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The Biggest Meltdown And Knickerwetting Thread Ever


shull

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We started both Ok and so sloppily!

I believe the point he is rather messily trying to make is that playing OK isn't good enough. On this occasion I think Ok means average - although I don't think we were anywhere near that good!

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The shit I took for highlighting Murray's naivety, his Dumbarton side shipping so many goals last season, him being missing for the first few weeks of his new job, dragging his heels with appointments, giving everyone who can stand upright a trial, then dropping Goodwin to force him out, and to top it off he still doesn't (by all accounts) strengthen our weak left side.....?

Aitken must have been rubbing his hands when he saw that team-sheet, lack of height, physicality, experience, goals and performances.... Let me be clear it doesn't take a genius (which i ain't) to be able to pick a team to boss us in every game this season, in this league. Unless there is a complete change of tack we will be picking up the same results week in, week out till the inevitable, drawn out hand wringing by the board over yet another managerial appointment clusterf**k... I wonder if Danny could be tempted back..?

Liked your post till you mentioned Danny Lennon. If Murray gets the finger out and plays experience we will get better but has to do it now so the team can settle

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f**king appalling team selection from Murray, he needs to learn fast as if we lose a few more games on the bounce the fans will start turning. No doubt about that.

Today was my first viewing (in person) of Murrays team and although there are some positives (Baird, McMullan, Agnew), I was shocked at how closely that performance resembled a Tommy Craig Saints team - wee boys who aren't quite ready getting bullied and general lack of tactical strategy. What the f**k is going on, Murray is a so called "bright young manager"..!

Hopefully he'll learn from today, but if not, here are some tips from me:

1. We need more experienced players and the ones we do have should be playing, not warming the bench.

2. Kelly is a total liability at CH and will get roasted all season. We need an alternative partner for Baird.

3. Gow is a ghost/charlatan/imposter who should be nowhere our stadium never mind wearing the jersey.

4. Mallan, if fit, should plsy

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f**king appalling team selection from Murray, he needs to learn fast as if we lose a few more games on the bounce the fans will start turning. No doubt about that.

Today was my first viewing (in person) of Murrays team and although there are some positives (Baird, McMullan, Agnew), I was shocked at how closely that performance resembled a Tommy Craig Saints team - wee boys who aren't quite ready getting bullied and general lack of tactical strategy. What the f**k is going on, Murray is a so called "bright young manager"..!

Hopefully he'll learn from today, but if not, here are some tips from me:

1. We need more experienced players and the ones we do have should be playing, not warming the bench.

2. Kelly is a total liability at CH and will get roasted all season. We need an alternative partner for Baird.

3. Gow is a ghost/charlatan/imposter who should be nowhere our stadium never mind wearing the jersey.

4. Mallan, if fit, should plsy

5. Conlan with McMullan in front of him failing to provide any sort of cover when the opposition have the ball is a fcuking recipe for disaster. Fix this and fix it before Friday.

Anyone care for No6?

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Firstly, I need to credit Dumbarton as they deserved all three points. They were well organised, defended as a unit and got the ball forward quickly. It's certainly no fluke that they beat Hibs last week and then beat ourselves as well.

I thought we started the game ok but it was as if we were watching us play a pre-season game, there was a real lack of urgency. We did look a bit better in the second half but again, we didn't really look capable of doing anything until Agnew scored. After that, we seemed to pick up a bit and I felt we had a chance of going on to win the game, but after the penalty it was all over.

I feel sorry for Ridgers as I don't think he had much to do and didn't have much chance at both of the goals. However, we need experience within the team so I would have Langfield as the number one going forward. Goalkeepers can be very influential when it comes to organising at the back. We were all over the place at the back at times.

Whilst I think that individually Kelly and Baird have the potential to be really good center backs, as a partnership it just does not work. We need some experience in there and Webster would be ideal with Kelly and Baird competing for the other place. Ideally, I'd like to see Kelly moved back to left back simply because I have absolutely no faith in Conlon at left back. I've seen him in a few games now, he seems incapable of following runs, tackling players and his distribution is dreadful - he gave the ball away too many times today, we can't continue with him as I got the impression even the players didn't want to give him the ball. I thought Naismith done well and tried to get forward as much as possible - hopefully his scan on Monday doesn't show too much damage but I reckon he will be out for a good while. Cuddihy done well when he came on but his inexperience cost us when he gave away the penalty.

McMullan will be a cracking player for us this season but I feel he is more suited in a midfield of five as he is not the best when it comes to defensive duties. Morgan isn't ready I don't think, he needs to seriously bulk up, too many times he got pushed off the ball today. Carswell done ok but I feel that Goodwin would be more effective and bring much needed experience into the team. Agnew done well and showed a good few touches - I like the fact he can strike a ball and we've missed someone that can score goals from midfield for a while. However, I think the team would be far more settled with five in the midfield as we got over ran today far too many times.

Apart from having a couple of nice touches at one stage in the second half, Gow contributed absolutely nothing today. He just stood about the whole game, didn't make any runs, made no attempts to win the ball in the air. He really is a wasted wage and the fact he got offered a new deal really pissed me off as the only reason I can assume he did is because he and Murray played together at Rangers. He'll no doubt get injured in training this week and be out for a few months. Maybe I'm being harsh, but signing the likes of him is why we ended up relegated last year.

Gallagher done ok and made some good runs and won us a lot of set pieces, but should have done better with a few of his chances. I'm confident once he gets his first goal he'll get the confidence he needs to bang in a few going forwards. Thompson was effective when he came on and bringing him on for the last half an hour is where we will benefit from Thompson most.

I respect the fact Murray is going with young boys but when you do that the young boys need to be good enough and strong enough to compete. The team also needs to have a good spine of experience to talk them through the game. Getting Webster, Langfield and Goodwin in that team has to be an absoloute must if we are to have any hope of a top four finish this season.

With the players we have the best set up for me is going with a 4-5-1 that turns into more of a 4-3-3 when going forwards. This would allow Goodwin to come back into the team and give us a physical presence in the midfield, we would have Mallan and Agnew attacking, with McMullan on the right. Ideally, we need a left winger and another striker. If we stick with a 4-4-2, we are just going to be exposed and be punished for it throughout the season.

I'll be at Annan on Tuesday and hopefully Murray knows where he went wrong today (although I'm concerned that he thinks we dominated the game!) and we fix it. Whilst the season has only just started, the league is going to be really tight and we can't afford to be throwing away points whilst he experiments, that's what pre-season was for.

I love this whole post. Well done Tam you should apply for a coaching role at St Mirren as you sound like you know what your talking about. To watch Jim Goodwin walk down the tunnel after not getting on is a travesty he so deserved a start today. Murray should say he got it wrong today might earn respect if he does. Murray Sound a little big headed to me and does not know this league as the other teams are looking better.

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We have a very young squad and they need time to gel. We need to be patient, to a degree. The basis of a decent team is there, but there is a lack of cohesion and composure at the moment. Hopefully these will develop in the coming weeks.

I never expected anything better than a mid-table finish this season. Murray needs time, as do the young lads in the squad. Today was dreadful, certainly, but it is very early days. I won't be losing heart just yet.

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**** look like strolling this league so best we can hope for is a playoff place. Still plenty of games left to manage that. New team full of young lads and an inexperienced manager. Got to give them a wee bit of time folks. I still predict a playoff place, albeit not confidently.

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We have a very young squad and they need time to gel. We need to be patient, to a degree. The basis of a decent team is there, but there is a lack of cohesion and composure at the moment. Hopefully these will develop in the coming weeks.

I never expected anything better than a mid-table finish this season. Murray needs time, as do the young lads in the squad. Today was dreadful, certainly, but it is very early days. I won't be losing heart just yet.

He got the job because he new the league well he does'nt. Why should he be given time. Young boys not ready. He said at the question night Jim Goodwin would play 25 games this year well we cried out for him today. So no the start of the season is the day Murray is judged and so far he is making way to many mistakes. Bottom of the league with no points and ok Rangers was a hard one but come on Dumbarton part timers no excuses. EXPERIENCE GOODWIN, MALLEN, THOMPSON from the start.

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I never expected anything better than a mid-table finish this season. Murray needs time, as do the young lads in the squad. Today was dreadful, certainly, but it is very early days. I won't be losing heart just yet.

No, Murray does not need time at all.

We're the 3rd biggest club in this division and we only need to make the top 4. That isn't too big an ask.

You don't get "time" to build teams anymore and with our entire forward line on 1 year contracts or on loan then we'll n=be rebuilding again next season.

No excuses. Play offs or out.

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We have a very young squad and they need time to gel. We need to be patient, to a degree. The basis of a decent team is there, but there is a lack of cohesion and composure at the moment. Hopefully these will develop in the coming weeks.

I never expected anything better than a mid-table finish this season. Murray needs time, as do the young lads in the squad. Today was dreadful, certainly, but it is very early days. I won't be losing heart just yet.

I lost a bit of heart today Drew. Sure, it's early in Murray's reign and things might eventually turn out dandy, but that was shit today, and it was largely shit because of Murray and Spalding's selection, tactics, substitutions, and I expected better from a manager who, erm, isn't Tommy Craig or Gary Teale. Murray deserves time, of course he does, but in the name of fcuk, Dumbarton handed us our arse on a plate today. Credit to the travelling Sons fans for not giving it 'Murray, Murray what's the score?'.

Sitting there at full time listening to them belting out their songs of victory was a right boot in the stones.

Get it sorted Murray. If we lose, fine - but it simply has to be a loss where we were organised, relatively solid, made meaningful substitutions, and started the game with a selection that wasn't baffling.

Basics. Should be a given.

Edited by pozbaird
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Hmm, let's just say we are in transition.

Beaten by well organised and motivated part timers.

Best head off to beer land now

No more in transition than Dumbarton. Or any other team in the league really.

They were certainly more organised than us though, the question is how can this be.

They train two nights a week after working at their regular job. We train 4 days a week full time, we have far more time on the training pitch than they do. The fact that a part time team can be more organised than us - as they were - is pretty alarming stuff.

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Let me explain myself a bit.

When the knives were out for Gus, I was of the opinion, no, unless there is someone better to come in. The BoD cut the budget and what they were prepared to pay Gus, so he went

When the knives were out for Danny, I supported him, I could see realistically maybe a top six, but we won a cup, had best league positions. The Bod cut the budget, and gave TC the job on less wedge.

I have never slated my team at a game, never have, never would. Yes the odd FFS, head in hands, head shaken, but no verbals. The reason i am so outspoken about Murray is i can see he is not up to it. Despite all the hype no other club came in for him, so our BoD got the cheap option again.

I now see months of this ahead unless somehow he changes tack and plays some experience to develop the youth. Otherwise they will fail, and drop out as too much is being asked of boys who have not yet shown the capacity for what is expected at this level.

Murray is out of his depth, who is going yo sink with him? Gow is already calling out for the lifebelt!

It's way too early to say Murray is our his depth as he kept a team with a smaller budget in this league for 2 seasons. Yes he needs to quickly learn what his best 11 is but he can't possibly be out his depth at another club at the same level when he managed ok at a club with lesser resources in this division.

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Worth highlighting that I suggested we need to be patient 'to a degree'. Passing overall judgement based on a couple of matches is premature. I'm no fanboy of Murray's, why would I be? We need a sense of perspective, however. I will be waiting to see if he has learned from his mistakes before making my mind up. That will be key, for me at any rate.

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At the Q/A Murray said we have far better players than Dumbarton I wonder if he still thinks that .

If he does think that, he's right. We do have better players than Dumbarton. He needs to pick the right 11 of them, play them in a better formation than he did today, make substitutions at H/T if it's shit after 45 mins like it was today, and, if he's going to drop Thommo, Mallan and Howieson, come up with something a damn sight better than today's Tommy Craig-esque shitfest. He could also tell Gow to get to fcuk. That would free up a wage and get the sand-dancer the fcuk away from St Mirren.

We DO have better players than Dumbarton though.

Edited by pozbaird
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Just back home and really gutted about game. Was full of optimism and this was a big big game for us. We were poor, but Dumbarton were lucky to get all the points today. Playing Morgan and McMullan in the same midfield was a disaster. They don't track back and crap out of tackles. It meant our shape was really poor. Morgan showed great flashes in the 2nd half, mainly speedy runs then penetrating crosses, but he must've given up possession more than 10 times and shouldn't have started. McMullen has the ability to change games for us but is lazy in defence. Would still play him though.

Thought Carsewell did ok and Agnew's goal was a peach, but as a unit they didn't work. The time Dumbarton had in midfield was shocking.

Gallagher was full of effort and running, but should've scored. He needs time to develop.

Like the look of Baird and think he could develop into a great player.

Biggest disaster today was Naismith, not the 2 chances he squandered in the 1st half, but his injury. Looked like a real bad one and he could potentially be out for a long time. He must be one of the first names on the team sheet. Really hope he's ok, but looks grim.

Off the pitch, noticed Webster in the stand with his family. Think he could help develop Baird and other youngsters if he signed. Also noticed Langfield was a like a jack in the box in the dugout, really involved in the game. Think their influence would be great on the pitch. We need more leadership, experience and fight.

Gow is a f***wit!!

Lots of young players needing time to develop, but so does Murray. It's hard to have the patience watching that and he got his tactics badly wrong today. Hope he learns quickly for all our sakes.

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The reason the part time players look fitter and faster as their bodies are developed

Most of starting team their bodies are still growing

There has to be some investment in the playing staff

that doesn't really cover it though

managed properly and motivated, the kids should be absolutely fearless and dieing to show what they can do. Don't forget that kelly and naismith were more than decent at a significantly higher level almost 2 years ago, Agnew, thomson and Gow are not exactly gawky teenagers either.

How are those sunday sessions working out, Murzo?

The board has washed all the quality out of our club since the league cup win

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No more in transition than Dumbarton. Or any other team in the league really.

They were certainly more organised than us though, the question is how can this be.

They train two nights a week after working at their regular job. We train 4 days a week full time, we have far more time on the training pitch than they do. The fact that a part time team can be more organised than us - as they were - is pretty alarming stuff.

Murray was a part-time manager and maybe he just doesn't have a clue what to do with the extra two days and the sunday session.

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Murray was a part-time manager and maybe he just doesn't have a clue what to do with the extra two days and the sunday session.

5 of our starting XI were at the club last season, plus 5 of our subs, whereas part time Dumbarton had 9 new signings in their starting XI needing time to gel under new manager as well!

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