" doesn't count. That would be like an air stewardess feeling qualified to comment on how easy flying a plane was.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To be honest FS, my job is hard enough without me worrying about how other professions are getting on.

As I said before I have done a bit of teaching so I do have an inkling of what it's about even though what I've done is pretty miniscule.

I know for a fact that many teachers are suffering stress and depression. Clearly there's a problem. I'm not in a position to know whether a reduction in hours will help them but there's obviously a problem.

Anyone who is commenting on how easy a teachers job must be clearly doesn't work as a teacher. "Working at a college" doesn't count. That would be like an air stewardess feeling qualified to comment on how easy flying a plane was.

What a stupid statement.

Their is littler difference working in a college than a secondary school.

All pupils are in their teens, stroppy and you get a fair share of pupils who have lost interest in the education system.

My job is to provide them with the knowledge and skills that are required for the real world. Prepare them for a job and all that entails.

All this blah about extra hours clouds the issue that while actually working it's not a difficult gig.

Many careers are harder with less frills.

Ask anyone who doesn't have a full pay sickness scheme, ask anyone who has around 6 weeks holiday a year rather than double that.

I could go on but can't be arsed.

Indeed, teachers suffer from stress and depression but they are lucky they can afford "time off" to recover, many others cannot.

I'll refrain from going into the reasons they feel they can't cope, that's another thread altogether.

PS I'm leaving my current position after 5 years, not because it's difficult, because it's doesn't stretch me in any way.

Standing on my head probably sums it up.

PPS Maybe you found it difficult because you're shit at it? lol.gif

Edited by faraway saint
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest TPAFKATS

The usual holidays are looked at and 2 + 2 = 22 answer comes up. reality is the Scottish government at this time has only power for Health - Transport - Education. Not a lot for a whole government to spend it's time on. result constant changes ( not tweaks like Stuart says )20 Years ago teaching was a good profession ( in some eyes) Today teaching is a whole different ball game with targets to be met. !% pay rise a few years ago resulting in much longer hours. Again it was not a bad paid job a good few years ago it is now lagging behind what it should be as is nurses and doctors.

To be fair, if Joe Public is getting 2+2=22 then it's no wonder teachers get a hard time...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The usual holidays are looked at and 2 + 2 = 22 answer comes up. reality is the Scottish government at this time has only power for Health - Transport - Education. Not a lot for a whole government to spend it's time on. result constant changes ( not tweaks like Stuart says )20 Years ago teaching was a good profession ( in some eyes) Today teaching is a whole different ball game with targets to be met. !% pay rise a few years ago resulting in much longer hours. Again it was not a bad paid job a good few years ago it is now lagging behind what it should be as is nurses and doctors.

How is it not just tweaks? The subjects always remain pretty much the same. Take History for example - what has changed since I studied it in 1985? My sons have done their Highers in more recent years and they were still studying the Second World War. Has the detail from that war changed dramatically in the last 30 years? You can use the same measure for almost any subject. You may need to update small sections of each subject as it language or scientific knowledge evolves but you really don't need to start again from scratch. And if teachers are doing their job and teaching a subject properly so the kids know the topic well, and not just giving them the answers so they can pass an exam, then I fail to see how they would be doing anything other than minor tweaks to the classes they run.

As for wages - f**k off. In recent years everyone has taken a hit in terms of pay rises. Since 2008 my annual earnings have gone down despite the fact that the company I work for had been sold just before I arrived for £5m and in 2013 it was sold again for a reported £100m. My hourly rate has increased but my P60 shows the effect of the downturn, and I suspect many others whether working in the private or public sector are in the same boat. What teachers have that most of us don't is some of the most advantageous working conditions in any employment in the UK, and they have a job security that many can only dream of.

As I said earlier teaching is supposed to be a vocation. I can't understand why any good teacher would be wanting more time away from the classroom anyway unless it's because they are workshy. And what exactly is wrong with targets? Should a teacher be exempt from the same performance measures the rest of us endure on a regular basis. We need to know we get value for money - targets keep standards up and surely the only teachers worrying about minimum targets are those who's lessons are shit in the first place.

Edited by Stuart Dickson
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How is it not just tweaks? The subjects always remain pretty much the same. Take History for example - what has changed since I studied it in 1985? My sons have done their Highers in more recent years and they were still studying the Second World War. Has the detail from that war changed dramatically in the last 30 years? You can use the same measure for almost any subject. You may need to update small sections of each subject as it language or scientific knowledge evolves but you really don't need to start again from scratch. And if teachers are doing their job and teaching a subject properly so the kids know the topic well, and not just giving them the answers so they can pass an exam, then I fail to see how they would be doing anything other than minor tweaks to the classes they run.

As for wages - f**k off. In recent years everyone has taken a hit in terms of pay rises. Since 2008 my annual earnings have gone down despite the fact that the company I work for had been sold just before I arrived for £5m and in 2013 it was sold again for a reported £100m. My hourly rate has increased but my P60 shows the effect of the downturn, and I suspect many others whether working in the private or public sector are in the same boat. What teachers have that most of us don't is some of the most advantageous working conditions in any employment in the UK, and they have a job security that many can only dream of.

As I said earlier teaching is supposed to be a vocation. I can't understand why any good teacher would be wanting more time away from the classroom anyway unless it's because they are workshy. And what exactly is wrong with targets? Should a teacher be exempt from the same performance measures the rest of us endure on a regular basis. We need to know we get value for money - targets keep standards up and surely the only teachers worrying about minimum targets are those who's lessons are shit in the first place.

I think I can speak for all of us on the forum when I wish that you soon get to work much longer hours. Much much longer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How is it not just tweaks? The subjects always remain pretty much the same. Take History for example - what has changed since I studied it in 1985? My sons have done their Highers in more recent years and they were still studying the Second World War. Has the detail from that war changed dramatically in the last 30 years? You can use the same measure for almost any subject. You may need to update small sections of each subject as it language or scientific knowledge evolves but you really don't need to start again from scratch.

What is different is that depth of subject has been sacrificed for breadth.

In other words they are learning about more areas but each of those in less depth.

This I actually agree with.

At such young ages you want kids exposed to as many things as possible rather than drilling down into the details of subjects too soon.

I can't stress enough that school on its own isn't there to teach mastery of any subject. It's there to provide opportunity for further study at university where you certainly will start progressively drilling down into a specific area.

It's almost impossible to teach subjects such as Physics and Chemistry to pretty much any more detail than they already do at school because the kids simply won't have the maths to cope with it.

Universities currently pick up the slack in depth and they do a pretty good job of it in those two subjects at least.

SO in summary, teaachers are having to teach an increasing breadth of different subjects.

It's all changed from when we were kids Stuart. It's no longer necessary for kids to ever calculate logarithms by slide rule.

Edited by oaksoft
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just an idea"....

But why dont we put aw the loud mouth f**kers who reckon they could control a class of 15 year olds and help them attain the best the can in their exams.. Into the job..?

Come on Dicko its easy....right?

My username might be Lord Pityme....

But i pity you..... Poor lonely windae licker trying desperately to get a rise oot of anyone....

Signed Lord Pity You...

You couldnae make it up, forum clown with ironic post, all within 10 minutes. 1eye.gif

I love this forum. lol.gif

Edited by faraway saint
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...