FTOF Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 Just now, faraway saint said: As I've said, an easy decision as schools on Scotland finish mid/late June anyway. Scotlands schools were never going to start in June for that reason alone. I'm not sure August would be the start date in Scotland if that were not the case. The UK government could have altered the pattern of holidays for England. Another couple of weeks wouldn't have made a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 Just now, FTOF said: The UK government could have altered the pattern of holidays for England. Another couple of weeks wouldn't have made a difference. They could have tried, but I'd imagine there would have been a meltdown from teachers? Anyhow, it's not all about schools/teachers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenziebud Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 11 minutes ago, shull said: Get back to the old normal. What about living in the present your always looking at the old normal ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, faraway saint said: They could have tried, but I'd imagine there would have been a meltdown from teachers? Anyhow, it's not all about schools/teachers. I'm losing almost a week*, but I can see the bigger picture. Although, if I'd booked a holiday and was due back after the 11th, I might not be so pragmatic about the situation. Plus we'll get it back at some point. *We were due back on the 17th. Edited May 22, 2020 by FTOF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 1 hour ago, faraway saint said: Kids are already at school, do you live in a cave? People are already working, why should't other people return to work? Tell us, how long do you think kids should stay off school, not avoiding the damage that's doing to them, and when should people return to work, not avoiding the longer people don't work the already considerable total of people losing their jobs would go through the roof? Cannie wait for this. Oh, the WORST is over, get over yourself. The kids that are at school are there to allow the essential workers, some who are there saving lives, to go to work. This is crucial to keep those numbers that you keep promoting at a manageable level. Imagine using that as an argument. Those who aren't deemed essential should be furloughed until 1) the level reduces to an extent where the chance of a resurgence is minimal, difficult to judge, 2) A vaccine is produced, unlikely or 3) And probably most practicle, track and trace is up and running. The English route is purely to do with business with no thought for the workers. Even the observation of protective measures are only guidelines. That in itself should sound alarm bells. You do sound like the tories you're defending. If this goes tits up and there needs to be yet more draconian methods put in place for longer periods of time what do you think that will do to the jobs market? But, hey ho. Why not go the full hog and get the pubs and clubs open? We could have the equivalent of a measles party. You could supply the quiz questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, stlucifer said: The kids that are at school are there to allow the essential workers, some who are there saving lives, to go to work. This is crucial to keep those numbers that you keep promoting at a manageable level. Imagine using that as an argument. Those who aren't deemed essential should be furloughed until 1) the level reduces to an extent where the chance of a resurgence is minimal, difficult to judge, 2) A vaccine is produced, unlikely or 3) And probably most practicle, track and trace is up and running. The English route is purely to do with business with no thought for the workers. Even the observation of protective measures are only guidelines. That in itself should sound alarm bells. You do sound like the tories you're defending. If this goes tits up and there needs to be yet more draconian methods put in place for longer periods of time what do you think that will do to the jobs market? But, hey ho. Why not go the full hog and get the pubs and clubs open? We could have the equivalent of a measles party. You could supply the quiz questions. You expect the furlough to continue indefinitely? You'll be first to start screaming about the inevitable consequences that will bring. The level, as I've already said, is a tad high, but close enough that movement could be made. Despite you shiting yourself there's little chance, looking at other countries, of any real resurgence but keep saying it, it might come true. There's no evidence of any countries that have relaxed the measures even coming close to returning to their original lockdown measure never mind this scaremongering draconian methods. The "English" route will be in place here in a few weeks, how's that going to sit with you Braveheart? I'm not defending anyone, Initially I was pointing out how much of a cnut you are saying Johnson was responsible for killing people. As for your last few sentences, sums you up and I'll leave it at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 What are you wittering on about A "tad" high. was it a smidgen last week? Most other countries established track and trace before opening up slowly. BoJo and his cronies have lied all the way through this including the level of testing. they are now claiming that the track and trace will be up and running soon. is that a tad later than tomorrow or maybe a smidgen after Monday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) Coronavirus: 'Path still not clear' for Scottish schools to reopen https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52768706 Coronavirus: Key evidence on opening schools revealed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52770355 Quote However, there is much uncertainty throughout the advice. Edited May 22, 2020 by FTOF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 13 minutes ago, stlucifer said: What are you wittering on about A "tad" high. was it a smidgen last week? Most other countries established track and trace before opening up slowly. BoJo and his cronies have lied all the way through this including the level of testing. they are now claiming that the track and trace will be up and running soon. is that a tad later than tomorrow or maybe a smidgen after Monday? Was it? 🤡 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, FTOF said: Coronavirus: 'Path still not clear' for Scottish schools to reopen https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52768706 Aye, we discussed this with my daughter last night. The practicality of part time schooling is next to impossible for many parents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 21 hours ago, stlucifer said: The criticism shouldn't be about them changing their minds. It should be because they didn't think it through tn the first place. what fcukwit thought this would be a good policy given the current circumstance. Oh yes. The puppet's real master, Cummings. Sorry but I would rather have one person who made mistakes, listened to criticism and made the necessary changes than 100 people who claimed to never make a mistake at all and refused to budge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, FTOF said: Scotland (or UK) isn't Denmark. Denmark's lockdown started at the right time and relatively few lives were lost, compared to our sorry state. https://www.itv.com/news/2020-05-20/how-denmark-sent-children-safely-back-to-school/ I had to laugh at the thought of a school in the UK employing an extra 30% of staff to boost teacher numbers in order to allow the classes to be taught. You can't even get sufficient supply staff when you need them. Not.Going.To.Happen. Schools in Scotland will be back in August or September at the latest, whether we can "guarantee safety" or not because life goes on I'm afraid. What teachers say or demand won't really come into it. FWIW, I think a massive mistake was made not allowing this years students to sit their exams. That could have easily been down with social distancing and their papers could have been marked as normal. The papers could have been shortened to exclude material not yet taught. Instead an entire year of pupils are going to be hamstrung by their prelim results and the word of their teacher. A real shame. Edited May 22, 2020 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 57 minutes ago, stlucifer said: The kids that are at school are there to allow the essential workers, some who are there saving lives, to go to work. I think this is in danger of becoming the most over-used phrase in the history of the English language. It's also nonsense. The overwhelming number of essential workers are not doing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 1 minute ago, oaksoft said: I think this is in danger of becoming the most over-used phrase in the history of the English language. It's also nonsense. The overwhelming number of essential workers are not doing this. Why didn't you highlight the whole text? I deliberately said "some". I have constantly said that there are far more than just NHS and care staff keeping things going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 32 minutes ago, stlucifer said: Why didn't you highlight the whole text? I deliberately said "some". I have constantly said that there are far more than just NHS and care staff keeping things going. My mistake. I didn't mean to include the words "who", "are" and "there". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shull Posted May 22, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 Too busy dancing are some of the NHS staff. Hope they wash their sweaty feet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) There was a nurse on the BBC last week who claimed that she felt "unappreciated by the public". For some people like her, the weekly round of Thursday night cowbells and clapping seals, the special NHS hours at supermarkets and the constant praise on facebook and twitter isn't enough. To illustrate her point, the article was full of photos of her pouting like a Freshwater Trout and of course the obligatory and cringeworthy photo of her after she took her mask off. "This is what a hero looks like". f**king! Cringe! This is all going the way of that horrendous "Help for Heroes" nonsense. They do an important job but FFS, why the need to fetishise these people? The people who genuinely kept this country afloat were not doctors and nurses at all. It was supermarket workers and the food delivery network. Edited May 22, 2020 by oaksoft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) Well, blow me down................... @stlucifer, A leading scientist has called for UK lockdown rules to be loosened more quickly, as the coronavirus pandemic has already infected half of Britain’s population and is “on its way out”. Prominent Oxford epidemiologist Professor Sunetra Gupta told unherd.com that the UK had based its handling of the crisis on the worst-case scenario and called for a ‘more rapid exit from lockdown’. Prof Gupta also argued that there is a “strong possibility” that the UK could return to normal, including pubs, nightclubs and restaurants reopening, without great risk. https://uk.yahoo.com/news/coronavirus-scientist-quicker-exit-lockdown-072039855.html Edited May 22, 2020 by faraway saint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookie Monster Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 I asked the question of what was the level of provision of PPE for staff when we go back. "We don't know" was the answer. Unsurprisingly this was quite a common answer. As long as there are "Don't know" answers to important questions, nobody should be stepping foot back into their place of work. I'll be back in work in June and none of the questions I asked were able to be answered.I can answer the PPE provision. A 2 metre cane. Use it wisely. [emoji6] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, oaksoft said: There was a nurse on the BBC last week who claimed that she felt "unappreciated by the public". For some people like her, the weekly round of Thursday night cowbells and clapping seals, the special NHS hours at supermarkets and the constant praise on facebook and twitter isn't enough. To illustrate her point, the article was full of photos of her pouting like a Freshwater Trout and of course the obligatory and cringeworthy photo of her after she took her mask off. "This is what a hero looks like". f**king! Cringe! This is all going the way of that horrendous "Help for Heroes" nonsense. They do an important job but FFS, why the need to fetishise these people? The people who genuinely kept this country afloat were not doctors and nurses at all. It was supermarket workers and the food delivery network. Aye @oaksoft, especially having to deal with panic buyers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 1 hour ago, oaksoft said: Schools in Scotland will be back in August or September at the latest, whether we can "guarantee safety" or not because life goes on I'm afraid. What teachers say or demand won't really come into it. FWIW, I think a massive mistake was made not allowing this years students to sit their exams. That could have easily been down with social distancing and their papers could have been marked as normal. The papers could have been shortened to exclude material not yet taught. Instead an entire year of pupils are going to be hamstrung by their prelim results and the word of their teacher. A real shame. Different schools do the courses in different order, so how can one paper compensate for that? Even if every school was at the same stage, the papers had all been printed and ready for distribution. Are you telling me that they were going to re-write the paper and re-print it? For a start, cost alone would prohibit it. You have oversimplified the entire exam process. Also, pupils are more likely to gain out of this than be hamstrung. The SQA have asked for estimates, based on teacher judgement, prelims and assessment carried out throughout the year. The majority of schools will tend towards being overly positive. The SQA will "seasonally adjust" the grades if that's the case. It's a horrific situation, but the one thing that the SQA have finally got right is cancelling the exams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 1 hour ago, faraway saint said: Well, blow me down................... @stlucifer, A leading scientist has called for UK lockdown rules to be loosened more quickly, as the coronavirus pandemic has already infected half of Britain’s population and is “on its way out”. Prominent Oxford epidemiologist Professor Sunetra Gupta told unherd.com that the UK had based its handling of the crisis on the worst-case scenario and called for a ‘more rapid exit from lockdown’. Prof Gupta also argued that there is a “strong possibility” that the UK could return to normal, including pubs, nightclubs and restaurants reopening, without great risk. https://uk.yahoo.com/news/coronavirus-scientist-quicker-exit-lockdown-072039855.html And then there's this. Quote A rival group of scientists called "Independent Sage" earlier also argued schools should not re-open until there is the ability to track the spread of the virus and test anyone coming into contact with infected people. It also said the risk to pupils would be halved if reopening was delayed by two weeks as a result of cases reducing further. Prime Minister Boris Johnson has indicated that 25,000 contact tracers, able to track 10,000 new cases a day, would be in place by 1 June. Sir David King, who leads Independent Sage, said: "It is clear from the evidence we have collected that 1 June is simply too early to go back, by going ahead with this dangerous decision, the government is further risking the health of our communities and the likelihood of a second spike." Wish these Science f**kers would agree with each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, FTOF said: And then there's this. Wish these Science f**kers would agree with each other. How many times, it's NOT all about schools. PS this conflict of views from these scientists has been on the go since day one. Wish they'd all feck off and let me make the decisions. Edited May 22, 2020 by faraway saint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TPAFKATS Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 Yes I get that but if Denmark is agile enough in its thinking and can adapt then why not Scotland. Don't think there are any excuses tbh. Given all the evidence from Denmark I think the Scottish government is more than correct to put a date of 11th August to get things in place.The short answer is that as Denmark is independent it has complete control over its finances. Scotland relies on a block grant and as such couldn't really make the decision to employ an additional 30% of teachers at such short notice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaksoft Posted May 22, 2020 Report Share Posted May 22, 2020 20 minutes ago, TPAFKATS said: 7 hours ago, lenziebud said: Yes I get that but if Denmark is agile enough in its thinking and can adapt then why not Scotland. Don't think there are any excuses tbh. Given all the evidence from Denmark I think the Scottish government is more than correct to put a date of 11th August to get things in place. The short answer is that as Denmark is independent it has complete control over its finances. Scotland relies on a block grant and as such couldn't really make the decision to employ an additional 30% of teachers at such short notice. That is a pretty reasonable answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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