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Bloody depressing reading, this thread. An irritated manager who is woefully out of his depth and creating friction with the support, a set of angry fans who are utterly bewildered and worried for the future mixed with a Board of Directors who are apathetic, blinkered and so intent on watching their pennies that they appear oblivious to the severe trough we are about to hit come May.

Really worrying times to be a Saints fan. Like others have said, the Coughlin days were dark, but in 23yrs following the Saints I've never witnessed so many fans losing faith.

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its like civil war breaking out, what we need is someone to lead the club

most clubs in this division have strong chairman when they speak employees listen is the board all happy

with Tc NEVER heard any backing from them ,i think if cash was there he would have been gone

To be honest they should be paying him off out of their own pockets as they were the only ones who thought hiring him was a good idea.
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In reply to the comments about certain directors being very condescending and talking down to some fans for having a differing viewpoint, I felt this was exactly the case in the meeting many attended 2 seasons ago when anyone dared to suggest that Rangers should have been fully punished for their misdemeanours and indeed relegated to the third division.

There was more than one of them standing about having a wee laugh up their sleeve and a 'we know better than you' attitude.

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I'm not sure why Tommy Craig seems to have been put in the spotlight when the real issue is why the club remains up for sale for 2 million pounds when clearly nobody is willing to pay that price?

It has been over 5 years now FFS!!!

As mentioned above, it is time for the fan ownership model to come back on the table and for a sustained campaign of pressure on the board to sell it to the community for a reasonable price.

Alternatively, I support the approach of SMISA to buy up enough shares privately to put the support in a position of strength. Mr Gilmour is running the risk of one his selling consortium walking away and leaving him as a minority shareholder who will get nothing from the sale of the club.

I would suggest everyone backing SMISA and getting fan ownership back on the agenda. We have no other options now.

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Also, was the issue of the board rejecting 50K investment from Smisa brought up?



Was the issue of continued failing's in the transfer market and clear lack of a scouting system? No matter the manager, it is simply unacceptable to let Dundee pick up McGinn, McGowan and Harkins (all from us!!) and Clarkson while we sign Marwood, Ball and Caldwell who would not get a game in League One. And then to go in to the season without having enough central defenders.



Are there any plans yet to boost off field revenue? The difference between our commercial department and St Johnstone's is appalling given the fact we recently moved to a new stadium that should have good facilities.


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How much of their "own money" do they give?

How much will they never see a return on? Actually just taken money out their own pocket to never get it back?

How much money do they give via their business's, so not actually their own money How much do they recoup via hospitality tables, boardroom meals and drinks, complimentary hospitality tickets to cup finals, international games etc, how much do they recoup to their business by building up contacts through the boardroom meeting opposition directors who trade off work with each other?

Of the money they really do put in, diverted away from their family fund, put some perspective on it. Say director X gives the club a 100k loan. How much is that to a successful business man? Compared to an average fan on the dole, stacking shelves, working in a call centre? Is that the equivalent of the dole fan loaning the club 100 quid?

Is that 100k going to effect his way of life?

We give our clubs what we can afford, some people can afford to loan the club money, money they will get back.

Some people can't afford to loan the club money, they are the ones who give and give and give.

They are the ones who are just expected to shut up and keep giving.

The money given through their business is their money.

Hospitality and meals?

They don't get a meal before each game, boardroom guests get a very small selection of finger buffet snacks, sausage rolls etc.

Bryan McAusland occasionally takes a table at hospitality, only Bryan and the club will know if this is paid for, I'm sure it would be.

Free drinks etc, I'm sure someone would have stuck them in for drink driving by now....

The 100k or more in short term loans, they may be able to afford it and that's why they are in such a position of trust.

18 months ago when we were lifting a national trophy they weren't getting any flack from the fans. Now we're not performing they're quite rightly getting it tight about appointing TC, but to accuse them as freebie chasers is ignorant and ridiculous.

Maybe that's what goes on at Thistle but then again, I couldn't give a toss.

Edited by davidg
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The board is where the problem has been at St Mirren over the last 14 years. It's been riddled with inaction and strangled by fear.

apart from selling Love Street, building a brand new ground, clearing £3 million of debt, building a new training ground, overseeing the club establish itself in the SPL (until now, granted!) and winning only the 4th major honour in the club’s 137 year history.

I’d love to have seen what we might have achieved with a board which was “proactive”…

:P

(what have the romans ever done for us!)

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The money given through their business is their money.

Hospitality and meals?

They don't get a meal before each game, boardroom guests get a very small selection of finger buffet snacks, sausage rolls etc.

Bryan McAusland occasionally takes a table at hospitality, only Bryan and the club will know if this is paid for, I'm sure it would be.

Free drinks etc, I'm sure someone would have stuck them in for drink driving by now....

The 100k or more in short term loans, they may be able to afford it and that's why they are in such a position of trust.

18 months ago when we were lifting a national trophy they weren't getting any flack from the fans. Now we're not performing they're quite rightly getting it tight about appointing TC, but to accuse them as freebie chasers is ignorant and ridiculous.

Maybe that's what goes on at Thistle but then again, I couldn't give a toss.

On that point David, 18 months ago ( & for a fair time after ) you had SGs face in almost every newspaper , in front of as many cameras as he could manage. Not only taking the plaudits himself ,but in fairness he was very quick to acknowledge all concerned in our achievement.

Fast forward to present day ....Where is he ?

When we are getting pelters on almost a daily basis in the press , radio & TV , when former players are publicly doubting his decision to appoint TC, when there is obviously something so very wrong with our club, where is SG now ?

At the very least he should be publicly backing his manager or giving the general fanbase some idea of where the club are going under the current management team , not just angry confrontation in a closed meeting.

The whole thing reeks of bad management from top to bottom .

FWIW, i would welcome a "the manager has our full backing "statement from the board...... coz thats usually followed by his sacking !! rolleyes.gif

Edited by Callum Gilhooley
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apart from selling Love Street, building a brand new ground, clearing £3 million of debt, building a new training ground, overseeing the club establish itself in the SPL (until now, granted!) and winning only the 4th major honour in the club’s 137 year history.

I’d love to have seen what we might have achieved with a board which was “proactive”…

tongue.png

(what have the romans ever done for us!)

Even the best boards make mistakes & the appointment of TC may turn out to be our boards biggest , one which will may ultimately relegate us and cost the club a small fortune.

Proactive boards identify their mistakes early & take steps to correct them.

I dont think there are many who dont acknowledge the massive debt of gratitude we owe our board but since the club was put up for sale , Cup win apart, it seems a general malaise has beset the club which appears to emanate from the top down.

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A club like ours is always one bad manager away from relegation. I remember the Hay and Hendrie* relegation seasons. Both seasons had club staff saying all the right things about being positive, getting out of the problems and all being behind the manager etc. But when you look back, you can see there was a desperation and malaise around the club, and the writing was on the wall throughout the season.

I hope I'm wrong, but this season has exactly the same feel about it to me.

*In fairness, the Hendrie relegation was largely brought about by a lack of resources and we were the only SPL team to break even, while others continued to run up massive debts.

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The BoD have put up their own money (as opposed to business cash) when its been necessary. They will, if they can eventually sell the club, get some of that back. But what about the ordinary fan? We put our cash into the club every season, with no return. In the time I've supported Saints, I reckon I've sunk at least 25K into the club, by way of shares, entrance fees, programmes, hospitality, etc, etc. I don't grudge that, normally, but it irks when we're being taken as mugs.

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A club like ours is always one bad manager away from relegation. I remember the Hay and Hendrie* relegation seasons. Both seasons had club staff saying all the right things about being positive, getting out of the problems and all being behind the manager etc. But when you look back, you can see there was a desperation and malaise around the club, and the writing was on the wall throughout the season.

I hope I'm wrong, but this season has exactly the same feel about it to me.

*In fairness, the Hendrie relegation was largely brought about by a lack of resources and we were the only SPL team to break even, while others continued to run up massive debts.

And at least Hendrie's team went down fighting. The post split performances were terrific, if too little too late.

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My observations from last night. TC described not buying either a centre half or a proven goal scorer as a mistake, he had expected a fit Thommo to be able to successfully mentor at least 1 of the 3 forwards he bought. TC also said (I'm quoting) we made ' a multitude of chances' in the fixtures in the first 3 months of the season; its only the last 3/4 fixtures in which we haven't played well. When TC was pressed, very politely, by one of the audience about his failure to buy a centre half, he asked for a minute 'to gather his thoughts' after a long pause he then said he had signed Plummer and that Goodwin or Tess can cover.



In short TC didn't say anything that couldn't be easily argued against.



It gives me no pleasure to say, based on the evidence of the AGM, that TC is both humourless and charmless in equal measure. I struggle to find any reason to believe he is a good man manager/figurehead/leader of men.



It was clear the BOD will at least give TC some time to work with players returning from injury.


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A club like ours is always one bad manager away from relegation. I remember the Hay and Hendrie* relegation seasons. Both seasons had club staff saying all the right things about being positive, getting out of the problems and all being behind the manager etc. But when you look back, you can see there was a desperation and malaise around the club, and the writing was on the wall throughout the season.

I hope I'm wrong, but this season has exactly the same feel about it to me.

*In fairness, the Hendrie relegation was largely brought about by a lack of resources and we were the only SPL team to break even, while others continued to run up massive debts.

he was tied by the PDE stand being renovated which left us with little money to strengthen and ended up being a weaker team to the magnificent scoring machine that won the first division.

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