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Stubbs putting the boot in


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Just now, TPAFKA Jersey 2 said:

And I think you’re failing to recognise that our recent run of form stretches further back than the last 5 games.

How far back? 

Selective games?

Isn't the season over a season? 

I have acknowledged we have had some good results, without focusing on our, IMO, fortune in a couple of last gasp goals.

Performance wise, which is secondary in our position, we have been poor.

Tonight, against a team from a lower league, we were, at best, equal, despite many half-wits predicting we would walk it.

Stubbs has been discussed to death, except for some who choose to revert back for fecking ever and ever.

Kearney is the manager, has been for 34 league games and he, along with the players, are responsible for our current situation. 

 

 

 

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Guest TPAFKATS
 

Whatever happens to St Mirren in their Premiership play-off against Dundee United, Alan Stubbs doesn’t believe he can be blamed for the fact that their top-flight status is on the line at Tannadice tonight and in Sunday’s Paisley second leg.

The Liverpudlian is more than willing to lay the blame for where it all went wrong for him at the club, though.

The former Hibernian manager lasted only three months at St Mirren, during which time he took charge of only four league matches. Yet, Oran Kearney is considered to have performed a salvage operation, despite taking over with the team 10th and ultimately finishing 11th. The Irishman is presented as having taken over a club at which a toxic atmosphere had taken root amidst a summer recruitment drive that backfired spectacularly. Stubbs signed 13 players of whom Cody Cooke is the only one remaining.

The hat-trick netted by the striker in the win over Dundee last Saturday – a result which didn’t allow Saints to overtake Hamilton in the scrap to avoid the play-offs – made for about the first time anything positive has been said about a player brought in by Stubbs.

Given the expectations and governance of chairman Gordon Scott and chief executive Tony Fitzpatrick and the suggestions that he presided over widespread dressing room unrest after he gutted the squad which had claimed the Championship under Jack Ross, Stubbs believes he has been the victim of what amounts to a smear campaign.

The 47-year-old claims the “unrest” charge” is a “complete lie” levelled at him by Scott simply because he told Adam Eckersley and Gary McKenzie
at the club’s pre-season training camp in La Manga that he didn’t see them being given much game time in his reshaped team. An accusation as unfair, he contends, as making his signings “an excuse” for the club’s league form.

“I’m not really interested in throwing mud but, at the time, I thought they were used as scapegoats,” said Stubbs, speaking yesterday as he promoted BT Sport’s coverage of the play-offs.

“[The fact they are gone] tells you about what a couple of individuals were saying to the board. We’ll see at the end of the season whether the board were right in sticking with them – or not. What I did was completely separate from what is happening now. Completely. I think people got blinded by the size of the task because they’d come up. I remember speaking to one St Mirren fan, well connected in football, and he said potentially only three of the squad I inherited were good enough.

“You look at the chairman and even Tony. One was 
saying top six, one was saying top four.

“Great to have your head in the clouds but to actually sit down and evaluate where you are and then say that, I found it baffling.

“I had Hibs in the Championship and, seeing the quality I had in that team in terms of individuals, I have to be honest these players weren’t at that level and that’s why I knew this was going to be difficult.

“Some of the players I brought in didn’t work out but those are the gambles you have to take when you are working to the level of wages.

“I can’t talk figures but the 
figures weren’t big.

“More often than not, the level of budget will dictate roughly where you are, give or take a place or two.

“When St Mirren came up they had a style. To be honest, I think Jack knew what he was leaving [when he went to Sunderland]. I spoke to Jack – not before I took the job, after I took the job – and he told me about some situations. I’m not going to go into it because that’s a private situation but after the phone call I thought: “Oh dear”. Jack was very honest with me. So I knew it was always going to be difficult, but I am not bitter and twisted. I wish them all the best. If they stay up, fantastic. I have got no animosity to them whatsoever. I could have. But I haven’t.”

 

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/sacked-alan-stubbs-says-st-mirren-expected-far-too-much-after-promotion-1-4932783

(Bit in bold) - Wonder if Steve Clarke said that when he arrived at Killie... "the team is pish so we're probably going down", sure sign of a great man manager  [emoji38] 

 

 

A more accurate quote from him would've been

"I had hibs in the championship with a squad of what I consider to have been better players and twice failed to get them promoted "

 

 

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27 minutes ago, faraway saint said:

How far back? 

Selective games?

Isn't the season over a season? 

I have acknowledged we have had some good results, without focusing on our, IMO, fortune in a couple of last gasp goals.

Performance wise, which is secondary in our position, we have been poor.

Tonight, against a team from a lower league, we were, at best, equal, despite many half-wits predicting we would walk it.

Stubbs has been discussed to death, except for some who choose to revert back for fecking ever and ever.

Kearney is the manager, has been for 34 league games and he, along with the players, are responsible for our current situation. 

 

 

 

Struggling to disagree with most of what you say, but it would be silly not to recognise that after Kearney had his own window, we have been considerably better. You have to agree with that.

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3 minutes ago, TPAFKA Jersey 2 said:

Struggling to disagree with most of what you say, but it would be silly not to recognise that after Kearney had his own window, we have been considerably better. You have to agree with that.

Better than what?

He had plenty of games to improve the squad he inherited.

We ended up 11th, in a league that has possibly, I'll check tomorrow, with the worst 3 teams for a considerable time.

It's all relative and as usual many focus on selective points.

The only thing that matters now is we scrape through.

Will it be enough to convince me Kearney is good enough, nope. 

Again, finding us in this 50/50 situation isn't a success IMO.

If we survive that will be seen as enough for some, I would be happier to be sitting back watching Hamilton fighting for survival rather than us. 

There's a lot riding on one game. 

 

 

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Struggling to disagree with most of what you say, but it would be silly not to recognise that after Kearney had his own window, we have been considerably better. You have to agree with that.


Considerably better than the 4 games Stubbs got? Two of which were away at Ibrox and Tynecastle!

And despite OK getting his window, it turns out that only 2 of his outfield signings made the line up last night, one of them being Kyle McAllister, who was with us before anyway!

Despite getting his window, it turns out that his best side is more or less the players he inherited from Stubbs!

All he did was chop and change some of the fringe players.... including getting shot of Cammy Smith who a numbers of zoomers on here had a complete meltdown about when Stubbs tried to get rid! Turns out he’s not even good enough for Dundee Utd!

The anti Stubbs brigade should hang their heads in shame. Wallopers the lot of them!
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3 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

Stubbs was treated shamefully.

Sacked after just 4 games and here we are, in exactly the same position with more or less the same side.

Only a complete roaster can defend that.
 

 

3 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 


Considerably better than the 4 games Stubbs got? Two of which were away at Ibrox and Tynecastle!

And despite OK getting his window, it turns out that only 2 of his outfield signings made the line up last night, one of them being Kyle McAllister, who was with us before anyway!

Despite getting his window, it turns out that his best side is more or less the players he inherited from Stubbs!

All he did was chop and change some of the fringe players.... including getting shot of Cammy Smith who a numbers of zoomers on here had a complete meltdown about when Stubbs tried to get rid! Turns out he’s not even good enough for Dundee Utd!

The anti Stubbs brigade should hang their heads in shame. Wallopers the lot of them!

 

Give it a rest Allan :D

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5 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 


Considerably better than the 4 games Stubbs got? Two of which were away at Ibrox and Tynecastle!

And despite OK getting his window, it turns out that only 2 of his outfield signings made the line up last night, one of them being Kyle McAllister, who was with us before anyway!

Despite getting his window, it turns out that his best side is more or less the players he inherited from Stubbs!

All he did was chop and change some of the fringe players.... including getting shot of Cammy Smith who a numbers of zoomers on here had a complete meltdown about when Stubbs tried to get rid! Turns out he’s not even good enough for Dundee Utd!

The anti Stubbs brigade should hang their heads in shame. Wallopers the lot of them!

If Stubbs had had his way MacKenzie, Baird, Flynn and Stephen McGinn would have been out the door. And considering the quality of signings he did make we would not have had Hladky and Popescu. So in last night's formation we would have had Danny Rogers in goal, a back three of Jones, Heaton and Kpekawa with Willock and Edwards playing in midfield. However we would not have been at Tannadice last night as we would have already been relegated.

Edited by Sonny
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See the people who defend Stubbs on here... do they actually go to games ? That 4 games sacked pish annoys the life out me... that bedfred cup run was shambolic. If getting taught a lesson by Spartans at home is what you call a sign of a good manager then deary me! Still not 100 percent convinced on Kearny but he is night and day to that muppet we had before. 

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4 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 


Considerably better than the 4 games Stubbs got? Two of which were away at Ibrox and Tynecastle!

And despite OK getting his window, it turns out that only 2 of his outfield signings made the line up last night, one of them being Kyle McAllister, who was with us before anyway!

Despite getting his window, it turns out that his best side is more or less the players he inherited from Stubbs!

All he did was chop and change some of the fringe players.... including getting shot of Cammy Smith who a numbers of zoomers on here had a complete meltdown about when Stubbs tried to get rid! Turns out he’s not even good enough for Dundee Utd!

The anti Stubbs brigade should hang their heads in shame. Wallopers the lot of them!

 

I’m not comparing him to Stubbs. You are. I’m just saying that we have improved since he was able to sign his own players. 

And why do you selectively choose to say “outfield” players just so you can exclude Hladky, one of the fundamental reasons for our improved performances. In fact the 3 players, Hladky, Popescu and McAllister can all share in a huge part of the credit for our improvement.

 

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I’m not comparing him to Stubbs. You are. I’m just saying that we have improved since he was able to sign his own players. 
And why do you selectively choose to say “outfield” players just so you can exclude Hladky, one of the fundamental reasons for our improved performances. In fact the 3 players, Hladky, Popescu and McAllister can all share in a huge part of the credit for our improvement.
 


I never said you were!

He HAD to sign the keeper cos Samson left!

Gus found him anyway!

All OK has done is bring in a centre half, again, whom Gus found!

And things haven’t improved that much. We’ve finished in the relegation play offs and failed to beat a side that failed ton win the Championship!

[emoji12]
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3 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 

 


So shambolic that we qualified from the group, unlike Jack Ross the previous season where we were whipped 5-0 by Patrick!

 

 

"Whipped by Patrick"

Think you've got your websites mixed up again ball bag.:moony2

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10 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 


I never said you were!

He HAD to sign the keeper cos Samson left!

Gus found him anyway!

All OK has done is bring in a centre half, again, whom Gus found!

And things haven’t improved that much. We’ve finished in the relegation play offs and failed to beat a side that failed ton win the Championship!

emoji12.png

 

You’re so funny.

12 points from 23 games until the transfer window closed.

20 points from 15 games since then.

But we haven’t improved. 

😂

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11 hours ago, Wendy Saintss said:

 


I never said you were!

He HAD to sign the keeper cos Samson left!

Gus found him anyway!

All OK has done is bring in a centre half, again, whom Gus found!

And things haven’t improved that much. We’ve finished in the relegation play offs and failed to beat a side that failed ton win the Championship!

emoji12.png

 

Wrong. The European lads were all "found" by a company the club used. Gus had nothing to do with finding any of them.

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On 5/23/2019 at 9:19 AM, Lord Pityme said:

And here we are ready to fight for a playoff win, when the talk pre-season was of top six minimum. We all know the signings Stubbs made that were poor, we can now see the ones he got right. Its easy to swallow the board's fake news that it was all Alan's fault!

This board have let our first choice keeper walk away from a contract, and us then suffer horrendous form till Hladky got settled.

They let a coach walk from a contract who went to a relegation rival and kept them up at our expense!

They refused to meet the budget Neilson was looking for, but consequently spaffed over and above that in sackings, compo and signing two squads in one season.

they sanctioned all Stubbs signings. Now Kearney has two games to show he has it, and rumours are he's had enough!

the common denominator in all this is a hapless board who lets face it got bloody lucky with Jack Ross, who himself was keen to jump ship at the earliest opportunity, and seems to have given Stubbs the lowdown on the chaos at the SDA.

I know many will say "well Stubbs got sacked, he would say that, wouldnt he" but, just think about all the other decisions etc... and why we are no better off at present, save if we do United by Sunday....

such a shame you were doing so well, think you forgot to take your pills, depression has set back in, tch tch tch.

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22 hours ago, mattman said:

See the people who defend Stubbs on here... do they actually go to games ? 

No.

They're sad old farts with nothing better to do than try and get bites on a football forum.

I hope it makes them feel good that they trot out the same nonsense the BBC and papers do - that's the level of intellect they're operating at.

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23 hours ago, Sonny said:

If Stubbs had had his way MacKenzie, Baird, Flynn and Stephen McGinn would have been out the door. And considering the quality of signings he did make we would not have had Hladky and Popescu. So in last night's formation we would have had Danny Rogers in goal, a back three of Jones, Heaton and Kpekawa with Willock and Edwards playing in midfield. However we would not have been at Tannadice last night as we would have already been relegated.

Some say Stephen King, Bram Stoker and Mary Shelley are the greatest horror writers ever born but your post would give anyone night mares

Not even the Texas chain saw massacre, the exorcist or a date with Anee whiddicombe is as scary as that line up.

A Bram Stoker Award for Sonny.

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On 5/23/2019 at 9:24 AM, DougJamie said:

His phone has hardly been ringing apart from BT doing a token offer to cover a Hibs game. So reckon Saints/ Rotherham tenders been noted by clubs, however........................

On a day I want to be positive , I still think a lot of gas was farted by GS and Fitzy...................... Oran has taken 6 months to start delivering with a new squad, Stubbs had 9 games.

I dont blame Stubbs but he was clearly out of his depth , lets not forget Oran has a team around him, Stubbs error was his selection of coaches and players.............. and the fact he never related to the fans.....................

If we survive this, I really hope we curb our expectations next season, 10th is success ......................... 11th is potential failure  

 

I don't think anybody would deny that Fitzy is a fan, so to my thinking the gas spouted by Fitzy and GS would elsewhere be called PR, wishful thinking, or dreaming, it's what fans do! .......................   And as for Oran having had 6 months and Stubbs only 9 games, well! Stubbs dismantled a squad that was successful and albeit in the division below; nevertheless they were 'a team' playing together and playing well.  Stubbs disassembled this and brought in a selection of player who (apart from Cooke) have since been deemed not good enough and more to the point they hardly knew each other......... this is what Oran inherited, just think of the damage you could do to the infrastructure of anything, city, club, ship etc given unlimited access and then try to rectify it in the equivalent of 9 games?

I DO BLAME Stubbs, since to begin with; he obviously talked a good talk in order to land the job, but ultimately couldn't deliver, Yes Oran has 'a team' around him NOW and it did take him a while to get there; but given the constraints he had to deal with( moving players out and finding suitable players outwith the window initially) at least he did get there. And yes Stubbs main error was his choices in players and coaches, but given those are paramount to the job, he clearly lacks these essential skills, just as he lacks empathy with supporters, his 'social skills' definitely need working on.

Have to agree entirely with you on curbing our expectations, we do get carried away but then we are St Mirren, it's what we do.  ☺️

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On 5/23/2019 at 10:03 AM, Doakes said:
On 5/23/2019 at 9:35 AM, Kemp said:

How many f**king times do we need to hear this pish.

Allan, son, nobody is disputing the squad needed major surgery. The issues are;

1. The players you did sign were an utter load of shite. You know nothing about scouting and clearly have no good contacts - maybe just some guys who pretend to be your mate in order to cash in when they sell you aforementioned shite.

2. You have zero man management skills. In fact, you come across as an annoying prick that nobody would want to work for.

3. You have zero tactical knowledge. You couldn't beat an amateur side or a non-league side because your players had no idea where to even stand or pass the ball.

Look forward to a resounding chorus of "Are you watching, Allan Stubbs?" when we beat United and stay up.

I wish I could like this post twice

I did it for you. 😎

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23 hours ago, mattman said:

See the people who defend Stubbs on here... do they actually go to games ? That 4 games sacked pish annoys the life out me... that bedfred cup run was shambolic. If getting taught a lesson by Spartans at home is what you call a sign of a good manager then deary me! Still not 100 percent convinced on Kearny but he is night and day to that muppet we had before. 

Agreed, it wasn't 4 games.

The cup, selecting the Spartans game is a favourite, conveniently forgetting the Killie game and a 6-0 victory that saw us qualify for the next round.

Kearney was a favourite by many from day one, Stubbs wasn't.

Is Kearney night and day, a neverending debate IMO as we've ended up 11th, the only team below us with the worst points total for many a year.

Kearney seems a nice man, as a manager he's far from proved he's anything other than average.

He's had 34 league games and we find ourselves in a one-off game to save our status in the top league.

Hope to feck we win through tomorrow, dropping down is not a great thought. 

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45 minutes ago, East Lothian Saint said:

Some say Stephen King, Bram Stoker and Mary Shelley are the greatest horror writers ever born but your post would give anyone night mares

Not even the Texas chain saw massacre, the exorcist or a date with Anee whiddicombe is as scary as that line up.

A Bram Stoker Award for Sonny.

'Gary McKenzie been absolutely outstanding for St Mirren - best player on the park' said Tam McManus after the game.

 

And Stubbs thought that Kpekawa, Jones and Heaton were better!  Stubbs could not pick his nose never mind pick out a professional footballer.

 

Edited by Sonny
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On 5/23/2019 at 12:26 PM, oaksoft said:
On 5/23/2019 at 12:16 PM, Sonny said:

And why he took the opinion of a 3rd rate journalist about players instead of making his own mind up?

Yes, it's odd that he didn't already know who was up to the job of playing at Premiership level.

That tells you he didn't watch Championship matches so hadn't a clue about what he was taking on.

Then you have to ask why Gordon Scott didn't ask him about his knowledge of our club and playing staff or didn't have alarms go off if he DID ask and Stubbs flapped around with an answer.

I think the appointment smacked of two men (Scott and Stubbs) who were so desperate that neither was prepared to do the necessary prior groundwork (aaaargh forgotten the correct phrase!) to ensure the relationship would work. Both of them blindly prayed it would be fine in the end. That, IMO, is why we are where we are today.

Thank you for the benefit of your 'Hindsight' such a marvelous talent.

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On 5/23/2019 at 3:39 PM, oaksoft said:
On 5/23/2019 at 12:16 PM, Sonny said:

And why he took the opinion of a 3rd rate journalist about players instead of making his own mind up?

Just re-read his article.

He was talking about Chic Young as the connected Saints fan wasn't he?

Also, why is he whining about Fitzy and Scott having lofty ambitions. That was well known BEFORE he took the job and he still took it. He's not making himself look particularly good compared to guys like Neilson who clearly did their homework.

This is fair comment but disappointing if it was Chick Young.

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