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Lord Pityme

Kibble/SMiSA Partnership Proposal (Merged)

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The fans want to run the club. If they can't get this right, they would never have got it right.  My biggest concern was would we be able to have the financial punch to carry it out. 

Where was the business acumen coming from.  

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The funniest, but most sinister element in a this is the PR job that suggests Kibble (who are spending £300k on virtually worthless shares in a football club) are only doing this for the community!
Surely sinking £300k into a few community enterprises would be more appropriate if you aren't seeking to benefit financially? Lol

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The fans want to run the club. If they can't get this right, they would never have got it right.  My biggest concern was would we be able to have the financial punch to carry it out. 
Where was the business acumen coming from.  
Smisa & Scott were clear we had what it takes, and were, I quote "the only show in town"...
That was until got the chance to flog £300k worth of shares and still be chairman of course. Lol

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8 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Aye, but... decisions thus far decided over by such a poor representation have included " Hand dryers, Matchballs etc" and once when the vote included a community option, our chairman (Mr Community) flipped his feckin biscuit.
Dear me Kombibuddie for his sins was told he needed 75% of members to approve an option on the quarterly £2 vote.
Regardless of how anyone votes, the outcome, or opinions held surely most can see this is a loaded vote?
And unfortunately those who vote against, if they lose out will likely end their participation in smisa.

I agree with your points above but it was how the whole thing was set up and you were one of the vocal drivers at it's inception. I have always had constitutional concerns with regards to SMiSA but accept that most of the members are really only in it as they see their contributions as a benefit to the club hence the small voting numbers each quarter etc

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I see it as a win-win deal where both parties get benefits. We are not selling off St Mirren assets (office space or facilities) but working together to maximise and improve their use. The benefit to SMFC is the extra revenue will be made available for the manager to strengthen the team, for Kibble the get the benefit of having access to employment opportunities for their young people thus giving them wider exposure to real working environments. By financial investment they are demonstrating that they are committed to making the partnership work, in return have minority voice on the board. This is all explained in the video which I’m sure will answer all the questions people have.

You are correct in that “expertise and talent” that the likes of Kibble can provide are and will be required when full fan ownership is reached particularly to take us to the next level. This has always been a slight concern to me about fan ownership; once complete did the fans have the correct people with the right skills, experience and time to take the club forward? Who would I like to see provide that? A sugar daddy businessman who would want profit share/payback on any investment? A foreign partner with no particular local attachment to Paisley or St Mirren? Or a long standing, local charity with commercial know how (turnover £32M), large resources in terms of staff and facilities, with a sound ethical and moral values. If you were to hand pick a partner then you couldn’t to my mind chose a more appropriate one.

I attended last night and was 80% decided that the deal was right for the club. I now am totally convinced that it is and will vote that it is accepted. I cannot think of any downside only positives and hope that most people will see the same. Congratulations must go to all those involved at SMISA for the effort to date and to the board for the obvious work done to bring a well thought through proposal to the table.
I might be misinterpreting this but it seems you are happy to change the original model because kibble will bring expertise in running the club that the fans can't?

I know this is part of their selling point but to me it's not a positive. Are we really saying, let's give kibble this large chunk of shares and pass over the day to day running of the company (not playing side) as its a lot of hard work and the fans consortium won't be any good at either doing it or finding an individual who can?

Im still intrigued as to how all of this expertise kibble will be supplying SMFC will be financed as well.

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1 minute ago, TPAFKATS said:

I might be misinterpreting this but it seems you are happy to change the original model because kibble will bring expertise in running the club that the fans can't?

I know this is part of their selling point but to me it's not a positive. Are we really saying, let's give kibble this large chunk of shares and pass over the day to day running of the company (not playing side) as its a lot of hard work and the fans consortium won't be any good at either doing it or finding an individual who can?

Im still intrigued as to how all of this expertise kibble will be supplying SMFC will be financed as well.

Kibble services will be free to the club

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8 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

The funniest, but most sinister element in a this is the PR job that suggests Kibble (who are spending £300k on virtually worthless shares in a football club) are only doing this for the community!
Surely sinking £300k into a few community enterprises would be more appropriate if you aren't seeking to benefit financially? Lol

it expands their brand - they're not hiding that

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7 minutes ago, TPAFKATS said:

I might be misinterpreting this but it seems you are happy to change the original model because kibble will bring expertise in running the club that the fans can't?

I know this is part of their selling point but to me it's not a positive. Are we really saying, let's give kibble this large chunk of shares and pass over the day to day running of the company (not playing side) as its a lot of hard work and the fans consortium won't be any good at either doing it or finding an individual who can?

Im still intrigued as to how all of this expertise kibble will be supplying SMFC will be financed as well.

to be fair - does this deal not answer all of your concerns?

are smisa not bringing this deal to the table, to bring on board the necessary expertise that you mention?

it's actually a masterstroke by the fans group!

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Does anyone know if/when the Q&A's from last night will be available to view for the members that were unable to attend ?

Think I've only voted once since the start, but guess I should this time as it's a bit more important than voting for new hand driers for the bogs.

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I agree with your points above but it was how the whole thing was set up and you were one of the vocal drivers at it's inception. I have always had constitutional concerns with regards to SMiSA but accept that most of the members are really only in it as they see their contributions as a benefit to the club hence the small voting numbers each quarter etc
I got involved basically to use my experience, knowledge and expertise to build smisa and the club. I had misgivings about the real endgame of those involved, but thought it better to tackle that from the inside. I accepted there was no perfect deal in my or everyone's eyes.
To be sat down with lifelong saints fans who just wanted assurance their subscription would be ringfenced to buy 71% of the club they loved, then for them to allow me to set up their direct debit online was a privilege.
Now I feel for my part I have let them down, what was promised to them quickly started to dissolve, and it felt wrong.
Kibble are a good organisation, but they simply dont want the same things we want, therefore conflict is inevitable, and will harm both parties.

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2 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

I got involved basically to use my experience, knowledge and expertise to build smisa and the club. I had misgivings about the real endgame of those involved, but thought it better to tackle that from the inside. I accepted there was no perfect deal in my or everyone's eyes.
To be sat down with lifelong saints fans who just wanted assurance their subscription would be ringfenced to buy 71% of the club they loved, then for them to allow me to set up their direct debit online was a privilege.
Now I feel for my part I have let them down, what was promised to them quickly started to dissolve, and it felt wrong.
Kibble are a good organisation, but they simply dont want the same things we want, therefore conflict is inevitable, and will harm both parties.

you've not let anyone down, you tried your best, just you're unfortunately out of sync with the majority!

 

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2 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

I got involved basically to use my experience, knowledge and expertise to build smisa and the club. I had misgivings about the real endgame of those involved, but thought it better to tackle that from the inside. I accepted there was no perfect deal in my or everyone's eyes.
To be sat down with lifelong saints fans who just wanted assurance their subscription would be ringfenced to buy 71% of the club they loved, then for them to allow me to set up their direct debit online was a privilege.
Now I feel for my part I have let them down, what was promised to them quickly started to dissolve, and it felt wrong.
Kibble are a good organisation, but they simply dont want the same things we want, therefore conflict is inevitable, and will harm both parties.

Very honest LPM.....we have often locked horns but from my end it was more about your delivery than anything else, I have often recognised some of your concerns as similar to my own.

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6 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Ha, ha ha... good one!
That mean they see smfc as a charity case?
Everything Kibble do is paid for!

if it;s in a shareholders agreement, of benefit to St Mirren then it will benefit the kibble

and to be fair, it's not conflict that is of concern, alternative view points are to be encouraged.

It's the outcomes that are important - if these are agreeable and of benefit to all, then the partnership will work.

Edited by garzo

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1 minute ago, Lord Pityme said:
2 minutes ago, garzo said:
you've not let anyone down, you tried your best, just you're unfortunately out of sync with the majority!
 

Ahh it's a done deal then?

this particular deal has still to have a vote, so I'm not prejudging the outcome of it.

I'm observing you are out of sync on most other matters on here - I may be wrong though!

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if it;s in a shareholders agreement, of benefit to St Mirren then it will benefit the kibble
and to be fair, it's not conflict that is of concern, conflict and alternative view points are to be encouraged.
It's the outcomes that are important - if these are agreeable and of benefit to all, then the partnership will work.
Honest question for anyone/everyone.
If A.N. Other came along with a counter proposal to lend smisa the funds now to buy Scott's shares.
And that they would undertake to invest in building the club's community trust to advantage all in the local community. And invest in the playing/infrastructure of the club.
And in return would want to be chairman for say five year period then subject to vote if still keen.
How do you think you would vote?
And the above proposal ensured a smisa board majority.

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2 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

Honest question for anyone/everyone.
If A.N. Other came along with a counter proposal to lend smisa the funds now to buy Scott's shares.
And that they would undertake to invest in building the club's community trust to advantage all in the local community. And invest in the playing/infrastructure of the club.
And in return would want to be chairman for say five year period then subject to vote if still keen.
How do you think you would vote?
And the above proposal ensured a smisa board majority.

that offer is a bit short on detail, is it not?

the one we have in front of us at the moment is a bit more than 6 lines in a thread in the middle of a fans forum!

Come on get sensible Sir!

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1 minute ago, portmahomack saint said:

That's not what I heard ?  they said at the meeting they are service provider and that's how they make their money, 

not to detriment or cost to SMFC though, that's what I heard.
Worth following up on your point though - just to be clear.

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23 minutes ago, Lord Pityme said:

No that's just what Div wants you to think.

Div wants everyone to review the facts of the proposal and to make their own minds up about what way to vote.

Div doesn't mind if the proposal is defeated or accepted.

Either way Div will be a SMiSA member for ever more.

Div doesn't do walking away.

Don't speak for Div thank you very much, Div can do it for himself.

ps; Let's not forget that Div is giving you the public platform to absolutely slate the Kibble, SMiSA, the club, the board and the chairman. I'm all for free speech.

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to be fair - does this deal not answer all of your concerns?
are smisa not bringing this deal to the table, to bring on board the necessary expertise that you mention?
it's actually a masterstroke by the fans group!
It's being sold as a deal that seems to good to be true. My only concern is there doesn't appear to be substance behind the claims.
Still can't see what they get back for their significant investment (time and money)

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