Doakes Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 10 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said: On the contrary, I’m against nationalism Unlike you Are you pro Britain? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 21 minutes ago, Doakes said: I think politics is an absolute farce designed to divide us and distract us all from the fact that they do very little but talk a lot.... however, if we're "playing the game"...; If you're an SNP/indy fan - now is probably when you want Sturgeon to push for indyref 2 Assuming we get indy, my main worry is that the next big debate will be "do we keep the monarchy?", which results in a split between republicans vs loyalists, can only end well... If you're a Labour fan who supports "remain", you want them to use this opportunity to stop Brexit by any means possible If you're a Labour fan who supports "leave", well, you're probably not much of a Labour fan any longer and questioning where your loyalties lie If you're a Tory, you're probably confused and don't know what to believe They've managed to divide us good and proper .One of my many sins is that I lunch with some friends 4 of whom who happen to be Tory Activists. The four of them voted brexit party at the european elections. I asked what the local MP was doing during the summer break and was told that he was taking a holiday and then preparing for an election campaign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 20 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: .One of my many sins is that I lunch with some friends 4 of whom who happen to be Tory Activists. The four of them voted brexit party at the european elections. I asked what the local MP was doing during the summer break and was told that he was taking a holiday and then preparing for an election campaign. Do they talk about how much they dislike the poor over a bowl of caviar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 57 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said: On the contrary, I’m against nationalism Unlike you Can you good you goose step- Just asking ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 42 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: .One of my many sins is that I lunch with some friends 4 of whom who happen to be Tory Activists. The four of them voted brexit party at the european elections. I asked what the local MP was doing during the summer break and was told that he was taking a holiday and then preparing for an election campaign. I don't think having a lunch is a sin ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornwall_Saint Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Saints Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Wendy Saintss said: I was jesting in my previous posts, albeit, the benefits I outlined could well turn out to be true. The opposition are not united in their anti Brexit stance by any stretch of the imagination. And the entire pro Brexit vote does not necessarily want no deal. It’s been Boris’ plan to win an election all along. And securing a no deal Brexit or stopping Brexit isn’t going to help the SNP’s cause. It would be better for them if Boris won. Absolutely a no deal would help the SNP cause but a GE would be to them an opportunity to secure a big mandate for a further Indy vote and lets face it the Tories are going to be all but run out of Scotland seats wise if there is a GE (max 3 imo). I'm far from convinced Johnson will be able to force a GE and I now think the most likely outcome is a deal for a far softer Brexit although it can't be May's deal so the impasse ain't going away anytime soon. As I said the opposition are now driving the bus (assuming the Tories do blackball the rebels - seems suicidal to me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 MP Kenneth Clark saying this is the most right wing government in the history of the Tory party that's not even in control of its self. That is some statement coming from a Tory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Lab are going to crash in any GE, either squeezed by Libs on the Remain, or Tories on the Leave. They still have no clue what they are. Some Lab clown last night said they are Remain and they will go over to Brussels to discuss new Brexit Strategy ? Eh ?? 25% in the Polls and falling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 31 minutes ago, Isle Of Bute Saint said: MP Kenneth Clark saying this is the most right wing government in the history of the Tory party that's not even in control of its self. That is some statement coming from a Tory. Hmmm- Maggie was pretty right wing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Doakes said: Do they talk about how much they dislike the poor over a bowl of caviar? They are decent guys. The way they see things is different to mine and they know it. No caviar is involved. The local MP is tory. He has done a good job as a constituency MP but is unlikely to retain his seat. Reason.. His support for the party line on brexit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougJamie Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 5 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: They are decent guys. The way they see things is different to mine and they know it. No caviar is involved. The local MP is tory. He has done a good job as a constituency MP but is unlikely to retain his seat. Reason.. His support for the party line on brexit. My son is just moving on campus at Stirling for his 2nd year. Will he become a Tory ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 minute ago, DougJamie said: My son is just moving on campus at Stirling for his 2nd year. Will he become a Tory ? Somehow I doubt it if he isn't one already. I have so far avoided "contamination" Not too many miner's sons finish up in the tory party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy Saintss Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Can you good you goose step- Just asking ? You’re the nationalist and a Sevco apologist, so more your thing I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 7 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: They are decent guys. The way they see things is different to mine and they know it. No caviar is involved. The local MP is tory. He has done a good job as a constituency MP but is unlikely to retain his seat. Reason.. His support for the party line on brexit. A lot of tories can't win tbf... If they rebel, lose jobs. Don't rebel but go against the majority of their constituents, voted out, lose jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy Saintss Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 MP Kenneth Clark saying this is the most right wing government in the history of the Tory party that's not even in control of its self. That is some statement coming from a Tory. So nationalism = right wing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy Saintss Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Are you pro Britain? No, I’m not a nationalist.I voted remain and no in the referendums Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Question. If there is a general election will any party stand on remain as their policy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 Just now, St.Ricky said: Question. If there is a general election will any party stand on remain as their policy? The Lib Dems l believe campaign on that. They have always been unionist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintnextlifetime Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 38 minutes ago, DougJamie said: Lab are going to crash in any GE, either squeezed by Libs on the Remain, or Tories on the Leave. They still have no clue what they are. Some Lab clown last night said they are Remain and they will go over to Brussels to discuss new Brexit Strategy ? Eh ?? 25% in the Polls and falling A poll l saw put labour at 18% . You get constituencys like Pontefract which is labour and 70% leave they aren't going to vote Tory but l suspect they won't vote for labour Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornwall_Saint Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 5 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: Question. If there is a general election will any party stand on remain as their policy? Lib Dem and Green will. SNP to an extent but it depends what they put first, Remain or Indy. Either way SNP look in good shape to obliterate the competition as they did in 2015. Lib Dem and Green will do well in Remain areas elsewhere, but ideally they need to make a pact and pull out of constituencies to help the other for the sake of Remain. Likewise it wouldn’t surprise me if the Brexit Party aimed for similar with the Tories - but expecting the Tories to withdraw from some areas is questionable. The Leave cause would benefit from it, but Tory arrogance makes it unlikely. Something that’s maybe a potential problem with Lib Dem too, although I could see them at the very least pulling out of Brighton and Bristol to help the Greens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, Wendy Saintss said: No, I’m not a nationalist. I voted remain and no in the referendums So how would you describe yourself? A globalist? Would you object to sovereignty being more passed to Brussels in the future? If not, would you then a be a European Nationalist? Not having a pop, labeling like this has always confused me. You see folk use "nationalist" as some sort of dirty word. Personally wouldn't say I'm a nationalist, but I do believe in less government, and localisation of power Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Ricky Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, Doakes said: So how would you describe yourself? A globalist? Would you object to sovereignty being more passed to Brussels in the future? If not, would you then a be a European Nationalist? Not having a pop, labeling like this has always confused me. You see folk use "nationalist" as some sort of dirty word. Personally wouldn't say I'm a nationalist, but I do believe in less government, and localisation of power About 20 years ago I was amusing myself whilst working at a business school. One of my pet topics was Globalisation v Localisation. I was predicting a move towards people wanting to take more power locally and with this a change in both the political and social structures. Also in the way that individual topics, rather than idealogy would need different approaches to stakeholder management, a growth in the number of parties and interesting times! And I was paid well for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle Of Bute Saint Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, saintnextlifetime said: A poll l saw put labour at 18% . You get constituencys like Pontefract which is labour and 70% leave they aren't going to vote Tory but l suspect they won't vote for labour I think the Lib dems will become the second largest party. Edited September 4, 2019 by Isle Of Bute Saint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doakes Posted September 4, 2019 Report Share Posted September 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, St.Ricky said: About 20 years ago I was amusing myself whilst working at a business school. One of my pet topics was Globalisation v Localisation. I was predicting a move towards people wanting to take more power locally and with this a change in both the political and social structures. Also in the way that individual topics, rather than idealogy would need different approaches to stakeholder management, a growth in the number of parties and interesting times! And I was paid well for it! There's a lot to unpack there Is localisation the same as nationalism? Is globalisation the same as centralisation? Then of course, which is better for the population as a whole? My view would be - you can be proud of where you're from without being a nationalist - nationalism to me would be putting people you live with first, at the expense of other nations. There's probably a happy medium to be found where countries/nations/regions agree to help each other without battling for supremacy. But that's probably an idealistic viewpoint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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