Welcome Alfie Jones

[WeeBud]

3 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

... and no one is mentioning that it was a pretty horrible pass from Magennis - hit at pace and bouncing in front of Baird with a man on him at the time that played a part in Baird' mis-controlling the ball and losing possession just outside our box. If Baird swings at a half volley and doesn't get a good connection on the clearance he would have been accused of panicking and putting us under pressure. Magennis also gave away the free kick for the second goal and had a few other mistakes which led to some of the international Rangers' best chances in the game.

Nearly right …….. I agree about the horrible pass but it was from Captain McGinn who also lost a ball doing a similar thing to Baird in the second half, fortunately they never scored from that mistake though!!

[Wendy Saintss]

I can't believe you're writing a player off just because he signed for Ayr...

Jack Baird had ample time to clear it.

I know this reply has nothing to do with your post but it’s all part of the same chain.

Simple concept.... [emoji12]

[Dibbles old paperboy]

1 hour ago, WeeBud said:

Nearly right …….. I agree about the horrible pass but it was from Captain McGinn who also lost a ball doing a similar thing to Baird in the second half, fortunately they never scored from that mistake though!!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45073311 it was Magennis who hit the pass to Baird - McGinn was in space less than 10 yards away from Magennis but he chose to play it all the way back to Baird who had Morelos on him.

[Callum Gilhooley]

6 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45073311 it was Magennis who hit the pass to Baird - McGinn was in space less than 10 yards away from Magennis but he chose to play it all the way back to Baird who had Morelos on him.

Im not a Baird hater , in fact i think the big fella has done well for us overall.  However , in my opinion the mistake was all his.

Watch the footage and stop it bang on 30 seconds when JB takes his first touch, Morelos is some 10-12 yards away and didnt even look like going for it until he saw JB  f**k up his touch. To compound matters, JB then tried to turn towards Morelos.. Jack had three touches on the ball , he could have launched it anywhere with any one of them. 

Mistake made , lessons learned (hopefully) we move on . COYS

[WeeBud]

13 minutes ago, Dibbles old paperboy said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45073311 it was Magennis who hit the pass to Baird - McGinn was in space less than 10 yards away from Magennis but he chose to play it all the way back to Baird who had Morelos on him.

Sorry Dibb's I stand corrected!!

But McGinn did still mess up a la Baird which was actually the point I wanted to make, he just got away with it.

 

[Soctty]

1 hour ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 

Jack Baird had ample time to clear it.

I know this reply has nothing to do with your post but it’s all part of the same chain.

Simple concept....

 

You've been on the forum long enough to understand how it goes, Stelios definitely led with his arm and deserved to go...

[Soctty]

1 hour ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

Im not a Baird hater , in fact i think the big fella has done well for us overall.  However , in my opinion the mistake was all his.

Watch the footage and stop it bang on 30 seconds when JB takes his first touch, Morelos is some 10-12 yards away and didnt even look like going for it until he saw JB  f**k up his touch. To compound matters, JB then tried to turn towards Morelos.. Jack had three touches on the ball , he could have launched it anywhere with any one of them. 

Mistake made , lessons learned (hopefully) we move on . COYS

Agreed. Baird has made mistakes in the past and always come back stronger. We've moved up a level so it will be more difficult, but I'm sure he has the balls to come back from this a better player.

[Super Stark]

On 8/15/2018 at 2:10 PM, Buddie Marvelous said:

Welcome Alfie- Great addition

Hopefully we'll be referring to him as Alfred the Great.

[Super Stark]

On 8/15/2018 at 1:50 PM, Maboza said:

Possibly, but what's the rest of the line up and shape?  Playing McGinn, Willock and Alfie in the middle and Magennis wide would mean either Mullen or Smith having to play on the left and the other being dropped. I can't see that I'm afraid. 

If he is signed as a Defensive Mid then it probably puts even more pressure on us to get McShane off of the wage bill.  I wonder if it also puts an end to any rumours relating to Polwarth from ICT.  

 

I can see Danny Mullen being dropped (if they feel Brock-Madsen is the better striker). That solid central midfield of S. McGinn, Willock and Jones might be a good tactic against the superior teams we will face this year. I don't think Mullen is going to trouble the likes of the Old Firm too much.

[MenstrieSaint]

17 minutes ago, Super Stark said:

I can see Danny Mullen being dropped (if they feel Brock-Madsen is the better striker). That solid central midfield of S. McGinn, Willock and Jones might be a good tactic against the superior teams we will face this year. I don't think Mullen is going to trouble the likes of the Old Firm too much.

I kinda agree you , but I think its very much a case of being in a position to play a very compact hard to beat team at away games , anmd being able to open up a bit for home games. 

[Bud the Baker]

22 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 

I really don’t get your obsession with the v9 signings.

A number of the v9 academy players have earned contracts with clubs higher up the scale.

Both Hamilton and Dundee have signed v9 players. Indeed, Dundee’s signing scored against us last week.

In what way is it a gimmick?

 

My real gripe was with the "highly rated" cliche and following on pointing out that in general I’ve been supportive of Stubbsy.

Is commenting about the V9 signings on a Saint Mirren forum obsessive? Anyway for every post I’ve made you’ve made a counterpost!  

***********************

Its a gimmick because players are being assessed outside of the factor that really matters - their onfield ability.

Vardy is an exceptional case and the programs the equivalent of BGT - all hype. My knowledge is not encyclopedic but the last player I can remember making the same leap from playing non-League in his 20s to Championship winner and international recognition would be Steve Heighway - so it’s a long shot on any of the V9 players repeating it.   

Did either Dundee or Hamilton pay money for their Showbiz Stars?

Given the massive squad turnover during the close season these were not the sorta players we needed - doubleplusso in the case of Heaton with the fee and three year deal.

Edited August 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker

[MenstrieSaint]

18 minutes ago, Bud the Baker said:

Is commenting about Saints signings on a Saint Mirren forum obsessive? Anyway for every post I’ve made you’ve made a counterpost!  

***********************

Its a gimmick because players are being assessed outside of the factor that really matters - their onfield ability.

Vardy is an exceptional case and the programs the equivalent of BGT - all hype. My knowledge is not encyclopedic but the last player I can remember making the same leap from playing non-League in his 20s to Championship winner and international recognition would be Steve Heighway - so it’s a long shot on any of the V9 players repeating it.   

Did either Dundee or Hamilton pay money for their Showbiz Stars?

Given the massive squad turnover during the close season these were not the sorta players we needed - doubleplusso in the case of Heaton wit the fee and three year deal.

Tony Book was actually 30 when he made the step up from Bath City to senior football and played 300 odd games , Stuart Pearce didn,t go senior until his twenties , Cyrille Regis was playing non league football as a 19 year old , Ian Wright was 22 when he made the step up , Chris Smalling 19 , so quite a few have successfully made the step up , probably loads more , In all honestly its a bit of a lottery because theres probably loads that get signed up , and struggle to make the step uip.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

I can see Danny Mullen being dropped (if they feel Brock-Madsen is the better striker). That solid central midfield of S. McGinn, Willock and Jones might be a good tactic against the superior teams we will face this year. I don't think Mullen is going to trouble the likes of the Old Firm too much.

Maybe, however Danny Mullen has come closest to scoring against the OF so far [emoji6]

[saintargyll]

I wouldnt be too shocked if Mcginn was dropped

[Wilbur]

5 minutes ago, saintargyll said:

I wouldnt be too shocked if Mcginn was dropped

Eh !!!

!!!!!

!!!!

Which one ?

Based on what I have watched so far this season neither of them should be dropped.

What is your recreational drug of choice, saintargyll ?? 

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

3 hours ago, Super Stark said:

I can see Danny Mullen being dropped (if they feel Brock-Madsen is the better striker). That solid central midfield of S. McGinn, Willock and Jones might be a good tactic against the superior teams we will face this year. I don't think Mullen is going to trouble the likes of the Old Firm too much.

It would be absolutely nuts to drop Mullen this a guy who scored two goals in his first game.

In the next game he hit the bar a bit of luck it would have went in.

We don't know enough of the big Dane yet his first touch when brought down would not have led to a goal in my humble opinion. 

However if we are only going with one up front I'm not sure the Dane is faster than Mullen hard to tell with one game. Surly we wont go to Aberdeen with one up front in a knock out cup stage.

[Bud the Baker]

46 minutes ago, MenstrieSaint said:

Tony Book was actually 30 when he made the step up from Bath City to senior football and played 300 odd games , Stuart Pearce didn,t go senior until his twenties , Cyrille Regis was playing non league football as a 19 year old , Ian Wright was 22 when he made the step up , Chris Smalling 19 , so quite a few have successfully made the step up , probably loads more , In all honestly its a bit of a lottery because theres probably loads that get signed up , and struggle to make the step uip.

To the level I quoted - playing non-League football into their 20s and going onto win medals and international caps only Pearce & Wright fit the bill.

Even if I give you Book it’s roughly a player a decade.

Edited August 16, 2018 by Bud the Baker

[Isle Of Bute Saint]

44 minutes ago, saintargyll said:

I wouldnt be too shocked if Mcginn was dropped

You can get the first eye test free. 

[saintargyll]

8 hours ago, Wilbur said:

Eh !!!

!!!!!

!!!!

Which one ?

Based on what I have watched so far this season neither of them should be dropped.

What is your recreational drug of choice, saintargyll ?? 

 

8 hours ago, Isle Of Bute Saint said:

You can get the first eye test free. 

yes i know it sounds crazy and thats why i said "not too shocked" because if Stubbs wants 2 centre mids... i get the feeling he will pick Jones and Willock 

of course there are other options...3 centre backs to which Jones would play and have both McGinns in a 5 midfield( Coulson and Mcginn as flying wing backs)

It just depends what Stubbs does but the good thing is that we are building a team that has options which can be changed during a game

[Maboza]

13 hours ago, Super Stark said:

I can see Danny Mullen being dropped (if they feel Brock-Madsen is the better striker). That solid central midfield of S. McGinn, Willock and Jones might be a good tactic against the superior teams we will face this year. I don't think Mullen is going to trouble the likes of the Old Firm too much.

Even if Mullen were to be dropped in that formation - it would still mean playing either Smith or Magennis on their unfavoured left-side and the other on the right.  I'm not sure that's a great idea after seeing how Smith's threat was nullified playing wide in the League Cup games. 

It'll certainly be interesting to the see the team selection and way we shape up in the next couple of matches. 

[Maboza]

1 hour ago, saintargyll said:

 

yes i know it sounds crazy and thats why i said "not too shocked" because if Stubbs wants 2 centre mids... i get the feeling he will pick Jones and Willock 

of course there are other options...3 centre backs to which Jones would play and have both McGinns in a 5 midfield( Coulson and Mcginn as flying wing backs)

It just depends what Stubbs does but the good thing is that we are building a team that has options which can be changed during a game

Can't see any chance of McGinn being dropped. 

He's the only one in the team offering any sort of leadership.  

Willock looks like he's still building fitness and will take time to grow into this season. If Alfie Jones is a cut-above the rest then I'd guess it would be a lot more chance of Willock being sacrificed than McGinn. 

[Wendy Saintss]

12 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

My real gripe was with the "highly rated" cliche and following on pointing out that in general I’ve been supportive of Stubbsy.

Is commenting about the V9 signings on a Saint Mirren forum obsessive? Anyway for every post I’ve made you’ve made a counterpost!  

***********************

Its a gimmick because players are being assessed outside of the factor that really matters - their onfield ability.

Vardy is an exceptional case and the programs the equivalent of BGT - all hype. My knowledge is not encyclopedic but the last player I can remember making the same leap from playing non-League in his 20s to Championship winner and international recognition would be Steve Heighway - so it’s a long shot on any of the V9 players repeating it.   

Did either Dundee or Hamilton pay money for their Showbiz Stars?

Given the massive squad turnover during the close season these were not the sorta players we needed - doubleplusso in the case of Heaton with the fee and three year deal.

But we're not asking these guys to make the leap from non league football to being a Championship winner and international. We're asking them to take the "leap" to playing in Scotland!

A third tier English side just beat us 6-0 on our own ground the other week. Its not the massive leap you are making out. Aberdeen's main striker this season was playing 6th tier English football 2 years ago and 5th tier last season.

As for onfield ability, its onfield ability that gets you into the v9 academy in the first place. They don't just let in anyone and everyone. Its nothing like BGT.

The first player to get a pro contract from v9 was 27 year old Danny Newton who scored 14 goals in League 2 last season, and he'd never played league football in his career.

As for paying money, Hamilton paid an 'undisclosed fee' for Alex Penny from Peterborough (who he had joined for a fee after being at v9 the season before) and again for Mickel Miller from Carshalton (who were in the 8th tier of English football). I'm relaxed with paying £75k for a player on a 3 year deal. We've wasted that sort of money on just wages for a single player  for a season on countless occasions.

[Wendy Saintss]

13 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

To the level I quoted - playing non-League football into their 20s and going onto win medals and international caps only Pearce & Wright fit the bill.

Even if I give you Book it’s roughly a player a decade.

So, unless a player we sign turns out to be as good as Pearce & Wright then its not worth it?

That rules us out from signing just about anyone from any standard of football then!

A quick google throws up former non league players such as Ricky Lambert, Charlie Austin, Jimmy Bullard, Chris Smalling, Kevin Phillips, Grant Holt, Troy Deeney & Gary Hooper plus Gareth McAuley who didn't turn pro until the age of 24 and didn't reach the Premier League until the age of 31.

And these are the just the guys who reached the top. There will be countless players who reached a standard equivalent to St. Mirren's level!

 

Edited August 17, 2018 by Wendy Saintss

[Jack the lad]

Anyway, when we gonna see some more of Stubb's marquee signings Heaton and Cooke?

[Danny]

14 hours ago, Bud the Baker said:

To the level I quoted - playing non-League football into their 20s and going onto win medals and international caps only Pearce & Wright fit the bill.

Even if I give you Book it’s roughly a player a decade.

And one Frank Macavennie

 

Also Lex Richardson was late developer