Flareybob Posted November 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 I am stunned he has till not resigned or been sack following the debacle at Tannadice. In 46 seasons of watching St Mirren, this I have to say is the worst I have ever witnessed. I will now not be going back until Tommy Craig is no longer manager of St Mirren. As for Top Cat coming on here defending Tommy Craig, just go back to the Morton forum you belong to and stop your posts on here, the joke has gone far enough now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopCat Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 I am stunned he has till not resigned or been sack following the debacle at Tannadice. In 46 seasons of watching St Mirren, this I have to say is the worst I have ever witnessed. I will now not be going back until Tommy Craig is no longer manager of St Mirren. As for Top Cat coming on here defending Tommy Craig, just go back to the Morton forum you belong to and stop your posts on here, the joke has gone far enough now. What a bizarre post Worst you ever witnessed? We lost 4-0 to Dundee Utd at Tannadice last season FFS. You've either not been supporting us for 46 years or you're lying. What about the years in the early seventies or the mid nineties? How can being 10th in the top flight be described as worse than those eras? Time to go for a lie down and relax me thinks. Asking for our manager to be given time is me being a Morton fan? FFS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykey Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 I am amazed at the number of posters on here who are surprised that TC doesn't resign or be sacked. This will be TC's last job if he does really well it's still unlikely a bigger club will come looking for him and if he does badly he is unlikely to walk to preserve his previous record (like Mccall), which is why I suggested on another thread that it would have been sensible for the club to offer him a 1 year deal. I think he would be daft to walk and give up 18 months salary, but that's the only way we could get somebody else in, if he's sacked Goodwin and Teale will be in charge and TC will not work in football again. I'm sorry but we have to get used to it, regardless of results TC is going nowhere, maybe that is causing some disquiet and perhaps some apathy but it's going to continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Monkey Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 (edited) Let's look at teams who have been relegated in recent years. Hibs - changed manager during season Hearts - exceptional circumstances, changed manager at end of season Dundee - changed manager during season. Dunfermline - changed manager during season. Hamilton - kept manager. Falkirk - changed manager during season. ICT - changed manager during season. Gretna - weird situation, officially changed manager during season. Dunfermline - changed manager during season. I make that 7 out of 8 teams who've earned the least points since we've been promoted have changed manager during the season they were relegated. Hearts are an exception and I know Gretna weren't officially relegated, but you get the picture. That's quite a hit rate, and quite a vindication of our boards decision not to change managers during the season. It would seem changing manager during the season actually increases the chances of relegation, as opposed to decreasing it. Let's hope we add Motherwell and/or Ross County to that long list of teams who've changed manager and then been relegated at the end of the season. OK, but that doesn't mean that changing the manager isn't the answer. It's a uniquely selective set of stats. For example, am I right in thinking the incoming ICT manager was Terry Butcher? I don't think there's any doubt that that move worked out for ICT in the long run. Or Dundee - they were dead and buried when they changed their manager, and suddenly that c*** Brown came in and, although none of us was even slightly worried, it did look like they'd got a bit more momentum about them than they previously had. Also, you've not shown the number of teams whose form has improved after changing manager. Changing boss does not automatically equal relegation. Hibs are a good example of doing it wrong - because they were sitting pretty and made a right c**t of it for reasons I still can't fathom. But we are not sitting pretty. We are in relegation form, out of the bottom two by the grace of god instead of anything more meaningful. Broadly I agree with you - knee-jerk reactions aren't right, which is why I suggested setting a target for improvement. He can either do the job - which already, in November, is to avoid relegation - or he can't. Better we work that out by January than wait til April, no? Edited November 4, 2014 by Magic Monkey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltcoatsbuddie Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 im amazed he didn't mention our defenders,we all know we have nothing up front ,but if we defend properly you always have a chance of a point ,when you defend like we do you could have messi bale and Ronaldo playing for us and we would still ,lose every game, Was speaking to a dde utd fan in wrk today. He was at the game and view was - 'Saints play good football and have some good players. He thought reilly was our best player on the day... we have nothing in the final third which will come with confidence...' My view is change the manager... new confidence and new belief for the players will bring results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spam_Valley Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 when you defend like we do you could have messi bale and Ronaldo playing for us and we would still ,lose every game, Well that's absolute nonsence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/gerrard-to-take-liverpool-fans-with-him-2014103192307 If we change the names its all sorted.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a50lennyc Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Let's look at teams who have been relegated in recent years. Hibs - changed manager during season Hearts - exceptional circumstances, changed manager at end of season Dundee - changed manager during season. Dunfermline - changed manager during season. Hamilton - kept manager. Falkirk - changed manager during season. ICT - changed manager during season. Gretna - weird situation, officially changed manager during season. Dunfermline - changed manager during season. I make that 7 out of 8 teams who've earned the least points since we've been promoted have changed manager during the season they were relegated. Hearts are an exception and I know Gretna weren't officially relegated, but you get the picture. That's quite a hit rate, and quite a vindication of our boards decision not to change managers during the season. It would seem changing manager during the season actually increases the chances of relegation, as opposed to decreasing it. Let's hope we add Motherwell and/or Ross County to that long list of teams who've changed manager and then been relegated at the end of the season. most of these clubs changed manager because they were in relegation trouble. what about clubs that stayed up after changing manager? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mc Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Alternatively http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/premiership-first-round-review-st-mirren-1-3594691 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenhill Road Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Alternatively http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/premiership-first-round-review-st-mirren-1-3594691 Spot on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) Copied the article in full, nothing in it to startle any Saints fans........... CONNECT WITH THE SCOTSMAN THE best and worst of St Mirren’s Scottish Premiership campaign thus far. Best player: Given St Mirren’s current predicament, there are understandably few candidates. Isaac Osbourne appears to be Tommy Craig’s best signing so far. The former Aberdeen defensive midfielder bossed the midfield in the small clutch of games in which he has featured before suffering his inevitable injury. In terms of regulars, left back has been a position in which Saints have struggled for years, however Sean Kelly and Jeroen Tesselaar have been consistent and talented performers. They have added an attacking threat as well as providing a defensive solidity while both have exchanged places at left back and left midfield in recent weeks. Worst player: Are you sitting comfortably? There are plenty of contenders, of that there is no doubt. James Marwood has flattered to deceive, Callum Ball’s goal return has been negligible and Marc McAusland’s inconsistency continues to dog him. However the most regressed player since last season has been Marian Kello. The odd error last season was masked by the staple diet of heroic stops and commanding performances. Goal-inducing mistakes have been something of the norm for the Slovakian this term and there have been calls for Mark Ridgers to get his chance between the sticks. Biggest surprise: St Mirren ending the first round of games with two teams sitting below them. Seriously, in another season Saints would be cut adrift at the mercy of more competent opponents. Alternatively, the 2-2 draw secured at Aberdeen in September was something of a shock. The Buddies looked desolate after falling two goals behind, somehow avoiding a cricket score as the hosts flunked an embarrassment of chances. It was a result borne out of hard graft and ridden luck at a historically fruitless venue. Biggest disappointment: Many fans have been unable to move past the apathy, disappointment and in some cases anger stemming from Tommy Craig’s appointment. Deemed uninspired when chosen to succeed Danny Lennon, many felt the board’s decision to appoint his number two was thrifty short-termism - particularly when Craig’s appointment was announced 24 hours after Lennon was informed his contract would not be renewed. A stringent selection process it was not. In addition, the injury crisis has seen fans’ favourite Steven Thompson remain on the sidelines until December with a groin injury. As we enter November, the Paisley faithful are yet to see the starting eleven at their strongest. Most promising: John McGinn and Kenny McLean have regressed from standout starlets to regular grafters, but their quality is still there for all to see. However Sean Kelly continues to quietly grow in confidence and improve game on game. He is arguably a better player now than when he was called up for the Scotland Under 21 squad in March, playing in the 2-2 draw with Hungary alongside McGinn and McLean. Best game: The meagre return of two wins and one draw has limited the potential for this section somewhat. The first win of the season away at Firhill was dramatic as it was desperately needed. On a Friday night under the lights, Saints fell behind in the first half; Callum Ball’s first goal for the club levelled the score, before Kenny McLean’s 94th minute penalty pinched the points with the final kick of the game. The best performance came at Motherwell on the opening day where the 1-0 defeat belied a bedazzling display from the Buddies. Worst game: Losing 2-0 to Hamilton in the second match of the season. Rarely has a St Mirren side ever been so toothless in the tackle while seemingly unable to pass the ball. Accies’ subsequent dominance has softened the impact of the defeat however it contributed to a horrid run of five straight defeats at the beginning of the season. Best individual player performance: Marian Kello’s heroics restricted Aberdeen to just the two goals at Pittodrie, allowing his colleagues in front of him to hilariously rob the Dons of two deserved points. Individual performances have been hard to come by quite frankly. Any flitting success has been the sum of a collective work ethic. Most worrying contract: That of the manager. Something just isn’t clicking and the controversy of Craig’s appointment may have doomed his tenure before it had started. The St Mirren board’s downright refusal to sack managers, combined with his two year deal makes for a potentially ugly remainder of his contract should results to continue as they are. Manager’s performance: “Must do better” is an understatement. Any manager is judged on results, and seven* points from eleven games is questionable – particularly when only one of those has been secured at home. In his defence he has had to contend with an ever-growing injury list containing a number of first team regulars. He is a fan of the 4-2-3-1 formation, with the immobile Callum Ball as the lone striker. Craig lambasts Saints’ attack on a near-weekly basis but neglects the glaring problems in defensive midfield and central defence. He seems able to motivate his embryonic squad at least, even if the product on the park leaves a lot to be desired. * - Eight actually but that's a minor quibble! Edited November 5, 2014 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whydowebother Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Spot on And yet , we are stuck with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave The Buddie Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Alternatively http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/premiership-first-round-review-st-mirren-1-3594691 Could not have summed up our season better. Great article Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a50lennyc Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 I remember the happy clapping brigade berating anyone who dared question marwood's goalscoring record when signed him they deserve what they've got Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie88 Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Alternatively http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/premiership-first-round-review-st-mirren-1-3594691 Would agree with everything in the article. Hopefully the board do something a bit different this year and sack the clown of a manager that we have in charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave The Buddie Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 I remember the happy clapping brigade berating anyone who dared question marwood's goalscoring record when signed him they deserve what they've got I am of the opinion that Marwood will not cut it at this level after watching him in the flesh but I can understand people reserving their opinion on any player until they have been given a run out in the team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopCat Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Marwood's been a terrible signing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM1 Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Marwood's been a terrible signing.You know things are bad when you're basically a poor man's Lewis Guy.Lewis Guy FFS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltcoatsbuddie Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 really hope someone on the board reads the Scotsman,,everything on this is exactly correct,,the only people who cant seem to see it are tommy craig and the bod Alternatively http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spfl/premiership-first-round-review-st-mirren-1-3594691 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Nipper Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 really hope someone on the board reads the Scotsman,,everything on this is exactly correct,,the only people who cant seem to see it are tommy craig and the bod Hmmmm, aye, well, no surprises there..................."thrifty short termism"................not as if we haven't had plenty time to get used to it Sums us up perfectly, drivless, no plan , no snap or ambition, trying to tread water until the Sale of the Club happens..................... Hope it's dry on Saturday, or maybe grey with the odd burst of sunshine , that could be the sole highlight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluto Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 Hope it's dry on Saturday, or maybe grey with the odd burst of sunshine , that could be the sole highlight That looks like exactly what was forecast an hour or so ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopCat Posted November 7, 2014 Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 most of these clubs changed manager because they were in relegation trouble. what about clubs that stayed up after changing manager? Yes, and the change either made it worse (Hibs) or made no difference at all in every occasion. To compare, if you take the team who avoided relegation by one spot since we have been promoted only two of them changed manager during that season, Hibs and Kilmarnock. A small fraction compared to the teams who were relegated. On both of those occasions 11th and 12th were occupied by teams who had changed manager. The evidence clearly suggests that changing your manager during the season increases your chance of relegation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibbles old paperboy Posted November 7, 2014 Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 11th in November now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddies1877 Posted November 7, 2014 Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 Yes, and the change either made it worse (Hibs) or made no difference at all in every occasion. To compare, if you take the team who avoided relegation by one spot since we have been promoted only two of them changed manager during that season, Hibs and Kilmarnock. A small fraction compared to the teams who were relegated. On both of those occasions 11th and 12th were occupied by teams who had changed manager. The evidence clearly suggests that changing your manager during the season increases your chance of relegation. so what you saying if a current manager is going to get you relegated no point changing half way through cos your f**ked anyway.Why does anyone ever change there manager then there's clearly no point. Give Tommy a 10 year contract Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mc Posted November 8, 2014 Report Share Posted November 8, 2014 Yes, and the change either made it worse (Hibs) or made no difference at all in every occasion. To compare, if you take the team who avoided relegation by one spot since we have been promoted only two of them changed manager during that season, Hibs and Kilmarnock. A small fraction compared to the teams who were relegated. On both of those occasions 11th and 12th were occupied by teams who had changed manager. The evidence clearly suggests that changing your manager during the season increases your chance of relegation. Be interested to know of those who changed what percentage respectively started as the club's new manager at the start of the season, were dismissed before the mid-season window, left to move to another 'bigger' job and had managerial success at a previous club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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