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Redundancies at the Academy


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36 minutes ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Private investigations into the missing millions since kibble joined.

Maybe it's time we prized Love over Gold, but we are overdue a communique from our brothers in arms.  The could be making movies about this affair in the future and talking about it on every street. Anyway, isn't it time Kibble took a walk of life and disappeared up the tunnel of love (st).

Edited by beyond our ken
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20 minutes ago, antrin said:

 

Aye…. Back on topic…good point, Albanian Buddie!

 

can someBuddie point me towards any public source or evidence about the mass redundancies and dismantling of the Academy, that animal started this topic about…

…a month ago?

Club directory no longer lists Michelle Evans who was Head of Club Well-being & Development. Did she resign or was she pushed? We still don’t have a club doctor since our long standing doctor Wong resigned after issues following Kibble’s involvement. The club advertised for a new doctor last October. https://www.stmirren.com/club-news/4151-we-are-recruiting-for-the-position-of-club-doctor with final applications by 3 November 2021. Looks like @animal is onto something here. 

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22 minutes ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Club directory no longer lists Michelle Evans who was Head of Club Well-being & Development. Did she resign or was she pushed? We still don’t have a club doctor since our long standing doctor Wong resigned after issues following Kibble’s involvement. The club advertised for a new doctor last October. https://www.stmirren.com/club-news/4151-we-are-recruiting-for-the-position-of-club-doctor with final applications by 3 November 2021. Looks like @animal is onto something here. 

Think we need to remember, part of the sell regarding the Kibble was to streamline the business using their experience & resources. 
 

Not sure it should be much of a surprise to people that restructures would result in people going. 

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

Think we need to remember, part of the sell regarding the Kibble was to streamline the business using their experience & resources. 
 

Not sure it should be much of a surprise to people that restructures would result in people going. 

There is an element of truth in that however Michelle Evans, I believe, started her role after Kibble came on board and I'm not sure they provide Club Doctors. It could well be that faces didn't fit, it could be that Michell chose to leave (I don't have that info) but neither of those roles would appear, at first glance, to be streamlining due to Kibble using their experience or resources.

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43 minutes ago, WeeBud said:

There is an element of truth in that however Michelle Evans, I believe, started her role after Kibble came on board and I'm not sure they provide Club Doctors. It could well be that faces didn't fit, it could be that Michell chose to leave (I don't have that info) but neither of those roles would appear, at first glance, to be streamlining due to Kibble using their experience or resources.

That’s a fair comment, guess we just don’t know right now. 
 

I always thought a club doctor was mandatory as well. 

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2 hours ago, bazil85 said:

Think we need to remember, part of the sell regarding the Kibble was to streamline the business using their experience & resources. 
 

Not sure it should be much of a surprise to people that restructures would result in people going. 

Michelle Evans was appointed long after Kibble were involved. Doctor Wong allegedly left his post due to the poor treatment of long standing staff employed prior to Kibble involvement whose contracts were terminated. Why hire Michelle and then make her job redundant? Unless she resigned. No news from club to thank her for her service as far as I know. Same with Dr Wong perhaps?

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23 minutes ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Michelle Evans was appointed long after Kibble were involved. Doctor Wong allegedly left his post due to the poor treatment of long standing staff employed prior to Kibble involvement whose contracts were terminated. Why hire Michelle and then make her job redundant? Unless she resigned. No news from club to thank her for her service as far as I know. Same with Dr Wong perhaps?

We can speculate until the cows come home. There is no doubt we have fans on here who usually assume/ fear the worst. 
 

For me, we still seem to have an extremely successful academy with several youth players in & around Scotland squads, attracting attention elsewhere. Dylan Reid’s decision also suggests to me, our more experienced youth prospects still see St Mirren as a great pathway club. 

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1 minute ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Has he signed a new contract? That’s great news. Last I read the club were trying to sell him like a McGinn type sell on. I don’t get home that often. Is he the real deal? What’s the length of his contract now?

No new deal yet but he decided the best for his career was to continue developing at St Mirren for the time being instead of going to Celtic. 

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1 minute ago, bazil85 said:

No new deal yet but he decided the best for his career was to continue developing at St Mirren for the time being instead of going to Celtic. 

Sorry I heard the club were keen for him to move on as he is in the last year of his contract. Would that mean the club would only get a small development fee and he can then sign for any club? Unless he signs a new contract then he holds all the aces. Have I got this wrong? I don’t understand how all this works.

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25 minutes ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Sorry I heard the club were keen for him to move on as he is in the last year of his contract. Would that mean the club would only get a small development fee and he can then sign for any club? Unless he signs a new contract then he holds all the aces. Have I got this wrong? I don’t understand how all this works.

I think you have it right AS.

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1 hour ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Sorry I heard the club were keen for him to move on as he is in the last year of his contract. Would that mean the club would only get a small development fee and he can then sign for any club? Unless he signs a new contract then he holds all the aces. Have I got this wrong? I don’t understand how all this works.

I can’t imagine the club would get a small fee. Billy Gilmour never kicked a ball for Rangers, is younger than Reid & they got £500k.
 

Development fee wise, I think we are in a decent place. Obviously not as good as if he signed a new deal.

If he goes at the end of his deal & the clubs can’t agree comp, it would go to a tribunal.  

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

I can’t imagine the club would get a small fee. Billy Gilmour never kicked a ball for Rangers, is younger than Reid & they got £500k.
 

Development fee wise, I think we are in a decent place. Obviously not as good as if he signed a new deal.

If he goes at the end of his deal & the clubs can’t agree comp, it would go to a tribunal.  

We will only get around the £125k we accepted that bid amount from Celtic.

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1 hour ago, bazil85 said:

I can’t imagine the club would get a small fee. Billy Gilmour never kicked a ball for Rangers, is younger than Reid & they got £500k.

I’ve researched this and found out that Billy Gilmour was still under contract aged 15 when Chelsea and Rangers agreed a transfer fee (which included his development fee) and all manner of transfer add ons.
Gilmour did not officially join Chelsea until he was 16.

Regarding Gilmour add ons. £250K was paid to Rangers when he made his first full team start at Chelsea. There was a similar payment when Billy made 10 appearances. No doubt there was another payment when he made his full international debut. There’s also a 15% cut of any fee Chelsea receive in the future, which is where Rangers really stand to gain.

Rangers and Chelsea will also receive “development fees” if he moves clubs many times. Just like we have with John McGinn.

So this is a completely different scenario to what I asked for if Dylan leaves at the end of his contract. 

The club vice chair was quoted in the recent Smisa report https://www.smisa.net/news-archive/5-general-smisa-news/332-smisa-members-quarterly-meeting

“Celtic came in with an offer that reflected the compensation on offer that included a 30 percent sell-on clause.”

This says to me that if he leaves next summer having not signed a contract the development fee will be around £125K without any add ons.

From a recent report on Evening Times https://therealefl.co.uk/2019/06/18/oxford-united-linked-with-22-year-old-scotland-international/

“Motherwell would be entitled to a fee for the twenty-two-year-old under the FIFA solidarity mechanism, which states clubs must receive compensation for training players between their twelfth and twenty-third birthdays. The report claims under the rules, Motherwell are entitled to around £270,000 for the signature of the midfielder.”

There is no way that St Mirren would be getting any more than £125K for a player leaving aged 16/17 next summer. The figure that was the “agreed “ fee between Celtic and our club surely had to be as close to the development fee we are due if he does not sign a new contract or else our board are not doing their job right.

Do you still think we will get significantly more than £125K for Reid if he leaves in the summer? I’ve provided a lot of information. Hope you can offer a similar argument as I’d love to be proved wrong.
 

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“Celtic came in with an offer that reflected the compensation on offer that included a 30 percent sell-on clause.”
This says to me that if he leaves next summer having not signed a contract the development fee will be around £125K without any add ons.



Depends how you read it.

It could mean as you say or it could mean that £125k plus the add on equated to the development fee. Obviously the value of the add on would be a total guesstimate.

I assume that you're correct, though.
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9 minutes ago, Slarti said:

To work out how many folk the club can afford to make redundant? :whistle

Think someone was trying to deflect from the issue that no one at the club wants anyone to know about.
Surely the fans who financed the buyout of Gordon Scott deserve better? I’ve contributed from the start, but I thinking of cancelling my monthly subscription if the club board won’t share details of staff leaving. They seem happy to announce appointments, but less keen to announce departures.

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35 minutes ago, Albanian Buddy said:

Think someone was trying to deflect from the issue that no one at the club wants anyone to know about.
Surely the fans who financed the buyout of Gordon Scott deserve better? I’ve contributed from the start, but I thinking of cancelling my monthly subscription if the club board won’t share details of staff leaving. They seem happy to announce appointments, but less keen to announce departures.

AS. My view, for what it’s worth is that everybody is still getting used to the reality of what ownership means and how this works. Transparency is one issue. How much information should the board share? How much will the owners demand? Change is never easy.
 

Stirling Albion are an example of fan ownership where trust between the owners and the club board have largely broken down as far as I read. Lessons to be learned I think.

Meanwhile, our club is starting to make serious moves into being a community club. Well done all for that and I think that perhaps Kibble’s know how is helping turn ideas into reality.

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