Coronavirus

[Hiram Abiff]

3 hours ago, oaksoft said:

the NHS is still heading for overflow regardless of whether the daily death rates continue to be flat.

Wrong again

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18377095.coronavirus-scotland-half-icu-beds-empty/

[ALBIONSAINT]

13 hours ago, faraway saint said:

That's his style, a shock jock with no limits, that's why he had a post deleted a few days ago. 

So he is as popular as Bob Fleming at the checkout queue in Asda 

[Guest TPAFKATS]

10 hours ago, Cookie Monster said:

Are you using a name that represents about half the population as an insult?

Now call me cynical but could you provide evidence of any threats that I or whoever you are referring to. Allegations of lying, surely are against some kind of rule of moderation on this site.

Or are you mates of the moderator or site owner and exempt from any disciplinary action?

He's off his heid. Lockdown making him worse.

[Guest TPAFKATS]

Sky news reporting that when the gov minister stated on Saturday that the ppe flight was on its way from Turkey, it hadn't even been requested. 

Order not placed until Sunday according to their sources in Turkey. 

With regards to EU scheme for ppe, lab supplies and ventilators senior civil servant tells Westminster select Committee that it was a political decision to stay out of this scheme. 

Few hours later he issues a statement clarifying that it wasn't a political decision. 

This is now the 4th explanation offered for not being in this scheme. 

Meantime 25 eu countries get ready to start receiving over 120 billion of equipment. 

[faraway saint]

Vaccine being tested this week in the UK.

Fingers crossed this proves to be successful. 

https://www.euronews.com/2020/04/21/coronavirus-scientists-in-the-uk-to-begin-testing-vaccine-on-humans-this-week

 

[faraway saint]

New cases................down

People in hospital.........................down.

Deaths........................peak on 6th April and steadily dropping.

Poor Oaky, his new job as the prophet of doom has been furloughed. 

[shull]

 

[shull]

 

[shull]

 

[faraway saint]

Aye, them bad polis, the public are always right...........................what a fecking tadger this guy is..................on his way to Brighton because he was bored and wanted fresh air. 

A spokesperson for the force said: "At around 1pm on Monday 20 April, officers from Kent Police's Roads Policing Unit stopped a vehicle after they spotted the driver using a mobile phone on the westbound carriageway of the M25 prior to the Clacket Lane motorway service area.

"The driver, a man in his 30s from the Romford area, was reported for using a mobile phone whilst driving, driving while three child passengers were not wearing seatbelts and driving without insurance.

"As the occupants were not from the area they were reminded of their personal responsibilities in relation to the government's instructions around essential travel.

"The uninsured vehicle was seized and the group made their own arrangements to return home."

[ALBIONSAINT]

2 hours ago, faraway saint said:

New cases................down

People in hospital.........................down.

Deaths........................peak on 6th April and steadily dropping.

Poor Oaky, his new job as the prophet of doom has been furloughed. 

Ring,ring, ring ring, Hello, yes I would like to register for universal credit please, work? No, I have one more job to do up in Arbroath then that’s me finished for now. 

[bazil85]

13 hours ago, Hiram Abiff said:

Nothing to do with the lockdown according to Professor Carl Heneghan, Director of the Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine at Oxford University

https://news.yahoo.com/lockdown-damage-outweighs-coronavirus-warning-121940675.html

The nature of this is you'll always find contrasting views, the media will seek them out and it's because so much isn't known regarding the virus.

You keep mentioning Sweden, UK has 130k cases with a strict lockdown, Sweden has 15k without. This shows they categorically can't be compared in the way you are. Do you think if we followed Sweden's lead the 130k would go down? Of course not, same as countries like Spain and Italy, we've had to take this strategy to limit a disease that's currently got a close to 10% death rate in this country. 

To think we should lift the lockdown and just let a lot more people die is a very harsh view. We know there will be deaths from the lock-down, there is no solution that removes deaths one way or another. Here's a useful graph that highlights the current scenario regarding increase in deaths linked to coronavirus and otherwise. It's a no brainer to keep the lockdown and have a slow re-open strategy that will hopeflly come in the next few weeks.

You spent pages talking about "no excessive deaths" not that long ago. Do you agree that was wrong? You must see a pattern in you jumping the gun in your view.  

 

[faraway saint]

5 minutes ago, Yflab said:

Imagine having to be in lockdown in Sweden with this lot.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's ma garden yesterday. 

[faraway saint]

1 minute ago, Yflab said:

And you wasted all that time power washing?

Wasn't wasted, the girls had to bring me drinks and wipe me down. 

 

[Hiram Abiff]

You okay with this @bazil85?

This is what your lockdown is causing.

David Beasley is the head of the UN’s World Food Program, and on Tuesday he warned that we could actually see famines of “biblical proportions” by the end of this calendar year.  The following comes from ABC News…

The coronavirus pandemic could soon double hunger, causing famines of “biblical proportions” around the world by the end of the year, the head of the World Food Programme, David Beasley, told the U.N. Security Council on Tuesday.

Beasley warned that analysis from the World Food Programme, the U.N.’s food-assistance branch, shows that because of the coronavirus, “an additional 130 million people could be pushed to the brink of starvation by the end of 2020. That’s a total of 265 million people.”
 

[oaksoft]

If there's any truth in this FT report, then the situation is much worse than is being reported by the government.

https://www.ft.com/content/67e6a4ee-3d05-43bc-ba03-e239799fa6ab

This would make those death rates of 800-odd more than half the true value.

Interestingly, Carl Henegan has been quoted in that article. Something that @Hiram Abiff should appreciate given that he name-checked him further up this page.

Carl Henegan, professor of evidence based medicine at Oxford university, said the deadly effects of Covid-19 were much more marked than during a bad outbreak of seasonal influenza. I don’t think we’ve ever seen such a sharp upturn in deaths at that rate,” he said. The 2017-18 seasonal flu outbreak may have killed 50,000 in the UK but “the reason we did not get alarmed then was that they were spread out over many weeks”.

It's very clear that you can't trust government daily death figures.

Edited April 22, 2020 by oaksoft

[Hiram Abiff]

50% of ICU beds empty, 40% of all hospital beds empty, 70% reduction in people seeking help for cancer symptoms, thousands dying in the U.K. from lockdown and hundreds of millions worldwide to die of starvation including millions of children. Social media filled with NHS staff doing well rehearsed dance routines in empty wards. 

Any lives this illegal lockdown *may* save is going to be swamped by the numbers it will kill.

People in the U.K. working from home on full pay, or on a long holiday getting 80% from the government. Yes, dead easy to support the lockdown. To quote a favourite phrase of the moment, “you’re killing people” 

 

[Bud the Baker]

6 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

If there's any truth in this FT report, then the situation is much worse than is being reported by the government.

https://www.ft.com/content/67e6a4ee-3d05-43bc-ba03-e239799fa6ab

This would make those death rates of 800-odd more than half the true value.

Interestingly, Carl Henegan has been quoted in that article. Something that @Hiram Abiff should appreciate given that he name-checked him further up this page.

Carl Henegan, professor of evidence based medicine at Oxford university, said the deadly effects of Covid-19 were much more marked than during a bad outbreak of seasonal influenza. I don’t think we’ve ever seen such a sharp upturn in deaths at that rate,” he said. The 2017-18 seasonal flu outbreak may have killed 50,000 in the UK but “the reason we did not get alarmed then was that they were spread out over many weeks”.

It's very clear that you can't trust government daily death figures.

The daily death figures "only counts those who have died in hospitals after testing positive for the virus."  estimates of the actual death attributable to the virus are between 40% to the FTs 136% (the highest I've seen) above the banner figure.

Hiram may also be correct when he says the lockdown will kill more than it saves the problem as ever is nobody really knows & until the correct procedure is toerr on the side of caution and continue with the lockdown. 

[faraway saint]

Today's numbers, that's not fantasy numbers, show 763, down from 826 yesterday.

Conforming the worst, barring any major changes in the current instructions, has passed. 

Looking at the trend in other countries the decline is pretty slow, if gradual. 

I wouldn't expect drastic drops in the next week or so. 

[Hiram Abiff]

Coronavirus: World risks 'biblical' famines due to pandemic - UN
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-52373888

[Hiram Abiff]

Report in The Lancet states that school closures have minimal or no impact 

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(20)30095-X/fulltext

Edited April 22, 2020 by Hiram Abiff

[bazil85]

1 hour ago, Hiram Abiff said:

You okay with this @bazil85?

This is what your lockdown is causing.

David Beasley is the head of the UN’s World Food Program, and on Tuesday he warned that we could actually see famines of “biblical proportions” by the end of this calendar year.  The following comes from ABC News…

The coronavirus pandemic could soon double hunger, causing famines of “biblical proportions” around the world by the end of the year, the head of the World Food Programme, David Beasley, told the U.N. Security Council on Tuesday.

Beasley warned that analysis from the World Food Programme, the U.N.’s food-assistance branch, shows that because of the coronavirus, “an additional 130 million people could be pushed to the brink of starvation by the end of 2020. That’s a total of 265 million people.”
 

Right now even with lockdown, deaths with Coronavirus mentioned are far above expectations for this time of the year. They easily outstrip Excess deaths for anything else. I am not claiming this is the perfect solution but common sense would tell anyone that lifting lockdown would accelerate the death count significantly. 

As for your point, no I wouldn’t be happy. We need to try make sure that doesn’t happen. The solution is not killing off many thousands more people by ending the lockdown, do you disagree with that & see many more lives as expendable?
 

We need to have a smart exit strategy not just open everything up & let round about 10% of the population that get this disease die because someone on the internet made a prediction. 
 

[bazil85]

1 hour ago, Hiram Abiff said:

50% of ICU beds empty, 40% of all hospital beds empty, 70% reduction in people seeking help for cancer symptoms, thousands dying in the U.K. from lockdown and hundreds of millions worldwide to die of starvation including millions of children. Social media filled with NHS staff doing well rehearsed dance routines in empty wards. 

Any lives this illegal lockdown *may* save is going to be swamped by the numbers it will kill.

People in the U.K. working from home on full pay, or on a long holiday getting 80% from the government. Yes, dead easy to support the lockdown. To quote a favourite phrase of the moment, “you’re killing people” 

 

The vast majority of excess deaths in Uk right now compared to previous years are Covid19 noted. You can’t make a claim the lockdown is causing more deaths than the virus. You’re wish not to have a lockdown would be killing more people based on statistics. 

Statists are also showing lockdown has slowed the spread of the virus, logically & evidence based on that, those percentages of ICU & hospital beds would evaporate if we didn’t lockdown. 
 

you’d think you’d learn to hold your tongue after being continuously proven wrong when going against the near global expert advice 😂

[Hiram Abiff]

Stringent lockdowns tend to be linked to higher infection rates

The Oxford University Coronavirus Government Response Tracker compares around 150 countries giving them a stringency score that reflects how strict a country's lockdown measures are. Oxford has plotted the stringency index against the number of Covid-19 cases for that country.

The trend line indicates that stricter lockdown measures are associated with an increased spread of the virus:

 

Edited April 22, 2020 by Hiram Abiff

[FTOF]

There are very few available statistics that prove anything at present.

Most of the data we have is flawed, in one way or another. It will take a significant amount of time to sort out which data is reliable and which isn't.

What is not up for argument is that the UK was hugely underprepared for this pandemic.

The main thing is that we learn from the many mistakes that have been made, and that we use any reliable data on how best to get out of the current situation and to make sure we're better prepared the next time.

Edited April 22, 2020 by FTOF