Brexit Negotiations

[oaksoft]

2 minutes ago, antrin said:

And, of course, any decision to be made regarding consolidation, restructuring, efficiency,  reorganisation, redundancies, political fall-out etc etc would all be made without the slightest consideration that the UK will no longer be part of the EU trading group. as Brexit is just "utterly bullshit" according to some in-the -know intellectuals.

 

Aye, right...  

 

Who said that?

[Bud the Baker]

16 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Who said that?

You did three posts above when you said "Neither Honda nor Nissan are pulling out because of Brexit. That is just an utterly bullshit excuse."

Obviously it's not the only reason but apart from the local MP (& I wonder where he stands on the issue  ) and possibly yourself everyone seems to agree it is a factor.

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

I'm bored stiff with politics worryingly there does not seem to be any leadership of any party in the house of spin and lies. Just thought I would mention that. 

[saintnextlifetime]

1 hour ago, Bud the Baker said:

Now Honda! 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47282603

Obviously Brexit will not be the only factor in the decision but let's face it in the current global economy going it alone will not benefit many UK workers.

@saintnextlifetime I really don't give a monkeys f**k about some trade deal done by Europe - Still feel that way?

200% why should we rely on what deals the festering superstate gets .  Europe is 15% of the world market , through the WTO we can make our own deals with the other 85% that suit the UK .

I don't want my country to be part of a super state where the principle states in the Euro zone are either in recession or the verge of financial collapse( expecting us to bail them out) . The project hasn't worked . It is a suppressive , undemocratic regime . They know that when the UK leaves it will be over for them which is why they offer deals that are not deals at all . They have had long enough and it is time for the UK government to show some balls and go with a WTO deal. .

 

[Guest TPAFKATS]

200% why should we rely on what deals the festering superstate gets .  Europe is 15% of the world market , through the WTO we can make our own deals with the other 85% that suit the UK .
I don't want my country to be part of a super state where the principle states in the Euro zone are either in recession or the verge of financial collapse( expecting us to bail them out) . The project hasn't worked . It is a suppressive , undemocratic regime . They know that when the UK leaves it will be over for them which is why they offer deals that are not deals at all . They have had long enough and it is time for the UK government to show some balls and go with a WTO deal. .
 

I appreciate that many don't wish to be part of a European superstate. However...

With regards to a WTO deal, it leaves UK at a massive disadvantage, particularly when trying to do deals with larger economies.

Also EU may only be 15% of the market but its a much higher %age of UK trading market (over 50% ?).

Its not 'them' who have had long enough. UK has had nearly 3 years and hasn't been able to keep a consistent line on what kind of deal it wants.

[saintnextlifetime]

1 hour ago, TPAFKATS said:

I appreciate that many don't wish to be part of a European superstate. However...

With regards to a WTO deal, it leaves UK at a massive disadvantage, particularly when trying to do deals with larger economies.

Also EU may only be 15% of the market but its a much higher %age of UK trading market (over 50% ?).

Its not 'them' who have had long enough. UK has had nearly 3 years and hasn't been able to keep a consistent line on what kind of deal it wants.

That is because May is duplicite. .

Yes we do trade a lot with Europe but we don't need those German cars , or the Belgian chocolates or that French wine . Facts are that Britain was always a seafaring nation that traded with the world not just 8 other countries as it was in the EEC or the other 27 as it is now - why limit your trade to those countries when you can trade with the world . As it stands we couldn't have a trade deal with Australia unless Europe approved it (that is a loss of Sovereignty ) . .

But trade is old hat , that is what it was about in 1973 now it's down to -do you want to be dictated to by Eurocrats who are far removed from these lsles ? Sturgeon used to go on about how Scotland never voted for a tory government , which was true at the time , but we certainly never voted fot Juncker and Barnier and they are much further removed from Scotland than the tory party .  . .I'd be surprised if Barnier can even spell Paisley. .

[saintnextlifetime]

1 hour ago, TPAFKATS said:

I appreciate that many don't wish to be part of a European superstate. However...

With regards to a WTO deal, it leaves UK at a massive disadvantage, particularly when trying to do deals with larger economies.

Also EU may only be 15% of the market but its a much higher %age of UK trading market (over 50% ?).

Its not 'them' who have had long enough. UK has had nearly 3 years and hasn't been able to keep a consistent line on what kind of deal it wants.

The USA have already said they would be willing to have a free trade deal after Europe has collapsed the UK leaves Europe . Is there a massive disadvantage ? Who said ? Jonny Major ( along with the CBI and financial institutions)told us that if we didn't get into the Euro it would be a disaster - and then it wasn't but it was a disaster for Eire getting into it . .

[oaksoft]

4 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

You did three posts above when you said "Neither Honda nor Nissan are pulling out because of Brexit. That is just an utterly bullshit excuse."

 

That is not what antrim was claiming I was saying.

[oaksoft]

4 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

Obviously it's not the only reason but apart from the local MP (& I wonder where he stands on the issue  ) and possibly yourself everyone seems to agree it is a factor.

Perhaps I should make myself clearer in order to prevent antrim from misrepresenting me.

The trouble is that Remainers want to assign an undue weight to that factor and ignore the very obvious  MUCH larger issue with both companies which is that they are struggling to sell cars in general and need to consolidate.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

That is because May is duplicite. .
Yes we do trade a lot with Europe but we don't need those German cars , or the Belgian chocolates or that French wine . Facts are that Britain was always a seafaring nation that traded with the world not just 8 other countries as it was in the EEC or the other 27 as it is now - why limit your trade to those countries when you can trade with the world . As it stands we couldn't have a trade deal with Australia unless Europe approved it (that is a loss of Sovereignty ) . .
But trade is old hat , that is what it was about in 1973 now it's down to -do you want to be dictated to by Eurocrats who are far removed from these lsles ? Sturgeon used to go on about how Scotland never voted for a tory government , which was true at the time , but we certainly never voted fot Juncker and Barnier and they are much further removed from Scotland than the tory party .  . .I'd be surprised if Barnier can even spell Paisley. .

We do vote for barnier and junker by being part of the EU.
Personally I think that needs to be reformed but not by trying to negotiate trade deals as a small nation as opposed to part of the biggest trading market.

Everyone can live without German cars, Belgian chocolates etc, but it's nice to have a choice isn't it?
We aren't limiting our trade with EU just now. We will still have German cars, they'll just cost more which will make them more of a status symbol for most who already buy them.

Being pedantic, Britain isn't a nation. England, Scotland and latterly Great Britain have all been seafaring trading nations however the most successful trading times were built around empire, East India company and slavery.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

The USA have already said they would be willing to have a free trade deal after Europe has collapsed the UK leaves Europe . Is there a massive disadvantage ? Who said ? Jonny Major ( along with the CBI and financial institutions)told us that if we didn't get into the Euro it would be a disaster - and then it wasn't but it was a disaster for Eire getting into it . .

USA have said they will negotiate a trade deal with UK. We hold no aces in this negotiation.

[antrin]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

Perhaps I should make myself clearer in order to prevent antrim from misrepresenting me.

The trouble is that Remainers want to assign an undue weight to that factor and ignore the very obvious  MUCH larger issue with both companies which is that they are struggling to sell cars in general and need to consolidate.

No, you arsehole.

(being as polite as possible in dealing with downright lies)

you stated that brexit had nothing to do with companies leaving UK - it was all consolidation.

no company that hopes to survive troubled times for ALL the excuses I suggested (including the nefarious “consolidation”) can ignore the elephant in the room - Brexit.

it f**ks up their business plans and any need they have to remain in the UK. They don’t need what was once a useful EU base.

Brexit has prompted action.  Brexit has been the catalyst.

if you don’t want to be misrepresented, then don’t post vacuous, incorrect statements that need to be later corrected...  so that you won’t have the follow-up pfaff of having to clarify your earlier genuinely utter bullshit.

Edited February 18, 2019 by antrin

[antrin]

1 hour ago, TPAFKATS said:

We do vote for barnier and junker by being part of the EU.
Personally I think that needs to be reformed but not by trying to negotiate trade deals as a small nation as opposed to part of the biggest trading market.

Everyone can live without German cars, Belgian chocolates etc, but it's nice to have a choice isn't it?
We aren't limiting our trade with EU just now. We will still have German cars, they'll just cost more which will make them more of a status symbol for most who already buy them.

Being pedantic, Britain isn't a nation. England, Scotland and latterly Great Britain have all been seafaring trading nations however the most successful trading times were built around empire, East India company and slavery.
 

Just as a throwaway thought...

my wummin’s big daft BMW was built in the USA and shipped in.  I don’t approve, but it shows that Germany’s car companies are not all that worried about all German jobs being lost if brits aren’t part of the Eu.

 

[antrin]

And another reason for Brexit being the catalyst in stripping Japanese car production from the UK, is that once Japan concludes its trade deal with EU, it will no longer have to have plants in EU countries like UK.

it can ship such jobs back home... or to another third world country...

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Just as a throwaway thought...
my wummin’s big daft BMW was built in the USA and shipped in.  I don’t approve, but it shows that Germany’s car companies are not all that worried about all German jobs being lost if brits aren’t part of the Eu.
 

I knew vw used to build in USA, Mexico and Brazil but never knew BMW built in USA and shipped back across to UK.
Everyday is a school day.

[antrin]

Just now, TPAFKATS said:

I knew vw used to build in USA, Mexico and Brazil but never knew BMW built in USA and shipped back across to UK.
Everyday is a school day.

Aye.

an X3.

(I just asked her.  I only knew it was a black BMW)  

 

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Aye.
an X3.
(I just asked her.  I only knew it was a black BMW)  
 

My wife has a similar approach with cars. She'll mention someone having a new car, I'll ask what it is and she'll reply its a red one.

[oaksoft]

7 hours ago, antrin said:

No, you arsehole.

(being as polite as possible in dealing with downright lies)

you stated that brexit had nothing to do with companies leaving UK - it was all consolidation.

no company that hopes to survive troubled times for ALL the excuses I suggested (including the nefarious “consolidation”) can ignore the elephant in the room - Brexit.

it f**ks up their business plans and any need they have to remain in the UK. They don’t need what was once a useful EU base.

Brexit has prompted action.  Brexit has been the catalyst.

if you don’t want to be misrepresented, then don’t post vacuous, incorrect statements that need to be later corrected...  so that you won’t have the follow-up pfaff of having to clarify your earlier genuinely utter bullshit.

Blimey

I think you need to get out a bit more. What a state to get into.

[Kemp]

4 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Blimey

I think you need to get out a bit more. What a state to get into.

I've noticed Oasksoft clearly subscribes to the Boris Johnson school of tory recklessness.

If proven wrong, ignore the original point, throw out an insult and make a joke while (common) people's lives go down the shitter.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Oaksoft out mixing with the common people, stocking up on tinned food ahead of brexit.

https://goo.gl/images/JmGQt6

 

[antrin]

2 hours ago, oaksoft said:

Blimey

I think you need to get out a bit more. What a state to get into.

I had just been out.  

two movies, a great meal, complimentary cocktails (blood orange martinis) and a nice red wine.

i think my reaction was proportionate, given that you regularly post lies on here then, when challenged, claim you were misrepresented.

you lie. You get pulled up. Learn to accept the consequences of lying.

 

[antrin]

9 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:

I knew vw used to build in USA, Mexico and Brazil but never knew BMW built in USA and shipped back across to UK.
Everyday is a school day.

I just had a check and found this.

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/242740-trump-blasts-bmw-er-building-almost-50000-cars-us-sells-us

BMW’s plant in Spartanburg SC is their biggest production centre on Earth - and exports more cars from US than any other producer.

(in the discussion below the article there’s an amusing debate between a knowledgeable guy and Orcsoft, sorry... a Trump supporter. The logic is limited in this one. )

[Eric Arthur Blair]

Now Honda! 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47282603

f**k them. There would have been no tears shed in Wiltshire when production ceased at Linwood.

[beyond our ken]

3 minutes ago, Eric Arthur Blair said:

 

f**k them. There would have been no tears shed in Wiltshire when production ceased at Linwood.

Their factory opened 5 years after Linwood closed

But your right, F-em

[beyond our ken]

16 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said:

200% why should we rely on what deals the festering superstate gets .  Europe is 15% of the world market , through the WTO we can make our own deals with the other 85% that suit the UK .

I don't want my country to be part of a super state where the principle states in the Euro zone are either in recession or the verge of financial collapse( expecting us to bail them out) . The project hasn't worked . It is a suppressive , undemocratic regime . They know that when the UK leaves it will be over for them which is why they offer deals that are not deals at all . They have had long enough and it is time for the UK government to show some balls and go with a WTO deal. .

 

But the rest of the world is doing largely localised trade deals and forming their own blocs.  We had access (still have for a while) to the rest of the world through our seat at the WTO as part of the EU bloc, why should we go freakin penniless and jobless for years while as strike those WTO deals (except there are no deals, just the WTO rule book which we work with anyway)

And when did we bail out EU states?  And do you remember when the UK, still staggering to it's feet in the first few years of EU membership, had to be bailed out?  What's wrong in principle with helping other countries when A: they helped us when we needed it and B: keeping them stable is in our interest as well as theirs.

And haven't we been seeing, for time immemorial, a succession of politicians signing trade deals around the world on behalf of Britain? And how do we quickly replicate the supply chains our manufacturers have built up across Europe and around the world, built on terms largely facilitated by the EU?

You want trade deals with no strings?  They don't exist.  Any trade deal will impose standards and conditions,  India wants a deal with us, but guess what-they want unlimited migration to the UK for their entrepreneurs and students as a condition.  The US wants a deal, but they want to monopolise our institutions as earning streams for their big businesses.

 

You get F-all for F-all, the EU is not perfect, but it gave us teeth in a global market when this country was going down fast,  The problems in the UK that people protest-voted against in the referrendum are almost all created by internal inequality and governmental obsession with the south of england