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41 minutes ago, StanleySaint said:

Ffs humour bypass or what, good to see that you are consistent enough to bring in the 'Old Firm', your favourite subject, to yet another thread Shull, well done!!

Ignore him, he's a grade A p*ick. 

Runs around throwing mud, name calling and crys about other people doing the same, if it wasn't so sad it would be funny. 

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3 hours ago, Hendo said:

I think it is much more black and white than that - he is not some kid who got involved in low level criminality, he is a rapist. Would you be happy if he rocked up at Greenhill Road?

But my point was about not judging Danny and had nothing to do with Goodwillie

as already pointed out, I wouldn’t want him at the club in any circumstances 

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3 hours ago, LargsBud said:

He's trying to get on with his life. Theres got to be a stage where is is allowed to move on.

Ostracising criminals for the rest of their life doesn't create a healthy society. Might be something to do with the reason Scotland has one of the highest criminal re-offending rates in Europe.

He isn't a criminal. He hasn't been proven a rapist. I would go as far as saying he may well have a case against the papers who are using the derogatory term in relation to him.

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Just now, Cookie Monster said:
7 minutes ago, stlucifer said:
He isn't a criminal. He hasn't been proven a rapist. I would go as far as saying he may well have a case against the papers who are using the derogatory term in relation to him.

He is a convicted criminal x3.

For rape?

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1 minute ago, Cookie Monster said:

As i was just answering your 1st sentence then no, just for 3 assaults he was convicted after a criminal court case.

My main point was that  the media are using the term "rapist" which he has never been found guilty for. No one has even whispered his real convictions in this debate.

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This thread is truly depressing. Currently I believe the conviction rate for reported sexual offences is between 1 and 2%. Main reason for this is often these offences take place in private with no other witnesses. Even if it is reported straight away, and there is forensic evidence, often establishing lack of consent is difficult.

In Goodwillies case, the prosecution case rested on the high level of intoxication of the victim, with a blood alcohol reading placing her at severe intoxication, which would have rendered her unable to consent. This, together with evidence from the taxi driver who said she was reluctant to get out the taxi, the fact he got keys to a flat from a friend to go with her indicating a level of planning, and significant discrepancies in the account both the accused gave in their initial statements and in court, were factors in the verdict. It was tried before a judge, who said he found the victims case "compelling". 

Goodwillie and Robertson then appealed the verdict, which was heard before three High Court judges. This was thrown out. Either they didn't have a case or maybe the judges were Dundee supporters.

I have looked at the court judgement, and would suggest others on here do likewise. The only mystery here is why he and his co accused were not criminally prosecuted, as there certainly seemed to be enough evidence to pursue this.

On here, it appears we have the common tropes used by primarily men when discussing this, suggestions he could sue for being called a rapist, "he doesn't have a criminal conviction", "what about rehabilitation", "he has the right to earn a living".

As HSS said, the first part of rehabilitation is showing regret and remorse, something which sadly he has never done.

 

 

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My main point was that  the media are using the term "rapist" which he has never been found guilty for. No one has even whispered his real convictions in this debate.

You're correct, it wasn't whispered. It was written.
If innocent why did he try three times to settle out of court?
He had three convictions for assault and this case was hanging over him when Aberdeen signed him.
No outcry from fans then.
 
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12 minutes ago, Hendo said:

This thread is truly depressing. Currently I believe the conviction rate for reported sexual offences is between 1 and 2%. Main reason for this is often these offences take place in private with no other witnesses. Even if it is reported straight away, and there is forensic evidence, often establishing lack of consent is difficult.

In Goodwillies case, the prosecution case rested on the high level of intoxication of the victim, with a blood alcohol reading placing her at severe intoxication, which would have rendered her unable to consent. This, together with evidence from the taxi driver who said she was reluctant to get out the taxi, the fact he got keys to a flat from a friend to go with her indicating a level of planning, and significant discrepancies in the account both the accused gave in their initial statements and in court, were factors in the verdict. It was tried before a judge, who said he found the victims case "compelling". 

Goodwillie and Robertson then appealed the verdict, which was heard before three High Court judges. This was thrown out. Either they didn't have a case or maybe the judges were Dundee supporters.

I have looked at the court judgement, and would suggest others on here do likewise. The only mystery here is why he and his co accused were not criminally prosecuted, as there certainly seemed to be enough evidence to pursue this.

On here, it appears we have the common tropes used by primarily men when discussing this, suggestions he could sue for being called a rapist, "he doesn't have a criminal conviction", "what about rehabilitation", "he has the right to earn a living".

As HSS said, the first part of rehabilitation is showing regret and remorse, something which sadly he has never done.

 

 

I quite clearly said at the outset that I personally thought there was something in this but, from a legal point of view, he wasn't taken to court. The crux of this is not the gender of those who don't cry foul. It is about the law. I also said that those who are directly involved in the club have every right to voice their concerns and take steps they feel is right. The real point here is whether it is right for, firstly, the Government to get involved, (this includes one MP in the HoC declaring Goodwillie a rapist), and, secondly, whether the media has a right to unilaterally convict Goodwillie as a rapist without a court of law finding against him.

Edited by stlucifer
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5 minutes ago, Hendo said:

This thread is truly depressing. Currently I believe the conviction rate for reported sexual offences is between 1 and 2%. Main reason for this is often these offences take place in private with no other witnesses. Even if it is reported straight away, and there is forensic evidence, often establishing lack of consent is difficult.

In Goodwillies case, the prosecution case rested on the high level of intoxication of the victim, with a blood alcohol reading placing her at severe intoxication, which would have rendered her unable to consent. This, together with evidence from the taxi driver who said she was reluctant to get out the taxi, the fact he got keys to a flat from a friend to go with her indicating a level of planning, and significant discrepancies in the account both the accused gave in their initial statements and in court, were factors in the verdict. It was tried before a judge, who said he found the victims case "compelling". 

Goodwillie and Robertson then appealed the verdict, which was heard before three High Court judges. This was thrown out. Either they didn't have a case or maybe the judges were Dundee supporters.

I have looked at the court judgement, and would suggest others on here do likewise. The only mystery here is why he and his co accused were not criminally prosecuted, as there certainly seemed to be enough evidence to pursue this.

On here, it appears we have the common tropes used by primarily men when discussing this, suggestions he could sue for being called a rapist, "he doesn't have a criminal conviction", "what about rehabilitation", "he has the right to earn a living".

As HSS said, the first part of rehabilitation is showing regret and remorse, something which sadly he has never done.

 

 

Jeezo.

The conviction rate, as you say, is low, due to the difficulty to provide any concrete proof or evidence.

While you state the female as a "victim", there's really no point in taking this any further as this is a done deal in your view.

I'm in no position to say either way why there was no criminal prosecution but if it was as clear as you see it I'm sure the authorities would have. 

As a balance to your "primarily men" comment it's mostly women who are screaming about the current Raith Rovers situation. 

Also, IF he showed remorse wouldn't that be close to admitting guilt which he is has denied? 

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1 hour ago, faraway saint said:

Ignore him, he's a grade A p*ick. 

Runs around throwing mud, name calling and crys about other people doing the same, if it wasn't so sad it would be funny. 

Jeezo, as somebody would say. How toxic is Titch from Arbroath tonight ? An angry poisoned dwarf. Surely, he isnae cocktailed up at this time .

As for ignoring, he will read everything by me and anybody else. He loves to troll, bully, belittle and abuse.

Stanley Saint keeps dodgy company.

 

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5 minutes ago, Sidmirren said:

Jeezo, as somebody would say. How toxic is Titch from Arbroath tonight ? An angry poisoned dwarf. Surely, he isnae cocktailed up at this time .

As for ignoring, he will read everything by me and anybody else. He loves to troll, bully, belittle and abuse.

Stanley Saint keeps dodgy company.

 

Swivel ya coward. :byebye

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2 hours ago, faraway saint said:

Jeezo.

The conviction rate, as you say, is low, due to the difficulty to provide any concrete proof or evidence.

While you state the female as a "victim", there's really no point in taking this any further as this is a done deal in your view.

I'm in no position to say either way why there was no criminal prosecution but if it was as clear as you see it I'm sure the authorities would have. 

As a balance to your "primarily men" comment it's mostly women who are screaming about the current Raith Rovers situation. 

Also, IF he showed remorse wouldn't that be close to admitting guilt which he is has denied? 

My comment about "primarily men" was directed at those on here and elsewhere, like yourself, who are making minimising comments about this.

Look at your language - "it's mostly  women who are screaming" - aye, it's hysterical women who are the problem here. FFS.

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11 minutes ago, Hendo said:

My comment about "primarily men" was directed at those on here and elsewhere, like yourself, who are making minimising comments about this.

Look at your language - "it's mostly  women who are screaming" - aye, it's hysterical women who are the problem here. FFS.

That was directly at your attempts to indicate it's men being men, when the people commenting are just as capable as coming to their own conclusions as you.

Sorry that doesn't sit well with you. 

Oh, FFS. 

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My comment about "primarily men" was directed at those on here and elsewhere, like yourself, who are making minimising comments about this.
Look at your language - "it's mostly  women who are screaming" - aye, it's hysterical women who are the problem here. FFS.
How do you know "those on here" are "primarily men"?

Out of curiosity, how intoxicated was Goodwille, did she get consent from him and was the taxi driver a Dundee fan?


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On 2/3/2022 at 12:19 AM, BuddieinEK said:

It's a totally horrible and disgusting situation whichever way you look at it.

A girl has been seriously wronged or a professional footballer has been hounded.

I'm not comparing the degree of potential harm. That's a no brainer.

But for 5 years the guy has played football and nobody has batted an eyelid.

Why now?

No criminal prosecution took place. Criminal convictions have to rely on absolute evidence.

The Civil case is based on "the balance of probabilities"

It is not absolute and not a guaranteed correct decision. It's a judgement call.

Bringing it up to date... Those attacking him say he should apologise.

He said at the time he did no wrong but confessed to consensual sex whilst under the influence of alcohol.

If he apologises now, is he not at risk of further attack from people saying it is a confession of guilt?

Could he then be tried in a criminal court? I don't know.

If he genuinely believes he did no wrong, he should most definitely NOT apologise unless he wants to make Boris sound credible.

If he IS guilty and is denying it, he is a C U Next Tuesday and deserves castrated... But I'm in no place to judge and I'm not sure many of his critics are qualified to do so either.

He denied and denies rape, but all day has been referred to in the news as a rapist.

The whole situation stinks.

There are no winners here.

Again though, I keep returning to... What has changed in the last five years?

Sent from my HD1913 using Tapatalk
 

Spot on

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  • 4 weeks later...
43 minutes ago, Mykey said:

Clyde woman's team leave the club and council bans Goodwillie from Broadwood stadium

Sent from my SM-A715F using Tapatalk
 

And terminate Clydes contract to play at Broadwood from 2023

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