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St. Mirren v Sunderland, friendly 21/7/18


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3 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

That's like saying we beat team A and team A beat team B, so we must be able to beat team B as well. 

Harry Davis signed for us as Crewe captain with over 200 games for one club under his belt - he'd also not been playing English L2 at that point. This big guy from yesterday has habitually spent one season and been punted on to the next club whereas Davis was an asset his club wanted to hold onto until the falling out. There is a clear difference between the two.

I'm not saying we shouldn't consider league two players, I'm saying we shouldn't be considering quite obviously shite league two players. For example, Scott Cuthbert has made a decent career in League Two. I'd like Scott Cuthbert because teams at that level generally want to keep hold of him as he's quite good. If a guy is playing one season at a club and being released time and time again, he's generally not going to be performing well enough at league two level that none of these clubs want to keep him. 

You mean like Martin Paterson playing for 8 clubs in the last 5 seasons and across 3 continents?

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That's like saying we beat team A and team A beat team B, so we must be able to beat team B as well. 
Harry Davis signed for us as Crewe captain with over 200 games for one club under his belt - he'd also not been playing English L2 at that point. This big guy from yesterday has habitually spent one season and been punted on to the next club whereas Davis was an asset his club wanted to hold onto until the falling out. There is a clear difference between the two.
I'm not saying we shouldn't consider league two players, I'm saying we shouldn't be considering quite obviously shite league two players. For example, Scott Cuthbert has made a decent career in League Two. I'd like Scott Cuthbert because teams at that level generally want to keep hold of him as he's quite good. If a guy is playing one season at a club and being released time and time again, he's generally not going to be performing well enough at league two level that none of these clubs want to keep him. 

Was it not his dad that made him club captain they released him as they deemed him not good enough but hey I never mentioned anything about where we signed him from I mentioned where he is now and talking about club history on judging a player if he’s suitable for us or not or even suitable for a trail.

Good you cleared it up now though we need only players that have spent more than 1 year at his last couple of clubs [emoji106]

Also 25 apps last year for them don’t think they would of thought he wasn’t good enough for them as although wiki isn’t always the most reliable it says He turned down a new deal at swindon.

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5 hours ago, buddies1877 said:


Was it not his dad that made him club captain they released him as they deemed him not good enough but hey I never mentioned anything about where we signed him from I mentioned where he is now and talking about club history on judging a player if he’s suitable for us or not or even suitable for a trail.

Good you cleared it up now though we need only players that have spent more than 1 year at his last couple of clubs emoji106.png

Also 25 apps last year for them don’t think they would of thought he wasn’t good enough for them as although wiki isn’t always the most reliable it says He turned down a new deal at swindon.
 

They released him because it was clear he wouldn't play for them again after his dad was bagged. Oh and because he had a serious injury, which prevented other clubs at League 1 level taking a chance with him last season. I'm quite sure it wasn't down to ability. 

Why do you think guys like Davis, and indeed 99% of players are signed without the need to put them on trial in the first place? Because they are clearly good enough and don't have to prove themselves at our level before being offered a deal. There is enough video footage out there on players these days that trials are essentially no longer needed unless it's purely as an exercise to prove fitness. 

Name me one successful trialist we've had in the past 15 years. We've certainly had our fair share as well. 

 

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5 hours ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

You mean like Martin Paterson playing for 8 clubs in the last 5 seasons and across 3 continents?

Exactly. Anyone who took a quick look at where he's been and what he's done since 2014 could see his career has been on a steep slope and he wouldn't even be worth considering for the level of football we're at. I think a few of us even said it before Saturday when we learned he was on trial. 

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16 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Exactly. Anyone who took a quick at where he's been and what he's else'sdone since 2014 could see his career has been on a steep slope and he wouldn't even be worth considering for the level of football we're at. I think a few of us even said it before Saturday when we learned he was on trial. 

Yet Stubbs in his wisdom still give him a trial, using up someone elses game time!

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Had a nice day and evening out on saturday only blighted by 90 minutes of pish in the afternoon. Shipping more than four in a pre season game to a comparable team is a point of concern. More so given how well the same players did a week earlier at Killie. That said it still only three games played, with a number of new recruits, and a trio of trialists.

it is the fact we are having to play trialists and newbies in competitive games of the poorly planned league cup, instead of a string of pre season friendlies which is highlighting how disjointed we look. Add to that whilst stubbzo is still trying to get new faces in he is having to play guys who werent getting ninety minutes in the championship last season, or indeed playing in it!

the big concern of having no goal scorers, or a solid backline is something that will make it a long, long  season if Stubbzo cant recruit some quality asap.

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In addition to Reilly, he’s told MacKenzie, Eckersley and McShane they can leave. Hippolyte has also been let go despite the fact we have no width or pace in the current team.

I’m not saying the new guys won’t get a chance or my support but Saturday should have been one of those opportunities rather than bringing in 3 trialists who were obviously not at the standard required.
Really sad to see Hippo go as I thought he'd do a turn for us in this league - not necessarily first name on the team sheet but perhaps more as an impact player from the bench.
But not to be - good luck to him at Dunfermline.
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17 hours ago, Macmackem said:

970 my mate and I were in there and never got the tickets from SAFC 

I would be extremely worried for next season if I were a Saints fan, our kids never broke sweat.

Rangers and Celtic will have a field day against yous

Every team will have a field day we will be relegated by Christmas. 

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10 hours ago, Kemp said:

Norman, it's not very difficult to grasp.

Anyone sitting in the stand could see after about 10 minutes that one of the trialists was utter shite and had no idea where to even stand on the pitch never mind what to do when the ball came near him.  We would expect our manager to have seen this in training as well, and not send him out for a first team game.  The worry is, therefore, his judgement is very poor.  It is concerning to be pissing about like this when the season has already started.

I think this is really the whole point. No one should have been sitting in the stands and the club should not be looking to make money out of a bounce game.... glad i watched the golf

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6 minutes ago, Isle Of Bute Saint said:

Fancy a wager on that ? 

Unfortunately can't afford it. But I stand by what I said if that's the standerd we have to look forward too then we are f**ked it was the most embarrassing performance I have seen in years. 

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31 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Had a nice day and evening out on saturday only blighted by 90 minutes of pish in the afternoon. Shipping more than four in a pre season game to a comparable team is a point of concern. More so given how well the same players did a week earlier at Killie. That said it still only three games played, with a number of new recruits, and a trio of trialists.

it is the fact we are having to play trialists and newbies in competitive games of the poorly planned league cup, instead of a string of pre season friendlies which is highlighting how disjointed we look. Add to that whilst stubbzo is still trying to get new faces in he is having to play guys who werent getting ninety minutes in the championship last season, or indeed playing in it!

the big concern of having no goal scorers, or a solid backline is something that will make it a long, long  season if Stubbzo cant recruit some quality asap.

100% a cause for concern but they're far from a comparable team. 

Agree with everything else said. 

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I’ve figured it out. The three trialists were gash, and have been told after one game to do one. It all seemed rushed, a panic. I know what’s happened. Stubbs wanted them in quick to have a look at them before Poundland closes its doors for good.

 

Boom! Boom! Mr Roy...

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9 minutes ago, pozbaird said:

I’ve figured it out. The three trialists were gash, and have been told after one game to do one. It all seemed rushed, a panic. I know what’s happened. Stubbs wanted them in quick to have a look at them before Poundland closes its doors for good.

 

Boom! Boom! Mr Roy...

I wonder how many of the other players he's already given contracts to would of been signed based on their performance Saturday as well. Worrying... 

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They released him because it was clear he wouldn't play for them again after his dad was bagged. Oh and because he had a serious injury, which prevented other clubs at League 1 level taking a chance with him last season. I'm quite sure it wasn't down to ability.  Why do you think guys like Davis, and indeed 99% of players are signed without the need to put them on trial in the first place? Because they are clearly good enough and don't have to prove themselves at our level before being offered a deal. There is enough video footage out there on players these days that trials are essentially no longer needed unless it's purely as an exercise to prove fitness. 

Name me one successful trialist we've had in the past 15 years. We've certainly had our fair share as well. 

 

 

We get plenty every year we see new faces in pre season training pics every year some get deals others we never ever see.

 

So what if Stubbs played a trailists in a f**king friendly too much needless moaning on this forum I’m concerned as most but will wait to see what squad he actually puts together in 2 weeks if he even does manage to bring anyone in.

 

Would you rather he done what jack Ross did last year wasted money on the likes of Daryl Duffy just offered him a contract who is very similar to Patterson Ross done a great job but also had his f**k ups in the transfer market and people saying signings weren’t good enough last year at this stage.

 

You can also look at it the other way how many players have we wasted money on that have just been offered deals that have decent cvs

 

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26 minutes ago, buddies1877 said:

We get plenty every year we see new faces in pre season training pics every year some get deals others we never ever see.

 

So what if Stubbs played a trailists in a f**king friendly too much needless moaning on this forum I’m concerned as most but will wait to see what squad he actually puts together in 2 weeks if he even does manage to bring anyone in.

 

Would you rather he done what jack Ross did last year wasted money on the likes of Daryl Duffy just offered him a contract who is very similar to Patterson Ross done a great job but also had his f**k ups in the transfer market and people saying signings weren’t good enough last year at this stage.

 

You can also look at it the other way how many players have we wasted money on that have just been offered deals awful that have decent cvs

Agree with all

 

However why did we take this stupid fixture...... ?

Play a closed match , don't let the public see a trail- You know what usually happens to them

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14 hours ago, norman said:

Sorry, how many trialists get offered a deal? You think it's normal for a trialist to train for a few days, play a game then get offered a deal? They are there on trail, the clue is in the name. They aren't deemed good enough to get offered a deal, but are given the opportunity to change the managers mind over a short trial period. We haven't replaced anyone with these trialists as we haven't actually signed any of them.

You have described, in the bold print, exactly the process to be followed when assessing a trialist.  Why would a manager play a trialist he knows is shite from his training ground performance in a game where serious contenders for a league spot are denied much-needed game time?  Unless you are somewhere other than the training ground yourself and just lobbed them into a game anyway.

 

Sorry, but this just seems like going through the motions to me.

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Just gonna stick my Brodie Helmet on and throw a hand grenade into this thread.   :toilet

Embarrassing as it was, if ever there was a game this season to get a doing it was this one, its shown where were at ( WAY OFF WHERE WE NEED TO BE)  A half decent result against Sunderland and we would have put the Spartans game down to just a blip,   better to get smacked in a friendly against a team who 14 months ago where playing in Englands top tier,  than going to Castle Greyskull in 3 weeks feeling a wee bit optimistic and getting battered 8-0. 

 

 

 

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As poor as the trialist Patterson was on Saturday, I did feel a wee bit for him. He was very isolated on account of Smith and Mullen being played in wider positions. I'm hoping this is something the coaching team will have picked up on, so it is possible that the trial might not have been entirely fruitless.

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9 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

I would sincerely hope that a scottish top tier team would be at least comparable to an english third tier outfit. If not the game's a bogey beore the season starts!

I thought Sunderland had a few very good players.  Numbers 8,9,10 and 11 were very effective going forward and number 6 strolled through the match. 

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I would sincerely hope that a scottish top tier team would be at least comparable to an english third tier outfit. If not the game's a bogey beore the season starts!

So far sunderland sold players getting around 20m for them and they have 25k season tickets sold

Aye we should be very comparable[emoji849]
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2 minutes ago, buddies1877 said:


So far sunderland sold players getting around 20m for them and they have 25k season tickets sold

Aye we should be very comparableemoji849.png

Were Sunderland in the SPFL set up they would be by far the 3rd best supported team. 

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