Big Fras

Classic http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVehMqCRj7E&feature=fvwrel

The Quo at their brutal boogie best (probaly not recognised by any under 40s !)

Whether or not RA is a St.Mirren fan is irrelevant. I think the chances of a private sector buy-out made up of Saints fan(s) is somewhat remote. Those who are have had their chance(s) and have been rejected by the current BoD. There doesn't appear to be any other wedged up Buds waiting in the wings. I'm not doubting Richard's intentions (what is in it for him to f*ck it up other than a high profile shambles attached to his reputation ?!!). I'm not convinced by a lot of the spin and PR that has emerged in recent weeks, some of it contradictory. Nonetheless, it is beyond the control of anyone on here (I think), and we can only register sensible questions on the forum for a healthy debate.......but get a sense of perspective: it is not the fans that will cause this to fail - the financial numbers from the B&W Army are great, but not critical. It is the private sector investment that is key. RA seems like a persuasive, slick operator, with a nice line in spin.....so I wouldn't put it beyond him to reign in the corporate backers. But for people to already to suggest that if the CIC fails then the fans can be blamed...well, that seems a bit off the mark. Bearing in kind the global access of t'internet, I could see the 300 target of fans at £10/month being easily met. For example, it would give exiled Buds a heightened sense of involvement in club affairs, and an ability to contribute towards the club even if they cannot regularly pay at the gate. I spend more than £10 in 48 hours on B&H, so this is a win/win for me !Yes, Div, that is the sound of a wallet being opened on t'moors.....

I wouldn't get too bothered about the Mail running a barely researched article. Hardly unusual ! However, this could be the start of the national press starting to ask the same "awkward" questions that are popping up on this forum. The touchy subject of public sector spending in 2011 usually gets some people frothing at the mouth, and I think that once the Taxpayers Alliance get their dentures into this one, then it will get bumped up the media radar. Maybe Sid should be appointed spokesman in RA's absence - then the Mail & Co would really get some headlines.

Careful there LS, Pravda officials will be along soon.

...or PRAAIIISSSEE DE LOOOOOOOOORD !

Not big or clever......but the memories come flooding back like a blocked lav.......

Lobby was just a turn of phrase. Your wonderful posts prove that one thing I am not is paranoid (see previous post). Sid, you are in dire danger of starting to appear a complete gibbering cretin. Please read/think before starting the slavering goon routine.

Sid. Read any of my posts over the last few days - against any RA abuse; supportive of the CIC bid; merely expressing a concern over funding, and asking for a positive reply. You have completely proven my point about anyone raising a query being blindly slaughtered. This does the CIC lobby no favours whatsoever. Read/think before clattering the keypad.

Oh dear. This is precisely the sort of stuff I was referring to. BTW Sid, I am in support of a CIC bid, and like most of the people I have spoken to/e-mailed, I hope it comes true. Animal may lose his argument through some bizarre ranting, but by & large all I see is a decent number of people making some simple queries about the whole thing, not slagging it off. Every time someone raises a doubt, they are cast aside and labelled a heretic. That’s where you get friction. Your opening paragraph is quite amazing in its assumptions. I too am a small businessman, yet almost deal exclusively with major companies. Please try and stop making sweeping assumptions about commercial enterprises, then declaring it as a fact. RE: Provans – Sid, you should practice what you are preaching: don’t make sanctimonious remarks about a situation you know nothing about. I’m not crying...just wincing at the words.

With the benefit of hindsight the PR on this could have been handled a lot better. I'll just wait until we see where the club is in a couple of months time. For a variety of reasons there's little point debating on here.

The biggest factor in all of this is the backing of the private sector......outwith the normal backers of SMFCs commercial dept. The supporters cash is great, but nowhere near what is ultimately required. Many (including myself) have been sceptical about bringing a number of firms on £10k pa, and I have already given my reasons for that. I would add that the suggestion of "business networking opportunities" is laughable. For £10k I'd want the contracts signed, sealed and delivered ! For £120/year any small business can join the FSB, and get heavy discounts on supply services from fellow members (such as legal advice, accountancy, right through to car hire etc.). They also hold networking events, etc. I've never been, but for £120 its not bad. For £10k I'd want some serious benefits. However, RA does seem to be well on course to getting a number already signed up, according to his piece in the PDE. Great ! Presumably these people have been given a presenation of what is on offer for the £10k. If so, it seems strange that this has not been explained publicly (ie. "We've got some firms signed up already, but we're not going to tell anyone else what the incentives are for a couple of weeks yet"). I'm not suggesting anything sinsister, just a bit odd. Some of the stuff on this thread is getting silly, with personal attacks on RA and forum members doing nobody any favours. Nonetheless, some folks seem to be completely in the thrall of RA, and any questiioning of the scheme so far (not neccessarily criticism) is met with derision. I just hope that the guy can pull this proposal off. If he fails, SG will just look for another buyer, but some people on here will just look...well, very silly indeed. There's nothing wrong with asking questions. As John Lydon said: "Blind acceptance is a sign of stupid fools who stand in line", and he was the brains of the Pistols, not Sid

I’m surprised at some of the outright negativity to the concept of a CIC ownership. To me it seems to represent some form of Utopian dream – a club owned by the community, working together to the benefit of everyone involved, the sort of thing that sees praise being showered (quite rightly) upon FC United and AFC Wimbledon. However, I agree with many posters expressing their scepticism that this may well be a dream. Looking at the target audience of investors, I will be pleasantly surprised if this actually happens: FansRA says he aims to have 300 on board. Given the SMISA backing when the broon stuff went down with Brearly, this does seem achievable. This raises £36k. Expanding beyond the 300 mark ? Probably likely, but unlikey to match the hardcore of 3000. If 1500 got involved, (treble RA’s expectations), then this raises £180k. Therefore we are still miles off the serious numbers required. Private Sector InvestmentGiven the above, this is the critical area. RA says he is aiming at 36 firms being involved. At £10k a pop, this brings in £360k. I am now getting confused at the way the sums are adding up, but doubtlessly I have misread things. More pertinently, as someone who runs a private company, if I had a spare £10k floating around in these economic times, then there are a number of more pressing areas I would be investing it in for the good of my business. If I was plunging it into the CIC, I’d want some seriously good benefits for my firm. I could get away with it as a sole trader, but if it was a partnership, my fellow partners would need to be Buds, or RA would need to provide a fairly amazing package. Big Campbell has been knocking on the doors of the Paisley business community for years to get them backing the club in one way or another. From speaking to Campbell over the years, this has clearly been a real hard sell.....and that was pre-recession, AND dealing with St.Mirren-minded firms. Few were being asked to part with £10k, and were getting hospitality/advertising, etc. You need to offer much more than that for £10k It strikes me that the trick to all of this is to reach beyond the SMFC hardcore support/business backer. Our existing fan/client base doesn’t seem capable of generating the funding involved, despite their good feeling. Therefore, persuading non-SMFC orientated businessmen/women to stick £10k into the Buds........a genuine “GOOD LUCK” to all concerned. I really hope you can pull it off. I f Gordon Smith came along tomorrow representing a 6-man consortium, with a price and business plan that met the criteria of SG & Co, then a deal would be done within 3 weeks/minutes. Seeing as there is no one waiting in the wings, then I could see that RA may be given extra time to get his funding together..........but all the while that drags on, there will be “stalking horses” keeping an eye on things, and noting any increased desire/desperacy of the BoD to dump their shares. I see that Fitzy has been wheeled out, which is great. I’m sure his business partner appreciates any insight to proceedings. Let’s just sit back and see how this works out. Interesting times anyway !

I get the impression that SG is quite calmly pulling evryone's chain here. No buyer so far from the private sector that meets his criteria, so Richard comes up with another way of doing it. SG & Co say "Ok - have a go......but if you don't come up with the dough then please go away." I think they would just as easily welcome a bid from the private sector if the plans met their criteria, and have (in the main) expressed very mild enthusiasm towads the CIC option, mixed with a wee bit of sceptism. For all that many on here have a go at SG &Co, they should be respectful of his reasons to be slightly sceptical about the CIC bid. I'm sure he wants it to work (he gets his money), but he has more experience than most of trying to get financial backing for St.Mirren FC (when the economy was a wee bit healthier than today), and has probably good reasons to be wary. Good to see 400+ already signed up, but that equated to £50k pa generated by the hardcore following. We need to find another £1,950,000. I really hope they get it, but it will need a lot of firms/organisations to be able to make the investments. I know from my own experience how tight private sector cash flow is at the moment, and it may be a bridge too far to get lots of firms deciding to back SMFC with cash (which is ultimately what we are talking about here, once we strip away the community benefits). If it happens, then great. If it doesn't - no disaster. It's not as if there is a predatory Brearly-type dude waiting to take their place, with the bank demanding action. SG may be playing the long game here, due to the economic climate.

Shock ! Horror ! Outbreak of reasonable common sense from forum member. I'm sure Minister for Propaganda (Div) will be along to tell us that Richard was planning all of this anyway, so don't worry. Apparently Atkinson has been working on this for months......so why the above hasn't been addressed by now is a wee bit surprising. Or maybe he likes the thrill of a gamble ?

Good post.......but the last bit is the catch. I mentioned on another thread that Dundee have managed to raise a whopping £250k after months of tireless work......and that is to SAVE the club. Presumably, Mr.Atkinson has some big hitters lined up, because I don't think we could raise much more than Dundee. The economic climate for businesses is dire, so spare cash isn't quite what it used to be, unless you are in the Ice Cream van / taxi business (cough/sneeze). SMFC does not have a masive support base upon whuch to draw extra investment (we didn't even sell-out for a National Cup Final lest we forget). Big CK was even lamenting the downturn on hospiatlity in the recent B&W Mag. One notion could be a Barcelona-style membership scheme. EG: 2,500 current/former ST holders are persuaded to pay £10/month as Club members. Some benefits would need to be given from this (not applicable at JD Sports though !), and it could be in the form of a ramped-up Gold Bond type affair, although this would still be too much for Shull's weakened ticker. This would provide £300k pa. However, given the "consumer complaints" about admission prices and every other cost relating to football, factor in the current recession, then the viability of this renders it null & void in all realistic probability. Therefore the extra funds to come via the support will probably be nowhere near enough. I hope that firms in the Paisley area are secretly doing really, really well. Everyone I've spoken to has nice words to say about Richard, so this is nothing personal, but the "Brierly-ometer" is twitching...........

Very saddened at this news. Got to know Derek via this site, and like many others I would recieve regular PMs from him. Wicked sense of humour, and a great taste in music. I was well chuffed to finally meet him at the Aber signing back in April, and he was a genuinely good guy, that I wish I'd known for longer. SFS took a good picture as well, with some snowbound shots of the Town Hall & Abbey being particularly good. I ws recently thinking about asking for his permissson to get an artist I know in Liverpool to do a painting of his "Paisley Panaroma" pics, but that will just have to wait. Favourite quote from Derek on this site ? Easy..... A while back, Shull was in full cry, calling for part-time football in a 600+ word post. SFS responded with a suitable direct....... "Are you aff yer heid ?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKKhTyXLyQc Overlooked belter from AC/DC - BRian Johnson on top form why aye

And not a celluc tap in sight.....

Cheers Topper