Reynard Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, Slartibartfast said: So answer the question, which word/words in the original post ("so which treaty deals entirely with the single market?") were you going to replace with "acquis"? Come on, go for it, show everyone how intelligent you are and how much of a half wit I am. All you are doing at the moment is showing yourself squirming about in an SD fashion trying to make people forget what you said in the first place. Maybe it made sense in your head, but that's your problem, not mine. "Don't change the subject, just answer the f**king question." I wasn't going to change anything. It's you that's got a bug up your arse about f**k all here. I just added acquis because the entirety of Eu legislation is commonly known as that. The part of it relating to the single market is contained in the EEA treaty. That's the single market acquis. If we left the EU and stayed in the single market then we are subject to around 20% of the current EU acquis. Although its not strictly EU as its EEA. But I'm sure most folk can work that bit out for themselves. Have you managed to admit that you're wrong about EFTA countries paying into the EU budget yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 5 minutes ago, Reynard said: I wasn't going to change anything. It's you that's got a bug up your arse about f**k all here. I just added acquis because the entirety of Eu legislation is commonly known as that. The part of it relating to the single market is contained in the EEA treaty. That's the single market acquis. If we left the EU and stayed in the single market then we are subject to around 20% of the current EU acquis. Although its not strictly EU as its EEA. But I'm sure most folk can work that bit out for themselves. Have you managed to admit that you're wrong about EFTA countries paying into the EU budget yet? TO BE CONTINUED!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted March 20, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2018 Close run contest between TM & Brechin as to who are having the worst season! Quote The key aspects of the agreement announced in Brussels are: The transitional period will last from Brexit day on 29 March 2019 to 31 December 2020 EU citizens arriving in the UK between these two dates will enjoy the same rights and guarantees as those who arrive before Brexit. The same will apply to UK expats on the continent The UK will be able to negotiate, sign and ratify its own trade deals during the transition period although they can only come into force from 1 January 2021 The UK will still be party to existing EU trade deals with other countries The UK's share of fishing catch will be guaranteed during transition but the UK will, in effect, remain part of the Common Fisheries Policy, yet without a direct say in its rules, until the end of 2020 Other aspects of the post-Brexit relationship yet to be agreed include what happens to the Northern Ireland border in the longer term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted April 23, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whydowebother Posted October 8, 2018 Report Share Posted October 8, 2018 Bumped to save the new runaway thread starter....Not long now - Deal or No deal ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted October 8, 2018 Report Share Posted October 8, 2018 yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted October 8, 2018 Report Share Posted October 8, 2018 Bumped to save the new runaway thread starter....Not long now - Deal or No deal ? yes[emoji3] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted October 8, 2018 Report Share Posted October 8, 2018 Bumped to save the new runaway thread starter....Not long now - Deal or No deal ?Genuinely don't know as the government view seems to change each week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted October 8, 2018 Report Share Posted October 8, 2018 Just now, TPAFKATS said: Exactly... No longer the key issue unless a Customs Union is included Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted October 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) Does anyone support May's current position? I had one ear on most of the Q&A session in Parliament yesterday and reckon not. She'd be better off choosing one side of her party and telling the other to do their worst! On 10/8/2018 at 8:22 PM, TPAFKATS said: On 10/8/2018 at 8:13 PM, whydowebother said: Genuinely don't know as the government view seems to change each week. She appeases one side and then to soothe the outrage makes a concession to the other (for two years ) which has resulted in a policy (Chequers) that nobody supports. Edited October 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bud the Baker said: Does anyone support May's current position? I had one ear on most of the Q&A session in Parliament yesterday and reckon not. She'd be better off choosing one side of her party and telling the other to do their worst! She appeases one side and then to soothe the outrage makes a concession to the other (for two years ) which has resulted in a policy (Chequers) that nobody supports. This is never going to happen. Hearing a Tory twat yesterday on Channel 4 news, saying never get through and a Super Canada Plus deal "might" get favour with "most" Tories. Its clear its never been about the 17.4m ............ I reckon it wont happen. May said " No deal is better than a Bad Deal" buts it more like no deal as we cant agree on a deal....................... Just a feeling but we wont leave EU, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted October 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) 31 minutes ago, DougJamie said: This is never going to happen. Hearing a Tory twat yesterday on Channel 4 news, saying never get through and a Drink Canada Dry deal "might" get favour with "most" Tories. Its clear its never been about the 17.4m ............ I reckon it wont happen. May said " No deal is better than a Bad Deal" buts it more like no deal as we cant agree on a deal....................... Just a feeling but we wont leave EU, I presume a "No Deal" Brexit has to go before Parliament. May would lose this and the subsequent VoC. The new PM will then ask for an extension to the Transition Period while a new deal is worked out (again my presumption). ***************** We might very well stay full members of the EU but it'll be on worse terms than we had prior to the Referendum and what we were offered to avoid this mess! https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35622105 Oh and the current rebate worth £12.9Billion in 2016 will be history! Edited October 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, Bud the Baker said: I presume a "No Deal" Brexit has to go before Parliament. May would lose this and the subsequent VoC. The new PM will then ask for an extension to the Transition Period while a new deal is worked out (again my presumption). ***************** We might very well stay full members of the EU but it'll be on worse terms than we had prior to the Referendum and what we were offered to avoid this mess! https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35622105 Oh and the current rebate worth £12.9Billion in 2016 will be history! Added to this , if the DUP leave the Tories in minority, would Labour actually seize the chance or just be the dicks they are and stay as fragmented as the tories.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Bud the Baker said: I presume a "No Deal" Brexit has to go before Parliament. May would lose this and the subsequent VoC. The new PM will then ask for an extension to the Transition Period while a new deal is worked out (again my presumption). ***************** We might very well stay full members of the EU but it'll be on worse terms than we had prior to the Referendum and what we were offered to avoid this mess! https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35622105 Oh and the current rebate worth £12.9Billion in 2016 will be history! If we stay, then surely we stay with the same deal, I am pretty sure I read that the activation of article 50 could be stopped dead. If we have to accept a lesser deal then that would be rejected out of hand. I doubt the other member states would take the risk of the UK crashing out and then having to negotiate new Ts & Cs. We would gain as well as lose and other members would be a afflicted with green cheese syndrome. Cherrypicking goes in both directions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 Has there ever been time with more dithering by a Prime Minister? Had TM had the courage of her convictions rather than a lust for power she would have turned the job down since she had voted to remain. This would at least have made matters clearer within her own party and to others. As I understand it, after much politicing,Parliament has the "final" say even if this is to recommend a People's Vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted October 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, beyond our ken said: If we stay, then surely we stay with the same deal, I am pretty sure I read that the activation of article 50 could be stopped dead. If we have to accept a lesser deal then that would be rejected out of hand. I doubt the other member states would take the risk of the UK crashing out and then having to negotiate new Ts & Cs. We would gain as well as lose and other members would be a afflicted with green cheese syndrome. Cherrypicking goes in both directions The rebate is not universally supported within the EU. Quote There has been growing pressure in recent years from various EU member states for the rebate to be scrapped. This is partly because the recent additional member states of the EU, which are considerably poorer than the fifteen pre-2004 states, will be a considerable expense on the CAP and the EU budget in general. The view is put forward by many that this makes the UK rebate harder to accommodate within the EU budget, leveraged with the moral argument that all the new entrants are substantially poorer than the UK. You may (sic) be right but we're on our notice period - I'd bet against us remaining on preferential terms. Edited October 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beyond our ken Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 10 minutes ago, Bud the Baker said: The rebate is not universally supported within the EU. You may (sic) be right but we're on our notice period - I'd bet against us remaining on preferential terms. I don't claim to be a student of the machinations of the EU. From what I read at times, it seems a club like the EU is the sort of place where most, if not all, members have something that they consider to be a preferrential deal. There might be moral presure on the UK to give up the rebate, however the other members know that there is something that they hold dear that they would have to surrender, otherwise surrender of the rebate would surely have been a condition on the deal offered to Cameron. If they get a chance to keep us in the fold they wont mess it up, though we might do that for them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 If Europe made it easy for The UK to leave , there is a big danger that other countries would follow suit and the house of cards would collapse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted October 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, beyond our ken said: I don't claim to be a student of the machinations of the EU. From what I read at times, it seems a club like the EU is the sort of place where most, if not all, members have something that they consider to be a preferrential deal. There might be moral presure on the UK to give up the rebate, however the other members know that there is something that they hold dear that they would have to surrender, otherwise surrender of the rebate would surely have been a condition on the deal offered to Cameron. If they get a chance to keep us in the fold they wont mess it up, though we might do that for them Why? **************** The argument for remaining is/was that the benefits in terms of freedom to trade of being a member of the EU outweigh the visible costs - if we were to go back cap-in-hand the UK rebate which has always been controversial (especially with France & Italy) would IMO be on the table and I very much doubt whether the UK would have the political clout to keep it. **************** Edit Quote BRITAIN will lose the favourable terms of its EU membership including the budget rebate and opt-outs on Schengen and the euro if it chooses to withdraw Article 50 and rejoin the club, the European parliament’s Brexit negotiator said today. https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/816923/Brexit-news-EU-Guy-Verhofstadt-UK-lose-rebate-opt-outs-if-rejoins Edited October 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud the Baker Posted October 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 5 hours ago, St.Ricky said: Has there ever been time with more dithering by a Prime Minister? Had TM had the courage of her convictions rather than a lust for power she would have turned the job down since she had voted to remain. This would at least have made matters clearer within her own party and to others. As I understand it, after much politicing,Parliament has the "final" say even if this is to recommend a People's Vote. Prior to the referendum May was regarded as a Eurosceptic - here's a headline from The Independent in Nov 2015. Quote EU referendum: Theresa May could lead 'Out' campaign after Nigel Farage says he'd be 'delighted' if she took the role It was a surprise when she favoured Remain, she made one speech only during the campaign - after Cameron resigned she was seen as someone who could bring the two wings of the Conservative Party together. Just as cynical as BoJo - bet she wishes she hadn't bothered now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bud the Baker said: Prior to the referendum May was regarded as a Eurosceptic - here's a headline from The Independent in Nov 2015. It was a surprise when she favoured Remain, she made one speech only during the campaign - after Cameron resigned she was seen as someone who could bring the two wings of the Conservative Party together. Just as cynical as BoJo - bet she wishes she hadn't bothered now! We are on the same page. A political opportunist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 If Europe made it easy for The UK to leave , there is a big danger that other countries would follow suit and the house of cards would collapse Indeed, if you give up membership of a club but continue to enjoy the benefits of membership why would others remain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 8 hours ago, St.Ricky said: Has there ever been time with more dithering by a Prime Minister? Had TM had the courage of her convictions rather than a lust for power she would have turned the job down since she had voted to remain. This would at least have made matters clearer within her own party and to others. As I understand it, after much politicing,Parliament has the "final" say even if this is to recommend a People's Vote. Yes, I don't understand this either. You take the job knowing that people have voted to Leave and that it's your job to make sure that happens. You surely know exactly how you want to make that happen before you take the job and make sure those selecting you also know your plans so that when you get in, nobody in your cabinet can undermine you. Then you announce that we are leaving, set the leaving date and start planning for that date. None of that needs negotiating. Once you start the ball rolling, you invite the EU to discuss areas where you can reduce future problems such as trade deals, mingration, security etc from a position of strength because you have set the agenda. Everything May has done appears to be from a position of weakness and I think this is because she wanted power more than anything else and so the EU are humiliating her, the Tories are openly undermining her and few of the electorate see any strength at all. It's a textbook example of how not to do things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted October 16, 2018 Report Share Posted October 16, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said: If Europe made it easy for The UK to leave , there is a big danger that other countries would follow suit and the house of cards would collapse Europe can only control this if we make it clear we need things from them. May should have announced we were leaving with no deal on the first day she took over. She should have put a date on it. The EU could not have controlled that. Any other deal we negotiated would then have been a bonus. We are only in this position because May doesn't really seem to want to leave. This has put the country in a very vulnerable position for no good reason. Edited October 16, 2018 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted October 17, 2018 Report Share Posted October 17, 2018 11 hours ago, TPAFKATS said: 18 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said: If Europe made it easy for The UK to leave , there is a big danger that other countries would follow suit and the house of cards would collapse Indeed, if you give up membership of a club but continue to enjoy the benefits of membership why would others remain. The Club of Rome has benefitted greatly from its U.K. Member. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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