Julian Banjos
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Posts posted by Julian Banjos
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If it really is the decision of the member clubs then I don't think they're going to get into the SFL either.
If 8 out of the 30 say 'no' then that's it. Already that's up to 2 thanks to Falkirk and Raith Rovers. Meanwhile, Jags' fans say they'll boycott if their club allows them in so that might be a third 'no' vote. I can't see why Dundee/Dunfermline, Hamilton, Livi or Morton would want them either when it eliminates their chance of getting into the SPL.
There's been a lot said about how having Newco in the lower leagues will benefit the clubs financially in those leagues, but will it really? Yes, you might get a few thousand extra fans through the gates for a couple of games a season, but maybe their fans won't turn out in the lower leagues. Also if you've got an uncompetitive league then there's a good chance you're going to take a hit in your attendances in your other games.
Who knows what's going to happen in the next few weeks, but it's beginning to look like it could be something radical. Stewart Gilmour's in the PDE this morning talking about a 16 team league. Fingers crossed.
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As far as I know Brian Lawson is a long term Buddie and regular attendee both home and away.
I dont think this is based on political agendas...
I remember flicking through the free Renfrewshire council bumf that comes through the door and recognising him as a face I'd seen at games. He's certainly a St Mirren fan.
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Botyh clubs should apply and it should go to an SPL club vote to be held on 4th July.
There are only 11 clubs now so whoever gets the majority wins.
Both clubs applications have equal merit TBH.
I'd prefer to see Dundee get up for the crowds.
Unfair to choose one over the other so I'd just go to a league of 11.
Of course, that would have the side effect of meaning there would be no place in the SFL for Newco. Them's the breaks.....
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So... eh..... Dundee or Dunfermline?
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Don't have a problem with the timescale.
June 14th - Rangers liquidated
June 18th - The newco bid was submitted to the SPL
June 21st - 10,000 hours submitted their bid to take over St Mirren.
June 25th - CiC members consulted on newco vote
June 28th - 11 SPL clubs meet at Hampden
July 4th - Formal vote takes place
We're not in a "who can say 'naw' first" competition with the rest of the SPL clubs; as well as that, the last couple of weeks have been mental. In the circumstances, I think the club are playing this fine.
As for the questions asked, I don't have a problem with them either. The answers to the 4 questions will mean that our board will, compared to the other clubs, be armed with more information from their fans than most of the other 10 when they go into that meeting on Thursday.
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Wondering what's going to come out of this "pre-vote debate" on Thursday. Also we should surely be hearing from Sky soon...
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Why not put it to the shareholders and season ticket holders as well?
Strange that at this stage it's going exclusively to the members of the CIC have haven't parted with a penny.
Fair point.
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JB - On point 2 I think you're wrong, if the vote on Newco remains with the consortium still in control of the club then the fans have no direct say.
Fair enough, 'direct' say may not be quite correct but 1000 fans being consulted and then having those thoughts formally presented to the board...... I would say those views, in light of what's been happening at other SPL clubs, will hold considerable weight.
As has been said before though, the 5 votes against Newco will probably have been confirmed by the time we are consulted anyway; it baffles me that people are now doing their best to link this vote to the CiC takeover. It's our misfortune that Rangers have imploded when this has been going on. Yes, we can punish them, put them out of the league for 3 years and enjoy it for a bit. So what though? We know they'll be back with their poison at some point. It's a short term victory. The real deal here is long term: a stable St Mirren FC into the 2020's and beyond.
All we can do is wait to see what happens with the Sky money for season 2012/13 and that's completely out of our hands. The Newco vote is a side issue which will be done and dusted this time next week.
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So the information released today.....
1. 10,000 hours (with its 984 St Mirren fans) are very close to concluding a deal to buy the club. That's what most of us want.
2. Those 984 St Mirren fans will have a direct say in whether the blue bigots are in the SPL next season. That's what most of us want.
Why all the gnashing of teeth?
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Sky have a clause they can invoke once Rangers are out of the league which allows them, if they so wish, to exit the contract. That is a fact and whilst it seems unlikely it still COULD happen.
Okay then, that clears things up a bit and is probably the key point in all of this? We move forward once Sky TV makes their position clear. Players have been given contracts based on the Sky deal being in place and there's a small chance Sky could walk away completely leaving us unable to pay wages.
As you say Div, it's unlikely they would tear up the contract and consign the majority of the clubs in the league to administration. Prudent though to wait and see what happens.
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First of all, regardless of how St Mirren vote, Newco are not going to be in the SPL next season. I think that's pretty clear. Motherwell and Hibs will join Aberdeen, Hearts and Dundee Utd in saying 'no'.
Following on from that, what do Sky do? They've got 2 seasons left on their SPL deal. Is there any evidence that this deal is dependent upon 4 Glasgow derbies? Could they rip up the contract before the start of the season? You would think the SPL boards, including the selling consortium would have that information. Maybe not.
Very hard to interpret that release this morning but.... joint statement from SMFC and bidder, SMFC using bidder to canvas the opinion of fans. That seems positive to me.
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One thing's for sure anyway, it's a helluva time to be buying a football club in that league!
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I am leaning towards the Machiavellian view expressed by Vambo57 a few posts back that delaying the deal lets the consortium take the flak for voting for Newco and lets the CIC come in with a clean slate.
By the sounds of it, the St Mirren vote may not matter for Newco anyway. Motherwell and Hibs are stick-ons to join Hearts, Aberdeen and Dundee Utd in voting against.
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Does lack of SKY wedge and lack of team 12 in the league mean that funding for the CiC bid is affected in some way? I take it that the "other bidder" can then cruise in and gazump the CiC bid? Unless they too don't want to be involved if the money tap gets turned off or shut down to a trickle. Some pretty major decisions are going to be made in the next few weeks.
Does this mean that our board are likely to vote yes now due to self interest? And I dont mean self interest regarding the club, I mean for themselves.
I can't quite see how the 10000hours deal alone would be dependent upon the Sky cash. You would have thought that every bid for the club would be factoring that in. Would suggest though that the sticking point is the future finances of the club rather than those of the selling consortium?
I guess we'll find out more shortly. The joint statement is to be released at 10am.
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According to the PDE, the 10000 hours deal is being held back until the outcome of the newco vote is discovered as the takeover "hinges on Sky cash".
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What does that mean for the BOD?....Well as there are 5 directors (albeit with different amounts of shares) that would equate to a £30,000 shortfall each. Now as they are not short of a bob or two the question is.....can the CiC convince the BOD that they will get their money but it might take longer?....IMHO they can and the statement tomorrow will not be be anything other than a yes or no .....and it will be a YES!
Not an enviable position for the board.
The thing is all we know about is the 10 000 hours bid. The board, on the other hand, have apparently got a few bids to look at. We have no idea how attractive the others might be to the individuals financially or what they say they can do for the club.
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Speculating that the announcement will be a further extension. The PDE carried a report that quoted Gordon Scott saying that the offer may fall a "couple of hundred thousand pounds short" but that he felt it would be worth it. I can imagine a reluctance to accept less than they think is fair but it would be stupid to sink the bid at the point where it seems to be at a peak in terms of momentum.
Here's that article from today: http://www.paisleydailyexpress.co.uk/renfrewshire-sport/renfrewshire-football/renfrewshire-football-st-mirren/2012/06/21/gilmour-urged-to-secure-his-saints-legacy-87085-31226477/
Gordon Scott told Express Sports: “Stewart and the rest of the consortium have said all along that they will do the right thing. They have said all along that they want the fans to get control of the club. They have said all along that they support 10000Hours. I would like to think that they will stand by those words. Even if we have to negotiate a reduced price, it would be worthwhile to them. We’re talking about their legacy here – it may cost them a couple of hundred thousand pounds but we feel it is worth it.”
The 10000Hours team have now secured cash pledges worth almost £11,000 a month from supporters who have signed up for individual memberships of the takeover scheme. However, they are sweating on the numbers for two exclusive packages, costing between £3,000 and £25,000, which offer investors a greater say on how the Buddies would be run in future. Last-minute calls were being made to a list of wealthy supporters and local business chiefs last night in a bid to boost the 10000Hours coffers.
But, with the takeover group set to meet Gilmour and the others this morning to table their final offer, the consortium may be asked to haggle further on an asking price which has already been dropped by £500,000.
Scott added: “This is just as big a decision as anything the consortium have made in the past. It’s every bit as important as any of the other big decisions they have made, if not more so. You have to say that, when you look at every big decision that Stewart and the others have made since taking over, they have got it right. I hope they get this one right too. You can go back to the Reg Brealey bid in 1998 – they saved the club from him. They have got rid of the club’s debt, built a brand new stadium and established Saints in the SPL. Now they can go down in history for certain by handing the club over to its supporters.”
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It's a great achievement and I think there are a lot of envious eyes looking on.
Was thought in the middle of last week that the timing of the 10 000 hours deadline was unfortunate (Club 12 was dominating the news), but I think that debacle probably helped us in the end.
Noticed this morning that Rangers bid for re-entry to the SPL has been submitted. Unfortunately, I think that's going to mean the 1000+ of us are taking control of Saints a few days too late. Looks like the Newco vote will be one of the last pieces of business for the current board.
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That's the initial deadline come and gone. 15% over (£8675) the £7500.
If this keeps going at the same rate over the weekend it will reach £10K.
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Feared the worst when we were at 62% on Tuesday. The past 48 hours so have been ...... incredible. Great credit has to go to Div for marshalling this from the website and spreading the word on Twitter and elsewhere.
Yes, it's a step into the unknown and we can't quite be sure where this is going to lead. However, that's what happens when you're doing something revolutionary. That's what this is! The first top flight club in the UK to be controlled by its fans.
COYS!
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Finally managed to get an answer from 10000hours about how to contribute from abroad.
That's me signed up!!
Anyone got any idea how close they are from the target??
At 5.15pm today it was 84%. One of the ones signing up today was Steven McGarry. Ricky Gillies in as well.
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PDE today: http://www.paisleyda...87085-31177292/
A poll of supporters will then be called as soon as possible before July 16 when the club’s position on Rangers – who need at least SPL seven clubs to back them for a reprieve – will be decided. Last night, Atkinson said: “If the CiC wins control of the club, we will go to the supporters and ask them to decide on how the club votes on Rangers newco.” However, the fans have been warned exiling Rangers to the Third Division could prove costly to the Buddies – as much as £500,000 for every year that the Gers are not in the SPL. But the team behind 10000Hours insists it will be the fans who ultimately decide how Saints cast their vote.
Scott – who will become Saints interim chairman if the CiC is successful in its bid to buy a 52 per cent stake in Saints being flogged by current club chief Stewart Gilmour and four other directors – explained: “With the power to control the club vote comes responsibility. It would be the obligation of the football club board to clearly explain the financial implications that a ‘yes’ or ‘no’ vote would have on the club. For example, a ‘no’ vote may affect our income by up to £500,000 a year. The football club board would have to provide definitive options as to how that could be handled to allow the club to stay solvent. This would allow members to make an informed decision. A ‘yes’ vote could be on the condition that club voting reform happens thus enabling the expansion of the SPL without the blocking vote of only two clubs. This is a pretty basic description but if this were to become an actual scenario the football club board would have to provide a lot more information to the members on the merits of the yes and no votes. Hopefully, this demonstrates to all our members and groups like SMiSA that the CIC is governed by its members voice and that the power of that voice is much greater than the ‘single fan representative’ on the board that has let many other clubs down over the years.”
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Far fetched?
Newco FC have to apply for re-entry to the SPL. 2 weeks following their application the SPL member clubs vote on whether to let them back into the league.
If St Mirren FC are in fans' hands on July 4th AND if Newco FC don't submitted their application to the SPL in the next 7 days then St Mirren fans will be voting on the application. Could even be the deciding vote....
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Signed up last night.
According to the website, they're now 70% towards the target of £7500. 62 hours to go.
Poor R*ngers Theads Merged.....
in Other Football
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There's been a bit of chat that if newco are refused entry to the SFL then they'll buy Cowdenbeath.
Definitely a bit fishy that Donald Findlay has been linked to this imaginary takeover by John Brown. He is, however, Cowdenbeath born and bred. Would he and Green stoop so low to wipe out another old football club to get into the 1st division?