WeeBud

The higher level "doctoring" and "rewriting of truth" wasn't just within the police force, it went on through "government" too. In fact it was still going on at government level as recently as 2011 and possibly even more recently than that.

I guess this is why a lot of people drift away from websites that at times can be good sources of information and avenues of reasoned questioning and debate. I am trying my hardest not to get involved in a long drawn-out tedious dialogue with you over this and for you, of all people, to ask people to deal in facts is one of the most ironic things I've read in a long time. You are antagonistic in the extreme and a strange "poster boy" for a campaign that is trying to win people over. This is exactly the route the threads regarding the last bid veered down between other posters diluting the relevant information to a dreg. With regard to debate/information seeking on this thread I won't engage with you any further. If you consider that a victory enjoy your celebration

I addressed you because you quoted and responded to my original post which certainly wasn't in your direction, you chose to respond and the rumour certainly wasn't mine. I sincerely hope that this thread and the overall debate regarding this bid doesn't drag itself down to the same level as the previous 10000 hours version and unfortunately so many other threads/debates lately.

Having not previously been a member of SMiSA and this being a thread about the joint SMiSA/GLS bid I just thought I would ask the questions to see if any of the more "informed" chaps had any feedback on this (cash shortfalls are obviously something that should be discussed in any business proposal) as this seemed a reasonable place to raise the query. There will be many "far-flung" supporters, who want to be involved, that may not be able to attend meetings and may wish to debate/discuss the proposal...........in fact a lot of the debate around the 10000 hours project was hugely informative before the abuse started. #I'VEALWAYSBACKEDTHEBUDS

As I intimated earlier I am very much pro "fan ownership" and have pledged to back this proposal and hopefully turn it in to reality. LPM, you claim we can reasonably assume GLS is in a position to help out when the cash-flow is tight, I think we can also reasonably assume (although I wouldn't want to run a business on assumptions) that he was previously in a position to help out too, the rumour is that he chose not to. I agree too that there are opportunities to drive revenue from other areas to help finances at the club but they come with no guarantees and if revenue returns are on the increase there will be pressure to spend that cash on the footballing side. There may also be times when there may not be time to go to the "membership" for consultation and agreement, I'd expect that to be done through an elected group (voted for and trusted by the membership) and I, personally, would be happy with that. I think we have to be careful in creating an image where by being a member will give you a say in decision making at every turn, that would be too unwieldy to be viable. Buddiecat, I'm all for SMiSA giving interest free loans the question is what happens if the club can't pay the money back, I'd hope that until SMiSA is the major shareholder it wouldn't be the only "entity" taking risk in that situation. Just a quick question on the loan repayment, does SMiSA receive a new batch of shares every time it makes a payment and gradually increase it's stake in the club?

I've read through what's been available information and through your post Div and I think you're pretty well on the money. I have to say I have a small concern (gripe maybe) that the rainy day fund will be supplied by the smaller shareholder (SMISA) and not by the major shareholder/director/chairman or is it accepted that both will contribute if and when required...........I guess what's sitting at the core of my concern is that it was rumoured, on here, that GLS hadn't been prepared to help out in the past when cashflow was an issue (that may or may not be true) and that membership money may be lost if there are deficits in the accounts. That plus securing funds against the stadium make me a bit nervous. That said, I have pledged my support and still think fan-ownership, done properly, is the way forward.

He went to the press to air his frustration or was he asked a question re next season's squad and answered it. I haven't seen his contract but I'd be surprised "going to the press to air his frustrations" wasn't somehow in breach of it.

I've read this five or six times now but I'm sorry you've totally lost me here..........there is no question the BoD have made poor choices or decisions, good ones too, but decision making and investment are totally different things. You allude to a "pot of money" lets just call it a budget. The manager is given a budget to recruit players as he sees fit, if he makes a mess of it that lies with him.........the BoD's part in this is that they've recruited a manager who doesn't spend or make best use of his playing budget wisely. As I said earlier I believe that we should look at improving our revenue streams to provide a larger budget for the manager to work with but borrowed money has to be paid back, often with interest, and can actually eat into the budgets of the future. On current turnover, bearing in mind we don't actually make a profit or have directors/shareholders taking dividends, where does the "investment" income come from??

Explain invested, in the terms you're using it, please........ As a club we should look at all available revenue streams but we should never go into debt to bolster the squad. Football is littered with teams who are in dire straits or even worse (going into administration/liquidation) chasing the dream.

Or from a Bolton fans perspective......"Oh well we got relegated and we're also financially f**ked because we spent money we didn't have"

i hope the manager does nothing other than pick the team that he believes has the best chance of winning both games, if that means both games being without Thommo or Goodwin then so be it!!

Not disagreeing with that AT ALL ST LUCIFER......I was merely pointing out that Shull's post was a weak comparison to the point IoBS was making but don't let that get in the way of some quality shouting on a Friday.

Will be a good weekend IoBS, some decent bands there.....if you like this sort of festival get yourself out to Tiree for TMF or Oban for ObanLive

If I remember correctly both these games sold out so not really a valid comparison, every St Mirren supporter who wants a ticket for this game will be able to get one (although maybe not in their chosen stand)

Come on Cockles my old son, we had some brain donor on here the other week suggesting boycotting our own club to starve it of cash!!

I'd cut the Board a wee bit of slack here I am quite regularly in contact with a guy who , from a legal perspective, was quite involved in all the drama surrounding Rangers liquidation and all the shenanigans regarding which league they should play in (if at all) etc.... His take on things was that Doncaster and Co were absolutely playing the "doomsday" card with regards to cancellation of commercial contracts and sponsorships etc if one of the "Marquee" clubs was no longer involved. Of course none of it came to fruition and incredibly Doncaster and cronies kept their positions despite the keech they were peddling but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

​http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/33470377 Apparently Latapy left ICT of his own accord for pastures new and to become a manager in his own right........

There were enough "No" voters who weren't particularly gracious in victory to have an idea that there were plenty enough muppets on either side.....

In essence I would agree with that BuddieinEK however we live in a country where currently, like it or not, SNP will hold a majority. So long as that's the case another referendum will be somewhere on the agenda. Should another referendum be held, and the majority vote for independence, there will be plenty tantrum throwing by No voters saying it was undemocratic to have another democratic vote. I've never publically, not even to my better half, declared my allegiances one way or another but the amount of posturing and hypocrisy from both sides has been cringeworthy in the extreme.

Rumours that he will return to his "parent" club at the end of his loan or beforehand??

Let's just pretend that the game where we played against Hibs (losing four goals), against Falkirk (where we lost three) or against Livi (where he had to be removed from the game, just before half-time, in case he got himself sent off didn't happen then or are you just being subjective to suit your argument?? As I said earlier I quite like Goodwin but we lost plenty games, and badly, when he was in the team......... on that basis I'm quite happy to let the manager choose as he sees fit without feeling the need to question his previous background.

I quite like Goodwin but up until his injury we had won twice in the league while drawing four times and losing seven..........since then we have won seven, drawn three and lost eight. It could be argued we've done better since Goodwin was out of the team although a lot of those games were played after the manager changed. I don't believe for a second that Goodwin not playing has anything to do with who our managers formerly played with and lets not forget he was also removed from the coaching set-up previous to any of those managers turning up.

The "starve the club of cash" stuff really worries me in all honesty. As supporters we have all followed St Mirren far and wide and through thick and thin but with "owners" in charge cash has been found a loaned in times of need........what happens if the new funders (fans) aren't happy with decisions being made by the new board (SMISA), have they to throw the dummy and stop funding the club making it more and more difficult to find the "spare cash" for difficult cash-flow times. Imagine a scenario where those who choose to stop parting with cash because they don't like decisions means that not only will they not buy tickets but also stop paying their direct-debits because they no longer believe in the folk making the decisions. I was a originally a supporter of the fan ownership idea but was horrified by people throwing out accusations against fellow supporters, name calling bordering on libellous because things weren't being done they way they wanted or felt they should.......I can see the same thing happening all over again if things aren't going the way that certain people want them to. I am still a believer in fan ownership in a "utopia" type way but will take a deal of persuading to chuck my hat, Stetson or otherwise, in the ring this time around.

Certainly not accurate enough but it was never a suicide pass, it was a pass to the full back to hit it long up the touchline which would be a good option in that situation

IoBS, my brother lives in Tobermory and Café Fish is indeed excellent. As you have to pass through Oban to get there, and if seafood is your thing, Eeusk, The Seafood Temple and The Waterfront Seafood Restaurant are all worth a visit.