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Annual, Manager Must Go Thread.


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Our policy of giving untried managers a chance in the Premier league doesn't really seem to work, does it? 

Craig, Teale, Murray Rae, Ross, Stubbs, Goodwin. One success (Ross) from seven isn't really a good strike rate. 

I would still give Goodwin a little longer yet. But if he does go, it is time to get someone in with some experience. 

 

Edited by Prague Buddie
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6 minutes ago, Prague Buddie said:

Our policy of giving untried managers a chance doesn't really seem to work, does it? 

Craig, Teale, Murray Rae, Ross, Stubbs, Goodwin. One success (Ross) from seven isn't really a good strike rate. 

I would still give Goodwin a little longer yet. But if he does go, it is time to get someone in with some experience. 

 

Wee Anxious was more untried than Stubbs , Goodwin and Ross for that matter .

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1 hour ago, Prague Buddie said:

Our policy of giving untried managers a chance in the Premier league doesn't really seem to work, does it? 

Craig, Teale, Murray Rae, Ross, Stubbs, Goodwin. One success (Ross) from seven isn't really a good strike rate. 

I would still give Goodwin a little longer yet. But if he does go, it is time to get someone in with some experience. 

 

Ross, then Kearney?  How could you forget?!

Teale was an unfair imposition on the man!!

And Goodwin is not yet over.

so... for me...?

3 from 7 successes.

and How about the years just before Craig... .   if you sincerely want to look at the success of that policy?

 

edit : naw!

Rae actually saved Saints from relegation, much as I disagreed with his approach to youth development AND his first love -  the stadium he used to play for.

he saved Saints from relegation one year...

so... 4 from 7 successes... 

 

Edited by antrin
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We are a good bit away from sacking Jim Goodwin and I hope he turns it round but today was the first time that questions are starting to be asked.

Big questions now being asked about recruitment, tactics and team selection. 

I personally think we have been poor all season and are very fortunate to have 7 points on the board. 

Other teams are improving and we are getting worse so a lot of work to be done. 

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6 minutes ago, Yflab said:

I love your optimism. I’m glad that I’m not the only one who is crazy.

Not quite optimism,  just trying to put a slight positive slant on things(if truth be known, I fear the worst under current stewardship)

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Do we have a squad that with a bit of fine tuning is capable of mixing it with the likes of the Fakes, Dundee Utd. & Killie or are we in a battle for 11th with Accies - if it's the latter then I suggest we'd better get tough & prepare for the mother of all shitfests. 

Accies have shown over their tenure in the top flight that it's big results that matter and I wouldn't bet against them repeating it this season - 35 points seems a long way away.

Edited by Bud the Baker
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12 hours ago, Prague Buddie said:

Our policy of giving untried managers a chance in the Premier league doesn't really seem to work, does it? 

Craig, Teale, Murray Rae, Ross, Stubbs, Goodwin. One success (Ross) from seven isn't really a good strike rate. 

I would still give Goodwin a little longer yet. But if he does go, it is time to get someone in with some experience. 

 

Ross never proved himself with us in the top league so that's 0 out of 7

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12 hours ago, ironsaints87 said:

Taxi for Goodwin. Hello Tommy Wright.

Not till after Halloween...👹👻🤡

Quote

Scotland is Tommy Wright's "preferred destination" when he returns to football management after leaving St Johnstone in May.

The Northern Irishman ended his seven-year term in charge at McDiarmid Park having guided the Perth club to another top-six Premiership finish.

A deal with St Johnstone chairman Steve Brown means he will not join another club until "November, round that time".

 

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Our deficiencies have been well and truly exposed since thd Shaunessy red card, we shouldn't be in the position we are with regard to having so few defenders at the club. Going forward we look ponderous until subs are made and even then it is usually because desperation has encoutaged us forward. Covid may well have had an effect on recruitment but Jim needs to decide his best 11 and fast because the chopping and changing, whether forced or not isn't working.

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The results are merely part of the problem albeit a big one. 

I can honestly say that for the second half yesterday, I noticed myself doing something that I've been doing a lot more when watching these games on the telly. I switched off. 

Not physically, as the game remained on til the end but I found myself browsing my phone, drifting away onto another subject whilst the hopeless commentator mumbled a lot of stupid platitudes in the background and I realised, I wasn't f**king interested. 

Anyone who knows me from off of here, understands and knows that when I'm at a match, I'm usually one of those folk that the commentator is apologising on behalf of for the language. I attack every ball mentally, I live on the edge of my seat for the full 90 mins... always has been the case... even way back in mid 90s as a ball boy when I got 'booked' post match in the tunnel for calling the ref a 'f**king joke' under my breath as we trudged past him following a controversial loss. 😂

Point being, at the end, if we win, it's a boost mentally but if we lose, when I leave I make sure I never let it affect me personally or my mood outwith the immediate hour or two in the aftermath of the result.

But as I sat yesterday, I realised, we're so mind numbing that I had my face in my phone for the full second half, I didn't care to mentally will the team forward or even get frustrated at them for misplaced passes etc, as the team, frankly are f**king boring.

Not just shite. We've seen shite in the past, more times than I care to remember, but absolutely devoid of any ability in the opposition half, a basic competence of getting the ball into area where we potentially might score. When we do get into the final third, we seem to have stumbled into it rather than carved out a chance. My main criticism of Goodwin teams is that there is no attacking intent or finesse, it's a horribly panicked mantra of  'get the ball forward 50 times, one or two of those are bound to have a lucky bounce and let us in for a shot' and it's absolutely painful to watch. 

I'm not in the Goodwin out camp. Not yet anyway, but he's about 3 or 4 weeks away from being untenable. Even if the results do turn, the football served will still be the gash were subject to. I don't mind a team hunkering in and grinding out a result when the pressure is on but we should not be performing that way against teams around us. It's an eyesore and a total turnoff. 

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1 hour ago, Bud the Baker said:

Do we have a squad that with a bit of fine tuning is capable of mixing it with the likes of the Fakes, Dundee Utd. & Killie or are we in a battle for 11th with Accies - if it's the latter then I suggest we'd better get tough & prepare for the mother of all shitfests. 

Accies have shown over their tenure in the top flight that it's big results that matter and I wouldn't bet against them repeating it this season - 35 points seems a long way away.

I hope it doesn’t come down to a mini league between us and accies. I would have thought that a debt free club with a decent sized support and good infrastructure could be competing mid-table. I just don’t know why we are always struggling at the wrong end of the league? I am starting to think the ground might be built on an old burial ground!! 

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1 hour ago, djchapsticks said:

The results are merely part of the problem albeit a big one. 

I can honestly say that for the second half yesterday, I noticed myself doing something that I've been doing a lot more when watching these games on the telly. I switched off. 

Not physically, as the game remained on til the end but I found myself browsing my phone, drifting away onto another subject whilst the hopeless commentator mumbled a lot of stupid platitudes in the background and I realised, I wasn't f**king interested. 

Anyone who knows me from off of here, understands and knows that when I'm at a match, I'm usually one of those folk that the commentator is apologising on behalf of for the language. I attack every ball mentally, I live on the edge of my seat for the full 90 mins... always has been the case... even way back in mid 90s as a ball boy when I got 'booked' post match in the tunnel for calling the ref a 'f**king joke' under my breath as we trudged past him following a controversial loss. 😂

Point being, at the end, if we win, it's a boost mentally but if we lose, when I leave I make sure I never let it affect me personally or my mood outwith the immediate hour or two in the aftermath of the result.

But as I sat yesterday, I realised, we're so mind numbing that I had my face in my phone for the full second half, I didn't care to mentally will the team forward or even get frustrated at them for misplaced passes etc, as the team, frankly are f**king boring.

Not just shite. We've seen shite in the past, more times than I care to remember, but absolutely devoid of any ability in the opposition half, a basic competence of getting the ball into area where we potentially might score. When we do get into the final third, we seem to have stumbled into it rather than carved out a chance. My main criticism of Goodwin teams is that there is no attacking intent or finesse, it's a horribly panicked mantra of  'get the ball forward 50 times, one or two of those are bound to have a lucky bounce and let us in for a shot' and it's absolutely painful to watch. 

I'm not in the Goodwin out camp. Not yet anyway, but he's about 3 or 4 weeks away from being untenable. Even if the results do turn, the football served will still be the gash were subject to. I don't mind a team hunkering in and grinding out a result when the pressure is on but we should not be performing that way against teams around us. It's an eyesore and a total turnoff. 

Great Post. Nails it.

Edited by magnus
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Agree with all you say watching the match was agonising to say the least we offered very very little against a no more than a fairly ordinary Killie side.It really makes you wonder what on earth Jim is thinking about with his team selections and tactics.I have been supporting Saints for over sixty years all I am asking is to be at least on a par with the likes of Killie and Well. We have a decent size support good training facility and nice stadium.Yes we can all accept losing its part of football but what we are being served I am afraid is utter dross. Questions have to be addressed regarding recruitment and the lack of straight forward defensive cover.

The results are merely part of the problem albeit a big one. 

I can honestly say that for the second half yesterday, I noticed myself doing something that I've been doing a lot more when watching these games on the telly. I switched off. 

Not physically, as the game remained on til the end but I found myself browsing my phone, drifting away onto another subject whilst the hopeless commentator mumbled a lot of stupid platitudes in the background and I realised, I wasn't f**king interested. 

Anyone who knows me from off of here, understands and knows that when I'm at a match, I'm usually one of those folk that the commentator is apologising on behalf of for the language. I attack every ball mentally, I live on the edge of my seat for the full 90 mins... always has been the case... even way back in mid 90s as a ball boy when I got 'booked' post match in the tunnel for calling the ref a 'f**king joke' under my breath as we trudged past him following a controversial loss. [emoji23]

Point being, at the end, if we win, it's a boost mentally but if we lose, when I leave I make sure I never let it affect me personally or my mood outwith the immediate hour or two in the aftermath of the result.

But as I sat yesterday, I realised, we're so mind numbing that I had my face in my phone for the full second half, I didn't care to mentally will the team forward or even get frustrated at them for misplaced passes etc, as the team, frankly are f**king boring.

Not just shite. We've seen shite in the past, more times than I care to remember, but absolutely devoid of any ability in the opposition half, a basic competence of getting the ball into area where we potentially might score. When we do get into the final third, we seem to have stumbled into it rather than carved out a chance. My main criticism of Goodwin teams is that there is no attacking intent or finesse, it's a horribly panicked mantra of  'get the ball forward 50 times, one or two of those are bound to have a lucky bounce and let us in for a shot' and it's absolutely painful to watch. 

I'm not in the Goodwin out camp. Not yet anyway, but he's about 3 or 4 weeks away from being untenable. Even if the results do turn, the football served will still be the gash were subject to. I don't mind a team hunkering in and grinding out a result when the pressure is on but we should not be performing that way against teams around us. It's an eyesore and a total turnoff. 

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Goodwin allegedly spat the dummy years ago when he lost his coaching position when Teale and Longwell took over. He should have been shown the door there and then but enough said about that.

He has returned to club and obviously totally out of his depth and keeping him just making situation far worse. Recruitment is a disgrace, lack of cover in defence a disgrace. Getting rid of Baird with no replacement is bordering on neglect of duties. Imo Erahon, Mcgrath, Sheron, McAllister, Morias, Irwin, Durmus totally out of their depth yet continue to play. Not playing Cammy Mcpherson stinks of stubbornness and "look at me, im in charge"... the tactics, team selection are clearly the actions of a guy who does not have a fecking clue whats going on. Surely Goodwin must be pulled in and asked what he thinks is happening because he looking at a different squad from me and his all round performance is a total joke...for me he would be away today and i would never ever have appointed him in the 1st place...stubborn man unwilling to look at himself and admit hes got it 100% wrong...

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14 hours ago, Yflab said:

I think you will find there have been questions about Jim’s tactics and recruitment for a number of weeks.

Fully aware of that but they are going up a level now.

I personally think once Magennis and Flynn are back we are fine across midfield and defense. 

Alnwick, Fraser, Shaunessey, McGrath(just!), Tait, Fraser is a decent defense. 

Foley, Flynn, Magennis, McGrath, McPherson, Erhahon is good enough to push us on from relegation battles.

The recruitment across the whole forward line has been woeful across the last three transfer windows and we are suffering really badly because of it.

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16 hours ago, antrin said:

Ross, then Kearney?  How could you forget?!

Teale was an unfair imposition on the man!!

And Goodwin is not yet over.

so... for me...?

3 from 7 successes.

and How about the years just before Craig... .   if you sincerely want to look at the success of that policy?

 

edit : naw!

Rae actually saved Saints from relegation, much as I disagreed with his approach to youth development AND his first love -  the stadium he used to play for.

he saved Saints from relegation one year...

so... 4 from 7 successes... 

 

Quite frankly, I am sick and tired of just being 'saved from relegation'. 

I don't see that as success. Sorry! 

I started watching Saints in the 80's, when we were a top half of the Premier league team, regulars in Europe, winning cups and/or getting to at least semi's. 

That was definitely a golden era for us and I certainly don't expect us to do it again year in year out, but once in a while would be nice. We haven't looked like getting near the top half of the league for over 30 year. Yet, other similarly sized or even smaller clubs have. 

That stinks of mis-management to me. 

 

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The fare is pretty awful to watch and also to listen to on the radio. ST nailed it yesterday when he said that some of the crosses were terrible, can't get it past the first defender.

Of course there will be a number who will argue that we are only just losing these games by the odd goal (Hibs aside), and with a little bit of luck we could have at least got a draw or even scraped a win, but I agree with Lenziebud, the forwards we have brought in reflect a manager who isn't that clued up about quality strikers. He knows about a combative mid-field and a defence, but the forward line needs someone who can take a chance. Morias doesn't really know the way to the net, Obika doesn't convert enough of the chances that come his way, and Erwin performs well outside of the box but isn't the kind of player that scores 15+ goals a season. I don't know anything of Dennis as we haven't seen anything yet of his abilities!

I'm not on board with any argument that justifies that the Manager Must Go but somewhere along the line we have lost the ability to find someone who can score goals. I laughed out loud when earlier this season after scoring his second goal in the league the fanny on the Beeb said that Obika was becoming "prolific"! The word may have been appropriate if he had scored say 6 or 7 in the first 8 games, but two.....................

We are bottom of the league for a very good reason and it was the same last year, we don't score enough goals and if this is the pattern for the next few games, then it will be same old, same old.

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Another thing I noticed yesterday was that apart from our final ball into the box being crap the amount of times we basically just gave the ball away was criminal, our midfield being the main culprits -  presuming that Foley is carrying some sort of injury as he was miles off the pace.

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