oaksoft
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Posts posted by oaksoft
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Don't know how much truth there is in the following warning but better safe than sorry......
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OlympicIn the coming days, you should be aware.....Do not open any message with an attachment called: Invitation FACEBOOK, regardless of who sent it. It is a virus that opens an OlympIc torch that burns the whole hard disc C of your computer. This virus will be received from someone you had in your address book. That's why you should send this message to all your contacts. It is better to receive this email 25 times than to receive the virus and open it. If you receive an email called: Invitation FACEBOOK, though sent by a friend, do not open it and delete it immediately. It is the worst virus announced by CNN. A new virus has been discovered recently that has been classified by Microsoft as the most destructive virus ever. It is a Trojan Horse that asks you to install an adobe flash plug-in. Once you install it, it's all over. And there is no repair yet for this kind of virus. This virus simply destroys the Zero Sector of the Hard Disc, where the vital information of their function is saved.
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This is a common hoax and has been going on for decades.
The idea is to get denial of service issues by overloading email servers with everyone emailing everyone else in a mass panic.
Delete it and DON'T email it to anyone.
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Some interesting statements coming out of SFL clubs.
It appears that it's now 14-3 against Rangers starting in Division One with Newco not in existence, Dundee not allowed to vote and Airdrie abstaining I make that there is no chance that newco can get sufficient votes to win outright any vote pitching Division 3 v Division 1. Of course the suspicion is that they still won't be given that choice and that the SFL board will attempt to manipulate any outcome.
Interestingly a number of SFL Chairmen have now come out and condemned the SFA and the SPL for attempting to - if I may paraphrase - bully them which flies completely in the face of Stewart Regan, Neil Doncaster and David Longmuirs statements that it was no time for outside influences.
The SPL clubs behaviour quite frankly stinks.
I see FIFA have now commented as well saying that sporting merit should be the guiding principle BUT that they won't get involved if SevCo go to Div 1. The SFA are duty bound to go with FIFA's stance on this but they might not.
No idea what repercussions this could have if they ignore FIFA.
The SPL and SFA need to ask themselves whether it is worth all the hassle of going through this for 1 club.
A brief risk assessment shows the "no brainer" which Gilmour was portraying as a very difficult decision.
Let's imagine they get Div 1.There's a significant risk that thousands will leave the game permanently in all divisions probably causing many clubs to go to the wall mid-season. There's also a significant risk that some sponsors present and future will be put off being involved in a corrupt league. SevCo will NEVER be allowed to live this down and for the rest of their probably brief days, their fans will be hounded about this. Banter is one thing but DECADES of having your birth and legitimacy questioned all over the world? Hmmm. IMO THAT will be the death of Scottish Football but I'm not persuaded it would be long or lingering. SevCo are STILL talking about going to England. Are our chairmen listening though?
Let's now imagine they get Div 3. Several clubs might be in long term trouble but the next season will probably be fine. The idea that sponsors will pull out before the end of the season is laughable. Yes, companies are about money but they are also about reputation. Which sponsor wants to have their brand soiled by being the one who pulls the plug on the entire Scottish league setup mid season? None of them. Not even ESPN. I'd stake my life on it. As for NEXT season, every club will have to release most players out of contract and rely on youth. The situation then resolves itself and equilibrium is restored at a lower wage bill level. I can't see the downside of this other than us losing out on all that world-renowned the sexy football we've been used to since the SPL started.
No brainer, as I said.
BTW is there ANYONE who still thinks the SPL model of chasing money is valid?
Since it started we've not qualified for any national tournament finals and have only two good Europa league runs and a host of clubs seemingly in poverty across all 4 leagues. When SPL chairmen survey the tattered landscape of Scottish football that many of them created or helped to sustain, do they get the warm glow of a grand vision achieved? Or do they realise they are personally and collectively responsible for corporate vandalism on a scale never seen in our country's game?
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Looks like the SFL Clubs are going to ask for a postponement of the vote on Friday. The shambles continues.
It's not surprising.
There is no vacancy to fill yet.
The SFL should NOT vote until the SPL decide which team to promote.
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He could just hand over the shares for free
But aye, I know, it's getting weary. Looking at Gilmour on Tuesday he looked as though the stress was getting to him, whilst George Campbell looked as though he was the youngest of the three! You'd think those who hero worship them would just realise that they want out and it's time to respect their wishes (whilst at the same time trying to ensure that the club gets the right group of people in to takeover the running of the club at the best possible price)
I think he has no choice.
You cannot tell everyone with ears that the club is facing administration and then put your hand out for £1.5 million.
That would be laughable.
That's the worst thing out of all of this.
Doncaster has effectively told every TV broadcaster that we are desperate.
That is NOT a great place to start negotiating from.
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I hope It's not just me and you Poz.....these are strange times and strange things may happen but don't mention it to Shull.
No I see the positives in this as well.
This has sent a clear message to Celtic that actually the fans of the diddy clubs do have some balls after all and any nonsense from Celtic MIGHT see them suffer the same fate.
Celtic are now duty bound to start thinking about how lucky they are not to have folded like Rangers.
I agree with you. The boycott talks should now be stopped. Every remaining club needs to be supported now to prevent ex-Rangers fans from being able to say "told you so".
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Good statement. I'm well up for doing whatever I can to 'ease the pain' of this affair. Seemed to me that a lot of good dialogue - with zero in-fighting or shouting the odds, was achieved on Monday and Tuesday.
Could be a good idea to do that again. Main stand - but the topic of discussion is coming up with ideas and maybe going about setting up some mechanism for club and fans to implement the workable ideas.
Credit where it's due I think given the severity of the problem there was remarkablly little fighting amongst fans across the entire country on this issue.
It's interesting to see what fans can do when they are sufficiently motivated.
Pretty sure that cries of help from the club on any issue will be met with lots of willing volunteers.
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Just to clarify, the document that was sent to the SFL clubs was sent to them by the SFL, not the SPL.
Who sent it is not actually the problem.
The problem is the threat of financial meltdown and a breakaway SPL2.
I'm pretty certain the SFL didn't make those two things up.
This is as clear an attempt at blackmail as you'll ever see and in writing as well.
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The massive favor is an opinion and not fact as no punishment has been given out. Too many of you are clicking the hatred button.
This is a chance to change Scottish football. Like it or not that club being reformed will be part of Scottish football it won’t go away like you hope. Unfortunately money makes the world go round as it does with Scottish football. As such provincial clubs should negotiate the change to suit our needs best.
You are making too many assumptions here about the motives of people.
Are you suggesting that 95% of football supporters across the country actively HATE a new company so much that they'd be prepared to hurt their own team?
Sorry bud. This isn't hate. It's bigger than that. This is about the purpose of organised football in this country.
None of us could give a toss about Rangers but we DO care about the integrity of the sport we love.
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Then why don't we all just concentrtre on St Mirren? we had a better season last time out, we could???? have a better one still this season ahead.
The people in the firing line are the chairmen of the SFL clubs, they need to hold their noses and get the best deal for their clubs. It's not their responsibility to punish rangers or any club come to that! Stick them in Div 1, divi the cash up, reorganise the leagus and change the voting structure.
let the **** bleed to death, they would if it were us!
Classic ostrich behaviour. Let's pretend that none of this affects St Mirren.
Sadly in the real world, the SevCo situation intimately involves every single club in the country.
Calling people who recognise that indisputable fact "negs" makes you look pretty daft.
You are still talking about "punishing" by the way. I have no idea what you're going on about.
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The sort of blinkered, short sighted, hate filled narrow agenda that will kill scottish football in exchange for sending a threadbare (playing staff and ticket sales) club to Div 3.
To everyone other than Oaksoft who can see the big picture, will it really, deep down give you any satisfaction if sevco 5088 go to div 3, and several clubs (possibly ours) cease to exist? yeah we'de be 'Dead & Right'... that'l make interesting reading (not) on the record books when they write up when scottish football shot itself in the foot.
Wow.
A compliment.
At least you acknowledge I can see the bigger picture.
Not sure about the rest of the pish in your post though.
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With the first of two meetings tonight, and a string of seemingly contradictory statements from the BoD and 10000 hours last week regarding the whole "newco, threats to sfl etc" It would be useful to determine exactly what is influencing the BoD at this time?
In a thinly guised statement SG appears to be backing SPL 1 (16 clubs) and SPL 2 (10 clubs) then a few "Bet ten Bob leagues" in pyramid formation.
Is the influence driven by their 52% shareholding being worth more if Sevco 5088 are parachuted into div 1 rather than div 3???
What is the benefit to SFL teams that don't make it into either Spl 1 or 2? will it be worth their while, reduced costs, higher distribution of income from above???
All of this is a side issue.
As usual, you seem to be incapable of understanding the nub of the problem.
There have only been two real questions here.
1) Will Saints vote NO.
2) Did Saints have anything to do with the SFL letter.
Fans have repeatedly asked for clarification on both and have been denied it on both counts.
The answer to question 1 was extracted from Gilmour at a bewilderingly slow pace.
Tomorrow he'll hopefully be asked the second question and we'll get an answer.
I sincerely hope those attending do not fall into that "keep this answer quiet" camp leaving the rest of us uninformed but that's the price to pay for not attending I suppose.
In terms of the current crisis, pretty much everything else is a distraction.
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Im sorry guys but I can not get my head around why we want to punish the CiC and St Mirren for a decision that we may not agree with.
I want to see Rangers in the third division at best, but I want to see a successfull St Mirren more.
SG and the current board may make some daft decisions at the momment with regards to Rangers, however in his tenure he has made some decisions that have saved us from being in Rangers position.
Time to take a reality check guys are you hatred for Rangers out weigh your love of St Mirren?
At what point do you put common decency and morals before your football team?
Is it SO overridingly important to you to watch 22 guys kicking a plastic ball for 90 minutes that you are willing to suffer corruption, blackmail and bullying?
What exactly would need to happen before you stopped watching games?
Would ticket prices need to go to £150 a match?
Whatever that point is for you, understand that for more than 95% of ALL scottish football fans out there, this is a red line.
BTW the entire point is that a boycott which is prepared to be seen through will result in the BOD backing down.
If you think a single person on here WANTS to miss a single match you've misunderstood everything.
I believe this is financially driven and therefore financial threats which overcome the perceived gain of greasingup for SevCo MUST logically win the day.
Temporary boycotts are that financial threat.
There isn't a chance in hell that Saints will disappear.
The boycott will hopefully remain, Gilm our will back down and make the statement we all demand and then he'll sell up, disappear and we can all forget about this shit. We can all tell our grandchildren how we were there when SevCo were finally beaten.
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Fair enough bud, I can't criticise anyone for feeling like that.
I too am disgusted by the proposal and particularly the way it has been worded, but I see the strength of feeling all the way through the leagues and believe the fans will ensure this fudge doesn't happen.
Rather than try and kill our own club, we should be trying to kill the proposal. In my opinion.
I agree but how do we do that effectively without threatening a boycott of tickets and withdrawing TTH money?
If these guys won't listen what else can we do?
Gilmour can end all of this tomorrow by making a statement. Let's hope he does because he doesn't seem to get the seriousness and immediacy of this problem as it affects Saints.
If he doesn't then he's seriously risking standing in an empty stadiumn on day 1 of the new season wishing for the old days where Saints stood to lose just a few quid from SevCo away fans.
Maybe he just doesn't think we are serious.
Ticket sales are apparently up 15%.
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Sorry, what have 10000Hours got to do with what St.Mirren FC are currenty doing ?
It seems a bit bizarre to punish the group who are trying to deliver fan ownership because the current board aren't seen to be listening to the fans ?!
I thought REA was on the current board.
I may be wrong.
If I'm right then culpability lies therein.
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That would certainly be my view as well. Perhaps each question needs to have an "abstain" option as well so that members can register either their ambivalence to the question being asked or their displeasure at how the question has been asked or that it has been asked at all.
I'm pretty happy with an 83.5% return in the first poll given that we only had 2 and a half days to get it done and that we are now into the holiday season so it's inevitable that many members are abroad and not necessarily checking their email.
Would agree that there needs to be some sort of threshold on the number of votes we get back, Something in the region of 75 to 80% would seem reasonable enough to me.
On the subject of the return in this test case we only had a few technical issues, which were almost all down to end users (mis typed email addresses), or their computer or security settings where email was spam trapped or the link wouldn't open directly from the email.
Given the emotions which run in football, I think a clear majority in any vote is probably necessary and I like the idea of 60-67% of cast votes being decisive and removing any objections.
The setting of a minimum participation limit is, I fear, a dead end. You'll be forever amending it.
Over time, it is inevitable that voter turnout will drop. There is no minimum turnout for any UK election so I don't quite see the logic of having one at Saints. Especially setting it at anywhere near 70%.
If you have to have one, 30% would seem reasonable and sustainable IMO.
Either way, it's good to hear that both issues (turnout and vote) are being addressed because both are fundamental.
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Zombie related article quoting Stuart Gilmour in today's PDE:
http://www.paisleyda...87085-31267620/
WTF!!!!!!!!!
Our Chairman would appear to be backing entry of the hvns at SFL1
You've got to hand it to Stewart. He certainly knows how to grab defeat from the jaws of victory.
He is making the arrogant mistake of thinking SFL clubs would just die at the chance of selling their souls for a few pounds.
It's almost sweet that he was surprised at two clubs saying no to that and not just any two clubs either - Raith and Falkirk are clubs which are struggling financially.
For them to say no to this takes genuine courage.
IMO there simply isn't anything in it for the SFL clubs.
If SevCo go to the 1st division 20 clubs out of 29 don't get to play them and only a small amount of cash comes their way which they've never had and wouldn't really miss. Seriously, what do SPL chairmen think Albion Rovers would do with 50k? Who the hell could they sign?
If SevCo go to Div 3, then every other team gives up promotion killing their league.
IMO SPL chairmen are making a mistake thinking SFL clubs can be bought.
Neither will they buy the pyramid thing.
I genuinely believe the SFL will tell SevCo to GTF.
Annan talked about Spartans getting their chance and I agree.
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Ok it seems like the 75% majority required in the 10000 hours daft constitution will not be achieved in the over complicated Newco vote.
SO!
I know at present somewhere around 59% have voted, but within that a 20% vote has been registered to allow a newco into the spl if it "Threatened" admin at smfc. a couple of hundred shy on ST sales "Threatens" admin at smfc!
So with that in mind how many people who have voted to do as it says on Question 4 below will actually pay their monthly subscription now to 10000 hours to help maintain "Integrity" for at least a year, bearing in mind that at no point has it been intimated this minimum of a years subscriptions will go towards funding a "Fan Ownership" of 52% of SMFC???
I'd be interested to see how many people who voted YES to Question 4 will now authorise the direct debit?
"In the event of SPL Commercial revenues reducing would you, working with the CIC and SMFC, be prepared to support the club through increased pledges and donations ? (Depending on the funding required this may delay the purchase for a year with your monthly contribution going towards helping the club directly while helping to maintain the integrity of Scottish Football"
Here's a better question.
Are you posting under the alias Dick Slexsia or whatever he is called?
If you are, you can f**k right off in terms of getting any further response from me and anyone else with half a brain.
BTW the vote hasn't finished yet so why not bugger off and amuse yourself till tomorrow.
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RickMcD......I disagree completey.....10000 Hours have cited the "direction" vote as being the key mechanism for fans to influence their BoD. It doesn't because it is shite. The fans own the £1.5Million debt of 10000 Hours, they do not influence the running of the club.
IF 10000 Hours does get put on hold for longer than the 2 - 3 weeks then we will have the chance to ensure that we actually have genuine fan influence. At the moment it is shit and this proof of concept has proved it's shit.
Financially it is a shambles, structurally it is a shambles.....and even worse everything about it is shifting sand with the fans the last to know about any changes made to it - despite having committed to it through direct debits before we actually know what it is, how it is funded and what the actual risk is to the club.
Yet again you dilute a good point by pouring more negative pish onto it.
Tell you what. I'll bet you that even if the vote is under 75%, the BOD will accept that the Saints fans want NO to NewCo and will vote that way citing the fans backing.
Whoever loses has to write a poem about how humble they are and post it on here. Come on. Take me up on it.
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The concern about the mechanism for fan influence on the CIC board and then the SMFC board is not quite addressed. As it stands under the draft constitution there isn't a high enough no vote from fans for Question 1 never mind the rest of the votes.
I do accept however that requesting 75% of the entire membership to vote a patricular way is tantamount to having no voice.
That would require nearly 100% of voters to turnout and even at that, almost no issue will gain that sort of support.
This will need looked at BUT the fact remains that you're being unusually negative.
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The concern about the mechanism for fan influence on the CIC board and then the SMFC board is not quite addressed. As it stands under the draft constitution there isn't a high enough no vote from fans for Question 1 never mind the rest of the votes.
FFS Sid stop your negative pish!
75% of members need to vote a particular way to get the vote carried but that's only when the CiC take over which they haven't.
Most of the results are showing well over 95% in favour of NO to NewCo.
To cross that 75% of members (because some haven't voted yet) we need:
15 more No votes on question 1.
36 more No votes on question 2.
150 more No votes on questions 3 and 4.
There are 260 people still to vote.
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Sid it leaves a rather unpleasant taste in the mouth that a supposed "fans" organisation consults on the questions, then ignores the feedback and puts them anyway including the question where they plead for more debt before they've even been able to table a bid. 10000 hours have shamefully sought to make this vote about them rather than scottish football and St Mirren.
Shame on them, first consultation with the fans and they've ignored the feedback. shape of things to come from the self appointed BoD???
I think you need to grow up a bit for two reasons.
1) You've won the debate. The overwhelming answer is NO to NewCo under ANY circumstances.
2) You've misunderstood why these questions are being asked. The BOD are looking for evidence that the support fully understand the consequences. In this way, the BOD will vote NO and if/when we complain about the consequences, we'll be shown the vote. This is an exercise in the BOD covering their arses over a decision which might land us in the shit if we're not careful and quite rightly they don't want to be blamed. This is politics. If there was glory to be had the BOD would want the credit. If there's shit to be eaten, it's our baby. In many ways, that's fine by me. Fans got their say when it really mattered. I could spend a month arguing amongst guys like Div etc but expecting to get absolutely everything your own specific way is childish.
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Yes I do, because you can agree or disagree or just ignore it.
What I think does not inspire adult debate is being shouted down by the mods/owner on what is a saints fans forum for discussing a selection of highly controversial questions. That is not democracy in action
As much as I agree about the nature of the questions, the fact remains that people are voting almost unanimously No, No, No and Yes. Under those circumstances your fears (and mine) about our support being confused are not being realised. Therefore you should with some relief place your vote safe in the knowledge that if the intention was to rig the vote it failed.
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If it really comes to it, a play-off between Dundee and Dunfermline would surely be the right thing. The losers should get the whole of the gate. Play it at Hampden? Would a few thousand neutrals be interested enough to go along? Would Sky buy it?
To be honest Rick,I'm sick to f**k of hearing the name Sky almost as much as NewCo.
I sincerely hope they too f**k off and don't come back. Then we'll be pollution-free.
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If all the fixtures were completed (as they were), and we finished bottom, I'd expect us to be relegated. I would feel differently if Rangers were guilty of bribing match officials in season 2011/12 games, or suchlike. If subsequent investigations see Rangers stripped of any cups and titles - I certainly don't want us to lay claim to the 2010 League Cup either. Rangers crimes are serious, and they are paying the price, but we fecked' up that day, just as Dunfermline fecked' up most of the season.
I seriously think Yorkston would be happier in Div 1 - big gates v Falkirk and some Fife rivals, while paying the squad less, and having lower associated costs. I see a club like Falkirk having SPL credentials - and we need ambitious clubs like them... sadly, I only saw Dunfermline as a club who (like Morton sadly), fancy a bit of a run at Div 1 to see gates increase to a nice level, but their BOD don't actually want them to win the damn thing.
Historically it's always been the relegated club which survived when any change is made.
We benefitted from that once in 91?
Pretty sure it'll be Dunfermline but Dundee would bring better crowds which might compensate a bit for Rangers dying so who knows.
Poor R*ngers Theads Merged.....
in Other Football
Posted · Edited by oaksoft
Aaaaaargh! Methinks that anyone who says "methinks" should be dipped in a vat of honey and left in the midday sun for an hour whilst everyone else parades around nearby dressed up as a sexy female bee in the hope of attracting a swarm of randy and hungry male bees.
You said it 3 times in that post. Get stripped bud I'm on my way over with a jar of Gales' finest.