Welcome Alfie Jones

[MenstrieSaint]

worth noting is the fact that Alfie Jones signed a two year contract in August , so Southampton must see a lot of potential in him , if he were a dud , he would have been released

 

[Sweeper07]

5 hours ago, ged62 said:

Baird? As much as I like him he’s prone to a few costly mistakes yes only young but played long enough now. As for Alfie being on loan that’s the nature of football these days. What player stays at a club long term these days, not a lot so am happy if he does a job for us.

Unbelievable the negative spin Baird gets -    yes he tackled a player and the ball broke to another, who had lost his St. Mirren marker and it led to a goal against us. I realise you say you like him, but all players make mistakes and some of these are costly....

Our new Man Utd star didn't do much of a marking job for the Gers 2nd goal?

Captain McGinn gave the ball away in the box and it could well also have led to a goal against us - though luckily it didn't. He's not getting pelters for that

Kpekawa had a block deflected that could have beat Sammy but didn't.

 

etc. etc.  Baird is a player who have been loyal and chosen 1st pick by all the recent managers - there is a reason for that - He is a really good player (Not perfect, but still improving - but needs the fans to value what he brings too - the dull stuff like defending, blocking, winning the ball etc etc..) Personally I think the one area where he needs to improve most is in his distribution of the ball - but surely Stubbs can help him there ?

 

I have no idea what Alfie may bring - but like you, will be delighted if he contributed positively...

[E=Mc2]

7 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

Leicester City fans were saying the same thing when they signed N'golo Kante

I agree, and he turned out be a great Kante.

[Drew]

3 minutes ago, Sweeper07 said:

Our new Man Utd star didn't do much of a marking job for the Gers 2nd goal?

Right, I'm losing track. Who have we got from Manchester United?

[Sweeper07]

2 minutes ago, Drew said:

Right, I'm losing track. Who have we got from Manchester United?

Matty Willock - OR have you forgotten ???

[Drew]

14 minutes ago, Sweeper07 said:

Matty Willock - OR have you forgotten ???

Oh aye

[Cornwall_Saint]

I'm not too worried at the amount of loan signings so far. It takes more than one transfer window to build a team and Stubbs didn't have the whole window to sign players, or Jan onwards to sign up players on PCAs. Get the start of his team/plan together this season, keep us up etc, next season should see some more permanent options coming in. If Jones makes a good contribution this season we will be delighted. Good look to him on joining the real Saints.

[Wendy Saintss]

With regards to the view that loanees won’t fight for the cause in a relegation battle, I seem to remember Harry Davis, Cammy Smith and Rory Loy battling it out to help us avoid relegation just over a year ago.

I also read a comment earlier in the thread about Danny Lennon not liking loanees.

Apart from Goncalves, Newton, Dummett and McGowan obviously.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Back on topic, I think Alfie Jones will be a great addition to the squad, but he will need time to settle.
If we can eke out a few wins between now and Christmas, I reckon we could be a really good team in the second half of the season and folk like Heaton and Jones will really blossom. All we need to do this season is finish 10th then kick on next season.

The down side of this will be we need to rebuild the team as all the loan signings leave at end of season

[Wendy Saintss]

I was laughing because "highly rated" is a cliche - how many young players are not "highly rated" - I have no idea whether the guy will be good or bad just that the phrase is laughable?
Paying our record post-Bosman transfer fee for a player who is not an automatic first pick - now that is pish - as other folk are realizing. Heaton/Cook are the only Stubbs signings I've criticized and I repeat they were ego driven gimmick by Stubbs. 
 
 

I really don’t get your obsession with the v9 signings.

A number of the v9 academy players have earned contracts with clubs higher up the scale.

Both Hamilton and Dundee have signed v9 players. Indeed, Dundee’s signing scored against us last week.

In what way is it a gimmick?

[norman]

To say these loan signings don't need to try or have less to play for than a permanent signing isn't true. A guy like Matty Willock for example isn't going to play for Man Utd, he'll be released in the summer. This could be his last chance to get a full season of first team football under his belt and show he's got what it takes to make it as a professional footballer. Brock Madsen is also going to be punted by Birmingham, he needs to make an impression if he wants to avoid spending next summer scrambling around looking for a club. These guys are playing for their careers just as much as any  permanent signing. 

[Wendy Saintss]

The down side of this will be we need to rebuild the team as all the loan signings leave at end of season

Other than the ones that sign on permanently or join on loan again for a second season.

[whydowebother]

Welcome to our club.

 

I think if we are taking players from Man U, Southampton, Birmingham etc then it speaks volumes for having Stubbs as our manager for the clubs to trust him to manage them appropriately and also for St Mirren as the clubs & players see us as a good option to develop.

 

McGinn,McClean,McAllister,Mallan etc are products of St Mirren and Longwell, other clubs know we are building something long term.

 

These players are here to do a job and develop, we will benefit from this.

 

Wait till you see our next two signings also and where they come from.

 

[Dan Is The Man]

Unbelievable the negative spin Baird gets -    yes he tackled a player and the ball broke to another, who had lost his St. Mirren marker and it led to a goal against us. I realise you say you like him, but all players make mistakes and some of these are costly....
Our new Man Utd star didn't do much of a marking job for the Gers 2nd goal?
Captain McGinn gave the ball away in the box and it could well also have led to a goal against us - though luckily it didn't. He's not getting pelters for that
Kpekawa had a block deflected that could have beat Sammy but didn't.
 
etc. etc.  Baird is a player who have been loyal and chosen 1st pick by all the recent managers - there is a reason for that - He is a really good player (Not perfect, but still improving - but needs the fans to value what he brings too - the dull stuff like defending, blocking, winning the ball etc etc..) Personally I think the one area where he needs to improve most is in his distribution of the ball - but surely Stubbs can help him there ?
 
I have no idea what Alfie may bring - but like you, will be delighted if he contributed positively...

It’s not just Sunday though, is it? This time last year he was giving away penalties and getting sent off when we got thumped at Cappielow. He’s made more than a few costly mistakes.

The fact is he made his first team debut the same season as Morgan and Mallan, those lads as you know have gotten big moves away from the club. He hasn’t developed the way we thought he would and we should just accept that, he wasn’t first choice last year and won’t be this year when our squad is eventually assembled.

[Wendy Saintss]

I wouldn’t have thought that we would drop a forward to accommodate a defensive midfielder.

I would think it more likely that one of the current midfield trio will drop to the bench. Maybe not immediately though.

[Sweeper07]

8 hours ago, Dan Is The Man said:

It’s not just Sunday though, is it? This time last year he was giving away penalties and getting sent off when we got thumped at Cappielow. He’s made more than a few costly mistakes.

The fact is he made his first team debut the same season as Morgan and Mallan, those lads as you know have gotten big moves away from the club. He hasn’t developed the way we thought he would and we should just accept that, he wasn’t first choice last year and won’t be this year when our squad is eventually assembled.

Liam Smith cost us 2 goals in 2 games last season also - he did not get the pelters Baird got...

Last season when we won the league Baird played in 31 of the games ;  Mackenzie played in 14 and Davis played in 20 - He was the one fit all season and I think would have played more if JR was not trying to persuade Davis and MACK to sign back on.

Mackenzie also cost us a goal against Morton and  the 2nd goal against QOS in the game we came back from 2 down to win 3  v 2

 

If a forward makes a mistake it often does not cost us much - but it usually doesn't work out that way for defenders...  Give Baird a break and watch what he does very positively contribute

He is much better than you clearly realise... and still only 22 years old.

IF he has not developed I wonder why he is a 1st team player who has played in all our games this season - even the Premiership ones - keeping the new £75,000 Stubbs signing out of the team?

[Wendy Saintss]

My recollection of the Morton game was that Baird got sent off when trying to recover the situation after a Mackenzie mistake.

IMO Baird’s distribution isn’t great. The manager should just tell him to clear his lines rather than attempting anything else.

Stubbs must rate him somewhat. As a centre half himself I reckon he must know.

[Sweeper07]

7 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

My recollection of the Morton game was that Baird got sent off when trying to recover the situation after a Mackenzie mistake.

IMO Baird’s distribution isn’t great. The manager should just tell him to clear his lines rather than attempting anything else.

Stubbs must rate him somewhat. As a centre half himself I reckon he must know.

I played alongside a number of centre backs in my career - some not dissimilar to Baird - clearing  his lines is not the problem - he often does this well - it is the medium to long ball passing that he does not always get right. So he could win the ball and lay off shorter passes to guys nearer him and let them play the cutting passes and folk won't think his distribution is any sort of problem.

[Wendy Saintss]

I played alongside a number of centre backs in my career - some not dissimilar to Baird - clearing  his lines is not the problem - he often does this well - it is the medium to long ball passing that he does not always get right. So he could win the ball and lay off shorter passes to guys nearer him and let them play the cutting passes and folk won't think his distribution is any sort of problem.

 

Yeh, I agree that clearing his lines isn’t a problem. That’s my point.

 

Just tell him to clear it and not try the shorter passing.

 

Jack Charlton or Sam Allardyce would sort him out!

[saintargyll]

i hate Newbie interviews...they are all the same

Buzzin to get started...Buzzin 

[Soctty]

2 hours ago, Sweeper07 said:

I played alongside a number of centre backs in my career - some not dissimilar to Baird - clearing  his lines is not the problem - he often does this well - it is the medium to long ball passing that he does not always get right. So he could win the ball and lay off shorter passes to guys nearer him and let them play the cutting passes and folk won't think his distribution is any sort of problem.

His mistake on Sunday was to try to be a bit too clever. Like you say, clear you lines, don't try anything funny or just give it short to someone who can pass - not all central defenders have to be Alan Hansen...

[Soctty]

1 hour ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 

Yeh, I agree that clearing his lines isn’t a problem. That’s my point.

 

Just tell him to clear it and not try the shorter passing.

 

Jack Charlton or Sam Allardyce would sort him out!

I can't believe you're writing a player off just because he signed for Ayr...

[David Mc]

22 minutes ago, saintargyll said:

i hate Newbie interviews...they are all the same

Buzzin to get started...Buzzin 

What's it all about Alfie?

[faraway saint]

14 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

I was laughing because "highly rated" is a cliche - how many young players are not "highly rated" - I have no idea whether the guy will be good or bad just that the phrase is laughable?

Paying our record post-Bosman transfer fee for a player who is not an automatic first pick - now that is pish - as other folk are realizing. Heaton/Cook are the only Stubbs signings I've criticized and I repeat they were ego driven gimmick by Stubbs. 

 

 

I know, you have repeated it many times.

Gies a brek.

[Dibbles old paperboy]

3 hours ago, Sweeper07 said:

Liam Smith cost us 2 goals in 2 games last season also - he did not get the pelters Baird got...

Last season when we won the league Baird played in 31 of the games ;  Mackenzie played in 14 and Davis played in 20 - He was the one fit all season and I think would have played more if JR was not trying to persuade Davis and MACK to sign back on.

Mackenzie also cost us a goal against Morton and  the 2nd goal against QOS in the game we came back from 2 down to win 3  v 2

 

If a forward makes a mistake it often does not cost us much - but it usually doesn't work out that way for defenders...  Give Baird a break and watch what he does very positively contribute

He is much better than you clearly realise... and still only 22 years old.

IF he has not developed I wonder why he is a 1st team player who has played in all our games this season - even the Premiership ones - keeping the new £75,000 Stubbs signing out of the team?

... and no one is mentioning that it was a pretty horrible pass from Magennis - hit at pace and bouncing in front of Baird with a man on him at the time that played a part in Baird' mis-controlling the ball and losing possession just outside our box. If Baird swings at a half volley and doesn't get a good connection on the clearance he would have been accused of panicking and putting us under pressure. Magennis also gave away the free kick for the second goal and had a few other mistakes which led to some of the international Rangers' best chances in the game.