New First Minister of Scotland

[antrin]

I thought that in an SNP Scotland all Scots were equal?  And that the SNP was a different sort of all-inclusive political party… with but one goal….

The idea (I was led to believe) was that AFTER separation, then other parties would arise from the ashes (snp having fulfilled its function).

It seems arse about tit, with a remarkable amount of recrimination and division in the last few days. But separation still husnae happened!  Schisms, resignations, blame and name-calling…

Whatever has gone wrong?

 

 

[beyond our ken]

45 minutes ago, ALBIONSAINT said:

Can you imagine the outcry from the press if Kate Forbes had won and brought in her wee free church members for prayers in Bute house. They also conveniently over looked that it’s all male prayers. 

Since we all know that Kate Forbes is an active wee free, we would not at all be surprised if she had a wee prayer meeting at BH.  Did Tony Blair not have No10 blessed by a priest when he moved in?    Do Moslems pray in same-sex groups?  If so, big deal

Now why would we worry about what would happen to a christian just because a Moslem had a wee pray when he took on a new job?  You seem to be inferring that a Moslem is doing something a christian would not be allowed to do, or would be criticised for.  There is literally f**k all to see here, unless you are a racist or religious bigot.  If that is the case, fill yer boots and get angry all on your own.

[beyond our ken]

On 3/28/2023 at 8:41 PM, ALBIONSAINT said:

Lost faith in him after the Dundee nursery carry on. It was a genuine administration error and he tried to make it about race I had a chuckle at him on stv news last night when he spoke about facing up to racism (imaginary that he concocted) poor show really. 

I know the nursery owners and that is very much the case,  Humza's wife then tried to entrap the owners by getting friends to call and ask for places they knew were not available.  Worst of all, he used his position to get the care commission to issue a very narrowly-focussed statement implying that the nursery was at fault and conflating an admin error with racism.

[ALBIONSAINT]

18 minutes ago, beyond our ken said:

Since we all know that Kate Forbes is an active wee free, we would not at all be surprised if she had a wee prayer meeting at BH.  Did Tony Blair not have No10 blessed by a priest when he moved in?    Do Moslems pray in same-sex groups?  If so, big deal

Now why would we worry about what would happen to a christian just because a Moslem had a wee pray when he took on a new job?  You seem to be inferring that a Moslem is doing something a christian would not be allowed to do, or would be criticised for.  There is literally f**k all to see here, unless you are a racist or religious bigot.  If that is the case, fill yer boots and get angry all on your own.

I think you may be missing my point, in the run up to the election the press was very much questioning her suitability for the role based on her religious beliefs (see below) yet Humza is a practicing Muslim with similar rigid morals and religious beliefs yet it was never questioned?
muslim men do not pray together with women. I have no comment to make on it. I am pretty sure I am not a racist or a bigot, however I don’t want my traditions and values being replaced by those of another culture, does that make you racist?  

[portmahomack saint]

Humza Yousaf was brilliant today at FMQ  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[stlucifer]

6 hours ago, portmahomack saint said:

Humza Yousaf was brilliant today at FMQ  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[shull]

 

[alanb]

12 hours ago, ALBIONSAINT said:

Can you imagine the outcry from the press if Kate Forbes had won and brought in her wee free church members for prayers in Bute house. They also conveniently over looked that it’s all male prayers. 

Murdo Fraser MSP took the same view and was called out for it and then deleted his tweet. It was pointed out that HY's mother is in the photo standing next to his father.

[portmahomack saint]

Man with different religious views from us Homo Neaderthalensis {we are the people}  moves into Bute House.

Time to mobilise the troops 

[beyond our ken]

31 minutes ago, ALBIONSAINT said:

I think you may be missing my point, in the run up to the election the press was very much questioning her suitability for the role based on her religious beliefs (see below) yet Humza is a practicing Muslim with similar rigid morals and religious beliefs yet it was never questioned?
muslim men do not pray together with women. I have no comment to make on it. I am pretty sure I am not a racist or a bigot, however I don’t want my traditions and values being replaced by those of another culture, does that make you racist?  

Your traditions and values replaced what was in place before them, as did mine.   That's life!

Anyway, tradition is one thing, in which way do the values of Moslems conflict with your own?

 

 

[portmahomack saint]

5 hours ago, shull said:

 

  Brilliant he's now upset the Mujahadeen, just another example why all religions are nothing but trouble, 

Religion or rather the extremists clowns that follow Religion have caused more wars than any other reason in world history..

Bin the lot of them.... Except the Judea Popular Front {that's mine} we don't take shit of anyone     

 

 

[Hunterian]

15 hours ago, ALBIONSAINT said:

Can you imagine the outcry from the press if Kate Forbes had won and brought in her wee free church members for prayers in Bute house. They also conveniently over looked that it’s all male prayers. 

With that said it was pointed out to me that there are daily prayers at Holyrood, presumably for all denominations.

[stlucifer]

I have no problem with people being stupid enough to think there is ANY god looking down on us but, given the christian worshippers were almost forced to accept female priests/ministers I think it's a poor show from a poor political leader who pretends to believe in equality to appear to be promoting an unequal practice. Perhaps this should have been left behind closed doors or, better still, he could have taken a stand by having females praying with them.

Edited March 31, 2023 by stlucifer

[W6er]

17 hours ago, beyond our ken said:

Since we all know that Kate Forbes is an active wee free, we would not at all be surprised if she had a wee prayer meeting at BH.  Did Tony Blair not have No10 blessed by a priest when he moved in?    Do Moslems pray in same-sex groups?  If so, big deal

Now why would we worry about what would happen to a christian just because a Moslem had a wee pray when he took on a new job?  You seem to be inferring that a Moslem is doing something a christian would not be allowed to do, or would be criticised for.  There is literally f**k all to see here, unless you are a racist or religious bigot.  If that is the case, fill yer boots and get angry all on your own.

Firstly, a lot was made about Kate Forbes' faith, and very little made about Humza Yousaf's. In light of this, it seems the latter is now publicly flaunting his faith. Absolutely he could hold a prayer meeting, but why publicise it? Which has the more intolerant record with respect to women's and LGBT rights?

Secondly, what's racist about criticising this? You are aware that Islam is NOT a race, it's a religion. My experience of those who conflate the two is that they're either very ignorant and have an erroneous and simplified view of the world in which only 'brown people' are Muslims. In addition to white Muslim converts, it's also the majority faith in places like Chechnya, Dagestan and Albania; in northern Nigeria they're typically black; and in Malaysia east Asian.

Muslims praying in same-sex groups might be considered a 'big deal' in the eyes of many SNP supporters, and others, who believe in inclusivity. 

 

[alanb]

1 hour ago, stlucifer said:

I have no problem with people being stupid enough to think there is ANY god looking down on us but, given the christian worshippers were almost forced to accept female priests/ministers I think it's a poor show from a poor political leader who pretends to believe in equality to appear to be promoting an unequal practice. Perhaps this should have been left behind closed doors or, better still, he could have taken a stand by having females praying with them.

His mother is standing behind him next to his father, blame the photographer 😉

[stlucifer]

3 minutes ago, alanb said:

His mother is standing behind him next to his father, blame the photographer 😉

That's neither here, nor there. Was his mother involved in the prayer on a level with the men? I would think not.

[alanb]

12 minutes ago, stlucifer said:

That's neither here, nor there. Was his mother involved in the prayer on a level with the men? I would think not.

She’s in the same room where he stated what was going on, in a personal tweet not official and jumped on by both racist and sectarian bodies and people 

Why if a prohibition in that faith generally is she in the room ? Probably because it’s breaking the fast during Ramadan and a big family thing, just like some other faiths say grace before dinner 

Bigots gotta bigot aka Fraser,Farage etc

link posted for true context 

Edited March 31, 2023 by alanb

[stlucifer]

17 minutes ago, alanb said:

She’s in the same room where he stated what was going on, in a personal tweet not official and jumped on by both racist and sectarian bodies and people 

Why if a prohibition in that faith generally is she in the room ? Probably because it’s breaking the fast during Ramadan and a big family thing, just like some other faiths say grace before dinner 

Bigots gotta bigot aka Fraser,Farage etc

link posted for true context 

WTF is the "bigots" nonsense? It is part of their religion not to have male and female in the same AREA for prayer. This is NOT inclusive. It is NOT a showing of equality. He either believes in equality or he doesn't. Perhaps it's a case of everyone is equal but some are more equal than others. AFAIC, He can't chase with the hounds and run with the foxes.

[alanb]

2 minutes ago, stlucifer said:

WTF is the "bigots" nonsense? It is part of their religion not to have male and female in the same AREA for prayer. This is NOT inclusive. It is NOT a showing of equality. He either believes in equality or he doesn't. Perhaps it's a case of everyone is equal but some are more equal than others. AFAIC, He can't chase with the hounds and run with the foxes.

The “ bigots” nonsense is only the left hand pic in his tweet was picked on and his mother is in the background and it’s taken in the hoose.

Rules maybe different in the mosque but I assume all members of that faith like other religions go with the flow but I bow to your expert understanding of Muslim theology 

Click on the link and read the comments and quote tweets for context 

[BuddieinEK]

1 hour ago, stlucifer said:

WTF is the "bigots" nonsense? It is part of their religion not to have male and female in the same AREA for prayer. This is NOT inclusive. It is NOT a showing of equality. He either believes in equality or he doesn't. Perhaps it's a case of everyone is equal but some are more equal than others. AFAIC, He can't chase with the hounds and run with the foxes.

Apparently he can and will. 

[ALBIONSAINT]

8 hours ago, beyond our ken said:

Your traditions and values replaced what was in place before them, as did mine.   That's life!

Anyway, tradition is one thing, in which way do the values of Moslems conflict with your own?

 

 

It’s a bit off topic from my point in the original post ( how would the press react if Kate Forbes won the leadership contest and asked the press along to photograph her and her church members having a prayer session) you could off course extend that question to have you ever seen any other leader in Scotland, U.K, Western Europe ask the press to come along to a prayer session with there family in a government building and photograph and report on it? Doesn’t that seem a bit odd? Anyway, back to your question above, yes Muslim/Islamic values conflict with my values in the following ways: I like to have a bacon sandwich in the morning before taking my dog out for a walk and then having a pint or two in the afternoon. If I am really lucky I may even have some premarital sex. This list is not exhaustive. 

[ALBIONSAINT]

8 hours ago, beyond our ken said:

Your traditions and values replaced what was in place before them, as did mine.   That's life!

Anyway, tradition is one thing, in which way do the values of Moslems conflict with your own?

 

 

It is indeed, Christmas holiday (now pushed as festive break) Easter holiday (now pushed as spring break) fireworks for guy Fawkes discouraged , whiskey drinking discouraged (minimum unit pricing) ……..

Would you not of expected the new leader of the SNP to wear traditional Scottish clothing for his inauguration? He didn’t need to wear a kilt, but maybe a suit with a tartan tie or handkerchief, no he dressed in traditional Pakistani clothes. Tradition is very important, once lost it’s gone forever. 

 

[Slarti]

It is indeed, Christmas holiday (now pushed as festive break) Easter holiday (now pushed as spring break) fireworks for guy Fawkes discouraged , whiskey drinking discouraged (minimum unit pricing) ……..
Would you not of expected the new leader of the SNP to wear traditional Scottish clothing for his inauguration? He didn’t need to wear a kilt, but maybe a suit with a tartan tie or handkerchief, no he dressed in traditional Pakistani clothes. Tradition is very important, once lost it’s gone forever. 
 

Christmas and Easter are not "Scottish traditions", they are "Christian traditions". Guy Fawkes - I've never seen the point of it. I don't drink whisky (or whiskey) - I do like bacon, though. What is "traditional" Scottish clothing?

Would you have an issue with a tee-total vegan atheist getting sworn in as FM while wearing jeans and a t-shirt?

As far as I'm concerned, he can wear what he wants and believe what he wants, as long as he doesn't try to force his religious beliefs on anyone else.

[W6er]

13 minutes ago, Slarti said:

 

 

Christmas and Easter are not "Scottish traditions", they are "Christian traditions". Guy Fawkes - I've never seen the point of it. I don't drink whisky (or whiskey) - I do like bacon, though. What is "traditional" Scottish clothing?

Would you have an issue with a tee-total vegan atheist getting sworn in as FM while wearing jeans and a t-shirt?

As far as I'm concerned, he can wear what he wants and believe what he wants, as long as he doesn't try to force his religious beliefs on anyone else.

 

 

This is where it just becomes silly. What is traditional Scottish clothing? You've seriously never heard of a kilt?

https://www.britannica.com/topic/kilt

Yousaf was clearly publicly acknowledging his Pakistani heritage by wearing those clothes. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that, per se. However, he had just been appointed First Minister for Scotland and therefore perhaps it would have been more fitting for him to publicly show his affinity and love of Scotland? I'm not sure why he has chosen to wear those clothes or have his photograph taken whilst praying, but it seems he wants the public to be aware that he is a Muslim of Pakistani heritage. Why then should people not comment on that?

Christmas and Easter are certainly not Scottish traditions, especially the former which protestants didn't even celebrate in a meaningful way, I believe. But certainly Easter has traditionally been celebrated in Scotland.

 

[antrin]

A kilt was NEVER part of traditional clothing for me growing up in Scotland - apart from being stuck in a tiny one as pageboy at an Auntie’s wedding.  We seldom saw kilts in Paisley.

Up until the ‘45, in the Highlands, a wrap-around garment like a “kilt” was worn, just like the long gowns in Arab/Muslim countries.  They were not traditional in the Lowlands nor South of there.

Kilts and tartans were “fabricated” as traditional “Scotch” wear by Walter Scott who was put in charge of bigging  up the visit of the new heid royal in his day.  You can laugh and learn from this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visit_of_George_IV_to_Scotland