Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 2 hours ago, stlucifer said: I've removed the pointl;ess waffling and left the pertinent part of your post. As to that, where is your evidence? For instance. Norway has taken extreme measures, excessive price hikes, banning sales after certain times, age restrictions and more but, due in the main to historical culture, the biggest "culprits" of drink excess tend to be young, unemployed people. Where does that fit into your theory of taking drink out of the reach of those with less money? And make no mistake. That is all you're advocating. There sre no easy answers but I certainly don't believe overpricing is one of them. My response was to Antrin. The people you describe are indeed very vulnerable but alcohol abuse is across society. The cost is historically low compared to incomes. It’s a multi faceted problem and on that we agree. Education has a big part to play and on that we agree. We will need to agree to disagree on the impact and desirability of the pricing policy as part of overall improvement. Changes for the better have and continue to take place and a new culture has and continues to evolve as we move from spit and sawdust and miners social clubs to a Mediterranean culture where mixing chat, food and drinks is more convivial and inclusive. For some reason you seem to have decided that I have no knowledge or sympathy with the poorest sections of our society. Joblessness and serial joblessness in families and communities is a terrible thing and very difficult to overcome. If it was easy then we would have done it by now. Can I understand a desire to block out the helplessness or anger that someone might experience in that situation? Of course I can but the solution isn’t at the bottom of a glass or tin . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 My response was to Antrin. The people you describe are indeed very vulnerable but alcohol abuse is across society. The cost is historically low compared to incomes. It’s a multi faceted problem and on that we agree. Education has a big part to play and on that we agree. We will need to agree to disagree on the impact and desirability of the pricing policy as part of overall improvement. Changes for the better have and continue to take place and a new culture has and continues to evolve as we move from spit and sawdust and miners social clubs to a Mediterranean culture where mixing chat, food and drinks is more convivial and inclusive. For some reason you seem to have decided that I have no knowledge or sympathy with the poorest sections of our society. Joblessness and serial joblessness in families and communities is a terrible thing and very difficult to overcome. If it was easy then we would have done it by now. Can I understand a desire to block out the helplessness or anger that someone might experience in that situation? Of course I can but the solution isn’t at the bottom of a glass or tin .Yep, alcohol doesn't solve any problems ... but, then again, neither does milk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 11 minutes ago, Slarti said: 8 hours ago, Rascal said: My response was to Antrin. The people you describe are indeed very vulnerable but alcohol abuse is across society. The cost is historically low compared to incomes. It’s a multi faceted problem and on that we agree. Education has a big part to play and on that we agree. We will need to agree to disagree on the impact and desirability of the pricing policy as part of overall improvement. Changes for the better have and continue to take place and a new culture has and continues to evolve as we move from spit and sawdust and miners social clubs to a Mediterranean culture where mixing chat, food and drinks is more convivial and inclusive. For some reason you seem to have decided that I have no knowledge or sympathy with the poorest sections of our society. Joblessness and serial joblessness in families and communities is a terrible thing and very difficult to overcome. If it was easy then we would have done it by now. Can I understand a desire to block out the helplessness or anger that someone might experience in that situation? Of course I can but the solution isn’t at the bottom of a glass or tin . Yep, alcohol doesn't solve any problems ... but, then again, neither does milk. Or yogurt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 21 minutes ago, Slarti said: 8 hours ago, Rascal said: My response was to Antrin. The people you describe are indeed very vulnerable but alcohol abuse is across society. The cost is historically low compared to incomes. It’s a multi faceted problem and on that we agree. Education has a big part to play and on that we agree. We will need to agree to disagree on the impact and desirability of the pricing policy as part of overall improvement. Changes for the better have and continue to take place and a new culture has and continues to evolve as we move from spit and sawdust and miners social clubs to a Mediterranean culture where mixing chat, food and drinks is more convivial and inclusive. For some reason you seem to have decided that I have no knowledge or sympathy with the poorest sections of our society. Joblessness and serial joblessness in families and communities is a terrible thing and very difficult to overcome. If it was easy then we would have done it by now. Can I understand a desire to block out the helplessness or anger that someone might experience in that situation? Of course I can but the solution isn’t at the bottom of a glass or tin . Yep, alcohol doesn't solve any problems ... but, then again, neither does milk. Don't talk pish, I've had no milk today, had lots of alcohol and solved lots of problems. 🤪 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 (edited) 50 minutes ago, faraway saint said: Don't talk pish, I've had no milk today, had lots of alcohol and solved lots of problems. 🤪 Oh dear…it shows..not the problem solving … just a little. Why not combine milk and alcohol. Don’t know if you have ever tried it? https://cocktailpartyapp.com/drinks/rum-cow/ Edited June 9, 2022 by Rascal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 On 1/28/2020 at 7:06 PM, stlucifer said: Just a thought. So the over pricing of alcohol has reduced the Sales of drink in Scotland? Let's look at the facts. There are other ways of getting your fill of the demon. I know of a few who have invested in home brew and small stills. The latter can actually create drink with far more alcoholic content, as much as 60% on average which has to be watered down to reduce it to the normal 40%. The other thing is the comparative rise of sales in England. Is this a coincidence? Have the English really increased their intake by as much as we have reduced? I think not. It's more likely that the increase is, at least in part, due to people finding it worthwhile buying in bulk and transporting it north, in some cases for profit. While this might seem fanciful why isn't it less fanciful to assume the English are sitting at Hadrian's wall sipping our whisky at 75% of the price consuming more just to say, "Get it right up ya Jock"!? I am, of course, exaggerating, (and a little tongue in cheek), the extent that some might go to get their hands on drink but I am simply emphasising that the Scottish government using end of line sales in such a triumphant manner is wrong. It will take years for any proof of benefits or change of habits to be seen. the overbearing, dominating, non beneficial increase might have been more palatable if the Scottish government had had the balls to make it a revenue generating tax which could have went towards helping those already down the rabbit hole. I do know that the pricing regime has NOT changed my habits. It won't have changed that of any who have a reasonable income. I just hate this form of state intervention. https://ahauk.org/news/english-drinkers-can-consume-a-weeks-worth-of-alcohol-for-the-same-price-as-a-high-street-cup-of-coffee-campaigners-warn/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stlucifer Posted June 9, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 1 minute ago, Rascal said: https://ahauk.org/news/english-drinkers-can-consume-a-weeks-worth-of-alcohol-for-the-same-price-as-a-high-street-cup-of-coffee-campaigners-warn/ SO? It's quite important to highlight the word CAN. It's a choice. Perhaps they should stick to DO. In fact. You should perhaps look further afield and you'll find that England isn't the cheapest in Europe even. It actually proves my point that cheaper drink doesn't mean more alcohol abuse. thanks for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 23 minutes ago, stlucifer said: SO? It's quite important to highlight the word CAN. It's a choice. Perhaps they should stick to DO. In fact. You should perhaps look further afield and you'll find that England isn't the cheapest in Europe even. It actually proves my point that cheaper drink doesn't mean more alcohol abuse. thanks for that. The UK is comparatively expense. But…in historic terms drink is very affordable and easily obtained. Culture is important….remember that piffle I wrote earlier? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 1 hour ago, Rascal said: Oh dear…it shows..not the problem solving … just a little. Why not combine milk and alcohol. Don’t know if you have ever tried it? https://cocktailpartyapp.com/drinks/rum-cow/ Why don't you shut the feck up ya tedious old fanny? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brilliant Disguise Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 16 minutes ago, Rascal said: The UK is comparatively expense. But…in historic terms drink is very affordable and easily obtained. Culture is important….remember that piffle I wrote earlier? The cost of alcohol in the UK is more expensive that many other European countries and more expensive in Scotland due to the minimum pricing policy. People who have dependency on anything will sacrifice the necessities to get their hit. Minimum pricing on alcohol has done nothing other than line the pockets of Asda, Tesco, Morrisons etc. Another flawed policy There is no coincidence that Scotlands drug deaths increased after the introduction of the minimum pricing on alcohol. the only solution to this problem is Education Education and Education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 23 minutes ago, Brilliant Disguise said: The cost of alcohol in the UK is more expensive that many other European countries and more expensive in Scotland due to the minimum pricing policy. People who have dependency on anything will sacrifice the necessities to get their hit. Minimum pricing on alcohol has done nothing other than line the pockets of Asda, Tesco, Morrisons etc. Another flawed policy There is no coincidence that Scotlands drug deaths increased after the introduction of the minimum pricing on alcohol. the only solution to this problem is Education Education and Education. Agree, agree, agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 There is no coincidence that Scotlands drug deaths increased after the introduction of the minimum pricing on alcohol.How do you know this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 2 minutes ago, Slarti said: How do you know this? How do you know its not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 How do you know its not true. I never said, or implied, it wasn't true, I simply asked a question. I didn't even say that that I doubted it. He made an assertion, the burden of proof is on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 9, 2022 Report Share Posted June 9, 2022 33 minutes ago, Slarti said: 55 minutes ago, faraway saint said: How do you know its not true. I never said, or implied, it wasn't true, I simply asked a question. I didn't even say that that I doubted it. He made an assertion, the burden of proof is on him. Who is he? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraway saint Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 7 hours ago, Slarti said: 7 hours ago, faraway saint said: How do you know its not true. I never said, or implied, it wasn't true, I simply asked a question. I didn't even say that that I doubted it. He made an assertion, the burden of proof is on him. Here we go again......😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 1 hour ago, faraway saint said: Here we go again......😄 Happy as can be, All good friends and jolly good company. (Paraphrasing an old song) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 Here we go again......[emoji1]I know, it's amazing how many times I have to explain basic English language comprehension to certain people. [emoji13] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 Who is he?Follow the thread and you'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascal Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 3 minutes ago, Slarti said: 11 hours ago, Rascal said: Who is he? Follow the thread and you'll see. Really!!!! I think I will leave it to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 Really!!!! I think I will leave it to you. Bye then. [emoji112] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brilliant Disguise Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 15 hours ago, Slarti said: How do you know this? Minimum pricing on alcohol in Scotland was introduced in 2018 Drug deaths ins 2018 were circa 1050 Drug deaths in 2021 were circa 1350 Thats an increase in and around 28%. It may be a conincidence If you want more evidence look up the NRS !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddymarvellous Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 The stats do show a worrying trend but its hard to see a direct correlation with minimum pricing from 2018. I think the latest asesments of MUP are disappointing but I thought at the time it was a good idea and I don’t think it was wrong to try. Stats are always difficult for example the latest figures for alcohol related liver failure was down in 2019 but it’s hard to say whither this had anything to do with MUP or just the fact that as a nation we are drinking less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slarti Posted June 10, 2022 Report Share Posted June 10, 2022 There is no coincidence that Scotlands drug deaths increased after the introduction of the minimum pricing on alcohol.It was the "no coincidence" bit I was questioning, not whether the number of deaths had risen.But now you say... It may be a conincidence.Make up your mind. [emoji1787] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brilliant Disguise Posted June 11, 2022 Report Share Posted June 11, 2022 16 hours ago, Slarti said: It was the "no coincidence" bit I was questioning, not whether the number of deaths had risen. But now you say... Make up your mind. I made up my mind about you a long time ago🤔 You as usual were just being YOU !!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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