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Johann Lamont Resigns


Guest TPAFKATS

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If the term 'lunacy' offends you flower, internet forums aren't for you.

If you actually read my post, you'll see the lunacy comment refers to the posters above who were predicting over 30 seats for the SNP in May. Which is absolutely what that is.

Your prediction of 20 is wildly optimistic, but not lunacy.

If you weren't referring to me, I hope you can understand the confusion as you'd use my quote in the 'lunacy' post - so I'd deduced you were replying to me. If you weren't that's fine.

I don't want to put you on the ignore list I think many of your points (about the team itself) have relevance and present good reason. There's no need to call me flower, thats clearly attempting to annoy me, its not necessary, I don't seek to misrepresent you or annoy you, I ask for respect and conduct myself with it, I'd rather you did the same.

Edited by Bloomsbury Bud
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If you weren't referring to me, I hope you can understand the confusion as you'd use my quote in the 'lunacy' post - so I'd deduced you were replying to me. If you weren't that's fine.

I don't want to put you on the ignore list I think many of your points (about the team itself) have relevance and present good reason. There's no need to call me flower, thats clearly attempting to annoy me, its not necessary, I don't seek to misrepresent you or annoy you, I ask for respect and conduct myself with it, I'd rather you did the same.

You take the internet far too seriously.

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I never said they would take 30, i painted the picture... What if?

I hope the charity if your choice is looking forward to the donation.

You hope my charity is looking forward to the donation... Wait a minute, you're saying you're going to lose? :lol:

Well you are going to lose, never expected such a quick concession though!

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I don't know where to start with that. It's quite clear you don't really know what you're talking about.

Because of the FPTP system the majority vote is almost irrelevant in the general election.

The current count for Scottish seats in Westminster is Labour 41, the Lib Dems 11 and the SNP in third place with a whopping 6.

That will change next year. The Tories will make gains in Scotland, it's possible they could get 4 or 5. The Lib Dems will lose 5 or so seats and the SNP will gain about 5. Labour will probably stay roughly the same, maybe lose a couple.

There is absolutely no chance, nilch, nada that the UKIP will be involved in any coalition. They will get less seats than the SNP and Plaid Cymru. They will be lucky to get 5 seats. FPTP has it's flaws, but it keeps crackpots like UKIP out.

A particularly honest yes voter on PNB recently admitted that talk of a Tory-UKIP coalition was scaremongering by the yes voters, I can get you the quote if you desire. He's telling the absolute truth. Anyone who thinks UKIP is going to get in a coalition government doesn't understand the voting system.

What does me thinking if Ed Miliband is electable make a difference? I'm more likely to vote Conservative than Labour, for what it's worth. Next years election will be close, there probably won't be a majority again. Who will win? I don't know, Labour certainly have a decent chance, but I hope they lose.

However, the campaign message from Labour in Scotland will be clear next year:

' If you want to keep the Tories, vote SNP, if you want them out, vote Labour '

It's completely accurate of course, and that message will resonate with Tory hating Scots. That's why Labour will comfortably win the General Election in Scotland. As they always do.

If the Tories/SNP gain 9 or 10 between them and the Lib Dems lose 5 then by definition Labour have to lose 4 or 5 seats more than maybe a couple. In the 2010 General Election The Greens and UKIP both got under 1% of the popular vote yet got 8.1% and 10.5% in the 2014 Euro elections pushing the Lib/Dems into 6th place now I know that voters are savvy who to vote for and when and that with different voting systems and Parliaments there's a bit of comparing apples with oranges (for example I don't see many Conservative voters picking UKIP in seats where the Tories have some chance of winning) but with 6 parties competing in a first past the post system results are IMO pretty unpredictable.

I think the Conservative have a core vote of under 20% of the Scottish electorate and see no reason to think this will change, also that large numbers of Labour and Lib/Dem voters are dissatisfied with their respective parties/leaders and that the SNP are the most likely beneficiaries - I believe and hope that the inconsistencies of the UK constitution will leave us with Holyrood and Westminster at loggerheads with each other and ultimately lead to the breakup of the UK and independence for Scotland.

Regarding a Conservative/UKIP alliance it won't happen prior to the General Election but who knows what the arithmetic will be in the House of Commons afterwards, even 2/3 MP's might be enough to give UKIP the balance of power - never say never that's why you had to change your name from Lex to Top Cat!

Edited by Bud the Baker
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If the Tories/SNP gain 9 or 10 between them and the Lib Dems lose 5 then by definition Labour have to lose 4 or 5 seats more than maybe a couple. In the 2010 General Election The Greens and UKIP both got under 1% of the popular vote yet got 8.1% and 10.5% in the 2014 Euro elections pushing the Lib/Dems into 6th place now I know that voters are savvy who to vote for and when and that with different voting systems and Parliaments there's a bit of comparing apples with oranges (for example I don't see many Conservative voters picking UKIP in seats where the Tories have some chance of winning) but with 6 parties competing in a first past the post system results are IMO pretty unpredictable.

I think the Conservative have a core vote of under 20% of the Scottish electorate and see no reason to think this will change, also that large numbers of Labour and Lib/Dem voters are dissatisfied with their respective parties/leaders and that the SNP are the most likely beneficiaries - I believe and hope that the inconsistencies of the UK constitution will leave us with Holyrood and Westminster at loggerheads with each other and ultimately lead to the breakup of the UK and independence for Scotland.

Regarding a Conservative/UKIP alliance it won't happen prior to the General Election but who knows what the arithmetic will be in the House of Commons afterwards, even 2/3 MP's might be enough to give UKIP the balance of power - never say never that's why you had to change your name from !

Yeah Labour will lose 4, or 5, I should have said a few not a couple.

They will still comfortably be the biggest party in Scotland in a general election, as they always are.

The Tories are targeting seats up here this time, unlike not really trying in previous elections, Cameron has said as much. Places like Perth and a couple of Edinburgh/East Lothian seats are likely to go blue.

To suggest the Tories will let UKIP into a government for the sake of 2 or 3 seats? Absolutely no chance. They're more likely to go with the DUP from Northern Ireland if they need less than 10. They're even more likely to run a minority government than to get into bed with UKIP.

Yes lost the referendum. The settled and clear will of the people of the people of Scotland is to stay in the UK. You think some constitutional fight is going to result in independence? Again, no. No chance.

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I try not to say anything on here I wouldn't say to someone in person, that's all I expect in turn.

My season ticket is Main Stand H49, introduce yourself to me and face to face call me 'flower'.

Jesus Christ, you're really seething here aren't you? :lol:

I would love to come and say hello, you sound like a right laugh. Sadly I don't sit in the main stand, and I don't want to pay for the privilege of meeting you. I do drink in the tartan rose before home games though, so I'll see you there. Can't wait!

Edited by TopCat
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Yeah Labour will lose 4, or 5, I should have said a few not a couple.

They will still comfortably be the biggest party in Scotland in a general election, as they always are.

The Tories are targeting seats up here this time, unlike not really trying in previous elections, Cameron has said as much. Places like Perth and a couple of Edinburgh/East Lothian seats are likely to go blue.

To suggest the Tories will let UKIP into a government for the sake of 2 or 3 seats? Absolutely no chance. They're more likely to go with the DUP from Northern Ireland if they need less than 10. They're even more likely to run a minority government than to get into bed with UKIP.

Yes lost the referendum. The settled and clear will of the people of the people of Scotland is to stay in the UK. You think some constitutional fight is going to result in independence? Again, no. No chance.

Why did you delete the reference to your enforced name change?

As for post election scenarios, to quote Doris Day que sera, sera............

As for September 18th it's just another step in the long march, why would I change my opinion about what's right for the country? No chance - tell it to Lex! lol.gif

*****************

Going back to the reason for the thread's creation, Johanna Lamont resignation, very few Unionist politicians are gonna want to waste their time at Holyrood (which they must by definition consider second rate) add to this the inconsistencies in devolution as it exists within the UK as opposed to a proper federal system (which is never gonna be on offer) and you've got two ongoing reasons why the desire for independence will not go away. No chance - time will tell but I'm not gonna give up on your say so.

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Why did you delete the reference to your enforced name change?

As for post election scenarios, to quote Doris Day que sera, sera............

As for September 18th it's just another step in the long march, why would I change my opinion about what's right for the country? No chance - tell it to Lex! lol.gif

*****************

Going back to the reason for the thread's creation, Johanna Lamont resignation, very few Unionist politicians are gonna want to waste their time at Holyrood (which they must by definition consider second rate) add to this the inconsistencies in devolution as it exists within the UK as opposed to a proper federal system (which is never gonna be on offer) and you've got two ongoing reasons why the desire for independence will not go away. No chance - time will tell but I'm not gonna give up on your say so.

Regarding the name change, I never said there was no chance TC would get the job, so didn't see relevance.

Thought September was a 'once in a lifetime opportunity'. Since you lost, its became one step in a long match?

No wonder separation is fast moving back to the crackpot fringe movement it had always been. I never said it will go away, of course it won't. There always has been and there always will be Scottish nationalists.

44.7% is not one step in a long march, 44.7% will be the peak of the separatists mountain. It is an artificially high peak created by a whole host of circumstances in the favour of independence. From the sheer incompetence of dithering Darling to the Commonwealth games in Glasgow. From the 700th anniversary of Bannockburn to having an incumbent Tory government enforcing cuts. From the richest lottery winners in Europe funding the cause to an SNP majority in Holyrood.

It was all there for it them year, and they still couldn't even get close.

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Guest TPAFKATS

A list MSP from Lothian just checked his profile - member of EIS so I presume he was a teacher, he's a member of the Cuba Solidarity Campaign, Viva Fidel! donatello.gif

He's been on a Sandal's break
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Regarding the name change, I never said there was no chance TC would get the job, so didn't see relevance.

Thought September was a 'once in a lifetime opportunity'. Since you lost, its became one step in a long match?

No wonder separation is fast moving back to the crackpot fringe movement it had always been. I never said it will go away, of course it won't. There always has been and there always will be Scottish nationalists.

44.7% is not one step in a long march, 44.7% will be the peak of the separatists mountain. It is an artificially high peak created by a whole host of circumstances in the favour of independence. From the sheer incompetence of dithering Darling to the Commonwealth games in Glasgow. From the 700th anniversary of Bannockburn to having an incumbent Tory government enforcing cuts. From the richest lottery winners in Europe funding the cause to an SNP majority in Holyrood.

It was all there for it them year, and they still couldn't even get close.

I would say that 44.7% of the votes at the referendum, being the largest party at Holyrood with the largest share of the popular (note the term) vote at the last Scottish Election is by definition not a fringe movement and I will never give up or change my name.

The struggle continues - Free by '23!

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Jesus Christ, you're really seething here aren't you? lol.gif:

I would love to come and say hello, you sound like a right laugh. Sadly I don't sit in the main stand, and I don't want to pay for the privilege of meeting you. I do drink in the tartan rose before home games though, so I'll see you there. Can't wait!

I sincerely take comfort from not conforming to your 'a right laugh' standard.

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The struggle continues - Free by '23!

One year more - free '24!

Freedom's alive - for '25!

We'll get it fixed - for '26!

Freedom's like heaven - in '27!

Slavery won't wait - for '28!

Independence is mine - in '29!

I feel dirty - in '30!

I hope these help? :)

Though I think it'll take more than glib slogans...

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I would say that 44.7% of the votes at the referendum, being the largest party at Holyrood with the largest share of the popular (note the term) vote at the last Scottish Election is by definition not a fringe movement and I will never give up or change my name.

The struggle continues - Free by '23!

As you well know, a vote for the SNP doesn't equate to a vote for independence.

The SNP will win in 2016 simply because they're the best run party in Holyrood by a distance, and because they're doing a pretty good job in that parliament. Not because we want independence, we clearly don't.

They'll certainly get my vote, unless they do something silly like put another referendum in their manifesto. Sturgeon wouldn't make such a silly mistake though, I'm sure.

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One year more - free '24!

Freedom's alive - for '25!

We'll get it fixed - for '26!

Freedom's like heaven - in '27!

Slavery won't wait - for '28!

Independence is mine - in '29!

I feel dirty - in '30!

I hope these help? smile.png

Though I think it'll take more than glib slogans...

I was just following your advice that the struggle to improve should always continue or don't you remember saying that?

And yes thanks for the extra slogans although I'm sure you understand I hope not to need them.

Edited by Bud the Baker
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As you well know, a vote for the SNP doesn't equate to a vote for independence.

The SNP will win in 2016 simply because they're the best run party in Holyrood by a distance, and because they're doing a pretty good job in that parliament. Not because we want independence, we clearly don't.

They'll certainly get my vote, unless they do something silly like put another referendum in their manifesto. Sturgeon wouldn't make such a silly mistake though, I'm sure.

But it does mean that wanting independence or at the very least considering it to be a feasible option is not a fringe/crackpot POV. It was right for Alex Salmond to resign in the wake of September's referendum defeat which was IMO due to the mild mannered campaign he lead. As for it being a once in a generation opportunity that rather depends on what's left of the Better Together 1eye.gif alliance delivering their promises.....................

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Neil Findlay (who?) odds cut from 16, to 2/1 this afternoon.

I was with him on sat night at a do in the Thistle Hotel in Glasgow. 1st time I had met him though he been helping my wife and others about a medical problem they have and has help her when she been at the parliament in Edinburgh for meetings. He was great company and came across as a decent guy. Shame he never gave me a wee nod and a wink about his intention so I could have put a bet one at 16/1 laugh.png

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Did I miss something? Who voted you the new internet hard(on)man? What the f**k does "!1!1" mean? Manners? Respect? I never mentioned them, why bring them up? Why put a colon after a lol emoticon? What kind of name is "Lex" for a cat? So many questions, I'll assume that there won't be a single intelligent answer. 1eye.gif

Fs, I was being sarcastic.

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Did I miss something? Who voted you the new internet hard(on)man? What the f**k does "!1!1" mean? Manners? Respect? I never mentioned them, why bring them up? Why put a colon after a lol emoticon? What kind of name is "Lex" for a cat? So many questions, I'll assume that there won't be a single intelligent answer. 1eye.gif

Fs, I was being sarcastic.

Your hope was misplaced Slarti. lol.gif

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Guest TPAFKATS

I was with him on sat night at a do in the Thistle Hotel in Glasgow. 1st time I had met him though he been helping my wife and others about a medical problem they have and has help her when she been at the parliament in Edinburgh for meetings. He was great company and came across as a decent guy. Shame he never gave me a wee nod and a wink about his intention so I could have put a bet one at 16/1 laugh.png

He's talking his chances down and saying he wants Broon to take the job.

If it's a choice between Findlay and Murphy it should get interesting. Leftist wing of Labour with union backing against blairite war mongering Trident supporter.

Don't think the strategists will let it come to that though.

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