The Original 59er
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Posts posted by The Original 59er
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A goal ratio of 1 goal per 3.56 games hardly pushes him into the 'legend' category!
The fact is that he has spent much more time in Paisley at St Mirren than at any other club throughout his career which suggests what he achieved here was the pinnacle of his career.
He got a lot of game time throughout that period, 146 games, - I'll accept he may be a "top bloke", and a "good professional", but please don't insult the few that have actually become 'legends'.
He's moved on, so should all you stalkers!
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Come on guys, less than one year ago we went up there and beat them 4-3.
Yes they beat us in the league this year, but it's not as though they are world beaters!
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Sorry am I missing something here.................????????????
Every time Billy Mehmet moves anywhere in the world some misguided contributor on this forum drags his name back into the picture that suggests he might sign again for us.
Firstly, whoever you are, you must be stalking BM as he travels round the world in search of a team that matches his 'talents' and secondly, why on earth would we want to turn the clock back four or five years and bring back a player who was big, very occasionally a danger to the opposition and hadn't a clue where the net was!
There are a lot more and better options out there than Billy Mehmet!
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Jonah welcome to the madhouse.................................
The Bull Inn gets my vote - probably the best pub in Paisley consistently over the years
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What I'd love to know is when I might have this earth moving moment of 'Zen'.
Nothing I've seen on the pitch this year gives me much hope of reaching that higher ground!
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Humble Pie eaten................................ got the years slightly mixed up!
The league stats are correct however and the Cup run and win only mask the reality that is the league results.
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Posted Today, 17:03Got your stats wrong, mate. We won 5 games in our League Cup run during 2012/2013. It's bad enough without you making it worse.Sorry to say I've got them bang on correct. If you read my post I quote from 1st January 2012 not the start of the 2012 / 13 season. We won our three other games in that competition before the end of December.
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Ok I keep coming back to the stats, stats and damned lies. Unfortunately in this case they don't lie!
Since the start of January 2012 ........................... yes that is 21 months ago, we have played 23 league matches - a possible 69 points.
In that time we have won just 3 games ...........................YES that's right you are reading this correctly - 3 league games, we have drawn 9 and lost 11. A total of just 18 points.
The League Cup masks our stats slightly in that if you include all competitive games since 1st January 2012 we have played 3 games in that competition and won 2 and lost 1. In the Scottish Cup we have played 2, won 1 and lost 1.
The Cup win was fantastic, we all loved our day in the sun and over the years I can still remember the moments when we lift a cup - they stick in the memory, but it's the bread and butter of the league that sets our standards and determines the standard of football that people talk about and write to this forum about (in the main).
The stats are woeful.
I'm sorry Danny, your comments in the press a couple of days ago are the signs that you too expect the chop - why else allude to the idea that maybe someone else might do no better!
The time has come my friend, leave with your head held slightly high, and wish the next person the best of luck in improving these woeful figures that you have managed over these 21 months!
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I'm a frequent visitor to Oregon................................ does that count?
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Posted Today, 14:46According to the BBC survey, entry fees to English 1st and 2nd division grounds on average is lower than SPL!Match Day prices for a sample four teams in the third tier of English football:Yeovil Town £25 or £23 Main stand or £24 or £22 in opposite sideShrewsbury Town £24 or £21Tranmere Rovers £23.50 or £20.50Sheffield Utd (with average crowds of 18,600) £22 or £18That's what we compete against in general playing level terms - some may argue that the English 1st Division is a higher standard than Scottish Premier - it may be the case, but the basic cost in these 4 examples are all higher than St Mirren's base cost of £20 for entry into the west stand.
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Posted Today, 10:10
Until clubs start paying players sensible wages (no more than £800 a week - a FABULOUS wage for kicking a ball) we'll not see admission prices drop, fans will continue to drop away and the game will die eventually.
It pains me to see so many apparently successful businessmen utterly unable to see the bigger picture and work together to avoid damaging a loved sport.
I have to say Oaksoft's reply does either reek of tongue-in-cheek, or cloud cuckoo land - can't quite decide!
If a footballer follows his childhood dream and get through the ranks of youth / junior / lower league football to reach the dizzy heights of Premier League football in Scotland he might then dream of a larger pay cheque in the south, but more often then not his dream stops there.
Now how long does that dream last one year, two or at a push even ten, but at the ripe old age of say 30 (if he has been lucky on the injury front) he is more or less getting to the end of that career. What's next - management maybe (proportionally very, very, few make the grade) , coaching........ maybe, re-start his education ..... maybe, but for most very unlikely.
So he uses the £800 (you suggest) he has earned per week (£40,000 per year - less of course tax, living expenses, mortgage, pension, the odd occasional night out etc. etc.) and retires gracefully for the next 70 years on that pension / capital built up during that period of playing football.
A footballer is like any other performer on a public stage - they look for the attention and they get attention - just look at the coverage in the last four pages of every newspaper - they are theoretically entertainers.
What do you pay to go and watch say the Proclaimers - £20 a ticket or even more perhaps? Ok so the Proclaimers might be national, so how much would you pay to see Glasgow Warriors play rugby?
By your suggestion footballers should be paid roughly a half to 30% of what they are paid, so are you suggesting you pay £8 to £10 per game to watch a SPFL match? That's a way short of where life sits I'm afraid to say.
So a footballer will try to get a wage that reflects what he is worth to the club - be that St Mirren, Dundee United, Aberdeen or Celtic. All have different levels of fan base, all have different approaches to investment and income streams, so to say that a footballer should be paid £800 a week is fundamentally daft.
On that argument, if you were that good in your job, you would happily expect a national average wage even tho' you might bring ten times the average profit into the company as the next man............................................. don't even try and argue that one!
The problem of high prices isn't per se the player's wages, it is the historical inflated amounts of money that was thrown at the game by Sky and the various television companies inflating the amount of money available to the clubs that led to inflation of wages beyond realism. The game now has an after-taste that permeates its way down to the fans at the turnstile. For clubs to pay players a wage that offers a reasonable level of skill they have to compete with the English 2nd or 3rd tier of league - we struggle with that, because in the south the basic crowd level is so much higher - just check out the crowd levels in the English 1st division this weekend and see what I mean (http://www.football-league.co.uk/page/DivisionalAttendance/0,,10794~201225,00.html) they can get so much more due to the population levels.
By all means argue for deals that get bums on seats, by all means argue for juvenile encouragement and get them there and hooked on the idea of supporting the buddies, but wake up and smell the coffee, we aren't living in the 1980's anymore!
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Posted Today, 09:45: Look at you with your big fancy words...that thesaurus of yours must be just about worn out!Barney, it's called education - use them or lose them, the English language has a wonderful vocabulary out there................... what's a thesaurus?
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One of the main problems of this website now is that I've virtually lost the knack of evaluating whether a post is supposed to be well-intentioned and a genuine feeling from the heart or is an attempt at irony and sarcasm.
Bart's three postings to (1) players, (2) Manager and (3) Board of Directors is couched in such terms that I'm perplexed by the nature of the verbiage and veracity of feelings.
Perhaps I've become afflicted in some way by the now constant bitter diatribe circulating around these pages that I've lost all sense of proportion!
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For many supporters, we've been here before, so often. Failing teams, indifferent tactics, faltering managers and Boards that jump when they see the panic button, - all this dialogue aimed at DL is no surprise.
Another poster has rightly said that he can smell relegation at St Mirren Park right now - 4 games into the season or not - I agree, it reeks of it.
Thistle showed us up good and proper on Saturday and this is a team that has just come up from the 2nd tier. Right now, I suspect that this disjointed team of ours would struggle to keep up with the top 4 in the 2nd division.
So who is to blame for this situation? Is it the players, the manager or the Board. To some extent you have to blame the players, but not for adopting questionable tactics on a newly promoted team. It took 45 minutes for the management to work out that every bit of pressure being forced on our defence was coming from the wings especially the left wing, just about every supporter could see it happening. The passing was slick and efficient by Thistle as opposed to slack and imprecise by Saints, so in that respect you can blame the players, but not for the long ball punt - that had to come from management. The Board? well why the Board - they run a tight ship, they have a passion for the club and they have guided us to a very stable platform that must be the envy of very many in the game.
Yesterday I posted that there is basically no hiding place for a football manager, it is purely a result based culture. You survive and succeed, or you fall on your sword by virtue of the results. It is the same the whole world over - there aren't many managers who survive if they fail and the poor stats suggest that the end is nigh for DL and probably TC, either that or the Board don't give a toss, which personally is a view I don't subscribe to.
I have so wanted DL to succeed, I believe his philosophy is well intentioned, but if Thistle can come to our ground as Ross County did last year and stick it on us with ease and beat us at our so-called passing game then something is rotten in the state of Denmark.
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Sorry LS, but you live in a bubble if you believe that supporters won't stand up and criticise the manager when he is trying hard but barely succeeding.
I've said it before and others have quoted the stats - our win record over a long period is terrible not just this season, last season too. 9 wins in 38 games and the second worst goal average in the league. That is one win in four. We had 14 draws that's one draw in 2.7 games. The stats don't lie. The League Cup win papered over the cracks - that's the reality- the bread and butter of the league was unsuccessful. This year we are now 4 games into this league campaign and we have one draw and no wins and by far the worst goal average in the league and we have Celtic to play at Darkhead.
Yes you can tell me I'm just being a knicker-wetter or a negative influence - However it's reality.
Saints fans want to see progress we don't want to be fighting relegation year on year and we see others making that progress. Please just remember the team in second bottom spot goes into play-offs with the three in the 2nd tier and right now watching that performance on Saturday gives me little or no confidence that progress is being made anywhere on the pitch.
Sorry Mr Lennon - you've lost my confidence in you - I sincerely wanted you to succeed, but events are over-taking you at a fast pace.
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The gamble of playing a striker from the start, who you have signed the day before, suggests a hint of desperation.
I thought the link between him and Thompson looked promising - yes he tried ever so hard to please, had a shoot on sight policy that somewhat wreaked of lack of practice and he sometimes forgot to take the ball with him on the many runs he made, but believe me I have seen many worse in a Saints jersey over the years.
I think he will get better, the main worry for me is tho' if the team continues in the downward spiral, it is often very difficult to shine when you are being battered every week.
As for our trolls - they are young, bored and think it's funny to abuse - sometime in the not too distant future the world will catch up with them, even if it's nothing more than being sacked from their job as a MacDonald's floor sweeper!
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Football is a completely results based culture and that stretches from the BoD's to the players. In between the Manager is the most vulnerable of all the parts, as his existence at the club depends on the players (i.e. others) carrying out his tactics and inspiring them to play at a level that is commensurate with their abilities and salaries.
If you don't achieve results then your employment is basically on the line.
For the life of me I can't imagine being a football manager as it is the most precarious and fickle of jobs, one minute you are the bee's knees - the next you are headed for the scrap-heap. It's not like many other jobs, such as working for the government, local authorities or a large corporate organisation where basically you can hide for large parts of your life without the threat of losing your job.
It is in the public eye, it is dealing with supporters (who, if you read this website, many subscribe to the concept that you can abuse whoever you like from behind a computer screen), it is dealing with a group of owners who often lack any logic other than self-glorification and it is managing a bunch of often highly over-paid guys who frequently stick two fingers up at you because they aren't getting a game in their favoured position.
The stats for DL and TC are NOT good. Basically many managers would have lost their Board by now. DL probably gained a few extra months due to the Cup win, but truth be told I'd bet the Board would rather see a consistent run of results that had us top of the league (ICT style) or frequently challenging for the top 6 year on year. We are making virtually no progress.
Saturday said a lot to me - the manager couldn't read that the service Thistle were getting down the left hand side needed to be stopped, - it only took the entire first half to realise it. Secondly Thistle's passing was so much crisper, accurate and direct it demonstrated that whilst we championed the passing game two years ago, others have by-passed us big style. Lastly even I could see that a gamble of playing a striker who hadn't even trained with the squad should be given a starting position was the sign of a pretty desperate management team.
I'm not the kind of person that cries for blood at the first sign of a problem, however when the problem becomes a crisis and the crisis becomes a disaster, then I do think that the time has come for the BoD to consider what is best for St Mirren Football Club.
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As good hard tacklers go - add Cockles Wilson to the list, but he wasn't a psychopath that's for sure, neither was Jackie Copland.
Aber was, I remember Clelland - yes he might fit into the mould!
Now I can name a few in the rugby world however that were real psychopaths..............................................................
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Peter Kane wore old rugby boots which had the leather studs - so they had 4 small nails in each stud - you can guess the rest!
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It's not rocket science. Allow only one name from an I.P. address and bin the rest. Not difficult to set up a spread sheet with all the addresses listed, then just put paid to the many names under the same address and let them bitch about it after the event.
If a father and child use the same computer to set up different names then they can apply separately to have these allowed within the system.
Sorted............................... now who has the time and the inclination?
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Whether this is an open forum or not is totally irrelevant, the open abuse and direct unmitigated personal attacks on DL are completely uncalled for.
Without doubt he is trying his best. Now to some that is maybe not enough, but whether we like it or not as supporters, that is what we have got - a Manager who has introduced a different brand of football and works within a severely constrained budget.
Guys - get it into your thick heads, if DL and TC were given Barcelona's budget and players we would see really exciting successful football, we don't and never shall have that luxury, so accept what we have, a BoD that won't go into debt, a budget that is extremely tight and a bunch of players that would struggle to make the grade in the third tier of English football.
Stop the vitriol against DL, by all means make sensible, rational and non-personal comments, but please stop this tirade against someone who has brought some joy to the miserable bunch that call themselves Saint's supporters!
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Isabella, extremely well documented.
I saw Gerry play quite a number of times - he was fast, had a real eye for goal and whilst not tall could take all the attentions given to him by the opposition defenders.
I did a post a few months ago and compared his goal ratio to many St Mirren strikers (through the years) and to some of the all time greats in the game in general - his goals per game ratio was away up there with the very best. Only Joe McBride of Celtic (from memory) was so much better.
Sad to hear of his passing, - now he was a GREAT LEGEND in the buddies Hall of Fame!
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Statistics, statistics and damned lies!
Unfortunately, the facts speak for themselves and there are no damned lies available to mask the extremely poor playing record of the team under DL and TC. Don't get me wrong, I was pleased with the change in playing philosophy post-Gus and it was refreshing, however the opposition soon learned how to counter our passing game and as we weren't Barcelona, the players didn't have the ability to take that passing game up a couple of notches to outwit the opposition who came to spoil our new-found game.
The original post by Tam has many basic facts absolutely on the ball. The stats don't lie - and in reality we are now going backwards as a team as opposed to forwards (maybe I should say across rather than backwards as that is the regular passing direction for those at the back). I am a stuck record in that I've posted several times that the goalkeeping position is important enough to have someone that inspires confidence, central defence is consistently not strong enough and leaks too many goals, and Thompson is not an out and out striker - he needs a partner who is effective (god forbid he gets injured).
I feel for Danny Lennon and Tommy Craig as they have brought large amounts of joy to the small bunch of regular supporters who follow the Buddies, BUT they are losing that crowd and they are losing the support of those who truly want them to succeed.
What's the answer - it's certainly not pushing untried and untested players who are currently on the staff into the managerial role. It's also not Calderwood - sorry far too many failures at various levels.
It is maybe time for the BoD's to seriously consider whether we are making progress and maybe at the end of this week, whether a failure to attract the right kind of players into a successful set-up is something to do with the perceived external attitudes of the club and whether players are not excited to come to Paisley to ply their trade because they seriously question whether they can improve or be successful with the current managerial set-up.
Something's not right and it's not just the lack of money -as has been ventured elsewhere on this forum- other teams such as the fake Saints, ICT, Ross County, Motherwell and Kilmarnock all seem to achieve better signings (or extract more from these signings) and better shape and tactics, than we do.
Sorry, I'm one of those supporters that's beginning to wet my knickers and see that maybe change is not that far away.
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This coming Saturday night news: Thommo pulls hamstring.......... out for 4 to 6 weeks.
PLEASE convince me we have sufficient back-up in the current squad to fill his boots and NOT go out and panic buy another Guy!
Speculation Thread
in The Rumour Mill
Posted · Edited by The Original 59er
Isabella Duke Posted 04 December 2013 - 20:22
"The fact that "The Original 59er" feels such venom and hatred for Mehmet after all this time suggests that its him who should move on!"
I'll take that comment with a total pinch of salt in that anyone who publically claims that Lewis Guy is his 'main man' has to do irony!