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OPEN LETTER TO THE BOARD AND ANYONE ELSE


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1 hour ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

St Johnstone have regularly generated more revenue than St Mirren - often around £1M more.

St Johnstone look to maximise their facilities all week. They have more staff available to facilitate this.

St Johnstone also use their family stand for home and away families something I’ve requested our BoD implement.

I also provided a high level plan on how our club could regular car boot sales. Fell on deaf ears.

Our club has history of ignoring ideas from the support. 

Some of the best initiatives and ideas have come from our support. The 2012/13 strip design, the Leaving Love Street film and book. All delivered by supporters.

I’d like to see a working group put together to thrash out some ideas for raising the profile of the club and introduce sustainable additional revenue streams.

I feel though there is reluctance within the club to take on new challenges and initiatives. 

 

I haven’t looked at the figures for both clubs but have no reason to doubt you but I hope that things are likely to improve going forward. One thing that St J has had that we haven’t is stable ongoing ownership and direction. We have had a club up for sale, sold and ownership passed on again to the present owners who are still getting to grips with how to work with each other as well as the role of fan ownership appointed directors. Remaining in the top league and finishing reasonably well won’t have hurt. I like the shared family stand idea but am told that this has been looked at and turned down as both sets of supporters would be using the same pie stands and toilets!  May be time to return with your ideas and for others to put forward theirs. 

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10 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

St Johnstone have regularly generated more revenue than St Mirren - often around £1M more.

St Johnstone look to maximise their facilities all week. They have more staff available to facilitate this.

St Johnstone also use their family stand for home and away families something I’ve requested our BoD implement.

I also provided a high level plan on how our club could regular car boot sales. Fell on deaf ears.

Our club has history of ignoring ideas from the support. 

Some of the best initiatives and ideas have come from our support. The 2012/13 strip design, the Leaving Love Street film and book. All delivered by supporters.

I’d like to see a working group put together to thrash out some ideas for raising the profile of the club and introduce sustainable additional revenue streams.

I feel though there is reluctance within the club to take on new challenges and initiatives. 

 

Any significant additional income from St Johnstone can pretty easily be explained by better seasons on the park. 
 

If fans think car boot sales & zoomba at the stadium every Tuesday & Thursday is going to generate big income, fine.

St Mirren & St Johnstone are both regularly ran in the black. Our last accounts (due to the pandemic) were the first in years that have seen us make a loss. How many other Scottish clubs can say that? 
 

As I have said before, it’s just pretty typical of some to moan about all things St Mirren. The reality is, we are a pretty well run club that’s only a year into our new fan ownership model. I’m sure our BOD will have plans, give them time to imbed any income visions they might have. 

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28 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Any significant additional income from St Johnstone can pretty easily be explained by better seasons on the park. 
 

Not true. 

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29 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

If fans think car boot sales & zoomba at the stadium every Tuesday & Thursday is going to generate big income, fine.

Again this just sums up your mentality. 

It’s all about increasing revenue and footfall around the stadium outside of matchdays to introduce sustainable additional income streams. No one said BIG income. People who build successful businesses understand the importance of marginal gains and compounding.

But nah let’s just do the annual dinner, the advertising boards and fill empty hospitality tables with non payers as @Brilliant Disguise says.

Are you a fan or a paid employee? Either way what ideas do you have for introducing additional revenue streams?

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56 minutes ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

Again this just sums up your mentality. 

It’s all about increasing revenue and footfall around the stadium outside of matchdays to introduce sustainable additional income streams. No one said BIG income. People who build successful businesses understand the importance of marginal gains and compounding.

But nah let’s just do the annual dinner, the advertising boards and fill empty hospitality tables with non payers as @Brilliant Disguise says.

Are you a fan or a paid employee? Either way what ideas do you have for introducing additional revenue streams?

Invite more opposition fans! 😂😜

I totally agree with everything you say but you do realise any attempt to reason in here is futile? 🤐😜

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1 hour ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

Not true. 

Disagree 

1 hour ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

Again this just sums up your mentality. 

It’s all about increasing revenue and footfall around the stadium outside of matchdays to introduce sustainable additional income streams. No one said BIG income. People who build successful businesses understand the importance of marginal gains and compounding.

But nah let’s just do the annual dinner, the advertising boards and fill empty hospitality tables with non payers as @Brilliant Disguise says.

Are you a fan or a paid employee? Either way what ideas do you have for introducing additional revenue streams?

As stated before, oh to be so knowledgeable about running a football club. Maybe some of these super business people should be trying to get on the board. We’d be champions league material in no time 😂

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52 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Disagree 

As stated before, oh to be so knowledgeable about running a football club. Maybe some of these super business people should be trying to get on the board. We’d be champions league material in no time 😂

So basically you can’t offer anything of value to answer both points. 

Waste of space.

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

Disagree 

As stated before, oh to be so knowledgeable about running a football club. Maybe some of these super business people should be trying to get on the board. We’d be champions league material in no time 😂

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Oh the irony...

You deem him "so knowledgeable about running A football club" for daring to be positive...

Whilst you counter be showing your vast knowledge on every football club by repeatedly referring to them. You " know" what all other clubs do and do not try and you "know" the reasons why. 

Now who is the Moan? 😂😂😯

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46 minutes ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

So basically you can’t offer anything of value to answer both points. 

Waste of space.

Answered and coveted over hundreds of pages & numerous topics going back years on this website. There is nothing new to cover. 

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13 minutes ago, BuddieinEK said:

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Oh the irony...

You deem him "so knowledgeable about running A football club" for daring to be positive...

Whilst you counter be showing your vast knowledge on every football club by repeatedly referring to them. You " know" what all other clubs do and do not try and you "know" the reasons why. 

Now who is the Moan? 😂😂😯

He is, & the multiple other people moaning about the way the club is being ran, that think they know better & that everything is such an easy fix. To think it’s me moaning to defend the club, sums up just how negative & miserable you are when it comes to SMFC. 
 

Also looks like the wee ‘haha’ reaction didn’t work to get my attention eh? You always need to get involved in the end :) 

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Baz, I don't think it unreasonable to defend the club to a certain extent and by no means am I a business expert but it is clear that there has been little evidence of additional revenue streams being explored, even on match days. I'll use my experience as an example, I travel up for games and meet my son who comes down from Inverness (and before that Aberdeen), we meet around 12-12:30, and I would love to get a bite to eat or a coffee in or around the stadium that benefitted the club but instead we have the 1877 that isn't open to all and as a result we head in to town. Now I'm not saying that this is the answer to our prayers but I'm a sitting duck customer ready to spend but no service exists. Until we as a club explore the alternative sources of expanding revenue we're never going to be able to regularly challenge for top 6 and europe that might bring us the success on the pitch that can be built upon year on year. Just one small example but there will be others with similar experiences and that's just matchday when we know footfall will be available.

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41 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

Answered and coveted over hundreds of pages & numerous topics going back years on this website. There is nothing new to cover. 

6C7E0152-B38E-4723-ACCE-F8A2FE0006AC.png.fc348e1d116e464aef441135c02ef063.png

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27 minutes ago, StanleySaint said:

Baz, I don't think it unreasonable to defend the club to a certain extent and by no means am I a business expert but it is clear that there has been little evidence of additional revenue streams being explored, even on match days. I'll use my experience as an example, I travel up for games and meet my son who comes down from Inverness (and before that Aberdeen), we meet around 12-12:30, and I would love to get a bite to eat or a coffee in or around the stadium that benefitted the club but instead we have the 1877 that isn't open to all and as a result we head in to town. Now I'm not saying that this is the answer to our prayers but I'm a sitting duck customer ready to spend but no service exists. Until we as a club explore the alternative sources of expanding revenue we're never going to be able to regularly challenge for top 6 and europe that might bring us the success on the pitch that can be built upon year on year. Just one small example but there will be others with similar experiences and that's just matchday when we know footfall will be available.

There are lots of ideas, fans have pushed for them for years. My issue is, when they don’t get taken forward it’s held against the club as not trying or ‘lazy’. 
 

The coffee shop/ food place idea is a classic one. But how many of these type places close down in the fist couple of years? It’s a big risk, add into that

- location 

- competition 

- start up costs 

- staffing costs 

- supply costs 

- location & facilities in & around the stadium. 
- how many fans are actually in a similar position to use it in the way you’ve said? 
 

If there has been a business decision that isn’t worth the risk, for me that is fine. I personally don’t think a coffee shop or anything similar would be successful in that part of Paisley with the competition there already is but same as you… what do I know 🤷‍♂️
 

I’ll say it again, I actually think it’s more lazy for fans sitting from ivory towers to assume these things aren’t being considered than an assumption that successive BOD’s aren’t trying hard enough because of lazy thinking. 

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54 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

He is, & the multiple other people moaning about the way the club is being ran, that think they know better & that everything is such an easy fix. To think it’s me moaning to defend the club, sums up just how negative & miserable you are when it comes to SMFC. 

Think your missing the point that the comments are evening provide to try and improve the club and the experience in the hope that the club could investigate or embrace some of the ideas. While you take them as moans and negative it’s supporters trying to be helpful

Whereas you like to blow smoke up the clubs arse and are happy with the mediocrity of the club on a number of aspects. I take your approach as unhelpful and negative

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

Answered and coveted over hundreds of pages & numerous topics going back years on this website. There is nothing new to cover. 

Maybe I’ve not be around as long as you, but I don’t ever remember you providing evidence of St Johnstone’s greater income on a season by season basis being directly related to league placing prize money. 

This is the current prize pot. 

A22B37F6-A2C7-4DB8-94D8-4621676D1242.thumb.jpeg.bfc67e40c0e8f1bf87e4c73cc15815a6.jpeg

These snapshots are from 10years ago from PWC report. There are other available.

https://pwc.blogs.com/files/2012---financial-review-of-spl-football2010-11_final.pdf

It’s clear that St Johnstone are a better run club with non footballing revenue streams.

68C6727D-DD74-4152-8F93-E9DE01E3C402.thumb.jpeg.1f4ff932b7cf8984a6d4d97c6e8c94ab.jpeg

ABBFE95E-6E5A-4EA6-859E-0D7A2007D2E9.thumb.jpeg.83cf758307dcf838acea9c44e1839028.jpeg

I also have no recollection of you providing ideas or suggestions on how to introduce additional revenue streams at our club.

Without any supporting evidence I would say you are a bullshit merchant. 

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How to Save Energy.

Brandolini's law, also known as the bullshit asymmetry principle, is an internet adage that emphasizes the effort of debunking misinformation, in comparison to the relative ease of creating it in the first place.[1] It states that "The amount of energy needed to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude larger than is needed to produce it."[2][3]

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Maybe I’ve not be around as long as you, but I don’t ever remember you providing evidence of St Johnstone’s greater income on a season by season basis being directly related to league placing prize money. 
This is the current prize pot. 
A22B37F6-A2C7-4DB8-94D8-4621676D1242.thumb.jpeg.bfc67e40c0e8f1bf87e4c73cc15815a6.jpeg
These snapshots are from 10years ago from PWC report. There are other available.
https://pwc.blogs.com/files/2012---financial-review-of-spl-football2010-11_final.pdf
It’s clear that St Johnstone are a better run club with non footballing revenue streams.
68C6727D-DD74-4152-8F93-E9DE01E3C402.thumb.jpeg.1f4ff932b7cf8984a6d4d97c6e8c94ab.jpeg
ABBFE95E-6E5A-4EA6-859E-0D7A2007D2E9.thumb.jpeg.83cf758307dcf838acea9c44e1839028.jpeg
I also have no recollection of you providing ideas or suggestions on how to introduce additional revenue streams at our club.
Without any supporting evidence I would say you are a bullshit merchant. 
What you quoted says that both clubs got better at non-football income generation.
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27 minutes ago, Slarti said:
3 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:
Maybe I’ve not be around as long as you, but I don’t ever remember you providing evidence of St Johnstone’s greater income on a season by season basis being directly related to league placing prize money. 
This is the current prize pot. 
A22B37F6-A2C7-4DB8-94D8-4621676D1242.thumb.jpeg.bfc67e40c0e8f1bf87e4c73cc15815a6.jpeg
These snapshots are from 10years ago from PWC report. There are other available.
https://pwc.blogs.com/files/2012---financial-review-of-spl-football2010-11_final.pdf
It’s clear that St Johnstone are a better run club with non footballing revenue streams.
68C6727D-DD74-4152-8F93-E9DE01E3C402.thumb.jpeg.1f4ff932b7cf8984a6d4d97c6e8c94ab.jpeg
ABBFE95E-6E5A-4EA6-859E-0D7A2007D2E9.thumb.jpeg.83cf758307dcf838acea9c44e1839028.jpeg
I also have no recollection of you providing ideas or suggestions on how to introduce additional revenue streams at our club.
Without any supporting evidence I would say you are a bullshit merchant. 

What you quoted says that both clubs got better at non-football income generation.

The financial numbers don’t lie. The words are just filler no doubt lifted from our annual account summary. 

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4 hours ago, bazil85 said:

There are lots of ideas, fans have pushed for them for years. My issue is, when they don’t get taken forward it’s held against the club as not trying or ‘lazy’. 
 

The coffee shop/ food place idea is a classic one. But how many of these type places close down in the fist couple of years? It’s a big risk, add into that

- location 

- competition 

- start up costs 

- staffing costs 

- supply costs 

- location & facilities in & around the stadium. 
- how many fans are actually in a similar position to use it in the way you’ve said? 
 

If there has been a business decision that isn’t worth the risk, for me that is fine. I personally don’t think a coffee shop or anything similar would be successful in that part of Paisley with the competition there already is but same as you… what do I know 🤷‍♂️
 

I’ll say it again, I actually think it’s more lazy for fans sitting from ivory towers to assume these things aren’t being considered than an assumption that successive BOD’s aren’t trying hard enough because of lazy thinking. 

Without getting in to an involved debate on this there were a couple of things that I needed to clarify, firstly I was giving an example of a situation  not a solution and secondly I did refer to match day (ie the only time I would be in town) and the captive footfall but who's to say if it existed on match days that enquiries wouldn't arise relating to the rest of the week?

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4 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

Maybe I’ve not be around as long as you, but I don’t ever remember you providing evidence of St Johnstone’s greater income on a season by season basis being directly related to league placing prize money. 

This is the current prize pot. 

A22B37F6-A2C7-4DB8-94D8-4621676D1242.thumb.jpeg.bfc67e40c0e8f1bf87e4c73cc15815a6.jpeg

These snapshots are from 10years ago from PWC report. There are other available.

https://pwc.blogs.com/files/2012---financial-review-of-spl-football2010-11_final.pdf

It’s clear that St Johnstone are a better run club with non footballing revenue streams.

68C6727D-DD74-4152-8F93-E9DE01E3C402.thumb.jpeg.1f4ff932b7cf8984a6d4d97c6e8c94ab.jpeg

ABBFE95E-6E5A-4EA6-859E-0D7A2007D2E9.thumb.jpeg.83cf758307dcf838acea9c44e1839028.jpeg

I also have no recollection of you providing ideas or suggestions on how to introduce additional revenue streams at our club.

Without any supporting evidence I would say you are a bullshit merchant. 

You’ve done a fair bit of the work for me, all be it on a very narrow scale. St Johnstone’s income was geared by cup runs not by massive off-field profits. 
 

If you have evidence to the contrary that they generate significant income above us from what they do off the field & it’s things St Mirren can adopt, feel free to share. My evidence is the factual overlook of them regularly having better league/ cup finishes & European football. 

Edited by bazil85
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1 minute ago, bazil85 said:

You’ve done a fair bit of the work for me, all be it on a very narrow scale. St Johnstone’s income was geared by cup runs not by massive off-field profits. 
 

If you have evidence to the contrary that they generate significant income above us from what they do off the field & it’s things St Mirren can adopt, feel free to share. My evidence is the factual overlook of them regularly having better league/ cup finishes & European football. 

That’s two years worth of data. There is much more evidence. It’s a lost cause discussing anything with you as you still refuse to answer any questions posed to you. I’m out. 

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4 hours ago, Brilliant Disguise said:

Think your missing the point that the comments are evening provide to try and improve the club and the experience in the hope that the club could investigate or embrace some of the ideas. While you take them as moans and negative it’s supporters trying to be helpful

Whereas you like to blow smoke up the clubs arse and are happy with the mediocrity of the club on a number of aspects. I take your approach as unhelpful and negative

It’s seemingly more realistic when we look at other clubs operating at our level. 
 

Your claims the BOD (successive ones at that) are ‘lazy’ the club settles for ‘mediocracy’ and outlandish claims we could be doing X, Y & Z to boost income is negative, ignorant & idealistic in my view.  

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Just now, SuperSaints1877 said:

That’s two years worth of data. There is much more evidence. It’s a lost cause discussing anything with you as you still refuse to answer any questions posed to you. I’m out. 

It absolutely is not. If you want to evidence that St Johnstone are far better run off the park than St Mirren & they do multiple things that we could easily adopt, fine. You haven’t done that in your precious (or any) post. 
 

Also if you think I haven’t answered something, show me? I must have missed it. If you’re talking about evidence St Johnstone’s incomes have been better driven by football performances than off field activity, for evidence, you already have what you shared, the factual nature of their recent success & if you want EVEN more, go look into their published accounts. 

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