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Next St Mirren Manager - Merged

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30 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Forget the names. So when the new manager comes in, and say we have a worse or similar set of results, should he/she get punted after six games too?

if that scenario (hopefully not) plays out There will be a clamour again, fed by a realisation that fan-pressure can get this board to bend and sack early. 

Yes you are correct all hell will break loose if the new manager has worse or similar results. However remember this, Murray who you wanted punted had better results than Rae has had at the start of this season. We weren't bottom of the league under his leadership. We are in a worse state now than we were at anytime last season. Rae had to go. I prefer the scenario that when the new manager comes in results will improve and we could end up in the top four. That wasn't going to happen with Rae in charge.

 

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15 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Are you looking for an hour by hour report or something?

The club issued a statement on Friday telling the supporters exactly where they are in the hiring process. I'm pretty much satisfied with that. Should there be no further movement between now and the weekend, I'd probably expect them to release another statement.

It'll be done when it's done, due diligence is completed and the board are fully satisfied that the right man is to be in place. I really can't be arsed with all this 'we demand instant gratification' pish.

 

To be fair, we should be livetweeting the interviews. We could even periscope them. This isn't good enough!!!!

 

 

:wink:

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Aye, Mixu over MacPherson for me, too.

I'd take Ross before Mixu. Something tells me that big Mixu could be one of those guys who is a bit fixed in his ways. That's great, if his way translates as the best way, but, if the chips are down, how willing would he be to change things.

To be honest, I'm basing this on a hunch, more than anything else. Just a (very crude) reading of the guy based on interviews and loosely following his progress as a manager in Scotland.

Danny Lennon went up considerably in my estimation when he held his hand up after the Summer of 'Beath and had a bit of a radical rethink about his overall approach to management. Admitting that you've f**ked up, and taking steps to sort it out is one of the most underestimated strengths in a good manager in any context, fitba or otherwise. As a manager, I have to say that, as I get it wrong all the time....

ETA - I've just had a wee search and found this article. Point 2 is interesting in terms of what I've suggested above. Of course, this is an opinion piece, but makes sobering reading all the same:

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/dundee-united/five-fatal-flaws-of-mixu-paatelainen-s-dundee-united-tenure-1-4119023


FFS someone please forward this link to GLS.
States Mixu stuck by the same flawed formation. We have just seen the same stubbornness in Alex Rae.

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2 hours ago, div said:

Alex Rae wasn't punted purely because of the results in the first six games. He's alluded to that himself in the interviews he's given since.

The new board didn't see the management team as being the right men to deliver either the short or longer term strategy they have set out.

They, rightly, see the manager as being absolutely fundamental to the success of the football club and so have decided to bring in their own choice for that position.

It's hard to argue with that logic, but I'm sure you'll try and spin some negativity about it anyway!

Why would I or anyone try to "spin negativity"? 

I am highlighting the risks with continually sacking and hiring, but expecting stability and progress. Nice of you to share your inside track on the reasons the last management team were sacked, that (board wanting their own man) was never put out as the reason why Rae and Farrell were sacked.

the question remains, will they back "their choice" if he/she returns similar points over six or seven matches, or will it be all change again? Like it or not a level of expectation and a precedent has been set.

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3 hours ago, TopCat said:

 


Of course if you actually read the post you'd realise i wasn't advocating either Thompson or Goodwin for the managerial role. To appoint a rookie of full time management in this situation would be madness in my opinion.

On the other hand, as others have pointed out, Ross may turn out to be our Alex Neil. Or maybe Thompson would, or maybe Goodwin would, no way of knowing. They've all managed the same amount of full time teams in their life: 0. No idea what Jim's playing ability has to do with that right enough. The hypothetical advantage Jim and Thommo have over Ross and Fullarton is popularity with the fans.

The reality is most rookie managers fail. I can't recall the exact figure but I know most new first full time managers never get a second permanent full time managerial job in football. For every Alex Neil there is ten of Ian Murray, Gary Teale, Danny Lennon, Tom Hendrie, Eddie May, Allan Moore, James Fowler, James Grady, John Coughlin... I could certainly go on.

We might get lucky and get one of those rare rookie diamonds in Ross, could argue we are certainly due one. Only one of our managers this century has went on to have another permanent managerial position with a full time club after leaving us (Guess who). Doesn't work like that though, if we appoint a rookie manager it probably won't work out, the numbers don't lie.
 

 

I think the only person that classes DL as a failure is you. 

What exactly did he fail at? 

 

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1 hour ago, Kendo said:

Yes you are correct all hell will break loose if the new manager has worse or similar results. However remember this, Murray who you wanted punted had better results than Rae has had at the start of this season. We weren't bottom of the league under his leadership. We are in a worse state now than we were at anytime last season. Rae had to go. I prefer the scenario that when the new manager comes in results will improve and we could end up in the top four. That wasn't going to happen with Rae in charge.

 

I never wanted Murray hired in the first place, anyone could see he had achieved nothing, and had just shipped nearly seventy goals the season he joined us. It wasnt rocket science.

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3 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

I never wanted Murray hired in the first place, anyone could see he had achieved nothing, and had just shipped nearly seventy goals the season he joined us. It wasnt rocket science.

Do you genuinely think it was a mistake to punt Rae? 

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The process is confidential not for every stupid punter to be 'kept informed'.

We will find out who the new manager is in good time.

Meanwhile keep up the daft twaddle if it makes your miserable little lives more interesting.




*whoosh*

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14 minutes ago, Simon_Towel said:

I think the only person that classes DL as a failure is you. 

What exactly did he fail at? 

 

As I've said before. He failed to get into the top 6 with this team:

Samson, DVZ, Dummett, Goody, Cheesy, McGinn/McLean, McGowan, Newton, Goncalves, Teale and Thommohawk.

That team should have qualified for Europe.

PS. I don't class him as a failure overall!

Edited by ScotstounSaint
Wee addition

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10 minutes ago, Kendo said:

Do you genuinely think it was a mistake to punt Rae? 

The issue i am raising isnt about that, we had some god awful performances this season under Rae, anyone could see that.

my point is will the board and support actually change mindset, behaviour and expectation if the next manager comes in with similar results to Rae? At some point the penny has to drop hiring & firing is expensive and continues to deliver poor stability to the club.

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1 minute ago, Lord Pityme said:

The issue i am raising isnt about that, we had some god awful performances this season under Rae, anyone could see that.

my point is will the board and support actually change mindset, behaviour and expectation if the next manager comes in with similar results to Rae? At some point the penny has to drop hiring & firing is expensive and continues to deliver poor stability to the club.

At the end of the day, the new board inherited a manager they never employed. They obviously never seen a long term plan under him and have a different vision from what Rae set out.

We could have run down his contract and taken the risk on being in the same league position and look back on hindsight at where we could have made change. The board are only a few months in the door and they feel and action like this is putting their mark on the club and the direction they want to take us.

Dwindling attendances has obviously shown a concern to the board and now was the time to act.

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4 minutes ago, kevo_smfc said:

At the end of the day, the new board inherited a manager they never employed. They obviously never seen a long term plan under him and have a different vision from what Rae set out.

We could have run down his contract and taken the risk on being in the same league position and look back on hindsight at where we could have made change. The board are only a few months in the door and they feel and action like this is putting their mark on the club and the direction they want to take us.

Dwindling attendances has obviously shown a concern to the board and now was the time to act.

Great...

but will they support their pick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

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13 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Great...

but will they support their prick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

Nice way to talk about our next manager.            Will we be able to afford it.

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16 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Great...

but will they support their pick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

If they get it wrong then the sackings should be in the boardroom IMO. FWIW I agree with the point you allude to LP. This appointment should be of someone who can create a working structure for the playing side of the club and although you can never guarantee that a successful manager will stay with you long term, it should be seen as a long term appointment. 

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15 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Great...

but will they support their pick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

You'd need to ask them.

What difference does it make now? Rae has left the building. Even if you were to receive an answer to your hypothetical query, it won't change that fact.

 

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19 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Great...

but will they support their pick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

Who would you like to see on your short list.

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19 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Great...

but will they support their pick if he has similar points return on his watch? Thats what I want to know, or will it be all change again?

Managers get sacked all the time in football, that's just the way it is. I believe if they give him a realistic target and he matches it, then he will be fine. If not, at least they can admit poor judgement. 

I do believe though whoever takes charge has a mammoth task in getting us back to the SPL. At least qualifying for the playoffs should be the minimum aim after this season.

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