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doakie

Saints
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Posts posted by doakie

  1. 2 hours ago, shull said:

    Just watched the highlights.

    Why the hell are we wearing an Aberdeen type strip ?

    We are playing Motherwell where there's no colour clash.

    We should be wearing black and white stripes.

    Absolutely correct. It's farcical, a betrayal of our tradition, our identity. There has been numerous complaints about the club's attitude to this issue but the chairman, the board, Smisa and Kibble seem to care not a jot - nothing gets done about it! I get that it's not a big deal to non-traditionalists but many of us believe that our strip represents who we are and the lame arguments about "contractual considerations" are, like many issues at our club, vague and illogical!

    When the team came onto the field today impersonating Aberdeen again, I decided that I will never enter the club shop again. What's the point in buying black and white strips, scarves, hats etc when the club elect to betray our colours on a whim? No, I'm spending no more in the shop when the club treats our tradition, our colours with such disdain

    We are St.Mirren, not Aberdeen. We are black and white, not red!

  2. Just now, munoz said:

    Would be an aye for me. Why not. Has played the game at the top level , club and international.  

    I don't get the backlash. 

    Is this a windup? I guess so but, if not, you forgot to mention that his qualifications for a managerial position are , mmmm, zero! No managerial experience whatsoever. Can I point out that managing requires a completely different skill set than playing the game. 

  3. 2 hours ago, bazil85 said:

    I don’t believe you or Animal, or these other supposed people are credible witnesses. You have your own, very clear anti-Kibble/ SMISA agenda right now & I think that has possibly impacted the way you interpret certain things. 
     

    Nonsense, you’re literally arguing the club I support is in tatters from the top down with practically zero evidence. Of course you’re going to cause arguments with such baseless claims. 
     

    Be worried about the club, great. Back up the claims we are in serious trouble or accept ‘adult’ criticism for your moon howling. 👍

    I've said many, many times before: don't believe me, don't believe any other poster - Ask a Smisa rep! Ask a director. But, no, you'd prefer to keep trying to score childish points on this forum. Grow up and go ask questions of the right people instead of casting aspersions on well meaning fans.

     

  4. 26 minutes ago, bazil85 said:

    Again, I'll take with a pinch of salt as I wasn't present

    You weren't present so you still take the information with a pinch of salt? Wow! There's a stunning lack of logic right there! If you ever had any credibility (doubtful, mind you) that's it blown out of the water now with that nonsensical, contradictory statement. 

    It's patently obvious to me and my contacts on this forum that you are an attention seeker, someone who enjoys arguing black is white in a childish attempt to provoke others. My son used to do that when he was a child too but he grew out of it.

    It's obvious who has an agenda and it's not those of us who are worried about the club at this time. Now, please, leave the adult conversations to the grown ups but, as is my norm, I'll leave you to have the last word that you so desperately crave.

  5. 13 hours ago, animal said:

    Fix this SMiSA!

    Having managed to watch the AGM proceedings at a friend’s house here’s a summary of Fibble’s achievements at the club according to Mr McMillan of Fibble.

    One seconded employee of Fibble entirely paid by the charity (taxpayer?) seconded to St Mirren as general manager (a scandal in my humble opinion) and they delivered fan ownership.

    That’s it then. 

    Then for afters the St Mirren vice-chairman, Mr Gillespie of Fibble, when asked if he would comment on the training ground refurbishment made his entire contribution to the two hour meeting, One word - A blunt NO. (with a giveaway face like thunder).

    And that says it all. Shareholders in the club he is vice chairman of denied any engagement or explanation. Call in Sue Gray. We have discovered Boris Johnson’s cousin in Airdrie!

    They were obviously afraid of probing financial questions on the current position from Stewart Gilmour.

    Fix this SMISA.

    Don’t bother with the excuses Baz. It was all there to see.
     

    Animal's is a pretty accurate summary of proceeding, especially his point about Vice Chairman Gillespie's demeanour. When the chairman's wifi went down it was embarrassing as I, for one, fully expected the vice chairman to do his job and literally chair the meeting however his downright rude, monosyllabic grunt in reply to one question - his one and only contribution to the meeting - gave away his lack of respect for the shareholders and the meeting itself. It was very revealing - as anyone who witnessed his petulance would agree.

    The "probing financial questions on the current position" - and there were many of them from the former chairman - were avoided or glossed over until the chairman conceded that, since the period that the financial report covered (May 2021), the club had been making a loss. However, he would not go into detail. Stewart Gilmour pressed the issue and referred to a page on the financial report but the chairman didn't have a copy of the report so couldn't respond.

    The reports we've all read about the club losing money at a speedy rate of knots seem valid and are worrying. Of course, in spite of the chairman informing us that the club is losing money, there will be people on this forum who did not actually witness the meeting who will dispute this and offer a different slant but no one who attended and heard what he had to say will be in any doubt.

    There were many shareholders upset at the stop/start nature of the Zoom format. Its limitations were exposed as shareholders simply could not type quickly enough to ensure a smooth conversation. In spite of the chairman saying that we would be able to ask questions verbally at the end of the meeting, this did not happen. I can't speak for anyone else, but I tried to flag up that I wanted to actually speak but to no avail. One person called it a farce and others chipped in with their complaints. 

    I'm told that this was not an AGM in the true legal sense as shareholders were not allowed to ask questions verbally. It should never happen again. I would also question Mr Gillespie's suitability for the role of vice chairman when, on an evening that the chairman was offline for a period, he did not step forward to chair the meeting as you'd expect from a vice chairman. Gordon Scott contributed to the meeting, Alan Wardrope contributed and Mark McMillan contributed but the sullen Mr Gillespie gave absolutely no indication of any respect for the vice chairmanship, for the shareholders for the club or his fellow directors. 

    To balance that, I will say that Mark McMillan spoke well although, when asked about the number of Kibble employees were working at the club, I felt he was evasive when he answered "one". He is a politician, after all. The questioner was clearly trying to ascertain how many young people from Kibble (employees or young people in care) were working at the club and replacing St.Mirren staff e.g. ticket office, front desk etc. When asked a second time he maintained that "One Kibble employee works on secondment at the club"

    When he was asked about what Kibble have done for the club he stated "delivered fan ownership". I disagree that Kibble delivered fan ownership although, again, I'll balance that by saying that he said Kibble are effectively doing some work at the training ground work free of charge and that is why that job didn't go to tender.

    The tendering process for other contracts was brought up but was quickly dealt with, albeit in an unsatisfactory manner in my view. The conversation went along the lines of "Was there a tendering process in place"? "Yes". No further detail was offered.

    This is about as much as I can remember but the overwhelming feedback from the shareholders about the Zoom format was damning and I would have been much happier if Stewart Gilmour's questions had been handled more efficiently.

    Of course, Tony's retirement played a big part in the proceedings but, for me and other attendees, the current financial position was the real issue. I would have preferred a more thorough explanation, particularly as it was admitted that we are making a loss but, I guess the lack of detail was only to be expected.  Was this the reason that there were no auditors present, I wonder? 

    Let me assure anyone who's reading this that absolutely none of my contacts who were in attendance (there were eight of us) were remotely impressed with the content or the manner of the presentation. There were pre-submitted questions that were simply not asked, mine among them, in spite of Lynsey McLean sending an e-mail asking for these questions. To quote one shareholder "This is no way to hold an AGM" - that comment, and other similar comments, were ignored.

    Let's hope for a return to a fit for purpose AGM next year, an AGM where every director and auditor is present as per usual business practice and where everyone involved is available to reply to questions from the floor. This was not an example of how an AGM should occur.

  6. 1 hour ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

    For the avoidance of doubt, I don’t dispute these claims, but it would be easier to debate if we know what they are.

    I appreciate that but some information, given in confidence, can't be proved however I suggest that most contributors come on here with the sole intention of keeping other fans well informed, fans that might not have the same contacts within the club as others. Consequently, that allows the naysayers to come on and cast doubt on any well meaning fan such as Animal or Goodietwoshoes. When posters such as the afore mentioned two offer their views in an articulate, well thought out manner without resorting to hysteria I tend to find them credible. What I don't find credible are those who are so firmly entrenched in their pro Kibble stance that they stubbornly refuse to acknowledge other than the opinion that Kibble are great, Kibble are good, Kibble can do no wrong.

    I've said before: don't believe me or any other poster - Ask a Smisa rep! Ask a director. No one will tell you that the Kibble directors have a harmonious relationship with the club.

  7. 15 hours ago, SuperSaints1877 said:

    No evidence presented so far to suggest we are in a financial mess.

    Given we took circa £1.2M Covid loan payable over 20years, then there must have been heaps of sausage rolls and prawn sandwiches being consumed in the bored room.

    If people are hearing such information get it posted as it’s critical that questions are asked at the AGM on Thursday.

    For the purposes of accuracy, let me point out that the loan is not a financial asset, it is a debt. It has to be repaid so there are consequences if we start spending it recklessly. My understanding is that we accepted it only to be kept for emergencies but don't think for a second that any loan will magically put the books in a healthy position - it simply doesn't work that way, as any accountant or well informed person will tell you. I'm certain that questions will be asked about "such information" on Thursday.

  8. 4 hours ago, bazil85 said:

    As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint, there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues this poster has claimed.

    "we are in severe financial difficulty" "could end up on the same administration route as the likes of Derby" "when (if) our club die,"

     

     

    Basil,

    Rather than poke fun at the new poster ("very clearly trying to dramatize the position the club is in") wouldn't it be a better idea for you to ask one of the Smisa board about our financial position, assuming you know at least one of the many members of the Smisa board?

    Goodie2shoes makes an impassioned plea i.e. "I don't want to be ridiculed for my opinion" yet both you and faraway Saint can't help but do so - "As much as I agree with the summary of faraway saint" in response to a laughing face? Have I missed something because a laughing face isn't what I would call a summary?

    As it so happens, I've been told a very similar story about the current financial state of the club but I guess you won't believe me seeing as your modus operandi is to adopt a "Kibble are Good" position followed by a criticism on whoever posts a view contrary to yours. My information has come from a person I trust but, even so,  I can't come on here and say that I know for certain that it's true so I struggle to understand your assertion that  "there is practically zero danger there is a solid basis for the financial issues". How do you know there is zero danger? Have you had an update since May from the board? 

    Of course, I understand that you're only offering a personal opinion but you have framed it as a matter of fact, not opinion.

    Due to what I've been told privately, I believe we could very well be in trouble but the AGM's accounts will not reflect that problem seeing as they only show the financial picture up until May last year. 

    No need to reply to my rhetorical questions - although I concede that you seem to enjoy having the last word - but I suggest you don't rush to judge posters such as the new guy. He seems to be a loyal, concerned fan who is worried about the club.

    For the record, I find his post to be credible but I could be wrong, only time will tell - and that is merely my opinion.

  9. 19 minutes ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

    Actually Doakes, I’ve got an idea.  Perhaps you would like to propose yourself to join the SMISA board and change it from the inside ? 
    I’ll PM you my address , when your elected , I’d like my personalised reply ( With signed A3 picture) delivered by hand within 2-3 working hours .

    I do apologise, Callum, I expected a mature response to my original post ("As for the Zoom meeting ?   Did I even mention that ?") More fool me.

    As I said before, have a good night and I'll leave you to have the last word that you seem determined to have, no matter how irrelevant to my point that may be.

  10. 8 hours ago, Callum Gilhooley said:

    Am I missing something here ?   Trawl through the internet ?
     It’s really not difficult at all, if you are able to find BAWA and post on the forum I have no idea why you think finding the info you want from SMISA difficult .

     I typed in SMISA and guess what , all the information is there, Names, a short biog, a picture of said individual and a handy link to get in touch . What more do you want ? 🤷‍♂️


     

     

    Yes, Callum, that's called trawling through the internet. I didn't say that it was difficult but I do say that it's Smisa's responsibility to make themselves known to us rather than us having to search for them.

    But why do we need to seek them out? They are supposed to be open and transparent. It's their duty, in my opinion, to make themselves known to us - that's my point.

    I'll give you a perfect example: How many of them attended the two meetings in the summer? Only two made themselves known and one of them has the roving microphone.

    Here's another: when was the last time that rank and file members of Smisa were invited to a run of the mill Smisa meeting? 

    Finally - and you've not mentioned this in your reply - what reasonable person would agree to a Zoom AGM to a public AGM? 

    "Am I missing something here", you ask. I respectfully suggest that you're missing my point i.e. the Zoom AGM and lack of communication from Smisa

    "a handy link to get in touch": It's seems to me that the Smisa board do not want to engage with the members at this point. What makes me think that? Well, I sent them an e-mail around this subject on Tuesday and received an automated reply stating that I should expect a reply in 2-3 working days. Have I had one? Nope! 

    You have, of course, every right to disagree but Smisa's lack of communication and visibility in recent weeks should be a concern to us all.

    In the meantime, I'll continue to patiently wait for the reply they promised but I've got to say that, if they can't even draft a reply within their promised timeline, then it doesn't fill me with confidence that they can handle major issues.

    Have a good night.

  11. 30 minutes ago, gorgo said:

    If you are a member of SMISA are you not all shareholders? And in turn as SMISA say we are a fan owned club then all supporters are technically a shareholder?

    Sent from my VOG-L09 using Tapatalk
     

    I'm told that there is a clause in the constitution denying that scenario. I can't be certain of the exact wording but apparently Smisa members are not shareholders. 

  12. 1 hour ago, glenburn ed said:

    We need less secrecy from who ever the SMISA  representatives are.

    Agreed!

    Today I pal said to me that Smisa have become almost a secret society. For example, when did they last have a public meeting to which Smisa members could attend?  (The two "emergency" meetings in the summer don't count because those meetings were driven by concerned fans and not by Smisa themselves.) They still haven't officially announced the AGM, nor have the club. They chose instead to send e-mails to shareholders, the implication being that the AGM is of no concern to non-shareholders. I beg to differ. 

    On the subject of "who ever the SMISA  representatives are": I have repeatedly asked various Smisa board members to identify themselves and make themselves known, my view being that the vast majority of fans have no idea who the individual board members are. I wrote to Smisa suggesting that perhaps they attach a photo of each board member to any communication issued thus enabling ordinary fans to be aware of who their Smisa representatives are. They claim to have a responsibility to be open and transparent, after all.

    I received the following reply: "Our pictures, profiles and email addresses are all on the SMISA website"

    In other words, the fans have to trawl through the internet to try identify who each board member is, instead of those individuals making themselves easily identifiable. My goodness, if you want to be on the Smisa board then don't be afraid to make it known to your fellow fans who you are. Be proud of being a Smisa board member and be visible

    Now there's a Zoom AGM coming up? Why the need for anonymity and secrecy? It's no wonder that many fans - and they are numerous - are completely disillusioned with the current Smisa board. 

  13. 38 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:

     

    Sorry but when I said in another reply that they joined in March it was actually in February.  However, the link and paragraphs below are from Kibble's own website where it's clear that they joined the board after this meeting. Having said all of that and while I'm just trying to be accurate, the point remains - the post is about the Zoom AGM so let's not get too pedantic.

     

    https://www.kibble.org/news/fan-vote-kicks-off-historic-partnership/  

    Posted: February 21, 2020

    A momentous day in our charity’s history, St. Mirren Independent Supporters Association (SMISA) have voted in favour of the exciting new partnership between Kibble and St. Mirren.

    By an overwhelming majority, members recognised the value in this partnership that will provide fan ownership by 2021, while strengthening employment and training opportunities for Kibble young people.

    The plans will see Kibble own a 27.5% stake in the club, opening future job prospects and opportunities in employment, training and education, as well as widening access to sport, health and wellbeing. It will also address local deprivation and exclusion through youth employment, community engagement, initiatives and activities.

    Today’s decision followed a public meeting earlier this month where over 100 SMISA members were given a platform to ask questions to a panel of St. Mirren and Kibble representatives.

  14. 19 minutes ago, Cookie Monster said:


     

     


    Let's start with getting facts right.

    https://www.stmirren.com/fans-news/3530-smisa-members-meeting-with-kibble

     

    I apologise for any misunderstanding  but I am confident that I have got my facts right.

    The Kibble directors have never addressed the shareholders since they joined the board in March 2020 and this meeting (which was with Smisa and not the shareholders, two separate entities) was prior to their joining the board. This meeting was all about what Kibble could bring to the table and took place before they came on board. So, when I said that "the Kibble directors NEVER having faced the supporters" I'm pretty certain I'm right - they were not directors of St.Mirren at the time this video was shot. I hope that clarifies the situation.

    Furthermore, to the best of my knowledge they haven't attended any public meeting or AGM since they actually joined the board e.g. neither Kibble director took the time to attend the two "emergency" meetings with the fans, Smisa and the remaining directors in the summer.

    Nevertheless, that is not the issue here but thanks for giving me the opportunity to try and be as specific as I can.

    Anyway, let's not get side-tracked....my point is NOT about the Kibble and what they bring or don't bring to the table. No, my post is simply about the shareholders AGM being conducted via Zoom. No more, no less. There is no doubt in any reasonable person's mind that a public AGM is much more efficient that a Zoom based meeting so I reiterate: Why is the AGM being conducted via Zoom and not in public when there is no requirement to do so under current guidelines?

    In my opinion, that's a perfectly reasonable question that I feel Smisa should answer. 

    Thanks for your contribution.

    Needless to say, I've written to them asking why. I await a reply with interest.

  15. 1 hour ago, Cookie Monster said:


     

     


    All that rant and you're not even a shareholder. emoji1787.png

     

    Are non shareholders not allowed an opinion on the running of the club? This site would quickly suffocate if only shareholders were allowed to post on the subject of, for example, an AGM.  We are all Saints fans and one could argue that, technically, Animal - as well as the rest of us - are all shareholders, seeing as we are a fan owned club.

    He raises serious concerns - such as the Kibble directors NEVER having faced the supporters - so may I respectfully suggest you add your thoughts on the subject matter i.e. why is a proper AGM not being held. 

    My view is that there is something untoward when the shareholders are not being allowed to question the directors face to face. That is more important a question than whether or not any individual fan is a shareholder, don't you think? 

  16. I must admit that the AGM being held on Zoom is a huge disappointment. Obviously this means that there will be much less debate and meaningful dialogue than if it were held at a public gathering. Smisa have requested that questions be submitted in advance of the AGM - that indicates that it will be more of a simple Q&A than a proper AGM. 

    There is no reason for , say, 60 or 70 shareholders not to gather, bearing in mind that the current guidelines about gatherings say that the limit is "up to 200 people at indoor seated events" Furthermore, latest reports claim that "These limits will now be removed from Monday 17 January."

    It begs the question: Does the Smisa board, the Smisa reps on the Club's board and the Kibble directors wish to avoid being held to account? That is the whole point of an AGM and the four shareholders to whom I've spoken to today tell me that it is unacceptable to them. They are all deeply unhappy.

    I've been told that the Smisa board as well as the Smisa reps on the Club's board read social media so will someone inform us why they are avoiding a traditional AGM in the presence of the shareholders?

    Why is our AGM being conducted via Zoom when, according to the guidelines, there is absolutely no need ?

    I wonder - is there something to be concerned about? 

  17. 1 hour ago, Hendo said:

    Well, I think what is not said is more significant than what was - reading between the lines, it pretty much confirms the difficult relationship between Kibble and other board members - interesting there is no denial of Kibble threatening legal action. 

    Time for Kibble to look for their next project to expand into I would think.

    Spot on, Hendo. 

  18. Part of the Smisa statement from today - 

    At the same time, we are aware of recent online discussion around our relationship with Kibble. In any partnership, differences of opinion and approach can arise. The best place for any issues to be managed is in the boardroom and between the shareholders.

    We would stress for us to play that out in public would not be in the best interests of St Mirren. On that basis we ask for understanding and realism from members over what SMISA can publicly say.

     

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