St.Ricky Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 3 hours ago, Doakes said: It is difficult to imagine, unless you were actually in W7 at the time - that no one seen someone throw a coin, but that seems to be what has happened. Mattman posted before explaining that it's not actually a "group", more an area where like minded fans congregate to get behind the team. The group identity means that we need to be somewhat responsible for what goes on in W7, but it's almost impossible to stop rockets being rockets. As Stevey Thompson said, if you're the type of rocket that throws a coin - you're the type of rocket that doesnae care about consequence. On an unrelated note, think it would be great if we could get a big noisy section of the support together at Dundee. Open invite to stand with us and sing on the boys on Saturday afternoon. I'm sure the team will appreciate the vocal support Sensible post Doakes. I look forward to you guys being in good voice on Saturday with all of this stuff behind you (I hope). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, oaksoft said: Are you actually attempting to equate golf and football here in terms of hooliganism? You're making the point that every team has a similar percentage of idiot. Of course I'm not suggesting golf fans and football fans can be compared. But what sets football apart is the tribal aspect. If Celtic and Rangers had golf teams and a big enough crowd, they'd probably still find a way to turn it into a fight... Certain teams have an identity problem in Scotland. I'd include Celtic, Rangers, Hibs and Hearts in that list. I'd say that St Mirren's identity/brand is fairly positive. It's overly simplistic to just brand people who are vocal as troublemakers & hooligans. Don't get me wrong, not all of our fans are angels - but not as tribal as some of the mutants you get at other clubs. 30 minutes ago, TPAFKA Jersey 2 said: Don't be too quick to judge him Oaky unless you've been in a pub when the Kilmacolm GC bootboys face off against the Old Ranfurly Division. The Caldwell boys would beat the both of them, lets be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattman Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 57 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: Sensible post Doakes. I look forward to you guys being in good voice on Saturday with all of this stuff behind you (I hope). Ffs. Can’t make this any more clearer Ricky. STOP MAKING THIS A GROUP ISSUE!!! If it came from m3 would you blame that full section. Seriously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, mattman said: Ffs. Can’t make this any more clearer Ricky. STOP MAKING THIS A GROUP ISSUE!!! If it came from m3 would you blame that full section. Seriously That victim mentality again. Do you actually read what is written. Did you notice that at least one of your number has already added a like to that post. Move on. Edited November 5, 2018 by St.Ricky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Doakes said: You're making the point that every team has a similar percentage of idiot. Of course I'm not suggesting golf fans and football fans can be compared. But what sets football apart is the tribal aspect. If Celtic and Rangers had golf teams and a big enough crowd, they'd probably still find a way to turn it into a fight... Certain teams have an identity problem in Scotland. I'd include Celtic, Rangers, Hibs and Hearts in that list. I'd say that St Mirren's identity/brand is fairly positive. It's overly simplistic to just brand people who are vocal as troublemakers & hooligans. Don't get me wrong, not all of our fans are angels - but not as tribal as some of the mutants you get at other clubs. The Caldwell boys would beat the both of them, lets be honest. I don't think that people are branding those who make a noise at our games as troublemakers. Where are you getting that from? How often do myself and others have to say that we love it for it to believed? Genuine question. Why do you have that impression? Edited November 5, 2018 by St.Ricky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattman Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 16 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: That victim mentality again. Do you actually read what is written. Did you notice that at least one of your number has already added a like to that post. Move on. I give up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, mattman said: I give up. I mentioned this earlier, like trying to debate with a revolving door. Gie it up, it'll drive you insane, ya nutter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattman Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, faraway saint said: I mentioned this earlier, like trying to debate with a revolving door. Gie it up, it'll drive you insane, ya nutter. He would give paracetamol a sore head. Anyways onwards to Saturday! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, mattman said: He would give paracetamol a sore head. Anyways onwards to Saturday! Ah dear... the old ones are the best ones. Enjoy Saturday. I will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 33 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: I don't think that people are branding those who make a noise at our games as troublemakers. Where are you getting that from? How often do myself and others have to say that we love it for it to believed? Genuine question. Why do you have that impression? Right so Munoz said majority of Saints fans don't get involved in religious hatred. (I agree) Oaky said Aberdeen & Motherwell have issues, despite lack of said religious hatred. (partially agree) Oaky followed up by saying every club has similar percentage of people prepared to get involved with violence. (I disagree) I disagreed with that as I believe that violence is more linked to tribalism and identity, especially within Scottish football. I gave the example that Rangers & Celtic could follow golf teams, and still manage to fight over it. Summary: I don't buy that our fans are as keen to get involved in violence as Oaky makes out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 12 minutes ago, Doakes said: Right so Munoz said majority of Saints fans don't get involved in religious hatred. (I agree) Oaky said Aberdeen & Motherwell have issues, despite lack of said religious hatred. (partially agree) Oaky followed up by saying every club has similar percentage of people prepared to get involved with violence. (I disagree) I disagreed with that as I believe that violence is more linked to tribalism and identity, especially within Scottish football. I gave the example that Rangers & Celtic could follow golf teams, and still manage to fight over it. Summary: I don't buy that our fans are as keen to get involved in violence as Oaky makes out. Of course the ugly sisters would fight over anything but as for violence no. How many OF fans do you know, work, play, relatives. Do any have problems no. There is an element that obviously higher because between them 110000 follow every week ..... so 0.1% is 100 animals I hate what they both stand behind, which is one of main reason I never supported . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Just now, Doakes said: Right so Munoz said majority of Saints fans don't get involved in religious hatred. (I agree) Oaky said Aberdeen & Motherwell have issues, despite lack of said religious hatred. (partially agree) Oaky followed up by saying every club has similar percentage of people prepared to get involved with violence. (I disagree) I disagreed with that as I believe that violence is more linked to tribalism and identity, especially within Scottish football. I gave the example that Rangers & Celtic could follow golf teams, and still manage to fight over it. Summary: I don't buy that our fans are as keen to get involved in violence as Oaky makes out. Put simply. It is matter of opinion that can't be settled either way, at least in my opinion. I don't think either that you guys are as far apart on this as it seems. Over the years the pattern of violence has varied. Hence the renewed interest of the police perhaps in fan groups and I'm not just talking Saints Fans here. The one constant has been the problems around the OF and sectarianism in particular which extends slightly to Hibs, Hearts and Dundee. You're right, IMO, that Saints fans are less inclined to religious hatred. I know from experience though that the crowd at Love Street was often bulked up by fans of Rangers or Celtic when they were playing away or the other half was a visitor to our ground. Friends of mine of each persuasion would come along with me and still do in fact. Aberdeen had their casuals as did Hibs. Relative numbers might well be similar but not necessarily exactly so since other social and cultural factors might/ would impact. How statisticlcally important that variation might be, I don't know but these would be likely to affect the propensity to violence to some extent. At least that was the traditional view (The casuals messed that up). I go with the tribal thing. Our town, Our Team is Tribal. Sets out our territory and challenges others to take us on if they dare - but in a good way. Back to the noise thing. Each ground had a section where young and noisy fans often congregated and shared pleasantries with each other. Ours was, as you'll know, The North Bank of Aggro fame. Opposing fans were separated by wire fencing and gates. The aggressive posturing rarely led to trouble within the grounds but established the idea of young people - noise - aggression - trouble. Possibly some people still associate the noisy section with trouble and trouble makers, drunkenness etc. Again.. I love it. I love to see young folk able to get together, make a noise and share a passion in the right place, at the right time and without the need to insult others. Love of my team has never meant hatred of any other team or fans for me - but put Morton in the frame and I definitely want to beat them and enjoy doing so. Don't really know if this addressed the issues. I play golf. I have been on golfing trips. I played rugby and I've been on rugby trips. I competed in the heavy events in athletics and have been on Athletic trips. The capacity for nonsense existed on every one of these. But with golf you had to wear a jacket and tie and good trousers to get in. (I was a Ranfurly Castle member) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, DougJamie said: Of course the ugly sisters would fight over anything but as for violence no. How many OF fans do you know, work, play, relatives. Do any have problems no. There is an element that obviously higher because between them 110000 follow every week ..... so 0.1% is 100 animals I hate what they both stand behind, which is one of main reason I never supported . Perhaps violence is the wrong word. A higher percentage of stuck in the past, hate filled types that use football as an excuse to behave like animals. St Mirren fans ain’t cut from that cloth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmac Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Just stick up netting all around the ground, to (1) stop balls from hitting the empty seats, (2) stop some asshole from chucking their playpiece money at a player, (3) stop assholes from entering the field of play. Simples. Next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 STV news have it as part of their headlines , might mention Sammy getting them chucked at him as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callum Gilhooley Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 1 minute ago, linwood buddie said: STV news have it as part of their headlines , might mention Sammy getting them chucked at him as well. Good luck with that !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Lothian Saint Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Point 1. The person who threw the coin did us no favours at all. Point 2. Are the authorities taking this investigation as seriously as Ricky. Where is the said coin. Did any officials or police officers actually retrieve it and bag it for evidence as they do in any other criminal case. If they don't have the coin, it will be difficult to prove anything. If they do have the coin will it be deemed necessary to have it analysed for residual DNA or Fingerprints. If it is, what if ??????? YOU spent it in the pie stand and the culprit got it in his change before launching it at Morelos.. Could the police be coming to YOUR door soon. Just a thought. Anyone who gave the pie stalls coins better get their alibi's ready. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smcc Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 13 minutes ago, East Lothian Saint said: Point 1. The person who threw the coin did us no favours at all. Point 2. Are the authorities taking this investigation as seriously as Ricky. Where is the said coin. Did any officials or police officers actually retrieve it and bag it for evidence as they do in any other criminal case. If they don't have the coin, it will be difficult to prove anything. If they do have the coin will it be deemed necessary to have it analysed for residual DNA or Fingerprints. If it is, what if ??????? YOU spent it in the pie stand and the culprit got it in his change before launching it at Morelos.. Could the police be coming to YOUR door soon. Just a thought. Anyone who gave the pie stalls coins better get their alibi's ready. Care to have a guess at how many people's DNA and partial fingerprints they might find? How many people do you think might have handled the coin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Point 1. The person who threw the coin did us no favours at all. Point 2. Are the authorities taking this investigation as seriously as Ricky. Where is the said coin. Did any officials or police officers actually retrieve it and bag it for evidence as they do in any other criminal case. If they don't have the coin, it will be difficult to prove anything. If they do have the coin will it be deemed necessary to have it analysed for residual DNA or Fingerprints. If it is, what if ??????? YOU spent it in the pie stand and the culprit got it in his change before launching it at Morelos.. Could the police be coming to YOUR door soon. Just a thought. Anyone who gave the pie stalls coins better get their alibi's ready. It's in the match observers report so SPFL will need to consider it.Collum was there at the time but didn't do anything, choosing instead to book candy ass for an incident he most likely didn't see. He's always the centre of attention is wullie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smcc Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Just now, cockles1987 said: 500. Am I close GOK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hambud Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 Doakes Not a one person crusade or a crusade of any sort but if you feel it easier to paint it that way then do. It's just the right thing to do. As for the money Donate it to a Mental Health Charity of my choice and me a copy of the receipt. It will go to a good cause. You might want to refund all of the money raised... People did ask for a plan for spending it but it never materialised. But in future don't take money and expect that there will be no monitoring of what you do. You seem to find accountability difficult as a group and as an individual. PS... Already started a thread on the Dundee game. Looking forward to it. Should donate it to the prevention of cruelty to animals. Mainly to the horses you've flogged the f**k right out of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Doakes said: Perhaps violence is the wrong word. A higher percentage of stuck in the past, hate filled types that use football as an excuse to behave like animals. St Mirren fans ain’t cut from that cloth. In the context of one of our fans throwing a coin at an opposing player celebrating a goal, it's violence I am talking about. The rest of it is of much less importance as far as I am concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 30 minutes ago, smcc said: Care to have a guess at how many people's DNA and partial fingerprints they might find? How many people do you think might have handled the coin? The most recent fingerprints will be on the top of the others and will show less degradation. Of course if the c**t who threw it was smart enough they would have worn gloves and you'll see evidence of that on the coin in terms of smudge marks on previous prints. It's not particularly reliable but it's certainly should be dismissed out of hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, Hambud said: Should donate it to the prevention of cruelty to animals. Mainly to the horses you've flogged the f**k right out of. It's very telling that there have been more posts making personal attacks on Ricky for being concerned about than there have been posts actually discussing the incident itself. I think the ratio is around 10:1 in favour of attacking Ricky. Almost all of the posts from people in W7 are some form of personal attack on Ricky. Just saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted November 5, 2018 Report Share Posted November 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, oaksoft said: It's very telling that there have been more posts making personal attacks on Ricky for being concerned about than there have been posts actually discussing the incident itself. I think the ratio is around 10:1 in favour of attacking Ricky. Almost all of the posts from people in W7 are some form of personal attack on Ricky. Just saying. Utter trash. You disregard Ricky repeating his usual posts, contradicting himself and tying himself in so many knots the scouts would struggle to get him out of his predicament. "Attacking" & "personal attacks".......................................... Pointing out he should try to stop himself posting/replying to every post isn't attacking, unless you live in a parallel universe. These "attacks" would not have happened if he's made his point and let it go. Everybody is entitled to a view, disagreeing isn't really an attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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