The Politics Thread

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Sorry, me guilty.

Mods!

Or other folk who hit people cos they don't like their clothes

[antrin]

6 hours ago, antrin said:

f**kin idiot.

 

3 hours ago, oaksoft said:

You need to calm down a bit if you want anyone on here to engage with you.

Ironic - as my post was a placid comment on your hysteria-laden posting style.

There was zero effort to engage.

 

 

[shull]

4 minutes ago, tony soprano said:

Mods!

Or other folk who hit people cos they don't like their clothes

Serious post. 

Children at School get severely bullied and abused if they aren't wearing the "correct " fashion trends. 

A dreadful hate crime. 

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Serious post. 

Children at School get severely bullied and abused if they aren't wearing the "correct " fashion trends. 

A dreadful hate crime. 

Ffs, shull in serious post alert! What a week it has been, this is up there with Ian Paisley MP advising his constituents, via social media, to apply for an Irish passport.

What a time to be alive!!!

[Guest TPAFKATS]

JP Morgan reckon Scotland will be Independent by 2019.

[saintnextlifetime]

Sturgeon has said we will have another referendum by 2018, so does that mean , no matter the outcome , we will continue to have referendums on the Union every 4 years . .

[antrin]

Politics - governing a nation - is all about Bread and Circuses.

 

Nicola is just ignoring the Bread bit.

[stlucifer]

7 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said:

Sturgeon has said we will have another referendum by 2018, so does that mean , no matter the outcome , we will continue to have referendums on the Union every 4 years . .

 

6 hours ago, antrin said:

Politics - governing a nation - is all about Bread and Circuses.

 

Nicola is just ignoring the Bread bit.

No one can deny that the Referendum was fought, in great depth by both sides, on the EU membership issue. Given the fact the "better together" campaign used this guarantee of continued membership as a key issue forcing SNP to attempt to prove we could still remain part of it means the massive change in circumstances, almost flipping the argument on its head, the Scottish people need to at least be offered that option. Now. Much will depend on what NS can get from the EU countries and what, if anything, the UK government do about Brexit but it would be crazy NOT to allow reconsideration to the nation. The circus you allude to antrin is going on on the other side of Hadrian's wall.

[Stuart Dickson]

No one can deny that the Referendum was fought, in great depth by both sides, on the EU membership issue. Given the fact the "better together" campaign used this guarantee of continued membership as a key issue forcing SNP to attempt to prove we could still remain part of it means the massive change in circumstances, almost flipping the argument on its head, the Scottish people need to at least be offered that option. Now. Much will depend on what NS can get from the EU countries and what, if anything, the UK government do about Brexit but it would be crazy NOT to allow reconsideration to the nation. The circus you allude to antrin is going on on the other side of Hadrian's wall.

I can deny it. The EU was one of the topics in the Scottish Referendum but we already knew that there would be an EU referendum. It was the SNP that made great play of independence being the only way to guarantee a place in the EU. All the No campaign did was prove that the SNP couldn't guarantee a place in the event of separating.

A far bigger issue was the Scottish economy. The SNP made a pile of promises, free childcare and increased pensions amongst them based on oil revenue predictions that will willfully over optimistic and which have since been shown to be utterly bogus. The fact Scotland now had a £15Bn black hole, that promises in education and healthcare can't be funded and that our emergency services are in crisis are all now clear to see.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

There was no EU referendum promised by the UK gov at the time of the Indy Referendum.

[Stuart Dickson]

There was no EU referendum promised by the UK gov at the time of the Indy Referendum.

No but it was very much on the cards. Everyone knew it was coming...hence the reason the SNP were making such a play of it

[beyond our ken]

10 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said:

Sturgeon has said we will have another referendum by 2018, so does that mean , no matter the outcome , we will continue to have referendums on the Union every 4 years . .

I don't know.  did she say that was the plan?

[dr rotund]

On 29/06/2016 at 7:07 PM, Stuart Dickson said:

I see wee Nic had her thunder stolen today as Spain and France told her to f**k off. Shame she's such a nice lass too.

Hmm and she didn't see that coming? Did she? She'll go through all the proper channels to try and retain EU status but when they're exhausted we'll have another referendum Shock! Horror!

[Stuart Dickson]

Hmm and she didn't see that coming? Did she? She'll go through all the proper channels to try and retain EU status but when they're exhausted we'll have another referendum:rolleyes: Shock! Horror!

Yep true but she'll need all 27 countries to back her to get an independent Scotland back into Europe without having its own central bank, without meeting the basic criteria for EU membership and to accelerate readmission whilst continuing to allow Scotland a veto and a rebate....none of which seems likely. Remember Scotland isn't being seen as a prize by the EU.... It's the whole of the UK they want

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Yeah, Scotland's fishing territory and oil reserves wouldn't be seen as a prize for any EU countries. The Spanish fleet and seafood restaurants would rather not have us and the French oil industry that's invested in Shetland and North Sea would rather just ship out.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

No but it was very much on the cards. Everyone knew it was coming...hence the reason the SNP were making such a play of it

So you were talking nonsense, was it deliberate?

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

Yeah, Scotland's fishing territory and oil reserves wouldn't be seen as a prize for any EU countries. The Spanish fleet and seafood restaurants would rather not have us and the French oil industry that's invested in Shetland and North Sea would rather just ship out.

He really does talk some pish at times meaning Stuart.

[nosferatu]

The main point about independence is the ability to borrow money and set our own budget.

On the point about borrowing money, Scotland would have to pay higher interest rates when borrowing money than the UK does.

On the point about setting our own budget, as the plan is to have a currency union with the rUK, we wouldn't be able to set our own budget anyway. It would be controlled by the rUK.

In summary, we wouldn't actually be independent!

65% of our exports are to the rUK. 19% to the EU. Being in a single market with the rUK is far more important than being in a single market with the EU!

Becoming independent would create uncertainty which would reduce investment into Scotland thereby reducing economic growth... a bit like what is happening with Brexit.

Scottish Independence = Brexit....  only on a much grander and catastrophic scale.

 

 

[oaksoft]

3 hours ago, tony soprano said:

There was no EU referendum promised by the UK gov at the time of the Indy Referendum.

That's not true Tony.

There was no firm date set but the Tories announced in 2013 that there would be a 2017 referendum.

Certainly there were many discussions during the debate about how we could lose EU membership by voting Yes that perhaps we would vote No and then Leave anyway.

[nosferatu]

29 minutes ago, tony soprano said:

the French oil industry that's invested in Shetland and North Sea would rather just ship out.

The same Shetland that voted 64% v 36% to remain as part of the UK?

[oaksoft]

2 minutes ago, nosferatu said:

The main point about independence is the ability to borrow money and set our own budget.

On the point about borrowing money, Scotland would have to pay higher interest rates when borrowing money than the UK does.

On the point about setting our own budget, as the plan is to have a currency union with the rUK, we wouldn't be able to set our own budget anyway. It would be controlled by the rUK.

In summary, we wouldn't actually be independent!

65% of our exports are to the rUK. 19% to the EU. Being in a single market with the rUK is far more important than being in a single market with the EU!

Becoming independent would create uncertainty which would reduce investment into Scotland thereby reducing economic growth... a bit like what is happening with Brexit.

Scottish Independence = Brexit....  only on a much grander and catastrophic scale.

 

 

The point about Independence is not having to hand over all of your income to another person who then hands you pocket money back.

The point about independence is being able to decide whether to remain in any co-operative unions or not and to leave if they prove unfavourable.

On the currency union, there are no plans at all. Sturgeon is still considering them so I have no idea where this fabled currency union with RuK would come from or why you would assume that RuK would be in charge of it. The euro is the way to go.

[oaksoft]

2 minutes ago, nosferatu said:

The same Shetland that voted 64% v 36% to remain as part of the UK?

The same Shetland which voted 56% to Remain in the EU - by your figures an overwhelming, crushing win for Remain.

Those 56% are being denied their democratic right to remain. Question is how you can be so certain that they would, under those circumstances, want to remain in the clearly racist UK. I'm not sure you can be certain of that.

[WeeBud]

11 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

That's not true Tony.

There was no firm date set but the Tories announced in 2013 that there would be a 2017 referendum.

Certainly there were many discussions during the debate about how we could lose EU membership by voting Yes that perhaps we would vote No and then Leave anyway.

• Only if "they" won the General Election which at the point of announcement was far from certain!!

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

The main point about independence is the ability to borrow money and set our own budget.

On the point about borrowing money, Scotland would have to pay higher interest rates when borrowing money than the UK does.

On the point about setting our own budget, as the plan is to have a currency union with the rUK, we wouldn't be able to set our own budget anyway. It would be controlled by the rUK.

In summary, we wouldn't actually be independent!

65% of our exports are to the rUK. 19% to the EU. Being in a single market with the rUK is far more important than being in a single market with the EU!

Becoming independent would create uncertainty which would reduce investment into Scotland thereby reducing economic growth... a bit like what is happening with Brexit.

Scottish Independence = Brexit....  only on a much grander and catastrophic scale.

 

 

Just have a wee look at Southern Ireland, that's all.

[FTOF]

4 hours ago, Stuart Dickson said:

 It was the SNP that made great play of independence being the only way to guarantee a place in the EU. All the No campaign did was prove that the SNP couldn't guarantee a place in the event of separating.

 

It was the Tories, wee Ruthie in particular, who made a great play of claiming voting No was the only way to ensure we remained in the EU.

That didn't really go too well for her, particularly in Holyrood the other day.

The lack of humility shown by her and her colleagues, for the Tory party being entirely responsible for the current shit storm, was deplorable. It only served to show them up as the arrogant and selfish reptiles that they are.