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The AGM via Zoom


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Just as predicted. 

The meeting’s content is selected. Board members get to know the questions in advance. So will prepare their answers before moving quickly to the next question “in order to get as many questions asked as possible”.And just to add insult the questions have to be emailed to a Kibble employee!

Result? The entire proceedings are tightly controlled from start to finish and that since joining the board and taking it over, neither Kibble director has yet faced any fans meeting including at two AGMs. Thus denying fans the right of reply.

The following was sent to shareholders today. My translation is in bold.


Good Afternoon Shareholders
 
As you are aware, we will be hosting our AGM on Thursday 27 January virtually via ZOOM conferencing. The details of Zoom have been shared with you previously. To help make this AGM run smoothly we would please ask your cooperation with the following:

Meaning: To help us keep as far removed from answering the questions that matter please

Prior to the AGM Meeting
 
1.    If possible, can you reply to this email by 2pm on Wednesday 26 January if you are planning on attending the AGM virtually.
2.    If you have a question you wish raised at the AGM, if you could again reply to this email by 2pm on Wednesday 26 January outlining your question, this will allow us to collate questions for the Directors in advance of the meeting. 

Meaning: we need to get our story straight so need to know what will be asked. Just like last year we can ditch the difficult questions.
 

On the day of the meeting
 
1.    There will be a virtual waiting room in operation where we will verify identity prior to the meeting starting

Meaning: We hope there is not a room full of people watching at your end.

2.    The waiting room will open at 7 pm and close at 7.30 pm to allow the meeting to start promptly.
3.    Upon admittance to the meeting all cameras and will be turned off and sound muted.

Meaning: Shareholders participation will be non-existent. You will not be allowed to speak.
 
During the meeting
 
1.    All cameras and sound must remain muted.
2.    The Board of Directors will be visible and unmuted.
3.    Any questions on the night should be emailed to [email protected], these will be grouped and forwarded to the chair for response.

Meaning: On the night we will silence two way communication, therby controlling every aspect of the proceeding.

This meeting is not legitimate. 

Will they answer the Asigura questions? Why did they act as Kibble and not SMFC directors to report JN to the SFA and then speak to the press immediately after? Do all directors agree with this farce? Are the financial rumours true as this meeting is considering figures that are over a year old?

 

 

Watch the meeting with all this in mind and ask what is missing because as always it is not what is asked but what is not asked that matters.


 

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Up until now, I have not had the urge to post on this forum, although I have followed it for years.

I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion.

I am a shareholder, a supporter through thick and thin, for almost 60 years, and have spent Thousands of pounds on following The Saints as well as taking advertising, sponsorship and other forms of support to the club.

So, therefore I dont talk lightly about MY club.

I have information, from within the club, that we are in severe financial difficulty, and could end up on the same administration route as the likes of Derby County!

This is not conjecture, but from someone who should know!

This is in part SMISA's fault as well as our chairman and the current board of directors.

SMISA's intentions were good and I bought into the concept initially, but after a few false promises withdrew my membership.

We are being called 'A fan owned club'.  We are not!

Yes, SMISA own 51% shares but only have joint control with a charity who own 27% shares!

The charity also pay a general manager to run The Football Club on a daily basis.

How can this be allowed? she is surely biased towards her paymasters!

The Charity have self elected board members on our football club. Who and when were they elected?

Have any of these people supported St Mirren at any time in their lives? I doubt it!

Yet SMISA, who;s supporters have been spending their hard earned cash for years in the hope that they will one day own the club,

are sold down the river as they do not have control as promised.

The silence from SMISA id deafening!

We are informed that the AGM will take place by zoom. WHY?

Last year because of covid I could understand it, but we could have had a face to face AGM either indoors or outdoors at the stadium.

A real chance to clear the air, to answer questions direct, to build bridges!

Our questions have to be submitted in advance, so therefore can be 'selected' to be answered.

So if your question is selected, you have to accept the answer without the chance to ask a supplementary question.

This just stinks, and when (if) our club die, will any of the charity care? I doubt it!

i cannot emphasise enough what this means to me. and i am being let down by the people that I have trusted to have ;custody of my club!

 

Oh, I have never met 'animal' nor do I know who he is. But listen to him. He is hearing the same as me.........

    I now await ridicule from Charity 'plants' on this Forum

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36 minutes ago, Sidmirren said:

Why are you even on a St Mirren forum ? A new guy makes a contribution and you can't wait to troll and belittle him. You hate St Mirren and you hate St Mirren fans . A pathetic wee man .

:lol:

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32 minutes ago, Sidmirren said:

Why are you even on a St Mirren forum ? A new guy makes a contribution and you can't wait to troll and belittle him. You hate St Mirren and you hate St Mirren fans . A pathetic wee man .

As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint, there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues this poster has claimed.

"we are in severe financial difficulty" "could end up on the same administration route as the likes of Derby" "when (if) our club die,"

The moans and views shared throughout the post highlight their position and they are very clearly trying to dramatize the position the club is in to add weight to their anger at how the club is being run under the fan ownership model. 

There are several potential culprits here.

 

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4 hours ago, bazil85 said:

As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint, there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues this poster has claimed.

"we are in severe financial difficulty" "could end up on the same administration route as the likes of Derby" "when (if) our club die,"

 

 

Basil,

Rather than poke fun at the new poster ("very clearly trying to dramatize the position the club is in") wouldn't it be a better idea for you to ask one of the Smisa board about our financial position, assuming you know at least one of the many members of the Smisa board?

Goodie2shoes makes an impassioned plea i.e. "I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion" yet both you and faraway Saint can't help but do so - "As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint" in response to a laughing face? Have I missed something because a laughing face isn't what I would call a summary?

As it so happens, I've been told a very similar story about the current financial state of the club but I guess you won't believe me seeing as your modus operandi is to adopt a "Kibble are Good" position followed by a criticism on whoever posts a view contrary to yours. My information has come from a person I trust but, even so,  I can't come on here and say that I know for certain that it's true so I struggle to understand your assertion that  "there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues". How do you know there is zero danger? Have you had an update since May from the board? 

Of course, I understand that you're only offering a personal opinion but you have framed it as a matter of fact, not opinion.

Due to what I've been told privately, I believe we could very well be in trouble but the AGM's accounts will not reflect that problem seeing as they only show the financial picture up until May last year. 

No need to reply to my rhetorical questions - although I concede that you seem to enjoy having the last word - but I suggest you don't rush to judge posters such as the new guy. He seems to be a loyal, concerned fan who is worried about the club.

For the record, I find his post to be credible but I could be wrong, only time will tell - and that is merely my opinion.

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Basil,
Rather than poke fun at the new poster ("very clearly trying to dramatize the position the club is in") wouldn't it be a better idea for you to ask one of the Smisa board about our financial position, assuming you know at least one of the many members of the Smisa board?
Goodie2shoes makes an impassioned plea i.e. "I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion" yet both you and faraway Saint can't help but do so - "As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint" in response to a laughing face? Have I missed something because a laughing face isn't what I would call a summary?
As it so happens, I've been told a very similar story about the current financial state of the club but I guess you won't believe me seeing as your modus operandi is to adopt a "Kibble are Good" position followed by a criticism on whoever posts a view contrary to yours. My information has come from a person I trust but, even so,  I can't come on here and say that I know for certain that it's true so I struggle to understand your assertion that  "there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues". How do you know there is zero danger? Have you had an update since May from the board? 
Of course, I understand that you're only offering a personal opinion but you have framed it as a matter of fact, not opinion.
Due to what I've been told privately, I believe we could very well be in trouble but the AGM's accounts will not reflect that problem seeing as they only show the financial picture up until May last year. 
No need to reply to my rhetorical questions - although I concede that you seem to enjoy having the last word - but I suggest you don't rush to judge posters such as the new guy. He seems to be a loyal, concerned fan who is worried about the club.
For the record, I find his post to be credible but I could be wrong, only time will tell - and that is merely my opinion.


Sent from my HD1913 using Tapatalk

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No evidence presented so far to suggest we are in a financial mess.

Given we took circa £1.2M Covid loan payable over 20years, then there must have been heaps of sausage rolls and prawn sandwiches being consumed in the bored room.

If people are hearing such information get it posted as it’s critical that questions are asked at the AGM on Thursday.

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44 minutes ago, doakie said:

Goodie2shoes makes an impassioned plea i.e. "I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion" yet both you and faraway Saint can't help but do so - "As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint" in response to a laughing face? Have I missed something because a laughing face isn't what I would call a summary?

 

Let me give you a little more than my laughing face.

A "new poster" comes wading in with quite serious statements, canoodling up with "animal" (LPM for some clarity, who has had a long running feud with everybody/anybody related to the club, the Kibble and SMISA) 

I don't believe this "newe poster" is new at all, and could easily be another alias of an existing poster, who knows. 

I, personally, don't give a flying feck what people "have heard", I prefer to see some facts and even then, what will be will be.

Aye, there's, IMO, poor management going on at the club, after the numerous debacles over the summer and thereafter, which is disappointing.

That's about as much as I will say on this matter.

As you say, merely an opinion, which is a valid as anyone's, which, in the bigger picture, doesn't amount to very much. 

 

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3 hours ago, doakie said:

Basil,

Rather than poke fun at the new poster ("very clearly trying to dramatize the position the club is in") wouldn't it be a better idea for you to ask one of the Smisa board about our financial position, assuming you know at least one of the many members of the Smisa board?

Goodie2shoes makes an impassioned plea i.e. "I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion" yet both you and faraway Saint can't help but do so - "As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint" in response to a laughing face? Have I missed something because a laughing face isn't what I would call a summary?

As it so happens, I've been told a very similar story about the current financial state of the club but I guess you won't believe me seeing as your modus operandi is to adopt a "Kibble are Good" position followed by a criticism on whoever posts a view contrary to yours. My information has come from a person I trust but, even so,  I can't come on here and say that I know for certain that it's true so I struggle to understand your assertion that  "there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues". How do you know there is zero danger? Have you had an update since May from the board? 

Of course, I understand that you're only offering a personal opinion but you have framed it as a matter of fact, not opinion.

Due to what I've been told privately, I believe we could very well be in trouble but the AGM's accounts will not reflect that problem seeing as they only show the financial picture up until May last year. 

No need to reply to my rhetorical questions - although I concede that you seem to enjoy having the last word - but I suggest you don't rush to judge posters such as the new guy. He seems to be a loyal, concerned fan who is worried about the club.

For the record, I find his post to be credible but I could be wrong, only time will tell - and that is merely my opinion.

No, I wouldn’t say so. If someone is going to make a completely baseless claim that we are in severe financial difficulty to the point we could possibly fold, they have burden of proof. There is nothing to back this up & his moans following it highlights there is quite a good chance of it just being an anti SMISA/ Kibble agenda. 
 

If I come on here and say Jim Goodwin is in serious trouble with the police & could be going to jail, I have heard this privately, Would it be fair for me to expect you to check that up with Jim Goodwin with absolutely no basis for my comment? Same logic applies imo. 
 

You may have heard similar, you may not. It may be reliable, I highly doubt it but will be the first to hold my hands up if something comes out. What I would say though, that seems pretty coincidental that you’ve also had a bit to say about the running of the club recently. What a strange turn of events it would be someone like that, that hears these rumours… 
 

As for your points on ‘kibble good’ and me framing things as fact. I don’t understand the agenda of some to hang the kibble at this point when very little has actually came out about what they’ve supposedly done wrong & it’s certainly a fact that there’s nothing in the fans sphere of common knowledge on these administration claims. You confirm this yourself by saying ‘private’

I’ll believe it when I see it would be a good way to summarise but I don’t think people should be let off on a fan forum not being challenge on these claims. 
 

As for your point on the ‘new guy’ it is just my view but I don’t believe it for a second. 
 

Your points on last words etc. i do enjoy this side of the debate on BAWA, I have never hid that but I would say I have relaxed on it recently 😀

(by the way, started typing this as a distraction to the poor second half start, what a goal though) 

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Heard an interesting story at the game last night from a club insider. It seems that the email instructions of the AGM that was sent out was, as I said, not legitimate.
Been told that the board have to quote, ‘been forced by the number of complaints to bring in some kind of live spoken questioning of board members to make sure they comply with companies house rules’. 
I have no reason to doubt this. 
This was not the format indicated by the club so we will see.
If this is true it represents an incredible climb down and an embarrassment to the board and more so to Fibble’s self-proclaimed increased professionalism! 
Sorry to point to that Bazil, at least we agree on the goal last night. I nearly landed on the dug out.

Maybe Goodie two Shoes might want to ask his contact if this is happening.

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17 minutes ago, animal said:

Heard an interesting story at the game last night from a club insider. It seems that the email instructions of the AGM that was sent out was, as I said, not legitimate.
Been told that the board have to quote, ‘been forced by the number of complaints to bring in some kind of live spoken questioning of board members to make sure they comply with companies house rules’. 
I have no reason to doubt this. 
This was not the format indicated by the club so we will see.
If this is true it represents an incredible climb down and an embarrassment to the board and more so to Fibble’s self-proclaimed increased professionalism! 
Sorry to point to that Bazil, at least we agree on the goal last night. I nearly landed on the dug out.

Maybe Goodie two Shoes might want to ask his contact if this is happening.

Reminds me a bit of the film Me, Myself and Irene... Just without the Irene part. :whistle

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15 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

No evidence presented so far to suggest we are in a financial mess.

Given we took circa £1.2M Covid loan payable over 20years, then there must have been heaps of sausage rolls and prawn sandwiches being consumed in the bored room.

If people are hearing such information get it posted as it’s critical that questions are asked at the AGM on Thursday.

For the purposes of accuracy, let me point out that the loan is not a financial asset, it is a debt. It has to be repaid so there are consequences if we start spending it recklessly. My understanding is that we accepted it only to be kept for emergencies but don't think for a second that any loan will magically put the books in a healthy position - it simply doesn't work that way, as any accountant or well informed person will tell you. I'm certain that questions will be asked about "such information" on Thursday.

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34 minutes ago, doakie said:

For the purposes of accuracy, let me point out that the loan is not a financial asset, it is a debt. It has to be repaid so there are consequences if we start spending it recklessly. My understanding is that we accepted it only to be kept for emergencies but don't think for a second that any loan will magically put the books in a healthy position - it simply doesn't work that way, as any accountant or well informed person will tell you. I'm certain that questions will be asked about "such information" on Thursday.

I know that loan is not a financial asset. The reason I raised the Covid loan was that it could be used as a safety net if what you are referring to is true. Still nothing from anyone to back up these claims though. Given that we have had financial difficulties in the past and we have some board members who remember these problems, then what exactly has caused this problem that someone is suggesting is as bad as Derby County. 

We had a successful season last year. Two cup semifinals and a 7th place. There is UEFA and league prize money to come in.

Have we spunked so much money on signing on fees and wages that has cost us dearly?

These claims would be better understood if people would let us know what they are. 

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52 minutes ago, doakie said:

For the purposes of accuracy, let me point out that the loan is not a financial asset, it is a debt. It has to be repaid so there are consequences if we start spending it recklessly. My understanding is that we accepted it only to be kept for emergencies but don't think for a second that any loan will magically put the books in a healthy position - it simply doesn't work that way, as any accountant or well informed person will tell you. I'm certain that questions will be asked about "such information" on Thursday.

The scenario the club is seemingly in is a massive jump from "could be in a similar administration route as the likes of Derby" and being in "severe financial difficulty" it surely doesn't warrant conversations about "when our club dies" 

Big jump to the negative, not out of line when compared to some current and many former BAWA contributors. 

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1 hour ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

For the avoidance of doubt, I don’t dispute these claims, but it would be easier to debate if we know what they are.

I appreciate that but some information, given in confidence, can't be proved however I suggest that most contributors come on here with the sole intention of keeping other fans well informed, fans that might not have the same contacts within the club as others. Consequently, that allows the naysayers to come on and cast doubt on any well meaning fan such as Animal or Goodietwoshoes. When posters such as the afore mentioned two offer their views in an articulate, well thought out manner without resorting to hysteria I tend to find them credible. What I don't find credible are those who are so firmly entrenched in their pro Kibble stance that they stubbornly refuse to acknowledge other than the opinion that Kibble are great, Kibble are good, Kibble can do no wrong.

I've said before: don't believe me or any other poster - Ask a Smisa rep! Ask a director. No one will tell you that the Kibble directors have a harmonious relationship with the club.

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16 minutes ago, doakie said:

I appreciate that but some information, given in confidence, can't be proved however I suggest that most contributors come on here with the sole intention of keeping other fans well informed, fans that might not have the same contacts within the club as others. Consequently, that allows the naysayers to come on and cast doubt on any well meaning fan such as Animal or Goodietwoshoes. When posters such as the afore mentioned two offer their views in an articulate, well thought out manner without resorting to hysteria I tend to find them credible. What I don't find credible are those who are so firmly entrenched in their pro Kibble stance that they stubbornly refuse to acknowledge other than the opinion that Kibble are great, Kibble are good, Kibble can do no wrong.

I've said before: don't believe me or any other poster - Ask a Smisa rep! Ask a director. No one will tell you that the Kibble directors have a harmonious relationship with the club.

Someone that has been told something in confidence to then come on a forum and broadcast it without basis is surely already undermining trust? This doesn't stack up for me at all. If there were people within St Mirren with this information but also willing to tell people it at football games and the likes, it would have spread like wildfire. Why has this person in the know told you and told this new poster but hasn't seemingly mentioned it off the record to many other people? 

Time will tell but if history tells us anything, this sort of doom and gloom spread by "I heard a whisper but I can't tell you where" is almost always baseless. 

"without resorting to hysteria" Heading for the same administration issues as Derby and when the club goes out of business isn't hysteria? You're having a laugh. 

Edited by bazil85
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Well as predicted it did'nt take long!

Ridiculed by the same people who come on here day after day to deny that anything is wrong with our club.

I genuinely hope you are right.

i have no axe to grind with SMISA, The Charity, or anyone else, just the wellbeing of the club I have supported all of my life. 

 

The bully boy playground tactics don't scare me.

       The 'My daddy's bigger than your daddy'  response means nothing to me.

 

I only came on this forum to warn fellow supporters of what I have been told.            Is that not what its for?

The response to my post was both predictable and tedious.

That is why so many people like myself did'nt want to post anything.

And NO I am not Animal!

As far as I know I have never met Animal. But his/her information must come from the same source as mine.

And I have never posted in this forum under any other name. First Post and today.

This may well be the last as I have more intelligent people to talk to.

Am I allowed to say that as Animal posted earlier, i have also heard that after complaints about AGM protocol,

we are being allowed to raise questions, and not being silenced. At last some common sense.

I wasn't at the game last night, but have to say how pleased i am with the last three performances and results.

 

 

 

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Please can someone put some meat on the bones and give a rough estimate of how much in debt the club is.

Given that no bank will loan us money the Board must have squandered the Covid million pound loan and the £250,000 Alan Wordrop had invested in the stock market.

Perhaps he took a punt on some crypto currency that has tanked….

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55 minutes ago, Goodie2shoes said:

Well as predicted it did'nt take long!

Ridiculed by the same people who come on here day after day to deny that anything is wrong with our club.

I genuinely hope you are right.

i have no axe to grind with SMISA, The Charity, or anyone else, just the wellbeing of the club I have supported all of my life. 

 

The bully boy playground tactics don't scare me.

       The 'My daddy's bigger than your daddy'  response means nothing to me.

 

I only came on this forum to warn fellow supporters of what I have been told.            Is that not what its for?

The response to my post was both predictable and tedious.

That is why so many people like myself did'nt want to post anything.

And NO I am not Animal!

As far as I know I have never met Animal. But his/her information must come from the same source as mine.

And I have never posted in this forum under any other name. First Post and today.

This may well be the last as I have more intelligent people to talk to.

Am I allowed to say that as Animal posted earlier, i have also heard that after complaints about AGM protocol,

we are being allowed to raise questions, and not being silenced. At last some common sense.

I wasn't at the game last night, but have to say how pleased i am with the last three performances and results.

 

 

 

"Ridiculed " " The bully boy playground tactics don't scare me."

...

...

...

"I have more intelligent people to talk to."

:whistle

 

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3 hours ago, doakie said:

I appreciate that but some information, given in confidence, can't be proved however I suggest that most contributors come on here with the sole intention of keeping other fans well informed, fans that might not have the same contacts within the club as others. Consequently, that allows the naysayers to come on and cast doubt on any well meaning fan such as Animal or Goodietwoshoes. When posters such as the afore mentioned two offer their views in an articulate, well thought out manner without resorting to hysteria I tend to find them credible. What I don't find credible are those who are so firmly entrenched in their pro Kibble stance that they stubbornly refuse to acknowledge other than the opinion that Kibble are great, Kibble are good, Kibble can do no wrong.

I've said before: don't believe me or any other poster - Ask a Smisa rep! Ask a director. No one will tell you that the Kibble directors have a harmonious relationship with the club.

 

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