faraway saint Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 Just now, Bud the Baker said: Circles! Indeed, no proof, just your desire to make 2 + 2 = 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 It's all a bit fishy, isn't it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 minute ago, TPAFKATS said: It's all a bit fishy, isn't it Disappointed it took you so long to appear. Tin foil hats anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 Disappointed it took you so long to appear. [emoji38] Tin foil hats anyone? Sorry, I was busy watching an interview with an ex kgb officer who was explaining why it wasn't Russian government operatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 minute ago, TPAFKATS said: 35 minutes ago, faraway saint said: Disappointed it took you so long to appear. Tin foil hats anyone? Sorry, I was busy watching an interview with an ex kgb officer who was explaining why it wasn't Russian government operatives. Didn't realise Jackanory was still on TV? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Blair Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/09/the-impossible-photo/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 Didn't realise Jackanory was still on TV? It was a news programme. The guy was interviewed in London and isn't pro putin. But I'm sure you know this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 minute ago, faraway saint said: Didn't realise Jackanory was still on TV? An ex American Special Services Colonel friend of mine worked in St Petersburg when Putin Was The Mayor. He helped teach Putin English. He tells me that Putin is a quote "very tough son of a bitch". Just another jacknory story. Easy to believe that he is involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 minute ago, St.Ricky said: An ex American Special Services Colonel friend of mine worked in St Petersburg when Putin Was The Mayor. He helped teach Putin English. He tells me that Putin is a quote "very tough son of a bitch". Just another jacknory story. Easy to believe that he is involved. Stopped reading after the first 8 words, realised you are, as usual, talking utter pish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 An ex American Special Services Colonel friend of mine worked in St Petersburg when Putin Was The Mayor. He helped teach Putin English. He tells me that Putin is a quote "very tough son of a bitch". Just another jacknory story. Easy to believe that he is involved. I don't disagree with any assessment that putin is an evil c**t.I'd just love to see some proper evidence that the Russian state were behind this absolutely shambolic amateurish event supposedly carried out by professional assassins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, faraway saint said: Stopped reading after the first 8 words, realised you are, as usual, talking utter pish. Not so F Man. Said to you before on here neither you nor others on here know who they are talking to online or what their background is. I have a number of Diplomatic Corps contacts from a number of countries. Came with my job. Helped to make it interesting. Edited September 6, 2018 by St.Ricky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: Not so F Man. Said to you before on here neither you nor others on here know who they are talking to online or what their background is. I have a number of Diplomatic Core contacts from a number of countries. Came with my job. Wow Lollipop men have came up in the world. Run along, you have no class, anyone who is anyone doesn't feel the need to broadcast it on a public forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, faraway saint said: Wow Lollipop men have came up in the world. Run along, you have no class, anyone who is anyone doesn't feel the need to broadcast it on a public forum. You questioned, I answered to illustrate your innacurracy. Nothing special, Just part of the job Ihad. Meant that I met Ambassors, Console and ofcicialsboth at work and socially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Arthur Blair Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: Meant that I met Ambassors... How were the Ferrero Rocher? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 minute ago, Eric Arthur Blair said: How were the Ferrero Rocher? Conspicuous by their absence. But the Embassy parties were good. Also safest place to be in town as you had a horde of diplomatic police attend, block off roads etc They are armed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linwood buddie Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 2 hours ago, faraway saint said: It's called making 2 + 2 = 5 or make it suit whatever you choose to believe. They say the" Truth is out there". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 2 hours ago, Bud the Baker said: We have different opinions, there's nothing to confirm either as factual. Only one of us, however, has misinterpreted the statement 2 + 2 =5. Actually I am not convinced either of you really understands it. It's about whether an assertion can be deemed true simply by enough people believing it to be true. Witches, religion and conspiracy theories are all examples of this. The first two leading to countless millions of deaths. I see it as evidence that humans inherently lack intelligence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Eric Arthur Blair said: https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/09/the-impossible-photo/ The backgrounds on both those photos are not the same. There are differences in the background fixtures and fittings. Given that the camera would be stationary this should kill any conspiracy stone dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 1 hour ago, St.Ricky said: An ex American Special Services Colonel friend of mine worked in St Petersburg when Putin Was The Mayor. He helped teach Putin English. He tells me that Putin is a quote "very tough son of a bitch". Just another jacknory story. Easy to believe that he is involved. When you said you were an International Business Consultant, did you really mean International Man of Mystery. By the way, either you or your friend are bullshitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybee Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 9 minutes ago, oaksoft said: Actually I am not convinced either of you really understands it. It's about whether an assertion can be deemed true simply by enough people believing it to be true. Witches, religion and conspiracy theories are all examples of this. The first two leading to countless millions of deaths. I see it as evidence that humans inherently lack intelligence. Apologies for butting in .......... BUT! truth cannot possibly be defined by the number of people who believe something, either it is true or it is not. you really cannot compare what someone believes through Faith to what is factual scientifically and yes you are right there were and still are countless deaths caused because of this. The people that 'inherently lack intelligence.' here are those that believe this guff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 1 minute ago, jaybee said: Apologies for butting in .......... BUT! truth cannot possibly be defined by the number of people who believe something, either it is true or it is not. you really cannot compare what someone believes through Faith to what is factual scientifically and yes you are right there were and still are countless deaths caused because of this. The people that 'inherently lack intelligence.' here are those that believe this guff. I am not sure if you are agreeing with me here or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybee Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 39 minutes ago, oaksoft said: I am not sure if you are agreeing with me here or not. I don't think I am, most certainly when you say ............. 'I see it as evidence that humans inherently lack intelligence'. Whether that is referring to the millions killed through religious wars, or even (I hate to use the phrase) 'ordinary' wars, but I am sure you get my drift. doesn't really matter which, it isn't to do with intelligence it's to do with doctrine, jealousy, greed, envy, ego and a multitude of other things such as emotions, yes even love, hate sex and god knows what else has been the cause of such as we discuss. But your phrase that 'an assertion might or can be deemed true simply by enough people believing it to be true.' is obvious guff Witches are not relevant today Conspiracy theories are usually mooted by those with a fertile imagination and don't usually cause too much trouble unless in the mind of someone such as Mr Trump from the USA and then perhaps it could grow more serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, jaybee said: I don't think I am, most certainly when you say ............. 'I see it as evidence that humans inherently lack intelligence'. Whether that is referring to the millions killed through religious wars, or even (I hate to use the phrase) 'ordinary' wars, but I am sure you get my drift. doesn't really matter which, it isn't to do with intelligence it's to do with doctrine, jealousy, greed, envy, ego and a multitude of other things such as emotions, yes even love, hate sex and god knows what else has been the cause of such as we discuss. But your phrase that 'an assertion might or can be deemed true simply by enough people believing it to be true.' is obvious guff Witches are not relevant today Conspiracy theories are usually mooted by those with a fertile imagination and don't usually cause too much trouble unless in the mind of someone such as Mr Trump from the USA and then perhaps it could grow more serious. I think you have misunderstood me. I am not saying I believe any of that. I am saying that this is the question put forward by Orwell. I added some examples of how that has manifested itself in humans including religion, witchhunts and Orwell is asking the question, I am just trying to explain what he meant. We can obviously argue about why humans behave the way they do. I think it's a basic lack of intelligence and I include all those factors you list in my definition of intelligence. The 2+2=5 thing was raised by Orwell but I think we are free to use that metaphor to describe other things which is what F Man did. The idea that if enough people believe something it becomes true is bollox but it doesn't always matter because if the consequences of that mass belief are terrible (like the once commonly held belief that people can be witches) then we have an enormous f**king problem and the idea of what is true becomes irrelevant. You can't defeat "believers" by reasoning with them because they have invested their entire sense of self in that belief. You may as well ask a "believer" to cut their own throat as to ask them to change their belief. This is the danger of what Orwell calls Groupthink. It happens everwhere. You even see it on this forum although the PieandBovril political forum is much worse. Finally, you say the witches thing is no longer relevant but that suggests we have somehow moved on intellectually. We clearly haven't. In the world, we still have widespread FGM, stoning of rape victims, persecution of homosexuality, the list is endless. All of these are widely recognised to be a problem of lack of education. That response was a lot longer than I expected it would be. I wonder if you get this sort of sophisticated discussion on other football forums? Edited September 6, 2018 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted September 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 The Masses Are Asses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 6 hours ago, oaksoft said: When you said you were an International Business Consultant, did you really mean International Man of Mystery. By the way, either you or your friend are bullshitting. Nope. After St Petersburg my friend went on to teach at West Point before establishing a career as a high level executive coach. Strange you should say Man of Mystery as my mother in law kept telling people I worked for MI5 and that's why I travelled so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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