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Next St Mirren Manager - Merged

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46 minutes ago, Drew said:

Alex Neil was a rookie when he took charge of Hamilton. He had them playing a pressing, high intensity football, and it was the perfect fit in terms of the players he had at his disposal.

He didn't need a great deal of experience to be able to see what had to be done to get the results that earned them promotion then a top six placing when he left.  

Experience certainly isn't everything. Indeed, experienced managers often become set in their ways, stuffy, and inflexible -  it worked there, so it'll work here, too.  

We need a manager who is a good fit, first and foremost. He needs to be able to adapt, and not have a narrow view of the game.  Rae was stubborn in insisting on playing a 4-4-2  with two wingers. That was nothing to do with his experience level, it was his inability to adapt.

Alex Rae had also played at the club and done his coaching badges there and been involved in coaching youth team. Our obvious equivalents are Jamie Langfield or Andy Webster, both of whom joined 12 months ago and will be playing under their 3rd manager and 4th assistant at the club in that time.

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28 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

You were making a certain amount of sense until the bit above. You were one of the people in the summer saying it was time for Goodwin to go, his legs were done, and he was too old to play in the Championship. If you wish to have him in a non-playing capacity the club have already sacked him as a coach less than 2 years ago and you think we should promote him to manager? You'll be well aware a section of our support labelled Goodwin a liability as a player. 

No matter how often Thompson says he is not interested and wants to pursue his media career some people still keep nominating him for manager or assistant manager. The Hawk has supposedly told the media how much we are offering our next manager and it didn't sound like the kind of money he thought we should be offering.

Its no where near what he thinks its a good bit more.

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If Mixu had got the job when it went to Murray, or if he hadn't gone to United and it was him that replaced Murray instead of Rae, most people would have been delighted at the appointment.

Last season is the only real failure he's had as a manager and it's a big one. Unfortunately, we find ourselves in almost exactly the same position as United (just a division lower) at almost exactly the same stage of the season and it could very well lead to a similar outcome if he gets the job.

The only positive to draw from it is he'll hopefully have learnt from last season and not make the same mistakes with us.

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I'm still hopeful it's none of the 4 rumoured to be on the shortlist. I cant get excited about any of them. Hopefully someone that can galvanise the fans has gone under the radar. Perhaps clutching at straws but surelywe can attract a better standard of manager who fancies the challenge.

Douglas McNeil tweeted to say their was 5 getting interviewed over next few days , so be interesting to know the mystery 5th candidate , I mentioned Steve lomas the other day , he hasn't been rumoured but I'd imagine he'd be interested

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3 hours ago, gazmc83 said:

 


Harsh to say he's been cramp everywhere else and Not entirely true ... he also done well at Cowdenbeath getting them promoted and finishing third with TPS in Finland , true eremenko was a big part of his team at Killie but not the only reason for the his manager of the year award ...

I just feel he would be a good fit for us , however I also think given the fact Alloa have made public about allowing us to speak to Ross that it's pretty much certain Ross will get it

 

 

That's true. He also had Kenny Shiels as his assistant. 

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4 hours ago, gazmc83 said:

The more I think about I am actually warming to the idea of Mixu, he would fit with what GLS was describing last week , he could be a really good appointment for us ... big charachter who was popular with the fans who could really lift the place , knows Scottish football well . We know he had a hard time at Dundee Utd last year but that club and dressing room was a pretty toxic situation, looking back to his time at Killie he was very much in demand and had them playing great football. His usual assistant Gordon Young would also be an interesting appointment given his track record with youth academies ...

His "usual" assistant? He hired Gordon Young in when he started at Dundee United. He'd never had him as an assistant anywhere else. I remember Gordon Young from his time at Motherwell. I haven't followed his career too closely since then but I'd be interested to hear about all the world class superstars he developed for Sheffield United. If he was good in his role, it would make you wonder why he couldn't get the kids at Dundee United to play for him and Mixu when they really needed to pull out some performances. 

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2 hours ago, Drew said:

Alex Neil was a rookie when he took charge of Hamilton. He had them playing a pressing, high intensity football, and it was the perfect fit in terms of the players he had at his disposal.

He didn't need a great deal of experience to be able to see what had to be done to get the results that earned them promotion then a top six placing when he left.  

Experience certainly isn't everything. Indeed, experienced managers often become set in their ways, stuffy, and inflexible -  it worked there, so it'll work here, too.  

We need a manager who is a good fit, first and foremost. He needs to be able to adapt, and not have a narrow view of the game.  Rae was stubborn in insisting on playing a 4-4-2  with two wingers. That was nothing to do with his experience level, it was his inability to adapt.

In fairness Drew I think everyone who knew Alex Neil as a player knew he was going to go on to be a manager. He got into coaching the kids at Hamilton long before the end of his playing career and any kid or parent who worked with him and his team there would be gushing about him, even after Neil let them go. He was clearly a bit of a thinker when it came to the game and he had his vision and philosophy mapped out quite early and in general he's stuck to it, even when being relegated at Norwich. We're going back quite a while now too but I also remember tipping him as a future top manager whilst watching him play for Hamilton Accies in Division Two.  I don't think the same thing can be said about Jack Ross or about his time at Hearts. 

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When the new manager is appointed, in the job and up and running. What will happen if he/she has six similar results/performances/points return as Alex Rae?

will the board act again so quickly and decisively? Will the support clamour for a change?

these are the questions I see neither club, nor poster answering, and fundamentally these are the very questions any new philosophy should address at he outset. Will we be repeating the definition of madness by doing this all over again before the year is out, but somehow expecting a different result???

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6 hours ago, Stuart Dickson said:

 We're going back quite a while now too but I also remember tipping him as a future top manager whilst watching him play for Hamilton Accies in Division Two.  I don't think the same thing can be said about Jack Ross or about his time at Hearts. 

:lol:

Ah well, Ross might as well chuck it if he hasn't been tipped by you to be a future top manager.

I wasn't claiming that Ross would be as successful as Neil has been. I was simply pointing out that experience isn't everything. Neil is a good example of this (and he was most certainly a rookie, regardless of how many kids he had coached).

 

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His "usual" assistant? He hired Gordon Young in when he started at Dundee United. He'd never had him as an assistant anywhere else. I remember Gordon Young from his time at Motherwell. I haven't followed his career too closely since then but I'd be interested to hear about all the world class superstars he developed for Sheffield United. If he was good in his role, it would make you wonder why he couldn't get the kids at Dundee United to play for him and Mixu when they really needed to pull out some performances. 


My mistake I should have said his "last assistant " , this is from his linked in profile ( and before you say I know it's written by him ) but nonetheless it does read rather impressively from his time at Motherwell.... Sheffield Utd not so much in terms of world class superstars but looks like he had lots of plans and ideas there before he left for Dundee Utd .. IMG_1475566031.379094.thumb.jpg.95e4d3f3

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Managerial career[edit]

As of match played 2 May 2016
Team Nat From To Record
G W D L GF GA GD Win %
Cowdenbeath Scotland August 2005 21 October 2006 7001510000000000000♠51 7001290000000000000♠29 7000700000000000000♠7 7001150000000000000♠15 7002111000000000000♠111 7001620000000000000♠62 +49 7001568600000000000♠56.86
TPS Finland October 2006 2007 7001340000000000000♠34 7001150000000000000♠15 7000500000000000000♠5 7001140000000000000♠14 7001570000000000000♠57 7001410000000000000♠41 +16 7001441200000000000♠44.12
Hibernian Scotland 10 January 2008 24 May 2009 7001620000000000000♠62 7001190000000000000♠19 7001180000000000000♠18 7001250000000000000♠25 7001680000000000000♠68 7001740000000000000♠74 −6 7001306500000000000♠30.65
Kilmarnock Scotland 23 June 2010 31 March 2011 7001340000000000000♠34 7001150000000000000♠15 7000600000000000000♠6 7001130000000000000♠13 7001550000000000000♠55 7001440000000000000♠44 +11 7001441200000000000♠44.12
Finland Finland 31 March 2011 14 June 2015 7001440000000000000♠44 7001170000000000000♠17 7001110000000000000♠11 7001160000000000000♠16 7001540000000000000♠54 7001540000000000000♠54 +0 7001386400000000000♠38.64
Dundee United Scotland 14 October 2015 4 May 2016 7001290000000000000♠29 7000800000000000000♠8 7000400000000000000♠4 7001170000000000000♠17 7001290000000000000♠29 7001450000000000000♠45 −16 7001275900000000000♠27.59
Total 7002252000000000000♠252 7002103000000000000♠103 7001510000000000000♠51 7001980000000000000♠98 7002373000000000000♠373 7002319000000000000♠319 +54 7001408709999900000♠40.87

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40% win ratio in all of jobs is not to bad and at Dundee utd people need to remember that wasn't his team it was mcnammaras team I think he would be a good fit for us and remember took our youth to the youth cup final


And low and behold his first two matches if he was to get it would be Hibs then Dundee Utd , how much would he love to that ? written in the stars ?

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Personally I'd be happier with Mixu than a return for MacPherson.

If it was a straight choice between Mixu and Ross, not entirely sure.

Mixu certainly has the experience but as TC has said previously, his stint at Utd has really put me off.

Guess we will need to wait and see!

 

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1 hour ago, Lord Pityme said:

When the new manager is appointed, in the job and up and running. What will happen if he/she has six similar results/performances/points return as Alex Rae?

will the board act again so quickly and decisively? Will the support clamour for a change?

these are the questions I see neither club, nor poster answering, and fundamentally these are the very questions any new philosophy should address at he outset. Will we be repeating the definition of madness by doing this all over again before the year is out, but somehow expecting a different result???

There lies the reason for taking so long to try and ensure we get the right man in place. If we get this wrong then we will be in a really difficult position.

This is possibly one of the most crucial decisions that Gordon Scott and the BOD will take. The stakes are really high and god help us if we get it wrong. However I'm certain that Gordon Scott is well aware of this.

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21 minutes ago, div said:

Personally I'd be happier with Mixu than a return for MacPherson.

If it was a straight choice between Mixu and Ross, not entirely sure.

Mixu certainly has the experience but as TC has said previously, his stint at Utd has really put me off.

Guess we will need to wait and see!

 

Aye, Mixu over MacPherson for me, too.

I'd take Ross before Mixu. Something tells me that big Mixu could be one of those guys who is a bit fixed in his ways. That's great, if his way translates as the best way, but, if the chips are down, how willing would he be to change things.

To be honest, I'm basing this on a hunch, more than anything else. Just a (very crude) reading of the guy based on interviews and loosely following his progress as a manager in Scotland.

Danny Lennon went up considerably in my estimation when he held his hand up after the Summer of 'Beath and had a bit of a radical rethink about his overall approach to management. Admitting that you've f**ked up, and taking steps to sort it out is one of the most underestimated strengths in a good manager in any context, fitba or otherwise. As a manager, I have to say that, as I get it wrong all the time.... :ph34r:

ETA - I've just had a wee search and found this article. Point 2 is interesting in terms of what I've suggested above. Of course, this is an opinion piece, but makes sobering reading all the same:

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/dundee-united/five-fatal-flaws-of-mixu-paatelainen-s-dundee-united-tenure-1-4119023

Edited by Drew

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