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Seaside Nipper

Rise in street begging ?

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I believe extra benefits are available if you have a dog.
Certainly less access to hostels and some other help if you are homeless and have a dog.
Yet, dogs are a great support to many on the street.
There's a charity based in London but expanding to other cities that does free healthcare etc for street dugs.

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Yup, seen similar across recent tams in particular, clearly a blatant form of coordination.
My gripe is simple, what are authorities ( agencies too numerous to mention ) actually doing to mitigate this, it appears absolutely hee haw. Presently it seems we are simply providing a blind eye, almost an assist to blatant begging in all its guises rather than doing anything about it. The trend looks like increasing and basically changing the street dynamic completely.
If we the great Joe Public can see and express concern over this, why cant the authorities  ? I suppose a zero tolerance approach to this is simply not acceptable in human rights parlance.
I'd just love to hear our politicians , local , regional national, express some concern and propose and implement some policy to recognise and eradicate this horrendous blight, both on beggars and the pavement walking public. Its blatantly unacceptable, but yet is clearly becoming the new norm.
Horrendous blight, blatantly unacceptable...
Really?

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2 hours ago, DougJamie said:

Do you have any facts to back that up ? Or are you just being clearly racist ?

:unsure: Racist.   OK, sometimes they give them return tickets.

Edited by pod

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9 minutes ago, pod said:

:unsure: Racist.   OK, sometimes they give them return tickets.

Dear oh dear- trust me been to Romania many times and they are a wonderful race with 3000 years of culture and heritage. You should try broadening your views and mind before you spout pish.

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19 minutes ago, DougJamie said:

Dear oh dear- trust me been to Romania many times and they are a wonderful race with 3000 years of culture and heritage. You should try broadening your views and mind before you spout pish.

Show me where I mentioned Romanians, clever dick.  

Romanians don't need to beg or steal and no different from us.  

  

Edited by pod

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3 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:
5 hours ago, oaksoft said:
It's completely transparent, utterly meaningless virtue signalling designed to assuage guilt. Don't build it up to anything more than that.
If people were genuinely interested in solving rough sleeping they would start lobbying their MPs.

In your opinion with no knowledge of the individuals involved.

You are so wonderfully naive. 🤣

I am beginning to think that you don't really understand human motivation at all. Humans are all about themselves and always act in a way which benefits themselves. I'd be stunned if you could show me an example where the "do-gooder" wasn't motivated by satisfying some personal need.

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Does the motivation really matter. If giving makes the giver feel better in some way so what ? It's a personal choice at the end of the day. Personally I don't give but it's pretty poor form to question the motivation of those that do. My earlier post wasn't a go at the actual beggars it's those that are exploiting these people that seem to be able to go about their serious criminality including people trafficking and human slavery totally unquestioned or untouched. I doubt the girls I see on the train want to be living their life that way any more than we want to see it on our streets.

You are so wonderfully naive. 
I am beginning to think that you don't really understand human motivation at all. Humans are all about themselves and always act in a way which benefits themselves. I'd be stunned if you could show me an example where the "do-gooder" wasn't motivated by satisfying some personal need.

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1 hour ago, Ayrshire Saints said:

Does the motivation really matter. If giving makes the giver feel better in some way so what ? It's a personal choice at the end of the day. Personally I don't give but it's pretty poor form to question the motivation of those that do. My earlier post wasn't a go at the actual beggars it's those that are exploiting these people that seem to be able to go about their serious criminality including people trafficking and human slavery totally unquestioned or untouched. I doubt the girls I see on the train want to be living their life that way any more than we want to see it on our streets.

Yes it matters and it's quite right to question the motives of those giving. Virtue signalling needs to be shown up for what it is. It's very important that people understand the way other humans think and act.

There seems to be a growing obsession with people attempting to the grab the moral high ground, as TPAK thingy did earlier. It's become a cultural thing. Like I said, it needs calling out at every opportunity.

Edited by oaksoft

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Yes it matters and it's quite right to question the motives of those giving. Virtue signalling needs to be shown up for what it is. It's very important that people understand the way other humans think and act.
There seems to be a growing obsession with people attempting to the grab the moral high ground, as TPAK thingy did earlier. It's become a cultural thing. Like I said, it needs calling out at every opportunity.
What moral high ground did I try to grab?
Just pointed out that not everyone out there has the moral viewpoint of an empathy vacuum.

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You are so wonderfully naive. 
I am beginning to think that you don't really understand human motivation at all. Humans are all about themselves and always act in a way which benefits themselves. I'd be stunned if you could show me an example where the "do-gooder" wasn't motivated by satisfying some personal need.


Maybe buddie in EK should answer your question since he likes your post yet stated he's worked in the 3rd sector for many years. I wonder what personal need he is satisfying and how he's always benefiting himself by doing so.

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Maybe buddie in EK should answer your question since he likes your post yet stated he's worked in the 3rd sector for many years. I wonder what personal need he is satisfying and how he's always benefiting himself by doing so.
Whilst I wouldn't have put it quite so bluntly or coursly, I liked the post as I felt it contained a truth... That most good deeds are at some level, conscious or subconsciously, motivated by meeting our own needs in some way.

Where we differ is that i don't see it as a negative but a positive, and I wouldn't criticise anyone for it.

Quite the opposite.

If by helping others we help ourselves, should that not be encouraged?

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Whilst I wouldn't have put it quite so bluntly or coursly, I liked the post as I felt it contained a truth... That most good deeds are at some level, conscious or subconsciously, motivated by meeting our own needs in some way.

Where we differ is that i don't see it as a negative but a positive, and I wouldn't criticise anyone for it.

Quite the opposite.

If by helping others we help ourselves, should that not be encouraged?
Most then not always. Thanks for clarifying

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3 hours ago, oaksoft said:

Yes it matters and it's quite right to question the motives of those giving. Virtue signalling needs to be shown up for what it is. It's very important that people understand the way other humans think and act.

There seems to be a growing obsession with people attempting to the grab the moral high ground, as TPAK thingy did earlier. It's become a cultural thing. Like I said, it needs calling out at every opportunity.

You are away one one here. So your saying giving a bag of messages for the food bank is for self satisfaction or to have the high moral ground. Years ago I stopped the car on Gilmour street because it was pissing down and freezing. It was obvious a poor soul walking the streets in rags and not shaven in weeks was homeless. I got out the car and gave the guy money to go get something to eat and a hot drink.  Did I do that for self satisfaction or to be on the high moral ground. I did it because my heart went to that man. I felt very sad for him. I did the same in Cape Town for a young couple who had a baby again because my heart went out to them. Probably I'm a big daft softie in these circumstances. Tell you what though thank f**k the world is not full of people with your mind set. You would have made a good SS officer. 

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Why ? Who are you or anyone else to question another person's personal motives. You chose not to give as do I but we have no right to pilory or even doubt another's choices. If anyone is taking a moral high ground it appears to be you fuelled by some personal cod psycholgy.

Yes it matters and it's quite right to question the motives of those giving. Virtue signalling needs to be shown up for what it is. It's very important that people understand the way other humans think and act.
There seems to be a growing obsession with people attempting to the grab the moral high ground, as TPAK thingy did earlier. It's become a cultural thing. Like I said, it needs calling out at every opportunity.

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14 hours ago, BuddieinEK said:

Whilst I wouldn't have put it quite so bluntly or coursly, I liked the post as I felt it contained a truth... That most good deeds are at some level, conscious or subconsciously, motivated by meeting our own needs in some way.

Where we differ is that i don't see it as a negative but a positive, and I wouldn't criticise anyone for it.

Quite the opposite.

If by helping others we help ourselves, should that not be encouraged?

Yes. Absolutely.

Providing you don't then start misrepresenting what you are doing as some moral high ground grabbing thing the way IOBS has just done.

I'm obviously not accusing you of that but I think you know that anyway.

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12 hours ago, Isle Of Bute Saint said:

You are away one one here. So your saying giving a bag of messages for the food bank is for self satisfaction or to have the high moral ground. Years ago I stopped the car on Gilmour street because it was pissing down and freezing. It was obvious a poor soul walking the streets in rags and not shaven in weeks was homeless. I got out the car and gave the guy money to go get something to eat and a hot drink.  Did I do that for self satisfaction or to be on the high moral ground. I did it because my heart went to that man. I felt very sad for him. I did the same in Cape Town for a young couple who had a baby again because my heart went out to them. Probably I'm a big daft softie in these circumstances. Tell you what though thank f**k the world is not full of people with your mind set. You would have made a good SS officer. 

This is exactly the sort of self-satisfied nonsense I was getting at.

Nobody mentioned you personally or asked about what charitable acts you may or may not indulge in but you felt the need to come on and tell us what you did anyway and then describe in detail how wonderful a person that makes you are and how, in comparison, I am SS officer material.

Hilarious grab at the moral high ground. :D

You did it because it made you feel good about yourself and morally superior to others. I rest my case.

Edited by oaksoft

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11 hours ago, Ayrshire Saints said:

Why ? Who are you or anyone else to question another person's personal motives. You chose not to give as do I but we have no right to pilory or even doubt another's choices. If anyone is taking a moral high ground it appears to be you fuelled by some personal cod psycholgy.

Yeah, I've probably not explained myself too well so I'll try again.

I have no issue with charitable acts. None at all really. I think it's great that people organise themselves to help others rather than whining about governments not doing it for them.

My issue is with the obsession with then seeking public approval for those actions whilst pretending that it's some moral high ground crusade. It isn't. It's attention seeking, gimme-Facebook-Instagram-likes bullshit and deserves to be called out for being such.

If someone wants to do charitable stuff that's great but they should f**k off and do it in private unless they need to create publicity for the charity itself. But if that person then wants to engage in personal publicity whoring and pretend they are somehow morally superior as a result as IOBS has demonstrated beautifully then they can expect a backlash.

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15 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:

What moral high ground did I try to grab?
Just pointed out that not everyone out there has the moral viewpoint of an empathy vacuum.

You know exactly what you did and continue to do in bold above.

Neither of us are idiots so stop acting like one.

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8 hours ago, Hands of stone said:

Ffs...imagine being homeless in winter, fecking freezing, sitting on a corner begging at xmas....call my views whatever u like on forum but i will actively be helping homeless this xmas...

Fair enough but why tell us about it when nobody asked?

Just f**king do it without seeking publicity.

Is it me? Am I missing some enormous point here? :lol

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15 hours ago, TPAFKATS said:


 

 


Maybe buddie in EK should answer your question since he likes your post yet stated he's worked in the 3rd sector for many years. I wonder what personal need he is satisfying and how he's always benefiting himself by doing so. emoji849.png

 

BuddieInEK doesn't need to justify himself to me. I am well aware of what he does.

You know what he doesn't do though?

He doesn't engage in personal attention whoring, he doesn't try to paint himself as some social warrior and he doesn't feel the need to talk down to those who don't do what he does.

I'll start having a problem with him if and when he starts questioning my empathy levels without knowing anything about me - the sort of thing you do constantly on here. Until then ( and I wouldn't hold your breath by the way)....

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1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

Yeah, I've probably not explained myself too well so I'll try again.

I have no issue with charitable acts. None at all really. I think it's great that people organise themselves to help others rather than whining about governments not doing it for them.

My issue is with the obsession with then seeking public approval for those actions whilst pretending that it's some moral high ground crusade. It isn't. It's attention seeking, gimme-Facebook-Instagram-likes bullshit and deserves to be called out for being such.

If someone wants to do charitable stuff that's great but they should f**k off and do it in private unless they need to create publicity for the charity itself. But if that person then wants to engage in personal publicity whoring and pretend they are somehow morally superior as a result as IOBS has demonstrated beautifully then they can expect a backlash.

That bit I can agree with - no need to shout it from the rooftops but that wasn't your initial point I was responding to.  You were questioning the motivation for people being charitable in the first place which is a totally different thing and there was not really a lack of clarity in your initial response, it was crystal clear unless what you are saying now is that some people give merely so they can trumpet that act (which is fair bit removed from how you put it initially ! )

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The obvious and logical flaw, in your wee stream of posts above on page 2, is that YOUR initial post on this thread - on Page 1 -  was just as personal and look-at-me as those of people who do care and actively wish to support those worse off than themselves.

 

You offered personal anecdote and poured scorn on beggars.

Also if YOUR SIX straight posts above do not exemplify "personal attention whoring" then I know not what could!?? :lol:

 

pots kettles etc...   :)

Edited by antrin

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