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Saints Fan Wants Compensation


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On 8/8/2018 at 1:35 PM, Lord Pityme said:

Actually Risk Assessments are there for venue operators/owners to do just exactly that "List every single risk" then... and this is the crux of the matter... take reasonable precations to eliminate/reduce the risk!

so how have the club eliminated or reduced the risk? I can't see any visible way that they have? No practice safety nets (used widely) for the warm up, no shooting into empty corners, and as far as I know no tannoy announcement/sign advising of the heightened risk before kick off, and perhaps at half time.

i think perhaps people are looking at this as 'hey... we're st mirren fans, it was an accident, get over it, dont claim against the club you say you support'..?

but is it any different to getting a hot drink spilled over you by the kiosk staff, getting hit by a swinging/falling item in the stadium, slipping on icy surface in the stadium, seat collapsing injuring you..? No, is the short answer, but because its football, and its a football he's been hit with, in a football stadium then thats ok.... 

if you follow that logic then being hit by a bike at the speedway, a Ferrari at the F1, or a Rugby player coming over the barrier and landing on you breaking several bones should be treated the same?

in this case all the club had to do was fix his specs.... jeez is that such a biggie?

lets look after our own, not pillory them because they got hurt and suffered through no fault of their own.

Aye, but as you probably know, you have to reduce the risk to "ALARP" ..... As Low As Reasonably Practicable.

Thats as open ended as you can get.

You could go your entire life and the ball might never come near.  With those odds being the norm at most grounds I reckon St. Mirren would have no case to answer.

In my opinion....:wink:

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I think there is quite a serious issue here that the club need to take heed of but won't until something serious happens.

The issue here is not during the actual match its pre match and at half time when shots are raining on goal in front of the kids stand.

The ball is being hammered and many times is flying into the crowd who are unsuspecting and not aware of it as it pre match and many are talking to friends etc and distracted.

I saw a guy at the Dundee game get a belt from a ball that Jeff King had hit. He was struggling for a good 15 mins after about 20 yards along from him was wee boy on his dads shoulders whilst his dad talked to a bunch mates. If that ball had hit that we boy on the face he was off and falling from quite a height onto concrete. 

Its the same every home game with balls flying in toward young kids.

So i personally think something needs to be done about it. At Parkhead 4 poles come up with a net and stop it. Many continental teams do the same.

Its not a massive outlay and may save serious injury or worse a life !

But hey as I say nowt will be done until it happens ! 

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16 minutes ago, lenziebud said:

I think there is quite a serious issue here that the club need to take heed of but won't until something serious happens.

The issue here is not during the actual match its pre match and at half time when shots are raining on goal in front of the kids stand.

The ball is being hammered and many times is flying into the crowd who are unsuspecting and not aware of it as it pre match and many are talking to friends etc and distracted.

I saw a guy at the Dundee game get a belt from a ball that Jeff King had hit. He was struggling for a good 15 mins after about 20 yards along from him was wee boy on his dads shoulders whilst his dad talked to a bunch mates. If that ball had hit that we boy on the face he was off and falling from quite a height onto concrete. 

Its the same every home game with balls flying in toward young kids.

So i personally think something needs to be done about it. At Parkhead 4 poles come up with a net and stop it. Many continental teams do the same.

Its not a massive outlay and may save serious injury or worse a life !

But hey as I say nowt will be done until it happens ! 

:lol:

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I think there is quite a serious issue here that the club need to take heed of but won't until something serious happens.

The issue here is not during the actual match its pre match and at half time when shots are raining on goal in front of the kids stand.

The ball is being hammered and many times is flying into the crowd who are unsuspecting and not aware of it as it pre match and many are talking to friends etc and distracted.

I saw a guy at the Dundee game get a belt from a ball that Jeff King had hit. He was struggling for a good 15 mins after about 20 yards along from him was wee boy on his dads shoulders whilst his dad talked to a bunch mates. If that ball had hit that we boy on the face he was off and falling from quite a height onto concrete. 

Its the same every home game with balls flying in toward young kids.

So i personally think something needs to be done about it. At Parkhead 4 poles come up with a net and stop it. Many continental teams do the same.

Its not a massive outlay and may save serious injury or worse a life !

But hey as I say nowt will be done until it happens ! 

Didn’t realise this was a new thing to football shots going into the crowd.[emoji849]

 

If you are concerned for your life don’t sit behind the goals.

 

 

 

 

 

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Guest TPAFKATS
I think there is quite a serious issue here that the club need to take heed of but won't until something serious happens.
The issue here is not during the actual match its pre match and at half time when shots are raining on goal in front of the kids stand.
The ball is being hammered and many times is flying into the crowd who are unsuspecting and not aware of it as it pre match and many are talking to friends etc and distracted.
I saw a guy at the Dundee game get a belt from a ball that Jeff King had hit. He was struggling for a good 15 mins after about 20 yards along from him was wee boy on his dads shoulders whilst his dad talked to a bunch mates. If that ball had hit that we boy on the face he was off and falling from quite a height onto concrete. 
Its the same every home game with balls flying in toward young kids.
So i personally think something needs to be done about it. At Parkhead 4 poles come up with a net and stop it. Many continental teams do the same.
Its not a massive outlay and may save serious injury or worse a life !
But hey as I say nowt will be done until it happens ! 
Reasonable post. Don't think it deserved the responses above.
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5 hours ago, lenziebud said:

I think there is quite a serious issue here that the club need to take heed of but won't until something serious happens.

The issue here is not during the actual match its pre match and at half time when shots are raining on goal in front of the kids stand.

The ball is being hammered and many times is flying into the crowd who are unsuspecting and not aware of it as it pre match and many are talking to friends etc and distracted.

I saw a guy at the Dundee game get a belt from a ball that Jeff King had hit. He was struggling for a good 15 mins after about 20 yards along from him was wee boy on his dads shoulders whilst his dad talked to a bunch mates. If that ball had hit that we boy on the face he was off and falling from quite a height onto concrete. 

Its the same every home game with balls flying in toward young kids.

So i personally think something needs to be done about it. At Parkhead 4 poles come up with a net and stop it. Many continental teams do the same.

Its not a massive outlay and may save serious injury or worse a life !

But hey as I say nowt will be done until it happens ! 

That's a couple of you now trying to convince us that a life threatening injury could result here.

Let's take the "saving a life" emotion out of this and use some evidence to guide us.

Very simply, what is the total number of serious injuries caused by pre-match and half time balls hitting the crowd over all Scottish games in the last 40 years?

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4 hours ago, Lord Pityme said:

Yeah everyone will have a laugh until a kid or someone is badly hurt, or worse.... its a known problem that is being ignored, and the victims are being pilloried for getting hurt.

That is what Public Liability Insurance is for.

The club has it right?

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5 hours ago, oaksoft said:

That's a couple of you now trying to convince us that a life threatening injury could result here.

Let's take the "saving a life" emotion out of this and use some evidence to guide us.

Very simply, what is the total number of serious injuries caused by pre-match and half time balls hitting the crowd over all Scottish games in the last 40 years?

Indeed and with no evidence, as yet, to back up these tabloid type posts. 

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10 hours ago, helpmaboab said:

Public liability protects the club, so injured party would be obligated to sue for compensation. That costs a lot of money so most won't go down that road.

These serious shots at goal warm ups before the match are totally unnecessary anyway. Lots of clubs around the world don't do that anymore. Simply relatively soft kick about exercises only and running and stretching to 'warm up' is all that is done. Ridiculous hammering shots at goal during pre match warm up. Lots of clubs around the world have no half time football by team squad, maybe kids having a mini game or penalties etc., and most have some form of half time activity to keep the crowd entertained. Local clubs love the opportunity to get out there in front of the crowd and show their stuff. Club just needs to have the will to do it. Good for the community also.

Get shull tae drive around the perimeter in his taxi waving at the crowd and handing out free taxi vouchers tae away games. That would be a good start.

 

The club is insured and there is a mechanism to get compensation if something serious goes wrong. By serious, I mean a roof collapse or a seat breaking and injuring someone. Getting your glasses broken by a stray ball when you CHOOSE to sit behind the goals should not even be a thing. That is my point.

You dont spend thousands of pounds on nets for "good PR" unless you have some evidence that it solves a problem.

I am happy to be persuaded over this but first someone needs to show evidence that this is a known and actual problem, rather than a health and safety fantasy. As I said, a few are so certain that this is an issue that they must be in possession of some evidence to back themselves up. Let's see it and we can make our own minds up rather than just making knee jerk decisions.

Most of this "health and safety gone mad" stuff is simply an army of individual idiots making stupid knee jerk decisions based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. On a previous page LPM claimed it was possible to list every single possible risk. He is wrong. You can't. Imagine looking up, yawning and one of the pigeons shat in your mouth and you caught bird flu. Should we write a specific sentence on the back of the ticket to warn against this?  The tickets would be the size of a bedsheet.

We don't need a "Duh" clause telling people they enter at their own risk because no reasonable person should need to be warned of such risks when attending sports events. This is not America.

 

 

Edited by oaksoft
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5 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

Why don’t they just move the portable goals to another part of the pitch away from the stand?

Decisions like this should be made based on footballing reasons or strong evidence showing a health and safety problem and not to avoid imaginary problems.

Edited by oaksoft
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21 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

 

The club is insured. That is my point.

You dont spend thousands of pounds on nets for "good PR" unless you have some evidence that it solves a problem.

I am happy to be persuaded over this but first someone needs to show evidence that this is a known and actual problem, rather than a health and safety fantasy. As I said, a few are so certain that this is an issue that they must be in possession of some evidence to back themselves up. Let's see it and we can make our own minds up rather than just making knee jerk decisions.

 

I can't give precise figures but spectator injuries at all of the clubs in the English Premier League, Championship and Leagues 1&2 totalled 963 in season 2015-6(spectator count 34,818,105) and 1,865 in season 2016-7(spectator count 35,818,919).     http://www.safetyatsportsgrounds.org.uk/sites/default/files/2016 - 2017 season injury publication FINAL.pdf

An analysis of patients referred to the crowd doctors at Parkhead in season 1999-2000 showed a total of 127 over 26 matches. Of these 27 were judged to have been taking advantage of the crowd doctors and to have no illness or injury related to the match. Only one of the casualties had been struck on the face by a ball.   https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/bjsports/35/4/245.full.pdf

 

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16 minutes ago, smcc said:

I can't give precise figures but spectator injuries at all of the clubs in the English Premier League, Championship and Leagues 1&2 totalled 963 in season 2015-6(spectator count 34,818,105) and 1,865 in season 2016-7(spectator count 35,818,919).     http://www.safetyatsportsgrounds.org.uk/sites/default/files/2016 - 2017 season injury publication FINAL.pdf

An analysis of patients referred to the crowd doctors at Parkhead in season 1999-2000 showed a total of 127 over 26 matches. Of these 27 were judged to have been taking advantage of the crowd doctors and to have no illness or injury related to the match. Only one of the casualties had been struck on the face by a ball.   https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/bjsports/35/4/245.full.pdf

 

Well that's a start. Thanks for this.

I did like the typo in the first table of the first link where they listed "injuries per spectator" rather than "spectators per injury". :lol:

 I would be surprised if there were in the region of 20,000 to 50,000 injuries PER SPECTATOR.  :lol:

At first glance, that first link shows less than 100 people needing hospital treatment out of 35 MILLION visitors and no details are provided about the causes.

The second paper is a beautiful academic paper detailing the exact injuries and like you say only one of them was for a ball in the face,

Edited by oaksoft
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