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57 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

So they are comparable to Fred Goodwin? 😅😅😅

I haven't been able to find much about this supposed failed project online. Was it the same level as the RBS failures comparable to the Kibble? Was it all down to the employee(s) that are now involved at St Mirren? Is there more to the story than what some overwhelmingly negative St Mirren fans claim on a fan forum? 

Can you also show whatever did happen shows the person/ people don't have the ability to do the job at St Mirren? My view is people should not have their whole career governed by past mistakes/ actions (within reason). If they did, the workforce today would be a lot smaller than it is. 

Typical deflection as usual. The Fred analogy was used to demonstrate that Fred was unlikely  to be accepted to take the same role elsewhere as he was still the scapegoat for the RBS failure, when you were stating people should not be judged on their failures in previous roles.

In the real commercial world,(unless your a civil servant) your only as good as your last job. 

The Peter Principalemployees are promoted based on their success in previous jobs until they reach a level at which they are no longer competent, as skills in one job do not necessarily translate to another”

The problem we have in our current workforce is we have a reverse pyramid. Everyone is a manager, line manager, executive, director or other buzz line. All of them managing no one including themselves. This brings no accountability and an inability of management to ever admit they got it wrong. 

 

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23 minutes ago, Brilliant Disguise said:

Typical deflection as usual. The Fred analogy was used to demonstrate that Fred was unlikely  to be accepted to take the same role elsewhere as he was still the scapegoat for the RBS failure, when you were stating people should not be judged on their failures in previous roles.

In the real commercial world,(unless your a civil servant) your only as good as your last job. 

The Peter Principalemployees are promoted based on their success in previous jobs until they reach a level at which they are no longer competent, as skills in one job do not necessarily translate to another”

The problem we have in our current workforce is we have a reverse pyramid. Everyone is a manager, line manager, executive, director or other buzz line. All of them managing no one including themselves. This brings no accountability and an inability of management to ever admit they got it wrong. 

 

I get the Fred analogy, my point was on it really being comparable? As you say, he was largely scapegoated but the public perception & reputational points mean there was practically zero chance of him walking back into another similar role. Could he perform a similar role again based only on experience and capability? I imagine so. As for not being judged on previous roles, it is of course within reason. Fred a good example based on public opinion and reputation where he should be, as the negative impacts for a financial institution taking him on as CEO would likely far outweigh any positives he could bring. For me it's exception to the rule and I don't think it should be across the board, you make a bad mistake or a costly error in judgement that's your career in that industry in the bin. 

My further points regarding it being comparable on a smaller scale. Did the people involved with St Mirren now make such a massive mistakes/ were they required to be scapegoated on the same level that they should NEVER be given a similar opportunity again anywhere? I've seen zero proof of that, in fact it doesn't look like the mistakes were even big enough for them to lose their association with the Kibble. I also have no idea of their other successes in previous roles, other successful projects, how they mitigated situations in this project, the circumstances. In my experience interviewing, often the best examples of integrity, resourcefulness, collaboration come from challenging situations where mistakes have been made (sometimes costly) and how people react to them. 

I hadn't even heard of this situation on here or in any Paisley circles until Slash brought it up. Given the negativity of the poster & those that followed, this leads me to believe there is exaggeration to the extent of the problem. The money sounds big when quoted in isolation with none of the project context. 

Can you demonstrate that last point re: SMFC? 

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2 minutes ago, waldorf34 said:

To get back on track have all the season tickets been posted out ,and if you dont get them on time can we still use the barcode on our letters?

Yes you can still use the barcodes on emails, the bacodes on season tickets are the same. 

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4 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Can you demonstrate that last point re: SMFC? 

My last point was a generalisation of how the private and public sector are working. I don’t know the inner sanctum workings of SMFC. (I will leva that to you)

However i note that we have the following

A CEO, Chairman, GM, Directors, Non Exec Directors, Commercial Mangers, Head of Brand Management to name a few. Seems top heavy to me.

Do we have a Head Chef to make the sausage rolls

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7 minutes ago, Brilliant Disguise said:

My last point was a generalisation of how the private and public sector are working. I don’t know the inner sanctum workings of SMFC. (I will leva that to you)

However i note that we have the following

A CEO, Chairman, GM, Directors, Non Exec Directors, Commercial Mangers, Head of Brand Management to name a few. Seems top heavy to me.

Do we have a Head Chef to make the sausage rolls

Of course it does and if we had less it would seem understaffed to you. You demonstrate repeatedly that the club can do no right in your eyes. 

On a completely unrelated topic, Motherwell FC who have their own fan ownership model:

CEO Alan Burrows

Chairman Jim McMahon 

Directors Douglas Dickie, Tom Freeley, Andrew Wilson

General Manager Charlie Bennett

Commercial Manager Diane Harvey 

Head of Brand Grant Russell 

Almost like clubs around that size have similar senior staff roles filled. 

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45 minutes ago, waldorf34 said:

To get back on track have all the season tickets been posted out ,and if you dont get them on time can we still use the barcode on our letters?

My physical season ticket barcode is identical to the emailed version at time of purchase.

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11 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Of course it does and if we had less it would seem understaffed to you. You demonstrate repeatedly that the club can do no right in your eyes. 

On a completely unrelated topic, Motherwell FC who have their own fan ownership model:

CEO Alan Burrows

Chairman Jim McMahon 

Directors Douglas Dickie, Tom Freeley, Andrew Wilson

General Manager Charlie Bennett

Commercial Manager Diane Harvey 

Head of Brand Grant Russell 

Almost like clubs around that size have similar senior staff roles filled. 

Well when the club have that much management yet manage to make an arse of all of the issues that come out of this summer then questions need to be asked. What do they discuss when they meet. the lottery numbers 

 

Interesting that you mentioned Motherwell

Season ticket renewals issued on time. In fact PR stunt on offering season ticket holders the chance to cash in from last year

Sponsorship Deal sewn up

Shirt Sales in place prior to start of season

Stewarding Company in place for start of season

Pie Stall in place for start of season

Club Shop in place for start of season

Complaint certification for emergency escape lighting]

More than 1000 fans for first home game (after freedom day)

Fans have season tickets to attend games

Visiting fans and non season ticket holders able to buy a ticket from their webpage

 

So if Motherwell have the same management structure yet get all of those things right. What are ours doing to get them all wrong all at the same time or have they proven Peters Principal correct.

The aspect to that appears to be forgotten is that with a Pandemic being in place the club had more time than normal to get these in place.n In isolation one of these is a minor teething problem. Accumulatively these infer there are fundamental problems with a lack of proper management and leadership.

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4 minutes ago, Brilliant Disguise said:

Well when the club have that much management yet manage to make an arse of all of the issues that come out of this summer then questions need to be asked. What do they discuss when they meet. the lottery numbers 

 

Interesting that you mentioned Motherwell

Season ticket renewals issued on time. In fact PR stunt on offering season ticket holders the chance to cash in from last year

Sponsorship Deal sewn up

Shirt Sales in place prior to start of season

Stewarding Company in place for start of season

Pie Stall in place for start of season

Club Shop in place for start of season

Complaint certification for emergency escape lighting]

More than 1000 fans for first home game (after freedom day)

Fans have season tickets to attend games

Visiting fans and non season ticket holders able to buy a ticket from their webpage

 

So if Motherwell have the same management structure yet get all of those things right. What are ours doing to get them all wrong all at the same time or have they proven Peters Principal correct.

The aspect to that appears to be forgotten is that with a Pandemic being in place the club had more time than normal to get these in place.n In isolation one of these is a minor teething problem. Accumulatively these infer there are fundamental problems with a lack of proper management and leadership.

I’m sure Motherwell will have went through challenging summers in the past as well. As I have pointed out, practically all of those issues are very short term in a time of a big transition with our clubs ownership & operating model. 
 

Your expectations that should happen with absolutely no teething problems whatsoever is completely unrealistic. 
 

You do highlight the inability for the club to do right in your eyes yet again though. Not only is everything falling apart in your view, the club should be trying to handle it with a fraction of the management staff we have right now despite it being similar to a club that seemingly had quite a settled summer.
 

😂 honestly can’t script it, the club just can’t win. 

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Got the 3 of ours today. Hopefully they works on Saturday.
I cannot wait for the Utd game. Cards easier to remember than paper barcode, catering is open to introduce my son to a pie and bovril and after speaking to him Marcus Fraser is going to come to the barrier when warming up to allow my son to thank him for his signed boots. The wee man is very excited for this and to show him his Fraser 22 top.

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24 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

As I have pointed out, practically all of those issues are very short term in a time of a big transition with our clubs ownership & operating model

Are you claiming that all of the issues relate to the change in ownership and operating model.

My understanding of this that the shareholders of the club changed not the management. The Directors had a wee game of musical chairs. (2 of which were already the kibble)

Or are you claiming that the running of the club was put on hold until the shareholders changed hands.

Your excuse a poor smokescreen to key aspects to running a football club.

ie How do get your consumer to give you money. Simple Give them something to buy. 

 

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

Did the people involved with St Mirren now make such a massive mistakes/ were they required to be scapegoated on the same level that they should NEVER be given a similar opportunity again anywhere?

Stop repeating this as though someone other than YOU said it. 

To use your words “I've seen zero proof of anyone making such a statement apart from YOU!”

I am giving you a final chance to prove that someone said what you implied.

Maybe it’s time your mummy and daddy limit your time on the Internet.

Edited by Slash
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8 minutes ago, Brilliant Disguise said:

Are you claiming that all of the issues relate to the change in ownership and operating model.

My understanding of this that the shareholders of the club changed not the management. The Directors had a wee game of musical chairs. (2 of which were already the kibble)

Or are you claiming that the running of the club was put on hold until the shareholders changed hands.

Your excuse a poor smokescreen to key aspects to running a football club.

ie How do get your consumer to give you money. Simple Give them something to buy. 

 

The benefit of the Kibble coming onboard were linked to changes that could be made in operating model. The pandemic put the breaks on some aspects to an extent but we are now seeing that more & it has caused a few (short-term) issues, which I think is a pretty unreasonable to think could be completely avoided. Such as with contracts, staffing changes, commercial aspects and legacy issues such as addressing stadium/ training centre infrastructure.
 

There are other issues of course but from what I can tell, pretty much short-term as well. Updating our ticketing systems & club sponsor changing terms for example.

I’m yet to see anything that’s causing me long-term concern. Some will obviously disagree but I’m sure any right minded individual will agree, the above are largely short-term issues. 

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7 minutes ago, Slash said:

Stop repeating this as though someone other than YOU said it. 

To use your words “I've seen zero proof of anyone making such a statement apart from YOU!”

I am giving you a final chance to prove that someone said what you implied.

Maybe it’s time your mummy and daddy limit your time on the Internet.

You’re lashing out again.
 

You & BD have both pushed the agenda on the previous Kibble project & how it should impact the colleague/ colleagues brought to SMFC. I’ll ask again, can someone share details on this disastrous event? 

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14 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

The benefit of the Kibble coming onboard were linked to changes that could be made in operating model. The pandemic put the breaks on some aspects to an extent but we are now seeing that more & it has caused a few (short-term) issues, which I think is a pretty unreasonable to think could be completely avoided.

Is that a Freudian slip? It would explain a lot.
 

The correct spelling is brakes.

 

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20 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

The benefit of the Kibble coming onboard were linked to changes that could be made in operating model. The pandemic put the breaks on some aspects to an extent but we are now seeing that more & it has caused a few (short-term) issues, which I think is a pretty unreasonable to think could be completely avoided. Such as with contracts, staffing changes, commercial aspects and legacy issues such as addressing stadium/ training centre infrastructure

Who is the we you refer to. Is that a give away to your employer.

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Kibble’s new events and entertainment centre was officially opened in 2016 by the Deputy First Minister, John Swinney MSP. ‘The Experience’ is based in the former Rolls-Royce aero engine factory in Hillington Park and hosts Scotland’s first indoor electric Go-kart track. Developed in three phases, the venue has already been given 5-star accreditation by Visit Scotland.

“It might sound like an unusual combination to have culinary arts mixed with go-karting, but with 70% of 16-19 year olds starting their careers in the hospitality industry, The Experience gives young people meaningful opportunities. I have no doubt that destinations of their careers have been helped by the knowledge and confidence received by being in a supportive workplace. As a social enterprise, The Experience will operate on a sustainable model to provide opportunities for years to come.”

Eileen Cummings, Director of Young Workforce Development, Kibble Group

https://www.socialinvestmentscotland.com/all-case-studies/603/

The Experience will be turned into a skills academy now. Maybe basic accounting skills could be taught. 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/local-news/youth-charity-kibble-transform-entertainment-22521137

I read the CEO blames the pandemic for the closure. That nasty virus can even burn right through £1.9M.

It also got the blame for many failures at our club. Maybe it caused the Health & Safety issue too? 

Edited by Slash
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